poppyfields Posted July 18, 2021 Posted July 18, 2021 (edited) On 7/18/2021 at 10:39 AM, Calmandfocused said: A true narcissist cannot have a “successful” relationship. They are incapable of it. They cannot function a relationship like we can. Moderator add - Poppy's thread is a side shoot from the thread below Thank you for posting that. The reason I said "oh dear" in my previous post was because reading the list, my ex (long term relationship - 6 years) had 8 and possibly 9 of the traits listed. Absolutely no question, I knew him extremely well. Yet he treated me VERY well for many years, we were engaged and planning a wedding! I think now in retrospect, the reason he treated me so well (give or take which is standard in any LTR) was because of MY response to him, not due to any genuine feelings he had for me. If I had not been in constant admiration of him, believing and literally treating him like the King, the GOD he thought himself to be, I doubt we would have lasted so long. But after 5.5 years, I woke up, grew up, became more independent, stood up for myself, and began retreating from this never-never land I had created for myself. And I left the relationship. He was also a serious drug addict, but again in retrospect, that's not even relevant anymore. So while yes I agree with others that when we get burned/hurt, it's typical to start labeling your ex as this or that - NPD, BPD, sociopath, commitment-phobe or whatever -- to lessen the pain of rejection, sometimes the person genuinely does have some form of personality disorder/dysfunction It becomes fairly obvious even without having been formally diagnosed. Edited July 22, 2021 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Title 2
Author poppyfields Posted July 18, 2021 Author Posted July 18, 2021 (edited) To add, despite my independence, and valuing/loving myself, this is still a work in progress for me. Differentiating between a man having extreme high confidence, high value and self-love and NPD or another disorder. When we become infatuated, try as we might, we either overlook and/or simply refuse to see what becomes obvious later when infatuation fades and we take the blinders off. With my ex, owning that I wore those blinders for many YEARS, almost as if I had become brainwashed or something! Akin to Stockholm Syndrome if anyone is familiar with that. @Calmandfocusedmaybe you can relate? The good news is, I am aware of it now, and happy to say the new man I've been seeing, while having high confidence no doubt!!, appears quite functional, he also had a long successful marriage, his wife passed away a couple of years ago (cancer), which is how my mom died too. So we shall see! OP, apologies for making this about me, but thought my story might add some value to this thread and provide additional perspective. Edited July 18, 2021 by poppyfields 1
Calmandfocused Posted July 18, 2021 Posted July 18, 2021 19 minutes ago, poppyfields said: Thank you for posting that. The reason I said "oh dear" in my previous post was because reading the list, my ex (long term relationship - 6 years) had 8 and possibly 9 of the traits listed. Absolutely no question, I knew him extremely well. Yet he treated me VERY well for many years, we were engaged and planning a wedding! I think now in retrospect, the reason he treated me so well (give or take which is standard in any LTR) was because of MY response to him, not due to any genuine feelings he had for me. If I had not been in constant admiration of him, believing and literally treating him like the King, the GOD he thought himself to be, I doubt we would have lasted so long. But after 5.5 years, I woke up, grew up, became more independent, stood up for myself, and began retreating from this never-never land I had created for myself. And I left the relationship. He was also a serious drug addict, but again in retrospect, that's not even relevant anymore. So while yes I agree with others that when we get burned/hurt, it's typical to start labeling your ex as this or that - NPD, BPD, sociopath, commitment-phobe or whatever -- to lessen the pain of rejection, sometimes the person genuinely does have some form of personality disorder/dysfunction It becomes fairly obvious even without having been formally diagnosed. Hi Poppy. My bad, I didn’t read the replies, I went straight in response to the Op. Unfortunately the DSM classification of NPD is not particularly helpful and most specialists agree with that- we all display at least one or two of those symptoms FYI. What is more relevant is the mentality of narcissists and the function of their behaviour. No psychiatrist (worth their salt) would diagnose based on the DSM categories alone without considering the wider picture - narcs abuse patterns being one of them. What makes diagnosing NPD especially hard is the fact that Narcs do not see themselves through the lenses of others- they cannot. In the same way that a computer specialist will not sign up for a computer course for beginners, a narcissist who believes he is a master of the universe will not sign up to see a psychiatrist. For this reason IMO NPD is a lot more prevalent than we realise and vastly undiagnosed. That is not to say that everyone who behaves badly is a narc though! Far from it! To answer your question: Stockholm syndrome features massively in the victims of narcissistic abuse. It’s one of the factors that maintains the cycle and why the victims find it incredibly difficult to leave. In your example with your ex, if he was a narc, your adoration would have provided “supply” so he treated you well. Shut the supply off and it’s showtime! 1 1
Author poppyfields Posted July 18, 2021 Author Posted July 18, 2021 (edited) 21 minutes ago, Calmandfocused said: In your example with your ex, if he was a narc, your adoration would have provided “supply” so he treated you well. Shut the supply off and it’s showtime! Which is exactly what happened; it was when I stopped admiring him, stopped believing him to be KING, when his adoration for ME stopped. This happened simultaneously with my discovering his drug addiction and questioning/confronting him (HUGE no no in his eyes). He even began verbally abusing, and THAT was when I left the relationship. Anyway, I'm past it now, but thank you for your insight, so interesting! What is also interesting and I have discussed this in one of my threads, but my own mom possessed many NPD traits as well, and have been told I attract such types in a subconscious effort to heal my RL with her. A former poster who no longer posts @Watercolorsexplained this to me along with my therapist who I still see from time to time. God, this life stuff can be difficult sometimes! Lol Edited July 18, 2021 by poppyfields 1
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 54 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said: I wonder though if (most) narcissists are at least somewhat aware of the incongruity of reality vs their perceptions of themselves though? I hope you don’t mind me using you as an example, but you say you put up with mistreatment from this guy. Wouldn’t a narcissist be like, ‘how could they treat me this way? Don’t they know who I am? Wouldn’t a narcissist lash out in some way towards the person, or feel the person is to blame for not recognizing their place, instead of internalizing it as being their fault? I don’t really know much about this disorder as it’s not known to be responsive to medication, so forgive me if this is a dumb q. Cookies, can't speak for the OP, but like I said in my previous post, my ex treated me extremely well as long as I continually admired him and treated him like the king he thought he was, and he DID truly believe he was king, very superior. As sick as it sounds now, we both enjoyed that dynamic. Ugh. It was only when I confronted him about his drug addiction and stopped admiring him and believing him to be superior, when he began lashing out. Nothing verbally abusive at first but it was obvious I fell off my pedestal in his eyes. Once the verbal abuse started, I can't remember exactly, I think he called me a "fukkin bytch" which he had NEVER called me before, hardly even raised his voice, THAT is when I knew we were over and I walked out. I had changed too, so there was that. I can't even say with 100% certainty he was a narcissist, he never sought treatment for it. It was when I read the list that a light bulb went off because he did possess at least 8 of those traits. 1
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 2 minutes ago, poppyfields said: Cookies, can't speak for the OP, but like I said in my previous post, my ex treated me extremely well as long as I continually admired him and treated him like the king he thought he was, and he DID truly believe he was king, very superior. As sick as it sounds now, we both enjoyed that dynamic. Ugh. It was only when I confronted him about his drug addiction and stopped admiring him and believing him to be superior, when he began lashing out. Nothing verbally abusive at first but it was obvious I fell off my pedestal in his eyes. Once the verbal abuse started, I can't remember exactly, I think he called me a "fukkin bytch" which he had NEVER called me before, hardly even raised his voice, THAT is when I knew we were over and I walked out. I had changed too, so there was that. I can't even say with 100% certainty he was a narcissist, he never sought treatment for it. It was when I read the list that a light bulb went off because he did possess at least 8 of those traits. cookies, this was not my recent ex, this was a man I dated for six years, it ended in late 2015. I have changed A LOT since then! 1
Miss Spider Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 2 hours ago, poppyfields said: Cookies, can't speak for the OP, but like I said in my previous post, my ex treated me extremely well as long as I continually admired him and treated him like the king he thought he was, and he DID truly believe he was king, very superior. As sick as it sounds now, we both enjoyed that dynamic. Ugh. It was only when I confronted him about his drug addiction and stopped admiring him and believing him to be superior, when he began lashing out. Nothing verbally abusive at first but it was obvious I fell off my pedestal in his eyes. Once the verbal abuse started, I can't remember exactly, I think he called me a "fukkin bytch" which he had NEVER called me before, hardly even raised his voice, THAT is when I knew we were over and I walked out. I had changed too, so there was that. I can't even say with 100% certainty he was a narcissist, he never sought treatment for it. It was when I read the list that a light bulb went off because he did possess at least 8 of those traits. Thank you for sharing that, poppy. I am sorry that you went through that. He could be a narcissist. It is really hard to say, because there are so many things that can cause people to act horrible like that at times, I guess, mental/behavior issues and even substance abuse/withdraw that your ex might have struggled with? It’s difficult to know exactly, and it’s easy to try to grapple with the why. But his anger towards you for voicing your concern about his addiction was completely messed up and glad you didn’t tolerate that for any longer. I hate when guys call women ‘b****’ even jokingly, so I would have felt the same way. Im sorry, poppy. 1
Calmandfocused Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 Great post CG and you’re absolutely correct on those points. Poppy, one of the things that CG said triggered me to add this: A true narc cannot treat anyone consistently well for the length of time that your ex treated you well. The reason being is that a true Narc cannot be satisfied just by positive consistent love, adoration and attention (supply) for any length of time. Supply is given to a narcissist via a variety of different human emotions. Once the original (positive) supply gets stale they have to create drama to help reinforce how special and powerful they are - in other words; supply but fresh supply. They absolutely love tears and emotional outbursts from their victims. This feeds the narcissism big time. So taking this into account, and what you’ve told us, I’m 99% sure that your ex was not a narcissist. If he behaved himself for many years he cannot possibly be a narc. If he were, he would have gone out of his way to trigger your emotional distress way before he did. But like I said: this doesn’t mean he didn’t have narcissistic traits. Most of us do . Also not being a narc does not mitigate the fact that he was emotionally and verbally abusive either. Abusers are not necessarily narcissists but all narcissists are abusers. 3
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 36 minutes ago, Calmandfocused said: So taking this into account, and what you’ve told us, I’m 99% sure that your ex was not a narcissist. If he behaved himself for many years he cannot possibly be a narc. If he were, he would have gone out of his way to trigger your emotional distress way before he did. But like I said: this doesn’t mean he didn’t have narcissistic traits. Most of us do . Also not being a narc does not mitigate the fact that he was emotionally and verbally abusive either. Abusers are not necessarily narcissists but all narcissists are abusers. Okay @Calmandfocused thank you for that. I really didn't think he was either until I read the list and I was like hmmmm, maybe. What triggered the verbal abuse was the drugs, he was high on meth and coke! I told him he needed to get himself into rehab or we were DONE. That is when he lashed out. Never went to rehab, so I left. After I walked out, THAT is when he went to rehab. But this isn't about me, it's about the OP, I just wanted to clarify. And also that I myself at times thought I might be NPD, but like you and @CaliforniaGirl said we all possess at least some of the traits, some of the time, that's human. Interesting thread!!
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) 53 minutes ago, Calmandfocused said: So taking this into account, and what you’ve told us, I’m 99% sure that your ex was not a narcissist. If he behaved himself for many years he cannot possibly be a narc. If he were, he would have gone out of his way to trigger your emotional distress way before he did. One more question and hopefully this will help the OP too, but re what's in bold, is this intentional? Like do they consciously say to themselves -- I am going to create some chaos, trigger my partner's tears, emotional distress, anxiety and insecurity to feed my ego or whatever it is a narcissist needs to feel whole and complete, or whatever it is that drives them? What happens when a woman (or man if roles were reversed) doesn't respond the way they want and stands up for herself and doesn't become the insecure emotional mess he's aiming for? Will he respect her for it? Are narcissists capable of actually respecting their partners? Edited July 20, 2021 by poppyfields
Calmandfocused Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, poppyfields said: One more question and hopefully this will help the OP too, but re what's in bold, is this intentional? Like do they consciously say to themselves -- I am going to create some chaos, trigger my partner's tears, emotional distress, anxiety and insecurity to feed my ego or whatever it is a narcissist needs to feel whole and complete, or whatever it is that drives them? What happens when a woman doesn't respond the way they want and stands up for herself and doesn't become the insecure emotional mess he's aiming for? Yes and no. The majority of narcs have no clue why they do what they do. But what’s true in all narcissists is that they are driven by a “need” to do what they do. Some understand it and know what they are but the vast majority do not. They are driven to act narky in the same way that all of us are driven to eat and drink. Supply is their life blood. They cannot function without it. Yes a lot narcs intend to hurt us but they don’t understand why they have the intent. They know what they want and need from us, they just don’t understand why they need it. The function of the narcissism is to trigger human reaction and emotion (the supply) it doesn’t matter what the emotion is. They just want it. Any of it. The more intense the emotions, the more supply the narc receives. They feel satisfied and sedated … until supply levels drop again and they need more fuel. So standing up for yourself and being strong is just more supply/ fuel for the narc. They love that reaction, any reaction. However what this may do is trigger a fear response in the narc m- they fear that their supply will leave them/ cut off, hence they ramp up the love/ affection again to stop their victims leaving. Most narcs are highly intelligent. The best way to hurt a narc is to ignore them. They cannot bear it. This is physically painful to a narc. It triggers their underlying low self esteem. In which case they react by ramping up their Narcy behaviours in order to get the supply flowing again. 1
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, Calmandfocused said: The best way to hurt a narc is to ignore them. They cannot bear it. This is physically painful to a narc. It triggers their underlying low self esteem. In which case they react by ramping up their Narcy behaviours in order to get the supply flowing again. I read something about this awhile back, years ago, I think it was right after my ex (the one referenced in this thread) and I split. It's the "I'm the best, I'm the worst" mentality. When the object of a narc's affection responds positively - admires him, respects him, in his eyes he's the BEST. And feels free to scrutinize all her flaws and imperfections and even use them against her when necessary. On the other hand, when the object of a narc's affection ignores him or rejects him, suddenly he feels like the WORST. Like you said it triggers their underlying low self-esteem and neediness. They loathe themselves. It's so sad, on some level it triggers my desire to nurture and want to help, you know? Probably not the best way to deal with it though.
Miss Spider Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, poppyfields said: Okay @Calmandfocused thank you for that. I really didn't think he was either until I read the list and I was like hmmmm, maybe. What triggered the verbal abuse was the drugs, he was high on meth and coke! I told him he needed to get himself into rehab or we were DONE. That is when he lashed out. Never went to rehab, so I left. After I walked out, THAT is when he went to rehab. But this isn't about me, it's about the OP, I just wanted to clarify. And also that I myself at times thought I might be NPD, but like you and @CaliforniaGirl said we all possess at least some of the traits, some of the time, that's human. Interesting thread!! I have had friends and even exes who did a fair amount of coke and I hate that stuff. It’s a scientific fact it makes people d*cks. I’d watch my friends pass around a plate and then argue about the most inane bs. When ex did it, I noticed it made him arrogant and irritating too , when he was normally pretty cool. So fck that mess. Meth just seems Edited July 20, 2021 by Cookiesandough 1 1
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) 8 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said: I have had friends and even exes who did a fair amount of coke and I hate that stuff. It’s a scientific fact it makes people d*cks. When ex did it, I noticed it made him a arrogant and irritating when he was normally pretty cool, so fck that mess. I can’t even image that mixed with meth. Meth just seems Yup I hear ya cookies, it was pretty bad, I was a member of another forum at the time and created several threads about it, I was in BAD shape after I left even though it was my choice to leave. I really struggled with the decision. I won't bore anyone with the details here, it's not my thread, only to say he got clean, and we are both very happy today and better off NOT together. In retrospect and even though he treated me well for the most part (prior to him becoming addicted and out of control), our RL was toxic in other ways. Or maybe toxic is the wrong word, but rather, unhealthy. And thank you for your kind words in your other post, I could tell they were sincere and that you care. xoxo Edited July 20, 2021 by poppyfields 1
Calmandfocused Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) On 7/21/2021 at 4:54 AM, poppyfields said: I read something about this awhile back, years ago, I think it was right after my ex (the one referenced in this thread) and I split. It's the "I'm the best, I'm the worst" mentality. When the object of a narc's affection responds positively - admires him, respects him, in his eyes he's the BEST. And feels free to scrutinize all her flaws and imperfections and even use them against her when necessary. On the other hand, when the object of a narc's affection ignores him or rejects him, suddenly he feels like the WORST. Like you said it triggers their underlying low self-esteem and neediness. They loathe themselves. It's so sad, on some level it triggers my desire to nurture and want to help, you know? Probably not the best way to deal with it though. Correct. The narcissist doesn’t scrutinise, he educates. He likes to learn everything there is to know about his victims. Not because he cares, or that he is even interested. Its about him and him only. The function of this education is to provide supply. He can readily flip flop in terms of how he uses this education about his victims. So for example; one minute, the narc can be parading his partner (victim), bragging about her looks, accomplishments , wealth etc to seek positive reactions from others (external supply), to the next minute calling his partner a “stuck up” and accusing her of thinking she’s better than everyone else (her shock, despair, bewilderment also provides supply). From his partner’s perspective this flip flop behaviour makes no sense whatsoever. What she’s failing to understand however is that his behaviour serves a purpose for him. Unfortunately you can’t help Poppy. The best thing to do is avoid them like the plague. Empaths are the perfect targets. Narcs are drawn to empaths like flies are to s**t. They will beg for your help but note that cannot and will not change. Not ever. Some may at some point realise there is something wrong with them but unfortunately at that point the narcissism is too entrenched. Narcissism is basically a defence mechanism. Deep down he hates himself and will do anything to protect facing who he is truly is. That’s the theory. But from a real life perspective they can be very dangerous and most victims need therapy after dealing with one. I certainly did. Edited July 21, 2021 by a LoveShack.org Moderator language
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) I am sorry you experienced that Calm, but the takeaway is you learned from it, became stronger and are now in a position to help others! I cannot imagine remaining with a narcissist long enough for him to do any damage to me though. That first "you stuck up bytch, you think you're better than everyone else"? Without provocation? I AM OUTTA THERE!! No matter how intoxicating the chemistry! One final question. Is there a difference between sociopath and narcissist with regard to how they view themselves and treat others? Edited July 21, 2021 by a LoveShack.org Moderator removed quote due to language
Calmandfocused Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 1 hour ago, poppyfields said: I am sorry you experienced that Calm, but the takeaway is you learned from it, became stronger and are now in a position to help others! I cannot imagine remaining with a narcissist long enough for him to do any damage to me though. That first "you stuck up bytch, you think you're better than everyone else"? Without provocation? I AM OUTTA THERE!! No matter how intoxicating the chemistry! One final question. Is there a difference between sociopath and narcissist with regard to how they view themselves and treat others? It’s ok Poppy, I love talking about narcissism. Fire away! Yes most of the time there is no provocation or if there is it’s minor. On the other hand a narc can react one way to a trigger one day and react differently on a different day to the same trigger. It all depends on his fuel levels. That’s why it’s confuses victims. The behaviour often makes 0 sense from one day to the next. In order to understand why a victim would tolerate the verbal abuse you would need to understand ensnarement. This takes place at the very beginning of the relationship. It manifests itself as Lovebombing and is designed to attach the victim to the narcissist. It gets the victim into position. That’s why I always say that Lovebombing is the most dangerous part of the cycle. Once you’re ensnared, it’s very difficult to untangle. This is where your Stockholm Syndrome comes in. Sociopathology is not my area of expertise. However as part of my narcissistic research I did come across 2 key differences: 1) sociopaths behave how they want, when they want whereas a narcissist is concerned about how the public perceives him. He is capable of exerting self control in this circumstances, 2) narcissists do understand the law (and fear consequence) and are therefore generally outwardly law abiding, whereas a sociopath will not be concerned about consequence. Both do not feel remorse and neither are capable of empathy. 2
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) I am VERY familiar with love bombing, all my boyfriends have love bombed me in one way or the other. The thing with me though is that while I can be very dreamy and romantic, I am also quite pragmatic, meaning I don't take the love bombing too seriously, as I know why it's occurring and it's only temporary. I simply enjoy the attention for what it is but again don't take it too seriously. THEY don't know that, that's between me and myself. I will never say never but that's why I think I would never fall victim to a narc. I am too "earthy" for lack of a better word. And like I said, no matter how intoxicating the chemistry, that first verbal abusive remark, and I am GONE. Like with my ex, he called me names" I packed my bags, left a note and was gone.... I don't mess around with that at all!! And I lost even more respect for him after he said it also, which is why I thought I might be a narc myself! But I'm not, I just possess a few traits like we all do, which is normal and healthy (self love). Edited July 21, 2021 by a LoveShack.org Moderator language 1
Miss Spider Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) 20 minutes ago, poppyfields said: I am VERY familiar with love bombing, all my boyfriends have love bombed me in one way or the other. The thing with me though is that while I can be very romantic, I am also quite pragmatic, meaning I don't take the love bombing too seriously, as I know why it's occurring and it's only temporary. I simply enjoy the attention for what it is but again don't take it too seriously. THEY don't know that, that's between me and myself. I will never say never but that's why I think I would never fall victim to a narc. I am too "earthy" for lack of a better word. And like I said, no matter how intoxicating the chemistry, that first verbal abusive remark, and I am GONE. Like with my ex, he called me a "fukkin bytch" I packed my bags, left a note and was gone.... I don't mess around with that at all!! ‘Lovebombing’ is a confusing term for me . Can you explain it like I’m five Because the way it’s defined in calmandfocused’s post and how I often see it seems to imply it’s nefarious or there’s some kind of agenda behind it to manipulate someone? I asked because how does one then know if it’s not genuine excitement about a person vs lovebomb? Like if someone said that a person was the one after the first date, and they actually ended up spending the rest of their life together, is it still lovebombing at the time? Because that happened (my grandma and grandpa) Edited July 20, 2021 by Cookiesandough
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 4 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said: ‘Lovebombing’ is a confusing term for me . Can you explain it like I’m give Because the way it’s defined in calmandfocused’s post and how I often see it seems to imply it’s nefarious or there’s some kind of agenda behind it to manipulate someone? I asked because how does one then know if it’s not genuine excitement about a person vs lovebomb? Like if someone said that a person was the one after the first date, and they actually ended up spending the rest of their life together, is it still lovebombing at the time? Because that happened (my grandma and grandpa) To me it's over-excitement, an over abundance of attention, that is how I am defining it. Which is sort of par for the course when you meet someone you're attracted to and excited about! Both women and men are guilty of this, although it's never been my nature do so, go overboard with the attention like that. I am always a bit reserved and detached in the beginning, which may not be the best approach either! There is more than one way to define it though, because it can also be used as a manipulation, which perhaps is how Calm is defining it. A calculated effort to seek out women (or men) who appear vulnerable and using it as a way to pull them in and placing them under your "spell" to assure they will become dependent on you and will never leave you. 1
Miss Spider Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) I guess I feel like lovebombed is used in so many contexts it’s confusing. I might have even lovebombed partners, because I tend to only date people I’m very into at first … so I’m kind of vocal about it to them sometimes.. and I may compliment them and say gushy things because I want to “win them over”, in part( I think that’s a ‘normal’ desire when you’re dating someone). But I’m not usually lying about it or actively trying to deceive ( though I’ve done that too ngl). And guys I’ve dated have been very into me too at the beginning telling me they really liked/loved me relatively quickly . & I think they genuinely meant it to the extent they understood what it meant and it never faded for any of my boyfriends and they claimed they “loved” me to the end. ( I don’t know how it would have ultimately played out, but until the end of our relationships) . Unfortunately, towards the end, I didn’t feel the same anymore, but initially with a lot of them I DID like them a lot / love them. In that moment, it was real to me. Also, I’m going back to my grandparents. My grandfather told my grandmother he was going to make her his wife On the first date. He said he knew she was the one for him. And they were together and married over 55 years until his death. But I guess he “lovebombed” her too, though in that context it’s sweet and not a pejorative. And I know that is definitely an exception but there are people that know relatively quickly what they want or that you’re a match. Anyway, it just seems problematic to me because it can only really be defined in retrospect. Maybe I’m just missing the point though sorry Edited July 20, 2021 by Cookiesandough 1
Author poppyfields Posted July 20, 2021 Author Posted July 20, 2021 (edited) cookies, this is how wikipedia defines it: Love bombing is an attempt to influence a person by demonstrations of attention and affection. It can be used in different ways and for either positive or negative purposes. Psychologists have identified love bombing as a possible part of a cycle of abuse and have warned against it. Personally, I think the term is too broad to define it as a manipulation or part of a cycle of abuse. In my experience, it was simply an over abundance of attention, due to meeting a woman (or man) they are attracted to and excited about. It's also driven, in part, by hormones and testosterone. Kind of the way you define it for yourself and the men you date. And your grandpa and grandma. You're excited and you're vocal about it! There is nothing wrong with that as long as your affection is genuine. JMO about it. Edited July 20, 2021 by poppyfields 1
Miss Spider Posted July 20, 2021 Posted July 20, 2021 9 minutes ago, poppyfields said: an attempt to influence a person by demonstrations of attention and affection. It can be used in different ways and for either positive or negative purposes. Thank you. I did not know that it could be viewed as positive. Still, it seems like only the person themselves( and maybe not even) would know if they were doing it to “influence” or just as a statement of fact. 1
Author poppyfields Posted July 21, 2021 Author Posted July 21, 2021 (edited) 30 minutes ago, poppyfields said: Of course, but people love to toss such labels around to lessen the pain of rejection. If their ex was a narcissist, or Borderline or whatever, it makes them feel less rejected. It's a form of blame-shifting imo; I also think it's unhealthy as how is one to learn, grow, evolve if they don't introspect and own their part after a RL ends, but instead toss the blame on their partner for being a narcissist?!! Commitment phobe is another one that gets tossed around WAY too much, imho. Even if/when true, that doesn't negate the fact the person lost interest and doesn't want a RL with you. Yes rejection hurts, it's human. It's life. Own your part, learn from the experience, heal and move on. Edited July 21, 2021 by poppyfields 3
Miss Spider Posted July 21, 2021 Posted July 21, 2021 7 minutes ago, poppyfields said: Commitment phobe is another one that gets tossed around WAY too much, imho. Even if/when true, that doesn't negate the fact the person lost interest and doesn't want a RL with you. Yes rejection hurts, it's human. It's life. Own your part, learn from the experience, heal and move on. Totally … and the belief that anyone who doesn’t want a at any given time or with any given person is a commitmentphobe or damaged or something 1
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