Phased out by friend group - I'm boring

[d0nnivain]

If you organize the get together you are in the driver's seat.  I think it will work out but if it doesn't, you will know & then you can shut the door on the whole thing.  I think you will be pleasantly surprised.  

[Alpacalia]

I think organizing a get together is a lovely idea. Maybe even a monthly get together where you get together and do a fun activity once things open back up.

[soheartbroken]

They are all in the group chat now purchasing something that they know I would be interested in, but no one is asking me if I want in on the purchase.

A few days ago they made the same purchase, someone asked if I wanted in, I said yes, and then the person doing the buying said "too late, XXX".

This time no one is even asking if I want in on it.

It's almost more than I can take.

Sure, I could jump in and say "please include me", but what's the point. they clearly are being exclusive.

[Happy Lemming]

I think you are giving them too much power...  If there is something you want to purchase, just order it for yourself.

If there is someplace you want to go... go there.  If there is something you want to eat, go to that restaurant and enjoy it (if the owners of the restaurant are not serving in the dining room, call in a a carry-out order).

You don't need them to fulfill your wants...

[ClearEyes-FullHeart]

2 hours ago, soheartbroken said:

I was thinking about seeing what they are doing on Friday, since I know a few of us have the day off.

 

What about just sharing to the group - Excited to have Friday off and checking X hike. Let me know if anyone wants to join me. I plan to leave around x-x hour. That's simple, just broadcasts your plan and if no one says yes it's not such a big deal. If they all reply with alternative plans for the day (probably not group plans as some work), that's also not such a big deal. 

Sorry you are feeling left out and I get it, I think I would too. I'd probably also just fade away as another poster mentioned. I'm also much older than you (55) and have had some great friendships wither away over time and life changes. It's the way of things but not always what we want.

[soheartbroken]

35 minutes ago, Happy Lemming said:

I think you are giving them too much power...  If there is something you want to purchase, just order it for yourself.

If there is someplace you want to go... go there.  If there is something you want to eat, go to that restaurant and enjoy it (if the owners of the restaurant are not serving in the dining room, call in a a carry-out order).

You don't need them to fulfill your wants...

This is very true. But it's not that I NEED them to buy these things for me. It has nothing to do with that. It's just group bonding, and I'm excluded. Everyone could buy these things for themselves. I could go buy it now. the point was for it to be a group investment. Similar to buying a lotto ticket as a group. The point is to go in as a group.

The obvious rejection is killing me.

I just replied in the group chat "ummmmm. I guess I'm not on the purchase?". I realize it's stirring up s***, in as mild a way as possible, but I just can't stand it anymore.

This is the first time I've kind of called them out (mind you, not super aggressively), and we will see what happens. I assume I will have an update by tonight.

Thanks everyone for your thoughts and company. This is a very difficult time for me.

[soheartbroken]

24 minutes ago, ClearEyes-FullHeart said:

What about just sharing to the group - Excited to have Friday off and checking X hike. Let me know if anyone wants to join me. I plan to leave around x-x hour. That's simple, just broadcasts your plan and if no one says yes it's not such a big deal. If they all reply with alternative plans for the day (probably not group plans as some work), that's also not such a big deal. 

Sorry you are feeling left out and I get it, I think I would too. I'd probably also just fade away as another poster mentioned. I'm also much older than you (55) and have had some great friendships wither away over time and life changes. It's the way of things but not always what we want.

Thank you CEFH. Sorry I didn't see this before I wrote my last message.

Yes, if I was going to send an invite, I would do exactly as you said: "I'm doing XXXX on XX day, leaving around XXXX. Let me know if anyone wants to join". And leave it at that.

Not sure how my message calling them out on the purchase (see above) will play out, so a lot will depend on that. No response yet, though I'm sure they've all read it.

They are probably having side conversations about my message as we speak. "what do we say to her?" "should we ignore her?", etc. They've been bantering back and forth all day, and now, suddenly, silence in the group chat.

[ClearEyes-FullHeart]

Well good for you for asking about the purchase. Try to stop caring what they do or think. I realize it’s hard as they are your core friends but try to shake it off. (Watch Phil Collins’s I Don’t Care Anymore live recording on YouTube to get fired up. Haha)

If you feel comfortable messaging about the hIke and if you even want one of them to possibly join, just do it. It also shows you are not taking their BS seriously. If you don’t feel like it, don’t.

Stop talking down to yourself. I think standing up for yourself a bit more will only help make them respect you more, or give you the agency to choose to leave them in the dust as you find some nicer folks to be friends with. 😀

 

[soheartbroken]

So the response was "I haven't  bought it yet, do you want in".

At which point I had to say, "yes please", otherwise I look like I'm being passive aggressive.

But clearly, they were going to purchase without including me.

Anyway, that's the first time I have spoken up, very timidly mind you, but now it's sort of out there....I think they will sense some of my hurt from that message, maybe. And we'll see what transpires from now on.

[soheartbroken]

11 minutes ago, ClearEyes-FullHeart said:

Well good for you for asking about the purchase. Try to stop caring what they do or think. I realize it’s hard as they are your core friends but try to shake it off. (Watch Phil Collins’s I Don’t Care Anymore live recording on YouTube to get fired up. Haha)

If you feel comfortable messaging about the hIke and if you even want one of them to possibly join, just do it. It also shows you are not taking their BS seriously. If you don’t feel like it, don’t.

Stop talking down to yourself. I think standing up for yourself a bit more will only help make them respect you more, or give you the agency to choose to leave them in the dust as you find some nicer folks to be friends with. 😀

 

Thank you, again, CEFH. I do care too much what people think, something I can hopefully address in therapy one day soon.

I have "shaken off" quite a bit with this group in the last few weeks. But the recent rejection over the last week has pushed me beyond my normal coping limits, hence turning to LoveShack, lol.

I will look up the youtube clip you recommended.

I would love to "leave them in the dust" and find new friends, but the truth is, any "new friends" will equally begin to find me...dull, over time. I'm lucky this group tolerated me for as long as they did.

And I will keep updating the thread.

Appreciated everyone's thoughtful responses. This has helped me tremendously to make it through the day.

Edited April 20, 2021 by soheartbroken

[MsJayne]

Is it possible that you're projecting your negative beliefs about yourself on to your chat group friends? Has anyone ever accused you of being boring, or is that your own perception of yourself as a member of a group, a feeling that you don't contribute enough? Are they really pushing you out, or have you withdrawn? Sometimes a relationship breakdown, especially if it was a toxic relationship, can leave us feeling a bit lost and empty, questioning our own worth, and as a result our social behaviour can change. For all you know the other people in the group may be a bit confused about why you're pulling back. They may think that by not pressuring you to join in activities, etc, they're giving you time to heal from your relationship breakup.  With the group purchase thing, do you normally have to be asked, or in the past would you have just assumed and joined in?  

[soheartbroken]

1 hour ago, MsJayne said:

Is it possible that you're projecting your negative beliefs about yourself on to your chat group friends? Has anyone ever accused you of being boring, or is that your own perception of yourself as a member of a group, a feeling that you don't contribute enough? Are they really pushing you out, or have you withdrawn? Sometimes a relationship breakdown, especially if it was a toxic relationship, can leave us feeling a bit lost and empty, questioning our own worth, and as a result our social behaviour can change. For all you know the other people in the group may be a bit confused about why you're pulling back. They may think that by not pressuring you to join in activities, etc, they're giving you time to heal from your relationship breakup.  With the group purchase thing, do you normally have to be asked, or in the past would you have just assumed and joined in?  

Hi Mary Jane. Thank you for writing.

It's possible that I'm projecting somewhat...but the rejection is real to a certain extent, and cannot be ignored. This group was 100% there for me during the early stages of the breakup, but now they have pulled away.

Has anyone accused me of being boring? Not directly, but sometimes when we joke around and tease each other, I definitely have been told that I am "quiet", so it's not all in my imagination. Mind you, they would say these things, but still include me, until very recently. Like I said, I'm more of an earnest, kind person, never the centre of attention, so this is the truth about me, whether they directly say so or not.

They are pushing me out, which has caused me to withdraw, so it's a combination of the two.

I agree that break ups can leave you feeling lost, but these friends were there for me for the first few months, including me in plans, coming over to my place to hang out. They really included me. But now there has been a shift. So it's not the breakup. Except to the extent, as I mentioned before, that they ironically considered me more interesting to talk to during the drama of the break up.

They probably sense my withdrawal in the past two weeks, but by the same token, they have withdrawn from me. I doubt they are confused; I think they know their behaviour has been exclusive.

For the purchase thing, if I am frank, and without getting too complicated or into too many details, I was the one who suggested the lottery tickets...but now they purchase them without me, as a group. Bit of a slap in the face. They have also set up a group payment app for exchanging payments, and I was the only one not included. This is what sent me into the really dark place.

[soheartbroken]

Just an update that I have been participating in the group chat tonight. Unlikely to make a difference, but I've tried.

[LivingWaterPlease]

2 hours ago, soheartbroken said:

So the response was "I haven't  bought it yet, do you want in".

At which point I had to say, "yes please", otherwise I look like I'm being passive aggressive.

But clearly, they were going to purchase without including me.

Anyway, that's the first time I have spoken up, very timidly mind you, but now it's sort of out there....I think they will sense some of my hurt from that message, maybe. And we'll see what transpires from now on.

So heart, I understand how you feel because I've felt that way before, too, a long time ago. It was the way I was raised. In my family everyone was concerned about themselves and it all centered around each person trying to be interesting in our family, which was large. I was the least entertaining. But, the most entertaining ones were the most popular and remained so.

When I got out on my own, though, gradually I learned that being popular is not all about being entertaining! It's about being concerned about others before oneself.

Right now, and I'm not criticizing you for it, you're mostly concerned about your own feelings.

Why not, when the person asked if you wanted to buy in, say something like, "Oh yes! You (or whose ever idea it was) had such a great idea for us all to get this together! It's going to be so much fun and I'm so glad you haven't bought it yet!" Doesn't have to be that exactly. You just want to make an enthusiastic statement about someone else's idea!

If you start focusing on others and getting enthused about their ideas and their jokes and be happy for them that they are having fun, looking for ways to support them from your heart not just acting the part, I believe you'll find they want you around all the time. Brag on the others! "Oh, you're always so funny!" "Your creativity is awesome!"

Look for ways to celebrate their cleverness.  Ask about their day. Be genuinely interested.

I have been thrown into some situations with people I could never compare with as far as their intellect, station in life, financial status, etc. But, I can always engage them in an interesting conversation because I care about them! Not how they view me. For instance, I was at an event and suddenly a friend grabbed my arm and said, "Livingwatersplease, this is Ms. Famous A list Actress," "Ms. Famous A List Actress, this is Living Waters Please!"

It was rainy that night and Ms. Actress had flown in on a plane and was leaving after the event. So I thought of her, rather than what she might think of me and commented not on who she was, she already knew that, she knew her movies, everyone probably wants to talk with her about them. I just asked her simply, "How was your plane ride? Was it bumpy because of the weather?" She was probably on a tight schedule and who likes a stormy plane ride? So she was enthused to talk about her ride. Pretty soon we were talking about her daughter at home and her daughter's music lessons. Not sure how we segued into that. But, I never had to entertain her, be witty, be fun, nothing! All I had to do was to care about what she had been through in the past hour, her plane ride. She never asked me one question about myself, as I recall. The conversation was all about her. But I'm sure if she'd have chosen someone to sit with (she didn't sit down ever) she would have chosen me to be in her group. Not because of anything about me, but because I made it all about what she was experiencing at the moment. Everyone is focused on what they are going through at the moment. Try to connect with that.

Point is, forget about yourself, forget that you're boring. Look for ways to brag about your friends' accomplishments. Watch for when they might be a little discouraged and when they are tell them something good about themselves. Make it your goal, not to be fun or witty, but to care about your friends' well being!

You're going to have to learn to really quit caring about yourself, focusing on yourself and really genuinely care about the others in order to truly be part of a group.

 

[soheartbroken]

6 minutes ago, LivingWaterPlease said:

So heart, I understand how you feel because I've felt that way before, too, a long time ago. It was the way I was raised. In my family everyone was concerned about themselves and it all centered around each person trying to be interesting in our family, which was large. I was the least entertaining. But, the most entertaining ones were the most popular and remained so.

When I got out on my own, though, gradually I learned that being popular is not all about being entertaining! It's about being concerned about others before oneself.

Right now, and I'm not criticizing you for it, you're mostly concerned about your own feelings.

Why not, when the person asked if you wanted to buy in, say something like, "Oh yes! You (or whose ever idea it was) had such a great idea for us all to get this together! It's going to be so much fun and I'm so glad you haven't bought it yet!" Doesn't have to be that exactly. You just want to make an enthusiastic statement about someone else's idea!

If you start focusing on others and getting enthused about their ideas and their jokes and be happy for them that they are having fun, looking for ways to support them from your heart not just acting the part, I believe you'll find they want you around all the time. Brag on the others! "Oh, you're always so funny!" "Your creativity is awesome!"

Look for ways to celebrate their cleverness.  Ask about their day. Be genuinely interested.

I have been thrown into some situations with people I could never compare with as far as their intellect, station in life, financial status, etc. But, I can always engage them in an interesting conversation because I care about them! Not how they view me. For instance, I was at an event and suddenly a friend grabbed my arm and said, "Livingwatersplease, this is Ms. Famous A list Actress," "Ms. Famous A List Actress, this is Living Waters Please!"

It was rainy that night and Ms. Actress had flown in on a plane and was leaving after the event. So I thought of her, rather than what she might think of me and commented not on who she was, she already knew that, she knew her movies, everyone probably wants to talk with her about them. I just asked her simply, "How was your plane ride? Was it bumpy because of the weather?" She was probably on a tight schedule and who likes a stormy plane ride? So she was enthused to talk about her ride. Pretty soon we were talking about her daughter at home and her daughter's music lessons. Not sure how we segued into that. But, I never had to entertain her, be witty, be fun, nothing! All I had to do was to care about what she had been through in the past hour, her plane ride. She never asked me one question about myself, as I recall. The conversation was all about her. But I'm sure if she'd have chosen someone to sit with (she didn't sit down ever) she would have chosen me to be in her group. Not because of anything about me, but because I made it all about what she was experiencing at the moment. Everyone is focused on what they are going through at the moment. Try to connect with that.

Point is, forget about yourself, forget that you're boring. Look for ways to brag about your friends' accomplishments. Watch for when they might be a little discouraged and when they are tell them something good about themselves. Make it your goal, not to be fun or witty, but to care about your friends' well being!

You're going to have to learn to really quit caring about yourself, focusing on yourself and really genuinely care about the others in order to truly be part of a group.

 

Hi LWP,

Thanks for the time you put into writing that.

Definitely, I can assure you, I have shown interest in others. Some have gone through breakups of their own over the last several months, and I texted frequently to check in on them (and them on me - private chats). Another suffered the loss of a loved one, and I checked in with her, and made a big effort to commemorate her loss, which she seemed to deeply appreciate, even writing me a letter of gratitude. Point is, I made a concerted effort to focus on others, to show interest in others (which is in my nature, and not fake). And I made an effort to contribute things like food, and money, and planned things.

Over the last few weeks, however, there was a shift.

What you are suggesting, I find, works for meeting someone new. Focusing on the other person, asking questions, making people feel good about themselves. All very solid advice.

Problem is, I have known these girls for so long, that a lot of the conversation when we gather is just...silly, mundane, stuff. The kind of stuff I am not great at. Laughing at dumb stuff, poking fun at the television, sending memes...this is not my strength.

I do genuinely care about these people (I think?), but they have stopped caring about me.

I guess I feel that I have made every effort, which seemed very well received over the last few months. And then, suddenly, something is different the past two weeks. Very obvious exclusion. I feel there is no other explanation other than that I am rather dull, and don't make enough jokes, and am not confident enough when we get together.

[LivingWaterPlease]

19 minutes ago, soheartbroken said:

Problem is, I have known these girls for so long, that a lot of the conversation when we gather is just...silly, mundane, stuff. The kind of stuff I am not great at. Laughing at dumb stuff, poking fun at the television, sending memes...this is not my strength.

I do genuinely care about these people (I think?), but they have stopped caring about me.

I guess I feel that I have made every effort, which seemed very well received over the last few months. And then, suddenly, something is different the past two weeks. Very obvious exclusion. I feel there is no other explanation other than that I am rather dull, and don't make enough jokes, and am not confident enough when we get together.

You've outgrown these girls. You're not interested in the same things they are is the bottom line. They're boring to you, actually. You write it's not your strength. That's not entirely right. The truth is, it's not your interest.

Nothing wrong with that. You just have more depth. Time to find friends who like the same things you do.

I don't care about being with people who are silly and laugh at dumb stuff, either. We grow and change as individuals, hopefully. Some don't. Some stay stuck in immaturity and superficiality!

Whatever things you're interested in focus on. Eventually it will naturally lead you to connect with others who are, too. In spite of the pandemic, socializing is happening. Focus on your interests and it will be a pathway to friendship as you find ways to engage with others about them.

 

 

Edited April 21, 2021 by LivingWaterPlease

[glows]

I think it's odd that they're going out just the four of them but you're part of the group chat of five.

I'm leaning more towards miscommunication here.

Have they asked you to go out in the past but you declined several times or enough to perhaps give the message that you're not available or interested? If you're interested in going, why don't you show interest in the outtings they're talking about right there infront of you?

 

 

[d0nnivain]

Good for you for speaking up.  They included you when you showed interest.  Similarly when you participate more, then will include you in more.  

Your threads read like you are depressed with low self esteem.  I've been there.  When you are low & vulnerable, it's hard to stick up for yourself.  You pull back & withdraw.  You want people to reassure you but they don't because they don't know you are hurting. They interpret your withdrawal as you rejecting them.  Then when they don't chase you & comfort you, but instead give you the space they think you want, you view that as them leaving you out.  You go down the spiral you are on & lament your own shortcomings, thereby highlighting them & making all worse.  

Get some therapy.  Boost your own mood & self esteem.  Give your friends a chance.  If they knew you were hurting & vulnerable, they would help.  They think you are pulling away from them so they have backed off.  Correct the record & let them in on how much you want to be included.  

[hippychick3]

I have been in a similar situation so can completely empathize with you. When my youngest was born, I was part of a large online “playgroup” with other moms of kids born the same time. There were smaller groups that developed over time from the big group and then even smaller ones from those. I was part of these smaller groups and we would meet up for girls trips together as we lived in different parts of the country. The large group still continues to this day but as each offshoot group grew smaller, people would stop posting in the “larger small groups.” My small group ended up being 4 of us and we were very tight for a few years, taking trips annually and talking throughout the day everyday until one year when I hosted our get together in my city. After that trip, they slowly stopped talking to me and in our online group. But I knew they were still talking to each other.  I’d ask them what was wrong and if they were upset with me for some reason, and they would deny that anything had changed. But I knew something had changed and it was very hurtful. To this day (16 years later), I still don’t know what happened. But it still stings a bit when I think about it.

In your situation, I am leaning more towards miscommunication after reading through this thread. Unless these are very mean, backstabbing women, I can’t imagine they’d stay in the group chat with you while pushing you out. It seems they would have formed their own group without you if they genuinely did not want you around. 
 

[Datergirl]

I can kind of understand how you feel somewhat. 

With regards to the group purchase thingy, couldn't you have messaged something like 'I'd love to contribute to the purchase because of xyz'...instead of waiting to be asked. Sometimes, if I wait to be asked things nothing at all would happen!

There will be times, in any friendship group where one or more people aren't included as much as usual, or you can't or don't want to contribute to the conversation or activity, it doesn't have to mean you're deliberately being excluded. 

If you want to continue with this group you're going to have to try and grow the connections again. Don't always wait to be included, include yourself.

It might also be because, while you were going through a breakup the focus was on you a lot, now that focus isn't on you, it feels like you're being left out, maybe the group has moved on from talking about your breakup and they need something fresh and exciting...find something that the whole group might enjoy doing together ❤ 

[Alpacalia]

My life, yours, and my friend's and your friend's lives are all the same while still being totally different, thanks to the various events that shape us into who we are.

Baseball is a sport that some of my friends enjoy though I do not care for it much. Many of our previous outings had been to baseball games, and I would read a book or magazine and be fully immersed in my own world before the game was over. But then I like Tennis matches, I brought my friend to one and she did the same thing.

Perhaps @LivingWaterPlease is right, and your friendships have simply outgrown you. Or, to put it another way, you could upset the status quo by mentioning things that no longer interest you and then proposing a new activity, one that you enjoy.

[vla1120]

12 hours ago, soheartbroken said:

Just an update that I have been participating in the group chat tonight. Unlikely to make a difference, but I've tried.

This is exactly what I was going to suggest. If they wanted to exclude you from the group chat, they would simply create a group without you. In my opinion, if they are talking about making plans in that group chat, it automatically includes you and if I were you and they were talking about doing something I was interested in doing, I would chime in with no problem. I realize you're a bit shy. I was too, when I was younger. The older you get, the less you will care what your peers think. Now is a good time to start that transition! Don't be afraid to put  yourself out there. What's the worst that could happen? (...and if the "worst" really does happen and you feel excluded, what's the harm? At least you'll know once and for all where you stand in this friend's group.)

[soheartbroken]

18 hours ago, glows said:

I think it's odd that they're going out just the four of them but you're part of the group chat of five.

I'm leaning more towards miscommunication here.

Have they asked you to go out in the past but you declined several times or enough to perhaps give the message that you're not available or interested? If you're interested in going, why don't you show interest in the outtings they're talking about right there infront of you?

 

 

 

Thanks for writing, Glows.

Yes, it is "odd". I don't think there is any miscommunication, however. I think it's a passive aggressive hint to me.

To be a little more specific and provide more context, a message will pop up like "what time is everyone coming over tonight?". To me it's out of the blue, but all the others (through private messaging) have been making a plan, obviously. So seeing this pop up in the group chat is a punch in the gut to me. Everyone else has obviously been planning through private message.

I have rarely rarely ever declined an invitation. They know I love hanging out.

[soheartbroken]

11 hours ago, d0nnivain said:

Good for you for speaking up.  They included you when you showed interest.  Similarly when you participate more, then will include you in more.  

Your threads read like you are depressed with low self esteem.  I've been there.  When you are low & vulnerable, it's hard to stick up for yourself.  You pull back & withdraw.  You want people to reassure you but they don't because they don't know you are hurting. They interpret your withdrawal as you rejecting them.  Then when they don't chase you & comfort you, but instead give you the space they think you want, you view that as them leaving you out.  You go down the spiral you are on & lament your own shortcomings, thereby highlighting them & making all worse.  

Get some therapy.  Boost your own mood & self esteem.  Give your friends a chance.  If they knew you were hurting & vulnerable, they would help.  They think you are pulling away from them so they have backed off.  Correct the record & let them in on how much you want to be included.  

Hi again Donnivain,

I do not suffer from depression, however, obviously I'm in a bad place this week, feeling very depressed over what is transpiring. When I hang out with these people, you wouldn't see depression in me. Lack of confidence, maybe.

Absolutely I am pulling back and withdrawing, rather than putting myself out there for more humiliation. I don't think they are "giving me space, however". I think there is a deliberate phase-out going on.

If I tell them I feel excluded, I will be perceived as whiny, clingy and insecure. Which I suppose may not speak highly of this group....but I find this is social reality.

[glows]

8 minutes ago, soheartbroken said:

 

Thanks for writing, Glows.

Yes, it is "odd". I don't think there is any miscommunication, however. I think it's a passive aggressive hint to me.

To be a little more specific and provide more context, a message will pop up like "what time is everyone coming over tonight?". To me it's out of the blue, but all the others (through private messaging) have been making a plan, obviously. So seeing this pop up in the group chat is a punch in the gut to me. Everyone else has obviously been planning through private message.

I have rarely rarely ever declined an invitation. They know I love hanging out.

Maybe I'm missing the full context or all the messages or past history but this reads to me as if that person is inviting all four of you over to that one person's house. It doesn't sound at all like it's passive aggressive. Why not private message the person then who sent that out and ask? You could say "Hey, I know I have been pretty busy lately and haven't joined in the conversation - just wanted to check in with you what the details are about the event tonight?"  See what the other person says. 

If that friend is being vague or doesn't respond to you or seem welcoming, then you have your answer. 

 

Edited April 21, 2021 by glows