Is it true that men do not find women attractive who are career ambitious?

[jspice]

15 minutes ago, Love Yourself First said:

the unattractive part of these scenarios is not her ambition or drive to have a career, it's the fact that these women want to, for example, tell us that a masculine woman is attractive... I mean, you can say a masculine woman is attractive, I understand you are creating a safe space, I get it, however in departure from that safe space, you are really not available to tell me or any man what is attractive and what is not, attraction is subjectively, but speaking subjectively, anecdotally and naturally, men typically find women who possess masculine traits to be unattractive, because we have been programmed throughout history to respond to feminity.

Now here is the real kicker and a lot of you ladies will agree with me im sure: I know a ton of women who are more masculine than some of my guy friends, a lot of men are raised by single mothers and instilled with feminine traits, these feminine men run circles around masculine women, their mothers have their sons back no matter what, no matter what, all you women know that, so why wouldn't she give him every advantage possible.

So yeah, I chalk it all up to changes in levels of masculinity and femininity, I mean this is nature, this is real life, we can't just change things and expect everything to just work as it did previously, furthermore the dating landscape is evolving every day, it's just pure chaos when you really think about it and that is totally fine with me, I see a beauty in it.

Nobody is telling anybody what to find attractive. 
People ARE saying “this is who I am. Like it or lump it.” They’re NOT saying, “ I want to be XYZ and you have love me” but rather “I’m XYZ and if love me that’s cool. If you don’t love me, that’s cool too.”

What the hell is a “masculine woman”. 
 

[Love Yourself First]

12 minutes ago, jspice said:

Nobody is telling anybody what to find attractive. 
People ARE saying “this is who I am. Like it or lump it.” They’re NOT saying, “ I want to be XYZ and you have love me” but rather “I’m XYZ and if love me that’s cool. If you don’t love me, that’s cool too.”

What the hell is a “masculine woman”. 
 

Well if a feminine woman is complicit and submissive, a masculine woman would be resistant and combative/dominant

Edited July 29, 2021 by Love Yourself First

[jspice]

6 minutes ago, Love Yourself First said:

Well if a feminine woman is complicit and submissive, a masculine woman would be resistant and combative/dominant

[basil67]

1 hour ago, Love Yourself First said:

Well if a feminine woman is complicit and submissive, a masculine woman would be resistant and combative/dominant

Being complicit means being associated with a crime or something of a questionable nature.  I think you were looking for another word.  

Is a masculine men also resistant and combative/dominant?   If so, why would women want a man who's pig headed and not a team player?  

 

Edited July 29, 2021 by basil67

[Weezy1973]

For me, I’d say that woman’s career ambition has literally zero impact on my attraction towards her in either direction. My wife is far more successful than me, but that had nothing to do with why I fell for her. She could have been unemployed and I still would have fallen in love with her. Or she could decide to end her career tomorrow and become an interpretive dancer and I still wouldn’t care. As long as she’s happy. 

 

Edited July 29, 2021 by Weezy1973

[Love Yourself First]

49 minutes ago, basil67 said:

Being complicit means being associated with a crime or something of a questionable nature.  I think you were looking for another word.  

Is a masculine men also resistant and combative/dominant?   If so, why would women want a man who's pig headed and not a team player?  

 

No, complicit is definitely the right word; there is a depth to the word in this context that won't be recognized, being complicit in this context in association to submission, to submit means to give in, but to be complicit means you are willingly an object, yeah its messed up, but let's face it, objectification is a 2 way street these days.

Ah, now you see! How can 2 pig headed people get along?

Want to know how masculine people get a long? It's a concept called Hierarchy, people who are masculine are constantly postering for a better position in the Hierarchy. Being a leader of a Hierarchy is a favorable position, because the leader of the Hierarchy dictates the morals of the group.

So let me ask you, do you believe I want some woman in my life who is going to be an actual competitor through her masculinity in my hierarchy, or do you think I want a woman who allows me to dictate her morals? 

Sorry if I'm going a bit over your head with Hierarchy and Morals, but this is essentially the social function behind masculinity.

[CaliforniaGirl]

3 hours ago, Love Yourself First said:

Feminine means complicit and submissive, you will be eaten alive by  cut throat corporate sociopaths, womanizers and potentially other women/men looking for your spot

Culturally it might, but biologically it sure doesn’t. In the wild any female animal is a force to be reckoned with, is aggressive in pursuing food and shelter for herself and her young, and will fight interlopers to the death.

[glows]

I find the masculine/feminizing polarizing, unattractive and outdated. It’s simply a turn off. As a woman, I wouldn’t date anyone who is so insecure.

Traits such as secure with one’s self, calm, motivated, assertive if need be, kind or intelligent (emotionally intelligent especially) are so much more important.

Edited July 29, 2021 by glows

[Love Yourself First]

4 minutes ago, CaliforniaGirl said:

Culturally it might, but biologically it sure doesn’t. In the wild any female animal is a force to be reckoned with, is aggressive in pursuing food and shelter for herself and her young, and will fight interlopers to the death.

Not if she has a man to do it for her.

[CaliforniaGirl]

Just now, Love Yourself First said:

Not if she has a man to do it for her.

Yes. Man or no man. You show me the mother who sees mortal danger and doesn't gather the kids and jump in front of them to kill or die, whichever fate decides, and I'll show you a mother who is either in a coma or really, really doesn't like her kids.

[basil67]

29 minutes ago, Love Yourself First said:

So let me ask you, do you believe I want some woman in my life who is going to be an actual competitor through her masculinity in my hierarchy, or do you think I want a woman who allows me to dictate her morals? 

Sorry if I'm going a bit over your head with Hierarchy and Morals, but this is essentially the social function behind masculinity.

No, you're not going over my head.

I don't know you well enough to guess at what you want.

On one hand, would say that if you are secure in your masculinity, you would relish a strong woman who forms a team with you, where you are both strong. On the other, if your masculinity is fragile, you would need a woman who has no strength, does what you says and will not stand against you, lest you feel threatened by her.

Are you secure of fragile?

 

Edited July 29, 2021 by basil67

[Miss Spider]

6 minutes ago, glows said:

I find the masculine/feminizing polarizing, unattractive and outdated

Agree.