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Am I walking into another heartbreak or could this really be heading somewhere?

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DatingMom Established Member

DatingMom

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Hello everyone. I am back with more dating questions! This forum has been so helpful in the past! As some of you might remember, my last post here was about walking away from a guy who needed time to deal with his own issues, and didn't feel ready for a relationship quite yet. That was early June. Although I was a bit heartbroken, I felt at peace with my decision, and decided to slowly go back to meeting new people.

Within a week I met this guy online who I started chatting with very regularly. When we met in person, I was surprised about how much I liked him: he was just very chill, smart, good conversationalist and extremely handsome. Summer was busy, and after that first date we only got to see each other every two weeks for June and July, and it's only been in the past few weeks that we managed to see each other once a week. For this reason, things developed very slowly, despite having sex on the second date. At first, we would often go a few days without texting (we're both texters and not so much phone people I would say), but then have those very long conversations over text a few times per week touching anything from what's happening in Afghanistan, to the insufficiencies of environmental policies, to our childhood traumas to what flavour ice cream our kids like. Last weekend, for the first time, we had a sleep over. He came in the afternoon for a bike ride, and left the next afternoon. Since then, he's been texting me like clockwork every evening for hours. And even when he spends the day with his kids, he checks in to see how I'm doing, sends me photos of his kids' activities and gives me an update on his day. 

In our flurry of texts and in person conversations, I got a sense that he is fishing for information about how I envision my future. With his ex wife, they were living about 45 minutes outside of the city because she's a doctor in the hospital there, and he's a freelance software developer that works from home. So living close to her work made sense. And the kids go to school there now also. So, I noticed early on that he was discussing his plans/ideas of what to do with his future and asking me my thoughts on it. He's currently rented an apartment downtown to give him time to figure out what his long term plan is. I'll come back to this, but I should add that assets with his ex haven't been divided yet despite the separation having taken place two years ago, and I think he was kind of waiting to see if she would keep the house and buy him out, and then he could invest that money elsewhere. Although he says that he also has enough down payment right now to buy a house without waiting for the assets to be separated. Anyway, as I said, he was mentioning early on that he might wait a bit to decide on where to live permanently as it would be nicer to buy with someone else. He also asked me on different occasions what I thought about the town where he was living (I actually had never even heard of it before we met!) and if I ever could see myself moving there. He even asked me if my mom would ever envision moving out of the city! My mom lives 5 minutes away from my house downtown. I finally told him that I would never move out of the city because my kids go to school here and their friends are here etc. Besides, I like living downtown. I don't want to live somewhere where I have to drive everywhere. 

Then, last week we were talking about speakers. He was teasing me about my poor quality sound system, and then said " are we ready to move in together? Lol. I have much better knives than you too". I kind of diffused the question by joking around, then 30 minutes later he came back to the topic and said that actually my house would be just perfect for all of us since it has so many bedrooms (he has 4 kids and I have 2!), and that his brother and his niece and nephew live just up the street, so even better. And he could just rent an office in the town where kids go to school, therefore avoiding lots of commuting to drop off kids!

Sorry, this is getting long! I just wanted to give the context of our meeting and our exchanges. Overall, although we have been communicating since quite some time now, we actually have only seen each other I think about 6 times. Scheduling issues were all on my side since I had family in town, and visiting friends and family over the summer. Things will get back to a more regular schedule for me in a couple of weeks. During these months, I went on many dates with other guys, and there is actually another guy who has expressed strong interest in dating me recently. It's therefore not as if I have concentrated all my energy and effort on this guy. But now, a few months down the road, I came to realize that I actually really like him a lot, and from our conversations, I get the sense that he perhaps does to, and that he seems at the very least to be daydreaming about living with someone again as a reconstructed family. To be honest, that would be my ideal relationship as well, although I am open to other possibilities.

So, one thing I left out, and that one is kind of big I think. He is on very very bad terms with his ex wife, essentially because after the separation she decided she was going to move back home (she's from Saskatchewan and we're in Ontario) with the kids, and he refused to grant her the right to do that because he wants 50-50 custody. They have been in Court over this for over a year now. She's been playing extremely dirty, and at some point he had to call the police on her because she physically threatened him with an axe! From what I understand, her mother passed away a few years ago, and she completely lost it after that. She had a breakdown, and then wanted a divorce and has been trying to move back home with the kids (which is something he had suggested to her towards the end of their marriage, but she said "I don't want to go with you"). He had to take a break from the custody battle last winter as he said it was getting really overwhelming psychologically and he could see the negative effects of it on the kids. He recently got a new lawyer, and will resume the case. It seems things are looking like this might be over in the next 6 months and he'll win, but I mean who knows? Once this Court thingy is settled, they will have an official agreement and divorce documents. 

I know how everyone feels on this forum about recently separated men that are still dealing with marital issues. And my experiences in the past year have definitely proven everyone right on that. In that sense, I definitely have no interest of walking into another heartbreak! With this guy I feel though that although his life is a mess right now, that he's solid and not afraid of commitment, and that things might work out if I just give him enough time and space to settle things with the ex. Am I deluding myself? What is everyone's opinion?

 

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Pumpernickel Established Member

Pumpernickel

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1 hour ago, DatingMom said:

although his life is a mess right now, that he's solid and not afraid of commitment, and that things might work out if I just give him enough time and space to settle things with the ex

I think you’re getting way ahead of yourself. 
 

He sounds like a dreamer, with his head in the clouds at best, and like a womanizer who uses the same lines on every woman he dates, at worst. And if it’s something in-between, he’s just a guy who’s confused & unfocused. (Not great!)

Why am I saying this? Because you guys hardly know each other, you met in June/July, and you’ve met 6 times? In between you text one another, and that’s it. Very early. Too early to even think about blending families. I’d be suspicious of a man who talks about moving in together (even if it’s just a joke on his part, or innocent banter), a man who is responsible for 4 children, and who isn’t even divorced yet. Very strange. Also - badmouthing his wife? Bad trait. She “went crazy after her mother died”? I doubt it. Have you done some research on that? I would be very cautious here. 
 

And you yourself - you’re falling for that banter. Don’t take it seriously! (at least, not quite yet!!!)

At the same time you’re dating other guys, in order to explore (which you should - enjoy dating and your new freedom!!!) - But I think you’re way too flattered by that guy’s “future plans”. He has no business making plans at this point. He has nothing figured out. He has nothing sorted out. Let him get his s*** together and date him casually in the meantime, if you have to. You guys have no business talking future plans. And blending fams with six kids combined? Good luck with that. How old are the kids? I would not even entertain that thought if I knew the guy super-well & if I had been in a serious R with the guy for years.

And honestly - I think he’s very aware of that, while you make the mistake of over-interpreting what he’s actually saying. “Do you like my town? Would you and/or your mother live here? Oh, I’d like to live in your city, because my cousin lives there as well.” Etc etc - That’s all very non-specific. See it for what it is. He’s just making conversation - nothing more

Edited by Pumpernickel
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stillafool Established Member

stillafool

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1 hour ago, DatingMom said:

I know how everyone feels on this forum about recently separated men that are still dealing with marital issues. And my experiences in the past year have definitely proven everyone right on that. In that sense, I definitely have no interest of walking into another heartbreak!

Then don't.

 

1 hour ago, DatingMom said:

I kind of diffused the question by joking around, then 30 minutes later he came back to the topic and said that actually my house would be just perfect for all of us since it has so many bedrooms (he has 4 kids and I have 2!), and that his brother and his niece and nephew live just up the street, so even better. And he could just rent an office in the town where kids go to school, therefore avoiding lots of commuting to drop off kids!

This guy seems like he's looking for a new and cheaper place to live.  Glad to see you didn't entertain this.

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DatingMom Established Member

DatingMom

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2 hours ago, Pumpernickel said:

I think you’re getting way ahead of yourself. 
 

He sounds like a dreamer, with his head in the clouds at best, and like a womanizer who uses the same lines on every woman he dates, at worst. And if it’s something in-between, he’s just a guy who’s confused & unfocused. (Not great!)

Why am I saying this? Because you guys hardly know each other, you met in June/July, and you’ve met 6 times? In between you text one another, and that’s it. Very early. Too early to even think about blending families. I’d be suspicious of a man who talks about moving in together (even if it’s just a joke on his part, or innocent banter), a man who is responsible for 4 children, and who isn’t even divorced yet. Very strange. Also - badmouthing his wife? Bad trait. She “went crazy after her mother died”? I doubt it. Have you done some research on that? I would be very cautious here. 
 

And you yourself - you’re falling for that banter. Don’t take it seriously! (at least, not quite yet!!!)

At the same time you’re dating other guys, in order to explore (which you should - enjoy dating and your new freedom!!!) - But I think you’re way too flattered by that guy’s “future plans”. He has no business making plans at this point. He has nothing figured out. He has nothing sorted out. Let him get his s*** together and date him casually in the meantime, if you have to. You guys have no business talking future plans. And blending fams with six kids combined? Good luck with that. How old are the kids? I would not even entertain that thought if I knew the guy super-well & if I had been in a serious R with the guy for years.

Thanks Pumpernickel for your comment. He might be confused and unfocused, but I don't think he's a womanizer. I've know womanizers, and he doesn't seem like one. I even doubt he's dating anyone else. I think that he honestly just doesn't like being single and living by himself. Of course, that is the last reason to rush into another relationship and even less moving in with someone. I certainly don't want to be in that train wreck! That being said, I'm just wondering if things could work out if I just slowed everything down a bit. 

As for his ex, I might have drawn a wrong portrait because he doesn't badmouth her at all actually. He's an extremely compassionate person. I think he understands that she's hurt and and why she wants to move back. He was willing to move back for her when they were still together. But now, he doesn't really want to move there for her as they are no longer together. He has been hurt too since she just got up one day and told him, after 20 years of marriage, that she no longer loved him and wanted a divorce. She didn't want to discuss it or try therapy. I wouldn't want to accommodate her wish either if I were him!

 

Edited by DatingMom
Wiseman2 Established Member

Wiseman2

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The problem with this is that it pushes building a relationship to the backburner and his divorce, ex, court, etc. takes center stage.🎭

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DatingMom Established Member

DatingMom

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41 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

The problem with this is that it pushes building a relationship to the backburner and his divorce, ex, court, etc. takes center stage.🎭

Yes, that is definitely how I see it too. I kind of saw that from the start and for this reason didn't really expect this to be going anywhere. But then somehow we kept seeing each other. I guess part of me thinks that if I wait it out, wait for him to settle his differences with the ex, we can see from there. You know, kind of take it slow and casual until then. The other part of me thinks that by the time this is all settled, I'll be pretty attached and what if it draws out? What if things don't go as expected? 

I feel like I'm constantly over thinking things. Maybe I just need to learn to go with the flow! 

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divegrl Established Member

divegrl

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Just remember, there are 2 sides to everts story. I would be very cautious of a man that says his ex is crazy. In my experience, it’s the guy that drove them crazy….. but I digress. 
 

This man is not ready to date. There is a good chance that the ex will win the custody and be able to move back home. Since he works remote, he can easily relocate to be closer to the kids. 
 

And it’s just way to early for any of this… at a couple months. 
 

Wishing you the best. 

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Ami1uwant Established Member

Ami1uwant

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2 hours ago, DatingMom said:

Yes, that is definitely how I see it too. I kind of saw that from the start and for this reason didn't really expect this to be going anywhere. But then somehow we kept seeing each other. I guess part of me thinks that if I wait it out, wait for him to settle his differences with the ex, we can see from there. You know, kind of take it slow and casual until then. The other part of me thinks that by the time this is all settled, I'll be pretty attached and what if it draws out? What if things don't go as expected? 

I feel like I'm constantly over thinking things. Maybe I just need to learn to go with the flow! 

I am unfamiliar with Canadian divorce process and how long divorces should take.

If his version is true that she wants to move out  of ON with the kids could produce a big stressful event Especially if she wins.

 

allf this says for you to not to pursue this until they are done.

 

 

 

Ami1uwant Established Member

Ami1uwant

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6 minutes ago, divegrl said:

Just remember, there are 2 sides to everts story. I would be very cautious of a man that says his ex is crazy. In my experience, it’s the guy that drove them crazy….. but I digress. 
 

This man is not ready to date. There is a good chance that the ex will win the custody and be able to move back home. Since he works remote, he can easily relocate to be closer to the kids. 
 

And it’s just way to early for any of this… at a couple months. 
 

Wishing you the best. 

Stop…..it’s the woman.

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poppyfields Established Member

poppyfields

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Posted (edited)
33 minutes ago, divegrl said:

Just remember, there are 2 sides to everts story. I would be very cautious of a man that says his ex is crazy. In my experience, it’s the guy that drove them crazy….. but I digress. 

Or not the guy per se but the situation, their dynamic; in a relationship it takes two to make "crazy" imo.

I really dislike when one person is blamed, because a different partner might have a completely different reaction/response to their behavior.

Other than that, I agree, it's a red flag when a man or woman badmouths their ex in that way. Even IF on some level they deserve it.

@DatingMomI see you doing the same thing with this man as you did with the previous man.

Wearing rose colored goggles, speculating and going off his "potential" (based on your expectations and hopes) telling yourself if only you wait it out a bit longer.

Basically like living in a Disney movie! Lol

I have an idea.   Instead of placing so much focus on who you want him (or any man) to be or hope him to be, base your decision to date him on who he is now, today, in the present.

No "waiting a bit longer" that's the mistake you made with the last guy, he never did turn into your prince charming and left you feeling disappointed and hurt.

 

 

Edited by poppyfields
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divegrl Established Member

divegrl

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@poppyfields Yes. I think that is what I am trying to say. The truth is usually in between the 2 different versions of events.

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poppyfields Established Member

poppyfields

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3 minutes ago, divegrl said:

@poppyfields Yes. I think that is what I am trying to say. The truth is usually in between the 2 different versions of events.

There's a saying "there is your version, there is their version, and there is the truth which lies somewhere in the middle."

So true! 

We should keep this in mind when reading all these threads!  

Edited by poppyfields
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Pumpernickel Established Member

Pumpernickel

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12 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

We should keep this in mind when reading all these threads!  

Yes, and the fact that the OP even mentions a “crazy” ex-wife combined with the fact that she’s already entertaining blended family scenarios speaks volumes. Not healthy.

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glows Established Member

glows

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Absolutely not. He is a complete mess and looking for an escape. You’re nothing but his flying carpet. Let him spend more time completing the divorce and spend time with someone who is a bit more ready for a relationship if that’s what you want. 

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spiderowl Established Member

spiderowl

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This could become more in the long term but I would be very wary of moving in with him anywhere.  He is not used to being on his own and sounds pretty desperate to be part of a family again.  While this is understandable, it is not necessarily the best decision for you and him at the moment.  You are in the early dating stage not the 'moving in together' stage.  You could talk to him about how it is early days and you want to be sure you are making decisions for the right reasons.

It's natural he's going to want to see a way through the mess that he has been facing.  His new girlfriend, their blended family, all conveniently close sounds perfect, but he really doesn't know if he's in love with you yet or if it is the idea of living as a family and not alone that appeals to him.

You sound very level-headed so I doubt you will be taking any irrevocable steps with him, like buying a house together or anything like that.

I would allow at least a year of dating before you decide to make any serious commitment-type moves.  You need to get to know each other better.  He needs to resolve his divorce and settle child custody arrangements.   He is naturally clinging on to anything positive in his life at the moment.  It could be that you two will be perfect for each other, just take a reasonable time to get to know him.

Miss Spider Established Member

Miss Spider

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How old is he 

HadMeOverABarrel Established Member

HadMeOverABarrel

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Slow and steady wins the race. I would answer his questions honestly but also keep my feet firmly planted on the ground so-to-speak. I echo he's not ready for a committed relationship. I'd keep the pace with him slow, no big milestones like moving in together or introducing kids, and keep your options open to others (but be honest about this with him). You two have not agreed to be exclusive, have you?

ShyViolet Established Member

ShyViolet

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You met this guy TWO MONTHS ago, and he is constantly bringing up moving in together.  I'm sorry but that is a red flag.  This forum is filled with story after story of people who start talking about moving in together, or DO move in together, after knowing each other a ridiculously short time.  Over and over again, we see that these relationships crash and burn just as fast as they began.  It's foolish and irresponsible to move that fast in a relationship.  Especially when kids are involved.  If you like him, then great, but tell him that he needs to stop bringing up this ridiculous idea of moving in together.  That shouldn't even be brought up until you've known each other a year, and until this divorce craziness is completely resolved.

Gaeta Established Member

Gaeta

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I would not beleive one thing he said about having money and more assets coming his way through his divorce. What l see is a man inviting himself to live under your roof after 6 dates. Big flashing red lights with sirens on. 

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introverted1 Established Member

introverted1

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You've seen him 6 times, had sex, but went on "many dates" with other guys?  Are you two even exclusive at this point? That's the move that might be appropriate right now:  date exclusively and see how things progress.

As for this:

16 hours ago, DatingMom said:

He has been hurt too since she just got up one day and told him, after 20 years of marriage, that she no longer loved him and wanted a divorce. She didn't want to discuss it or try therapy.

Really?  Just out of the blue, no warning, his ex decided to toss away 20 years?  Either he was clueless to issues in the marriage or (less likely based on what you've shared) she has someone else.  Either way, this is a giant red flag imo.

WRT his custody battle, I don't know anything about Canadian law, but if she can argue the kids have a support system and relatives in Saskatchewan, and he has the freedom to work from home, I am not as convinced this will go his way. 

 

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DatingMom Established Member

DatingMom

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Good morning everyone. Thank you for your comments. First of all, I just wanted to address the "crazy ex". As I said above in a comment somewhere, I used the word crazy, not him. Just based on the stories he told me. But he isn't actually badmouthing her at all. There are two sides to every story, and yes she did break the marriage "all of a sudden" but it was after many years of marital difficulties where he kept suggesting therapy and she refused to try. He has told me many stories of things that he did in the relationship that he regrets now. I don't get the sense that he blames it all on her. What he does blame on her is not having tried harder to save their marriage when he was willing to do so. 

Other questions:

He's 39 (I'm 43).

No we are not exclusive. I mean, we haven't talked about it, but I haven't slept with anyone else but have gone on other dates. I don't think he slept with anyone else. He might have gone on other dates but I doubt recently because he pretty much keeps me in the loop of his actions. Then again, his tennis match might have been a date. I've certainly done that. I wouldn't blame him if he did. 

As for the moving in together part: I didn't get the sense from him that he was entertaining the idea of doing this soon, but more trying to figure out if I could fit into his life long term. If it could work out. On my end, I certainly would never under any circumstances move in with someone and merge families before dating at least one year. And certainly not if there is a custody battle still hanging over his head. 

10 hours ago, Gaeta said:

I would not beleive one thing he said about having money and more assets coming his way through his divorce. What l see is a man inviting himself to live under your roof after 6 dates. Big flashing red lights with sirens on. 

I see your point, but I don't think this is the case. He actually has been house shopping on his own for the past two months, and is pre-approved by the bank. I don't see why he would be making this up.

All that to say, that I totally agree with all of you on: 1) there is a possibility he might loose the custody battle. 2) he is not in a place right now in his life where he can make a serious commitment because too many things are up in the air for him 

I guess my question to myself and to this forum is whether this is worth pursuing. I'll be honest that I like this guy a lot and I like the idea of one day moving into a blended family scenario. That being said, I also know that there are other fish out there, and if this doesn't work out, there will be other options. Better options? I don't know! 

My other dilemma is also (same as before!), that I feel uncomfortable about the multiple dating thing, especially when it comes to having multiple sexual partners. I haven't done this yet, because I've always felt uncomfortable about it. This other guy who is interested I've been putting off seeing again because I know sex will come up soon, if not next date the one after. And I also feel bad about leading people on. Like I need to disclose my actions to everyone if that's what I'm going to be doing. I know technically it's ok to continue dating other people while you're not exclusive with someone, but I have moral issues with it somehow. I keep doing it because I don't want to put all my eggs in one basket, but then I feel bad about it. Does that make sense?

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Weezy1973 Established Member

Weezy1973

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14 minutes ago, DatingMom said:

Does that make sense?

I’m all for multidating in the early stages, but I think after almost two months of talking and six dates it’s fine to date this guy exclusively. Just have that conversation with him. 

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smackie9 Established Member

smackie9

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In Canada you have to be separated for one year before applying for a divorce. Custody of the kids is a separate court and the court decides what happens to the kids. Divorce can take a few years, depending on hoe long it takes to split and liquidate assets, etc.

I think his wife gave him the boot and he needs a cheaper way to live. She's staying in the house with the kids I imagine, and he is responsible to keep her in the lifestyle she is accustom to. He's in a bad spot financially most likely. As Gaeta said..red lights flashing and sirens are going off here.

Edited by smackie9
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GeorgiaPeach1 Established Member

GeorgiaPeach1

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First, he is still married. 

Second, he doesn't know you well enough to make all these future plans with. This guy is lovebombing and Future Faking you. My guess is that he's doing this to run from his emotions regarding his marital issues.

Third, be careful about assuming things about his wife. You are only getting one side of the story. Remember, he was once telling her all the same sugary sweet things he's telling you. 

 

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DatingMom Established Member

DatingMom

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36 minutes ago, smackie9 said:

In Canada you have to be separated for one year before applying for a divorce. Custody of the kids is a separate court and the court decides what happens to the kids. Divorce can take a few years, depending on hoe long it takes to split and liquidate assets, etc.

I think his wife gave him the boot and he needs a cheaper way to live. She's staying in the house with the kids I imagine, and he is responsible to keep her in the lifestyle she is accustom to. He's in a bad spot financially most likely. As Gaeta said..red lights flashing and sirens are going off here.

They've been separated since two years, living separately since that time also. She has stayed in the house with the kids, and will most likely keep the house, and buy him out. He is fine with that. He doesn't pay her anything at the moment and that's very unlikely to happen. She's a surgeon and makes 500k per year. So in reality she would owe him child support and spousal support, which she is currently not paying although he has the kids pretty much 50% at the moment. He think this might be part of the reason also that she wants full custody: because she doesn't want to pay him anything. Although he says that he doesn't care about the support, he would be happy to give it up if this would put an end to the court procedure. 

The reason they are not legally divorced yet is because they need to have a separation agreement in order to proceed with the divorce. And this is exactly what they are in court over. 

Anyway, I do think there are quite a few concerns in this situation here, but financials is not one of them I'm pretty sure. I think they're both pretty well off. He drives a 150,000$ car. He could just sell that to pay for a house down payment. 

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