Should I go to give my my personal documents to HR when they told me nothing about giving me an interview?

[Katkats7777]

Applied for a position at a police station to work in the HR dept. I got an email from HR telling me she would for me to come in and bring in my documents like birth certificate, social security, ID so that she can make copies for "paperwork" and testing. One of the attachments she sent was saying those documents must be sent at the time when filling out an application. Why the heck should I have them make copies of my social security card and they need proof of ID when I don't even know-if I'm even getting an interview? I asked if I was going to get an interview she said that it wasn't an interview and that its just for paperwork. The only times when I was told to bring in my birth certificate and social was when I interviewed, and got HIRED. Copies for WHAT?

[basil67]

Interviews take time and effort from both parties, so it's likely that they want to make sure you're eligible for the job before the interview process is done.   You can either go along with it, or look for a job elsewhere. 

[Katkats7777]

Sounds shady and feel uncomfortable having them make copies of my social and birth certificate. This isn't the new norm. Only time I had to do that is when I was HIRED. I probably won't even get the interview, why the heck would I want my personal info for them to keep for paper work? Doesn't make sense.  

[SoulCat]

As you are applying for a job at the HR department of the police, they would need to do a thorough background check on you, as you would be privy to a lot of sensitive and confidential information in that role.
They would start this vetting process off before the interview stage, just to weed out unsuitable candidates. 

Providing the required documentation along with your initial application allows them to run these checks before selecting people for the interview stage. 
It's a waste of everyone's time interviewing someone only to discover later on that they aren't eligible due to criminal convictions, bankruptcy, CCJs etc.

 

It's nothing personal, just part of their hiring procedure.

[d0nnivain]

You want to work for law enforcement.  They don't waste time interviewing people who can't pass the most routine background check.  They do that up front. 

If you are truly uncomfortable giving them your BC & SS info, apply to work somewhere else.  It's very simple.  

[Pumpernickel]

I sometimes contract with govt agencies on a 1099 basis, sometimes through an intermediary, and they ALL do background checks before any contract can be officially signed.  To do this, they need all kinds of documentation. It’s normal, especially if you want to work for a police station as a W-2 employee. 

[Katkats7777]

Well what if I don't even get an interview and I'm no longer under consideration? I'm going to go through all that trouble to go the my safe at the bank-get my personal docs out, take time out of my day to drive to downtown for them to make copies? 

Seriously, I've been screwed over before, what's going to happen to my files? Are they just going to keep them there for memories or id theft? I don't care if they are "police" I don't trust anyone. 

[d0nnivain]

You can ask them what they are going to do with the personal info they obtain from candidates but yes, you probably have to do all of that to get an interview  

[poppyfields]

@Katkats7777, my understanding of the laws against discrimination in the United States is it's against the law for a prospective employer to ask these questions before or during an interview:

Age or genetic information.

Birthplace, country of origin or citizenship.

Disability.

Gender, sex or sexual orientation.

Marital status, family, or pregnancy.

Race, color, or ethnicity.

Religion.

So having said that, I don't believe it's legal for them to be asking for your birth certificate (showing your date of birth/age) or your social security card (proving citizenship) before you are even interviewed!  That sounds very off to me.

They have the right to conduct a background check on you but only after the offer of employment has been presented and you have accepted.  The offer of employment is contingent upon your passing the background check.  If you pass, your paperwork is typically given to them on your first day of employment.

This is my understanding having worked in employment law as a paralegal for many years.

I would NOT be giving them this documentation and if you want to be really bold, you can tell them, by law, you are not required to.  You may even consider reporting them to the Fair Employment & Housing Commission.

If someone with more knowledge re discrimination laws wishes to refute this, I am open!   It's simply my own understanding of the law, that's all, assuming you are in the United States.

 

 

Edited September 3, 2021 by poppyfields

[Katkats7777]

20 hours ago, poppyfields said:

@Katkats7777, my understanding of the laws against discrimination in the United States is it's against the law for a prospective employer to ask these questions before or during an interview:

Age or genetic information.

Birthplace, country of origin or citizenship.

Disability.

Gender, sex or sexual orientation.

Marital status, family, or pregnancy.

Race, color, or ethnicity.

Religion.

So having said that, I don't believe it's legal for them to be asking for your birth certificate (showing your date of birth/age) or your social security card (proving citizenship) before you are even interviewed!  That sounds very off to me.

They have the right to conduct a background check on you but only after the offer of employment has been presented and you have accepted.  The offer of employment is contingent upon your passing the background check.  If you pass, your paperwork is typically given to them on your first day of employment.

This is my understanding having worked in employment law as a paralegal for many years.

I would NOT be giving them this documentation and if you want to be really bold, you can tell them, by law, you are not required to.  You may even consider reporting them to the Fair Employment & Housing Commission.

If someone with more knowledge re discrimination laws wishes to refute this, I am open!   It's simply my own understanding of the law, that's all, assuming you are in the United States.

 

 

The whole thing sounds off to me. A few months ago, I applied for position to work at a court house in the same city, they called me in for an interview, I went in and interviewed and at the time of the interview, the woman that interviewed me gave me a form to sign for a background check, so I signed it and that was that. She didn't ask for my social or birth cert, I imagined, she would have asked me to bring those in when an OFFER is made/first day of work. What makes a working at a police station any different than a court house? Also, when I filled out the application for the police, they asked the same questions such as are you a citizen, place of birth, and it had me put in my socials anyway. That's pretty stupid to think that someone would lie to those questions on the application if they were going to get asked bring in proof of documentation later along the line. Anyway, I've applied to other places anyway. 

[lana-banana]

On 9/2/2021 at 11:49 PM, poppyfields said:

@Katkats7777, my understanding of the laws against discrimination in the United States is it's against the law for a prospective employer to ask these questions before or during an interview:

Age or genetic information.

Birthplace, country of origin or citizenship.

Disability.

Gender, sex or sexual orientation.

Marital status, family, or pregnancy.

Race, color, or ethnicity.

Religion.

So having said that, I don't believe it's legal for them to be asking for your birth certificate (showing your date of birth/age) or your social security card (proving citizenship) before you are even interviewed!  That sounds very off to me.

They have the right to conduct a background check on you but only after the offer of employment has been presented and you have accepted.  The offer of employment is contingent upon your passing the background check.  If you pass, your paperwork is typically given to them on your first day of employment.

This is my understanding having worked in employment law as a paralegal for many years.

I would NOT be giving them this documentation and if you want to be really bold, you can tell them, by law, you are not required to.  You may even consider reporting them to the Fair Employment & Housing Commission.

If someone with more knowledge re discrimination laws wishes to refute this, I am open!   It's simply my own understanding of the law, that's all, assuming you are in the United States.

 

 

This is not fully correct. If you are applying for a position that requires a background check, employers can absolutely have stipulations for employment such as "must be able to obtain/maintain a security clearance", which technically requires being a citizen, without explicitly asking the question. In this case they probably want ID info to run a NACLC or similar before an actual background check.

You can ask about their data retention policies but I wouldn't expect a satisfying answer. And It's no comfort but Acxiom, Experian et al already have this data on you and much, much more. 

[Weezy1973]

@Katkats7777 different employers have different hiring practices and as long as it’s legal, can ask for anything they want. Some people will consent, others won’t. If you don’t like it, refuse and look for somewhere else to work.

[poppyfields]

21 hours ago, lana-banana said:

This is not fully correct. If you are applying for a position that requires a background check, employers can absolutely have stipulations for employment such as "must be able to obtain/maintain a security clearance", which technically requires being a citizen, without explicitly asking the question

Thank you I understand that and agree. 

But before the interview?  Not my understanding of the laws protecting potential employees against discrimination.

A background check is performed after the employee is offered and accepts the position, but can be reneged if she/he fails the background check.

I dunno, I think US discrimination laws and laws relating to ethics are fairly straightforward, and there is no manipulating around by asking for one's birth certificate and social security card PRIOR to being interviewed.

That is unethical but sadly @Weezy1973is correct, if you do not comply, you likely will not be called for the interview. 

Not sure if the law is different for law enforcement or governmental agencies, I would think not since they are ones who made these laws in the first place. 

 

Edited September 5, 2021 by poppyfields

[lana-banana]

13 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Thank you I understand that and agree. 

But before the interview?  Not my understanding of the laws protecting potential employees against discrimination.

A background check is performed after the employee is offered and accepts the position, but can be reneged if she/he fails the background check.

I dunno, I think US discrimination laws and laws relating to ethics are fairly straightforward, and there is no manipulating around by asking for one's birth certificate and social security card PRIOR to being interviewed.

That is unethical but sadly @Weezy1973is correct, if you do not comply, you likely will not be called for the interview. 

Not sure if the law is different for law enforcement or governmental agencies, I would think not since they are ones who made these laws in the first place. 

 

Again, this is not correct, and does not reflect an accurate understanding of how background/security checks work. When there is a law enforcement or national security nexus you can 100% conduct basic verification of employment/eligibility to work in the US/criminal record checks on employees with the individual's consent. 

source: my life and career

[poppyfields]

12 minutes ago, lana-banana said:

Again, this is not correct, and does not reflect an accurate understanding of how background/security checks work. When there is a law enforcement or national security nexus you can 100% conduct basic verification of employment/eligibility to work in the US/criminal record checks on employees with the individual's consent. 

source: my life and career

Ok then I will defer to you since you have direct experience and thanks again, I just learned something new! 

Edited September 5, 2021 by poppyfields

[Wiseman2]

On 9/1/2021 at 7:57 PM, Katkats7777 said:

Applied for a position at a police station to work in the HR dept. I got an email from HR telling me she would for me to come in and bring in my documents like birth certificate, social security, ID so that she can make copies for "paperwork" and testing. 

Background checks. Driving record, criminal or arrest record, credit reports, citizenship status, etc.

If you are applying in a police dept. there will be more scrutiny than say bagging groceries.