Hurt by what hubby said

October 20, 2005

I think this ppost keeps going back to something that Jade does not want to hear or believe. Slubber, I think you are dead on--a confirming opinion from another male.

We are physical creatures as you are emotional ones, there needs to be common ground. It seems that you are not willing to freely give sex without your required intimacy. The fact that you do have sex does not mean it was freely given, and I am sure he realizes that it was not.

Most of the female posters here seem to be just affirming the issue and saying he should change. Maybe so, but I think that Jade needs some changing as well.

October 20, 2005

Yeah, it really seems to be at a standstill. Saying it's his fault and that he isn't changing might be a true statement, but it doesn't seem to be getting you anywhere. You've gotta keep trying new ways to compromise and open the lines of intimate communication if you're going to save the marriage.

October 20, 2005

Jadestar -

I hear your frustration and understand your resentment. I strongly suggest that you read two books that have been recommended by others (Mz. Pixie and Outcast) elsewhere on this site. I've read them due to their recommendations, and highly recommend them as well.

No offense to anyone here meant at all, but I think these readings will shed far more light on your situation than anyone on this board can. I think we can agree that all situations are different and only you can decide what is most important to you.

1. "His Needs, Her Needs. How to Affair Proof a Marriage" by Willard Harley Jr.

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi3200_love.html

2. The 5 Love Languages by Gary Hartman.

It seems that you both still love each other and want your marriage to work. I think 13 years is worth the price and effort of a couple of books that are likely to assist you.

October 20, 2005

Jade,

I feel for you sweetie. I was exactly where you are in my first marriage before I had the A.

Some of the men here on this forum are telling you to meet his sexual needs and he will meet your emotional ones? In my experience this is crap. My exhusband told me the same thing and when I stepped it up in the sexual department for a long time I still didn't get what I wanted.

What woke my exhusband up is when I started packing my bags. Then, he was all willing to go to counseling, read the books I'd brought home or whatever.

Google Why Women Leave men and print out the article for him. Here is a marriage expert telling men that their wives DO NOT expect too much from them.

October 20, 2005

Some of the men here on this forum are telling you to meet his sexual needs and he will meet your emotional ones? In my experience this is crap.

Mz. Pixie, I honestly appreciate where you are coming from. But your post, unfortunately, confirms my point.

A 13-year marriage is not a place to play the standard MAN = BAD, WOMEN = GOOD game; there's too much at stake.

You are certainly free to ignore a man's advice or call it "crap," but that doesn't solve the problem.

Jade, sincerely empathize with your problem. But after giving it some considerable thought, and trying to analyze the issue from both sides (some posters here would be enlightened to try it sometimes) my suggestions stand.

I wish you well.

October 20, 2005

Slubber I am with you. Need to look on both sides. Maybe I missed the OP but are you looking for commiseraton or suggestions?

All that I have read is that your needs are not being met and he wont change even though I have tried withholding sex and then giving him a little taste of it here and there.

Unfortunately, I have heard all to often that first marraiges are like trial runs and you learn a whole lot there but they typically don't last. Even more unfortunate when there are kids.

Maybe it is time to consider divorce and to find a man that is currently meeting your emotional needs and stick with him--don't go looking for someone who might meet them and then try and change them.

Honestly leopards do not change their spots---male leopards or female!

October 20, 2005

Pretend like it the best sex you've ever had, fake the orgasms...the whole nine yards.

And if he's still the same dullard he is now, then you know he's just a selfish prick.

October 20, 2005

It does sound an awful lot like you are saying:

"I'm not going to physically desire you until you meet my emotional needs..."

And he's "saying":

"I'm not willing to bother with emotional needs until my physical needs are met.."

Okay, you can see that these two attitudes don't mesh. I know that you said you've told/showed him numerous times what you want/need. Did it get temporarily better when you we actively telling/showing him? Maybe like an earlier post mentioned, maybe telling him what you want has to be an every time kinda deal. I understand that's not what you want, but it's something.

Also, whenever I hear that a man had an affair because his wife wasn't putting out regularly, I always wonder if the wife knew how serious the consequences where for holding back, would she still hold back? You are in a very unique position. Regardless of how you think the situation should be resolved, you now know that the lack of sex for him is just as serious of a problem as the lack of emotional connection is for you. Now's the perfect opportunity for the two of you to deal with it.

October 20, 2005

It does sound an awful lot like you are saying:

"I'm not going to physically desire you until you meet my emotional needs..."

And he's "saying":

"I'm not willing to bother with emotional needs until my physical needs are met.."

YES, YES, SOMEONE FINALLY GETS IT.

Thanks, Bab. You said it far more succinctly than I did.

October 20, 2005

Slub-

I did GET it, trust me, I lived it. I understood what you were saying. They are locked in a vicious cycle.........just like my exhusband and I were. I did, however, try to see things his way, and meet his needs when mine weren't getting met. Do you know how that made me feel? Like a prostitute, but at least a prostitute gets paid for her services.

What would work much better is if they would try to meet each other's needs both ways but it's obvious that he's not going to do that. It's about who can last longer at this point- who is going to give in first or get out first. Jade will either give up or she will look elsewhere to have her needs met.

I know exactly what I'm talking about, because I had an affair and left my exhusband because he didn't meet my emotional needs. Do I regret it?? I regret the affair but I do not regret leaving him. Because guess what? I've got a husband now who meets my emotional needs. He never has to ask to have his sexual needs met either, I can promise you that.

October 20, 2005

Another male perspective...........If you want the marriage to continue its downward spiral then withhold sex or loose interest in it or do not have it very often. Regardless of who is more right or more wrong...........this will be the gauranteed result.

October 20, 2005

Mz. Pixie;

I'm sincerely happy that you've found someone with whom you connect on every level. As people grow and evolve, relationships also change. That's not always bad, of course, but it's not always positive either.

I understand what you're saying about Jade's hub and the vicious cycle. But someone has to take the initiative. It may as well be her (Jade) because, from what I've read here, she's holding all the cards.

BTW... Pix... I really like your signature line.

October 20, 2005

Thanks slub-

Part of my problem was that I didn't understand what sex meant to my exhusband either. I thought he was just wanting a tingle, when in reality he connected with me emotionally in that way.

When you get that far and there is much resentment and much hostility it's hard to back down.......

October 20, 2005

It does sound an awful lot like you are saying:

"I'm not going to physically desire you until you meet my emotional needs..."

And he's "saying":

"I'm not willing to bother with emotional needs until my physical needs are met.."

I was thinking the same thing as I read through this thread. And I understand what Slubberdegullion is saying as well.

I know how Jade feels and I've been in Mz. Pixie's shoes.

What the problem is, is that some women can't "get it up" without the emotional stuff. This inability for a woman has the same degree of difficulty as a man who "can't get it up." The only difference is that for some women the "getting it up" part IS emotional, whereas it is physical for a man.

Not feeling attracted to a man isn't the same type of "choice" as a man not helping with chores or not talking to her.

Now, if a man gets his emotional needs met while having sex and a woman needs hers to be met before having sex, doesn't it only stand to reason that if the couple puts the steps in the right order, both will get what they need and be happy?

October 20, 2005

I went on a field trip with my daughter to the pumpkin patch and i rode with another parent and we was talking about our families and she told me things about her h that he don't do nothing around the house and she does everything for her daughter !!She told me she thought she was the only person that had that type of problem... We then got with another parent and she said the same thing.. I think that women are more emotionally needed than men but is it far for us to settle !! We are all stay at home moms and are very involved with our kids ..

Why don't we deserve more help with the kids and house and all just because they bring home the bacon? I totally agree with what Jadestar said... I give my h what he needs when is my turn and im sure she feels the same!!!! Mega I have read the five love languages but my h hasn't and i am a member of the marriage builders .. I think im the giver and my h is the taker and that he is selfish .. Most men are .. I am with you Jade and can so relate hang in there !!! I love the love bank thing sounds so familiar ...

October 20, 2005

lilmoma1973;

Stay-at-home moms have my greatest respect. To put one's life basically "on hold" for the sake of the kids is a sacrifice that too few are willing to make, and I sincerely applaud you for it.

Now, I'm not going to defend a lazy hub who's too busy sitting in front of the TV watching bikini-clad women jiggle themselves about in the latest episode of Survivor. But I will step up to the plate for a fellow who works 10 hours a day at a job that's killing him so he can provide a decent standard of living for his family.

So here's an alternative: Hire a cleaning service. If you have little ones in diapers, get a diaper service. Essentially, remove the caustic issue from the relationship. She is happy because the house is in good shape, he's happy because he's not badgered about cleaning out the fridge as soon as he gets home from another crushing day, the kids are happy because mum & dad are getting it on a regular basis... everybody wins.

October 20, 2005

l
So here's an alternative: Hire a cleaning service. If you have little ones in diapers, get a diaper service. Essentially, remove the caustic issue from the relationship. She is happy because the house is in good shape, he's happy because he's not badgered about cleaning out the fridge as soon as he gets home from another crushing day, the kids are happy because mum & dad are getting it on a regular basis... everybody wins.

Big Groan. Having a cleaning service would be nice. But cleaning services don't meet emotional needs. Having a clean house and a H that still doesn't participate around the house, is still a distant husband. Having a H that helps around the house is a H that's involved with the family. He appreciates what the W is doing, and he wants to be a part of it. Wanting help around this house is the easiest way a W can explain to her H: I want you to be involved with this family and here's a way to show that you want to be.

Like I said before, they are in a vicious cycle. Knowing what everyone wants and why is important.

Again JadeStar. Tell him exactly what you want. Like maybe, hey, Can you take care of the dishes and the living room while I put the kids to bed? Then maybe we'll have more time for some lovin' before I pass out from exhaustion!!

October 20, 2005

Now, I'm not going to defend a lazy hub who's too busy sitting in front of the TV watching bikini-clad women jiggle themselves about in the latest episode of Survivor. But I will step up to the plate for a fellow who works 10 hours a day at a job that's killing him so he can provide a decent standard of living for his family.

I couldn't agree more.

I really have to say that I do believe that because men and women are different, communication is the key. Unfortunately, women want men to "just know" things, be able to sense things, but some (better put the word "some" in there . . .) men aren't able to do that. That means that they need to be told. In my case, if I told him more than twice, I felt like I was nagging. After time number two, I'd do stuff myself. (Lord knows the life was already being sucked outta me, so why let it happen to him, too. )

Women just have to deal with the fact that they need to be direct. I myself don't understand how something so obvious can be so oblivious, but . . . that's the way it goes. Anyway, one of my favorite solutions helped keep me organized (and the kids from time to time), so hopefully it might help with your hubster.

Buy a big, plain calendar and the Dollar Store. Each person that has a chore, gets a color. (Mine was purple. Yay, purple. ) For each day that a chore needs to be done, write it down in the color for the person that is going to do that chore. The same goes with date night, going for walks, working on a project together. With it all written down, everyone KNOWS what needs to be done without having to be told.

Now, if you wanna give him more ideas, keep a separate small calendar with notes for different days that say things like, "Smooch me," "talk with me," "Give each other a massage," "whipped topping night," etc., etc. Keep that calendar where he will see it (in his bathroom drawer? ) but where it isn't a public display.

October 20, 2005

I never quite figured out why the sexual urge of men and women differ so

much. And I never have figured out the whole Venus and Mars thing. I have

never figured out why men think with their head and women with their heart.

For example, one evening last week, my girlfriend and I were getting into

bed. Well, the passion starts to heat up, and she eventually says: "I don't

feel like it, I just want you to hold me." I said "WHAT????!!! What was

that?!" She responded to my puzzled look by saying, "Can't you just love me

for who I am and not what I do for you in the bedroom?"

What every boyfriend/husband on the planet dreads to hear..."You're just

not in touch with my emotional needs as a woman enough for me to satisfy

your physical needs as a man." Realizing that nothing was going to happen

that night I went to sleep.

The very next day I opted to take the day off of work to spend time with

her. We went out to a nice lunch and then went shopping at a big,

department store. I walked around with her while she tried on several

different very expensive outfits. She couldn't decide which one to take so

I told her we'll just buy them all. She wanted new shoes to compliment her

new clothes, so I said lets get a pair for each outfit. We went on to the

jewelry department where she picked out a pair of diamond earrings. Let me

tell you...she was so excited. She must have thought I was one wave short

of a shipwreck. I started to think she was testing me because she asked for

a tennis bracelet when she doesn't even know how to play tennis. I think I

threw her for a loop when I said, "That's fine, honey." Smiling with

excited anticipation she finally said, "I think this is all dear, Let's go

to the cashier". I could hardly contain myself when I blurted out, "No

honey, I don't feel like it." Her face j ust went completely blank as her

jaw dropped with a baffled "WHAT???!!!"

I then said, "Really honey! I just want you to HOLD this stuff for awhile.. You're just not in touch with my financial needs as a man enough for me to satisfy your shopping needs as a woman." And just when she had this look like she was going to kill me I added, "Why can't you just love me for who I am and not for the things I buy you?"

October 20, 2005

I then said, "Really honey! I just want you to HOLD this stuff for awhile.. You're just not in touch with my financial needs as a man enough for me to satisfy your shopping needs as a woman." And just when she had this look like she was going to kill me I added, "Why can't you just love me for who I am and not for the things I buy you?"

Nailed it .. 933kjl ..

Great comparison.. but we all know in real life that it wouldn't work..

October 20, 2005

but basically it is relevant to this too.

Men show their affection/intimacy/love through sex. At least most men that I have known. What I can't figure out is why women consider this so inferior to showing affection/intimacy/love through emotions? Why is sex bad and cuddling good? Why do we put things in a hierarchy of importance and deem who is right and who is wrong?

Sex is what makes a marriage whole. It's also what makes your eyes roll back in your head. Why do we demonize it as if someone who is interested in sex, cannot possibly respect your emotional needs. Why are physical needs considered "not a priority" compared to emotional needs?

The whole conversation is annoying to me.

October 20, 2005

OMG, THAT was HYSTERICAL, 933KJL ! ! !

The sad part about the story is that women DO need to feel important. If we feel that we are just a piece of furniture to jump on, then we "feel like prostitutes" as Mz. Pixie put it. It's almost like you can just lay there and "go to your happy place" until he's done doing it and he wouldn't even notice. To US . . . no . . . I should speak for myself . . . to ME, it's like it wouldn't matter that it was ME . . . the only thing that seemed to matter is that the body parts were there.

October 20, 2005

Carmen:

I don't see one aspect inferior and another superior. I don't see cuddling as good and sex as bad.

Like I said in an early post, why can't the steps be followed in sequence so that it feels right to both people?

As far as respecting emotional needs, if a person refuses to listen to his/her partner and what he/she needs, then I really don't see where the respect IS.

October 20, 2005

do any of you have orgasms? I don't know how you can have an orgasm, and then think of sex as something to "get through". Do you know that statistically only about 25% of women have ever had an orgasm?

I know this may sound rude and crude, but it isn't meant to be. It is one thing to say that a man doesn't bring you flowers, or bathe the kid. But to extrapolate that into laying there while he does his business? Doesn't anyone WANT to enjoy sex anymore? Trust me, I can be annoyed with my man, A LOT and OFTEN. But when we have sex, I am going to get off. I can't imagine going through the motions for nothing! Does he not know how to please you in bed?

If you aren't having orgasms, you need to start immediately. If he can't figure out how to do it for you, figure out how to do it for yourself. Then teach him. Trust me, it's worth the effort.

October 20, 2005

Carmen:

I don't see one aspect inferior and another superior. I don't see cuddling as good and sex as bad.

Like I said in an early post, why can't the steps be followed in sequence so that it feels right to both people?

As far as respecting emotional needs, if a person refuses to listen to his/her partner and what he/she needs, then I really don't see where the respect IS.

So my question to you is: why is your sequence preferential to his? I don't want to seem accusatory. But we really consider our emotional needs more important than a man's physical needs. If a man wants to have sex without talking he is disrespecting us. But aren't we disrespecting what he wants too? Face it. It is a double standard.

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