ExpatInItaly Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Your best friend doesn't get a vote in how you conduct your marriage. You need to do what you feel is best for you and your husband. Her needs and desires should not take priority. I don't see how the four of you can just go back to being friends like before, though. You all changed the goalposts here, and you and her husband even moreso when you continued communicating privately. I would be honest with your husband. It is likely to come out at some point anyway, and it is far better that he hears this from you and not a third party. He can decide what to do next. Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 26 minutes ago, MaybeI'mCrazy said: I kind of thought that was what everyone wanted after this to be honest… my husband has always had fantasies of me being with someone else. But afterwards he seemed against the idea. That’s the sense I got, it was all good fun until your husband decided that he was not interested. You failed to understand this and took things further than you should… 21 minutes ago, MaybeI'mCrazy said: My goal at this point is to reinstate healthy boundaries for myself, and keep my family intact. If I tell my husband would that be the outcome? If that is your goal, consider the fact that this information may be shared from another person and then how will he feel about that? Would you rather this information come from you, such that you can control the narrative? Or, would you rather it be disclosed by the other couple during another night when they’ve had too many drinks (perhaps they assume he knows and it’s mentioned casually - “remember that night when your wife came on to me…”). Seriously, if your goal is to reinstate healthy boundaries and keep your family intact, I believe you need to have a discussion with your husband. Be honest, “I thought we were on the same page, but then you decided that you were not interested. I didn’t realize/didn’t respect that and things went too far. I’m sorry, but I’m prepared never to see this couple socially again and I would be willing to go to marriage counselling if that’s what you want.” 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Tinyjaguar Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 This is super complicated. In wife swapping, as well as the infidelity issues, you and you husband have crossed a line where you have shown you capability to not be with only each other. That is a hell of a boundary to rebuild and will be fraught with trust issues. Should you tell your husband? I'm not sure, I wasn't happy about hearing about my wife's infidelity but it did give me the chance to re-evaluate and recover. If you keep it secret and your husband finds out from someone else, your marriage will be under far more stress than if you tell him yourself. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MaybeI'mCrazy Posted July 13, 2021 Author Share Posted July 13, 2021 Thank you Bailey and Expat. I would rather it come from me for sure. I really don’t think it would come out as the only two other people who know are the ones insisting it doesn’t come out to keep the peace and friendship. But you never know. I don’t see how we can maintain our friendship, but that’s what they’re hoping for. Everyone is right though, I’ve been so focused on what my friend wants, since she’s the one who is aware, that I’ve been neglecting what my husband may deserve in all this. I am going to stop prioritizing what they want. I’m still not sure if that means telling my husband, it feels like I’m relieving my guilt and putting the burden on him if I do. I will stop communicating with the wife about this. I have already ceased contact with her husband of course. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
Wiseman2 Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 40 minutes ago, MaybeI'mCrazy said: My goal at this point is to reinstate healthy boundaries for myself Ok that is someone you don't need to drag your husband, her and her husband and your kids into it. It's a matter of personal resolve to stop loose sexual boundaries, swinging, foursomes or whatever was the case here. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MaybeI'mCrazy Posted July 13, 2021 Author Share Posted July 13, 2021 Thank you for your input tinyjaguar. I agree. It is all such a mess. By the way I saw one of your posts, and I’m so sorry for the trauma that happened to your wife, and then the trauma that happened to you. I believe she was assaulted. It is not uncommon for sexual abuse/assault survivors to feel a lot of shame and guilt for what happened to them, and to then act out promiscuously in situations. It sounds counterintuitive, but it reinforces their feelings of worthlessness. They’re basically re-traumatizing themselves and hurting others in the process. Not an excuse for her behavior, but maybe it will help you understand. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Tinyjaguar Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 3 minutes ago, MaybeI'mCrazy said: Thank you for your input tinyjaguar. I agree. It is all such a mess. By the way I saw one of your posts, and I’m so sorry for the trauma that happened to your wife, and then the trauma that happened to you. I believe she was assaulted. It is not uncommon for sexual abuse/assault survivors to feel a lot of shame and guilt for what happened to them, and to then act out promiscuously in situations. It sounds counterintuitive, but it reinforces their feelings of worthlessness. They’re basically re-traumatizing themselves and hurting others in the process. Not an excuse for her behavior, but maybe it will help you understand. Thanks for your post. We've come though it and I feel that our marriage is stronger. As for your marriage, I don't believe that it is over but you need to work on learning to trust each other again. It's a hard won battle but it can be done. Whether, you tell your husband or not, only you can determine. In your husband's position, I know which I'd prefer. Also, I suspect that he won't take it as hard as you think, bearing in mind that your foursome effectively set hares running. The best advice I can give is to go with your gut and be positive 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Bryanp Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 It is the the secrets and lies by omission that destroys relationships. After a prior transgression you would have thought that you had learned this. All of your excuses to not tell your husband are simply self-serving reasons to protect you. Honesty versus deception. The choice is yours. Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 1 minute ago, Bryanp said: It is the the secrets and lies by omission that destroys relationships. After a prior transgression you would have thought that you had learned this. All of your excuses to not tell your husband are simply self-serving reasons to protect you. Honesty versus deception. The choice is yours. Agree. Just like the other couples desire for you not to tell your husband serves their interest. The question is, where is your loyalty? To this other couple, or to your husband? Link to post Share on other sites
Tinyjaguar Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 19 minutes ago, BaileyB said: Agree. Just like the other couples desire for you not to tell your husband serves their interest. The question is, where is your loyalty? To this other couple, or to your husband? OP said that she wanted to tell her husband but was sworn to secrecy by her friend. Link to post Share on other sites
Just a Guy Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Hi Maybe, after reading your OP and the various responses that have been posted along with your replies to them, it is clear to me that you( and the others) are treading on thin ice. There is no point in reiterating false morality when your natural inclination is to have an open marriage. Your past infidelity and your husband's sexting escapade all point in the direction of being more comfortable in an open marriage. Your do called friend and her husband also seem similarly inclined. If that be the case then there is no point beating about the bush. You have already said that your husband has expressed a desire to see you with other men. You, yourself are open to sleeping with other men. Yes, there is a feeling of guilt about this radical change in your marital status from monogamy to non monogamy. You have been brought up to consider marriage as a closed arrangement and so have the others. However, you have already broken out of that mindset by having an affair behind your husband's back. That involved cheating along with infidelity. The cheating is the component that made you feel guilty and also forced you to tell your husband lies to his face, further compounding the issue. The fact is that if you and your husband agree to an open marriage then there will be no guilt involved. Personally, I am monogamous by nature and have no desire for having an open marriage. However, I have lived long enough to know that everyone is not cut from the same cloth. If you must practice infidelity then do it consensually with your husband's agreement and knowledge. This way both of you will be guilt free and there will ne no need to sneak around. Also, such an arrangement will enhance your pleasure free from guilt. You may have heard of Hotwives since you are aware of practices like swinging and open marriages. You may like to visit a website called ohw which deals with this matter and will give you a lot of useful background information on the subject. To my way of thinking, slinking around to do something that comes naturally to you is not the way to go about things. Take the Bull by the horns( No pun intended) and do things the right way. Hope this helps. Warm regards. Link to post Share on other sites
Tinyjaguar Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Or as above, an open marriage is an option, but that does take a lot of trust and ground rules. My wife and I considered this once and she was swamped with offers (none of which she took), but as soon as I got any interest, she got very jealous. Then a few events occurred that convinced us that an open marriage was not appropriate for us. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
ExpatInItaly Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 38 minutes ago, Tinyjaguar said: OP said that she wanted to tell her husband but was sworn to secrecy by her friend. And I think therein lies the issue: she is too busy keeping her friend happy rather than doing whatever she feels is best for her own marriage. Link to post Share on other sites
HappilyMarried Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Hello @MaybeI'mCrazyit does seem that you have a situation on your hands. Best of luck. A observation based on what you have provided. I wonder if the reason your friend wants to keep your guys friendship and intact is that her and her husband had discussed this before and was planned by your friend. Another possibility your friend and your husband had feelings for each other and thought this would be a better way than just having their own affair. A question I have is when will you guys be together again? That will tell you a lot I think about two things your friendship with the other couple and also let you see how your husband and friend interact when back together. Link to post Share on other sites
BaileyB Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 48 minutes ago, Tinyjaguar said: OP said that she wanted to tell her husband but was sworn to secrecy by her friend. Her friend gets to make that decision - how? Link to post Share on other sites
Tinyjaguar Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 6 minutes ago, BaileyB said: Her friend gets to make that decision - how? It shouldn't be. Unfortunately, some people acting in self-interest convince others to protect them at their own expense. 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Ha-ha Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 18 hours ago, MaybeI'mCrazy said: I appreciate all the replies. Glows there is fear behind a lot of what I do. Not abuse per se… wiseman we haven’t done swinging with this couple before. They swore after they’ve never done anything like that before. But the time before when we saw them, the wife was rubbing my husband’s feet… Bailey B I agree. My family should be my only focus. Thank you for the important reminder. Why was your friend rubbing your husband’s feet? I wonder what is really going on here. 4 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MaybeI'mCrazy Posted July 13, 2021 Author Share Posted July 13, 2021 Thank you for everyone’s time and responses. A few of you brought up a certain point, and you all are right. My friend doesn’t get to make the decisions in regards to my marriage. I think since she was the vocal victim asking for that, I immediately wanted to remedy things with her and help her heal, and so I agreed. I’m ashamed to say it did sway me away from what should have been my main focus. It’s eating me alive to keep this secret. But I feel I deserve the pain more than him. I’m so confused though. Nothing feels right. I’ve started cutting myself. It helps. As far as when we’ll all see each other next, if we do, I don’t know. It will likely be several weeks from now with vacations and such keeping us all busy. Also someone asked why she was rubbing my husband’s feet the time before. I do not know. Her husband didn’t seem to mind. It was strange. Again she insists she doesn’t like my husband. But these things keep happening when she’s drunk. I never been a very jealous person, but it does bother me a little. I think I go along with it since I’m the one who had a physical affair. 3 Link to post Share on other sites
glows Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 Please don't cut or self-mutilate. Find someone you can talk to, go to your doctor immediately and ask for a referral to a specialist or therapist. Do not self-mutilate. This isn't worth that kind of self-inflicted damage and you should find someone to talk to and help you. Stay with a family member if you need space to think through everything. There is so much helplessness and pain. 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Wiseman2 Posted July 13, 2021 Share Posted July 13, 2021 2 minutes ago, glows said: Find someone you can talk to, go to your doctor immediately and ask for a referral to a specialist or therapist. Do not self-mutilate. Agree. Something is going on beyond this drunken foursome issue and foot massages. Don't hang out with them. Start individual counseling and marriage therapy. Perhaps marriage therapy would be a better place to confess all this. 1 2 Link to post Share on other sites
Asc1226 Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 Quote It’s eating me alive to keep this secret. But I feel I deserve the pain more than him. I’m so confused though. Nothing feels right. I’ve started cutting myself. It helps. Sooner or later this is going to drive a wedge between you and your husband. Where do you think the emotional energy you’ve been feeding this is coming from? You’re taking it from your marriage and your husband and eventually he will feel your withdrawal. This is why it’s often the lies and deceit that kill the marriage more so than the infidelity. Link to post Share on other sites
Bryanp Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 The Truth Shall Set You Free. Why is this so difficult for you to understand? Link to post Share on other sites
HadMeOverABarrel Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 (edited) Please don't cut yourself. Have you cut yourself before? I knew a girl who coped throughout her life by cutting herself. Brutal! Please seek professional help to find ways to cope that are not self-destructive. EDIT: OP, here is a live resource https://www.crisistextline.org/topics/self-harm/#what-is-self-harm-1 Edited July 14, 2021 by HadMeOverABarrel Link to post Share on other sites
Author MaybeI'mCrazy Posted July 14, 2021 Author Share Posted July 14, 2021 I don’t know Bryanp. I guess I feel I deserve the pain. If I tell, I will be free, but I’ll be spreading the pain outward onto others. I have cut before. But it’s been a very long time. 1 Link to post Share on other sites
Author MaybeI'mCrazy Posted July 14, 2021 Author Share Posted July 14, 2021 (edited) Talked to my current therapist over the phone. She is advising I do not disclose this “mild” indiscretion (her words). She believes it is coming from an unhealthy place of wanting to tell, and not for the purpose of benefiting my relationship. We are focusing on how to help me process without hurting myself. We are working to continue addressing my past with sexual abuse, in the hopes it will help heal my feelings of unworthiness, and will curb the destructive behaviors to find validation. She believes I can stop. And I want to believe that too. Edited July 14, 2021 by MaybeI'mCrazy Adding info for clarity 1 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites
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