I don't know what this means: He told me he loves me and thinks I'm beautiful, yet isn't sure he wants to be with me

[Gaeta]

@smackie9: I am reading interesting literature these days. The biggest problem with men is that they don't heal between relationships so it brings on behaviors like always going back to the ex. The commitment phobe in reality is not afraid to commit, he doesn't want to commit to You because he has not dealt with what he needs to deal with.

[smackie9]

This guy has been off and on FOR YEARS with another women. That is a commitment phone, not someone that hasn't healed. Whatever his deal is, he wants the icing on the cake, but not commit to eating cake.

Edited February 11, 2021 by smackie9

[Gaeta]

1 minute ago, smackie9 said:

This guy has been off and on FOR YEARS with another women. That is a commitment phone, not someone that hasn't healed. Whatever his deal is, he wants the icing on the cake, but not commit to eating cake.

He's together with his ex. Their relationship is dysfunctional so they last a few months, a couple of years. Everything blows up and they break up. He's ok for a while, then he starts missing her and instead of blocking her, doing all the steps to get over her he choose the easy path, goes back to her. She suffers from the same dysfunction and she takes him back every time. And the cycle goes on. It's good for a while, it blows up.....rinse and repeat. 

[princessaurora]

11 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

He's together with his ex. Their relationship is dysfunctional so they last a few months, a couple of years. Everything blows up and they break up. He's ok for a while, then he starts missing her and instead of blocking her, doing all the steps to get over her he choose the easy path, goes back to her. She suffers from the same dysfunction and she takes him back every time. And the cycle goes on. It's good for a while, it blows up.....rinse and repeat. 

We don't know he's still together with her, unless @divegrl mentioned it, but I didn't see her saying it was still ongoing. Maybe it's over and he's just hesitant to get involved in something like that again. Divegrl, did he tell you when they last ended again? Have you ever met her? Are they still in touch?  I'm wondering how long it's been since they were on because if it's been a while maybe he wants to change things up and have a stable relationship for a change. Maybe he's tired of the cycle and wants to break it. 

I think we can all agree on one thing though, she needs to find out what that comment was all about. Until then we're really just guessing. 

[Alvi]

Just curious, how old are you two? You both sound young. I could be wrong but that's what it feels like. Sounds like an intense two month of dating with lots of I Love Yous. Way too soon for that.

Talk him and listen to what he is saying. If he truly doesn't see a future between the two of you, then it is over. So be it. 

[Gaeta]

10 minutes ago, princessaurora said:

We don't know he's still together with her, unless @divegrl mentioned it, but I didn't see her saying it was still ongoing.

No he's not with his ex but they have a history of going back together for years. I was explaining why men (and women) do this on-and-off relationship thing. 

[princessaurora]

31 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

No he's not with his ex but they have a history of going back together for years. I was explaining why men (and women) do this on-and-off relationship thing. 

Gotcha, my apologies. Postings are adding up so fast on here I can't keep up with what's fact or just examples. lol 

But this does sound like what happened with me and now hubby. He had just got out of a long term relationship right around the time we met. They knew each other  since they were in grade school and it was very on and off for alot of it. Then they have a several major breakups, she stays in touch with him as a "friend"  and from time to time she tries to pull him back and eventually he gives in because of the co-dependant relationship they've built together. He went back with her for a bit a few years into our relationship and then they broke up again because he couldn't stay away from me. But i'm not interested in being someone's side chick and i don't trust that he's not seeing her behind my back so I finally walk away. He continues to go back and forth with her while sleeping with a bunch of other women, and then gives it one last shot with her by moving to the town where she lives. After not speaking to him for nearly a year (even though he called me nonstop and I just ignored him) I finally give in and resume our "friendship". I start visiting him in her hometown and of course we have sex the whole time I'm there. He's what i like to call an honest a hole,  so he tells her he started sleeping with me again and of course she gets mad because like before  he won't stay away from me. But we're not  in a relationship, just having sex and hanging out some weekends together. The weeks i'm not with him,  I'm going out with other guys trying to move on. But none make me feel the way he does and eventually they break up for good, he cuts off all contact with her, moves back home and we're married a year later. So, yeah, I'm very familiar with the rinse, repeat. I guess now that I think of it, he kind of did that with both of us, but fortunately he eventually found a way to break the cycle!

Edited February 11, 2021 by princessaurora
grammar

[elaine567]

20 hours ago, divegrl said:

he loves me and thinks I am beautiful. Yet, he is not sure he wants to be with me.

Can anyone honestly see anything good about this statement.
Why mention it at all? Why put a spanner in the works?

I guess
I love you (as a friend), you are beautiful (compliment to make you feel better and don't blame yourself) BUT this is going nowhere...I just  do not see myself being WITH you.

[poppyfields]

7 hours ago, BaileyB said:

I’m just saying, I wouldn’t end the relationship without asking for clarification. Give the guy a chance to explain, and ask (generally speaking) what his intentions are long term...

You don’t know what he meant by that statement, unless you ask him...

Agree Bailey.  I think I am learning that some guys will throw these types of comments out, hoping you'll ask!  Perhaps they feel vulnerable or ambivalent or a combination of both or something else, but they don't know how to express it, so they toss something out like what divegrl's guy did, hoping she will ask and they can have a open honest discussion about it.

I admit in the past, I've missed such opportunities to get in his head a little bit, to find out what's going on, which could be so many different things.

It's quite possible he may be starting to feel close, and it scares him a bit.  And he's feeling a bit vulnerable.  It's fear, which is not uncommon.  Some men will try to push a woman away due to this fear.  Some women will as well.

Again, just speculating but my sense is it's more so that than he's not into you, or on his way out.  It might actually be just the opposite.

I keep saying this, but things are not always what they appear to be, that's why it's important to ask and talk about it.

 

 

 

Edited February 11, 2021 by poppyfields

[Watercolors]

@divegrl Your friend sounds like the classic commitment phobe. I mean, he reiterated to you how casual your hookups are, by telling you that while he loves you, he can't see himself with you long-term. There's no misreading that. I'd say, that's a pretty straightforward statement from him. 

Since you know how that statement felt after he said it (like a side-kick to the ribcage, that knocked the wind out of you), you have to ask yourself, why are you so emotionally invested in a guy you've only ever seen once a year to say 'happy birthday' to, over the years you two have known each other. 

I don't think the problem is him per se. I think the problem is the way you've mismanaged your feelings and expectations with a reputable bachelor who has never settled down (and literally told you he isn't going to either). 

I think your confusion is definitely from your own projection of your wants and desires, on to an object (him) that is the closest target, yet isn't the right target. Does that make sense? 

I think there needs to be a conversation with him where you do not pussyfoot around about how you feel; how you feel towards him, how his comment made you feel, and what your expectations are moving forward with him. 

Again, he's already told you directly that he doesn't want a long-term, exclusive relationship with you. When someone tells you who they are (he's a bachelor), you need to believe him. This is where I see problems all the time between people. One person wants one thing, while the other does not. Only, the person who wants the thing, gets upset and demands (not you, but the general 'you' in my scenario) that the person they're incompatible with, force themselves to meet all the other person's needs anyway. Eventually, the person who let himself (a square peg) be emotionally manipulated into a role they know doesn't fit (a round hole), will get upset and leave the relationship. 

Have a conversation with him, yes. But don't expect him to do a 180 and suddenly admit that he was wrong and wants to be exclusive with you. Based on your history of once a year hookups I don't think he's the right guy for you to be so hyperfocused on. You need to select a guy who lives closer to you who is emotionally available (your guy friend is definitely not emotionally available), and who wants what you want. 

Square peg, round hole. That equation doesn't work. 
 

 

 

[poppyfields]

8 minutes ago, Watercolors said:

@divegrl Your friend sounds like the classic commitment phobe.

I think he sounds a bit commitmentphobe as well.  A years-long off and on relationship with his ex, and now this. 

Commitmentphobia is all about fear (hence why it's called a phobia) versus a lack of desire for a committed relationship, in general or with a particular person. 

Two totally different things.

Edited February 11, 2021 by poppyfields

[Watercolors]

To add, a leopard never changes its spots. A commitment phobe cannot be bothered to conform himself to societal standards of 'regular relationship guy' either. 

Having dated my fair share of "c.p.'s" I can attest to the fact that his statement to you, "I love you, but I can't see myself with you long term," is code for "I care about you, but not enough to change the lifestyle I've come to reap the benefits of." 

It's why Diane Chambers and Same Malone didn't work as a couple. (Cheers)
It's why Peter Mitchell and Margaret Collin didn't work as a couple. (Three Men and a Baby)
It's why Amanda Woods and Ethan, and Iris and Graham didn't work as a couple each. (The Holiday)

I know there's a lot more pop culture examples (and I don't know if you even watch tv or movies) of such square peg/round hole relationships where the leading lady is attracted to the static character who is the commitment phobe. 
 

[Watercolors]

10 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Commitmentphobia is all about fear (hence why it's called a phobia) versus a lack of desire for a committed relationship, in general or with a particular person. 

Really? Commitment phobes do lack the desire for a committed relationship, or they'd actually have them, and not be phobic of commitments. Same thing actually. 

[poppyfields]

6 minutes ago, Watercolors said:

Really? Commitment phobes do lack the desire for a committed relationship, or they'd actually have them, and not be phobic of commitments. Same thing actually. 

Actually all the books and articles I have read which include interviews with such men (and women) suggest that yes they do have the desire for a committed relationship, but their fears and anxieties when it happens (or looks like it may happen) are so intense, they override the desire and they bolt.  It IS a genuine phobia, similar to claustrophobia except instead of the fear of enclosed spaces, they fear being and feeling "boxed into" a close committed relationship.

After they run, once it's over, their fears and anxieties are alleviated and they begin missing the rejected partner so they return.  Once back, the anxiety returns and once again they bolt.  Lather, rinse, repeat, sometimes for years as in divegrl's guy's case with this other woman.

Which explains the off and on aspect to many of these relationships.

I am no expert, just what I've read, plus my brother is a huge commitmentphobe, he admits it and now dates women within the parameters of what he can offer.  It's sad because he really does desire a long term relationship, but unfortunately unable to sustain one due to his fears and anxieties.

 

Edited February 11, 2021 by poppyfields

[Trail Blazer]

He doesn't love you.  If he did, it wouldn't even be a question as to whether he wanted to be with you or not.  

[divegrl]

Hi friends, 

Thank you for all the replies. So the “on/off” relationship ended 2 years ago. I am not worried about them getting back together. But the fact that they were on/off is not a good sign to me. 
 

Before that his relationships were ranging from 6 months to 2 years. I asked him what was the reason for the break ups... and his words were “She just was not the right person.”

 

We will be talking tonight. I will be listening, really listening to what he is saying. 
 

Thank you all again so much. 

[poppyfields]

12 minutes ago, divegrl said:

Before that his relationships were ranging from 6 months to 2 years. I asked him what was the reason for the break ups... and his words were “She just was not the right person.”

That would be fine if he were in his 20's or even 30's but you are both in your 40s, correct?  That answer simply doesn't fly anymore when you reach that age.   Plus, there is no "right person" for commitmentphobes, they will find something "wrong" with every single person.  Again, it's their fear talking, not the person they're with.

But good luck, hope it all works out the way you hope.

Edited February 12, 2021 by poppyfields

[Watercolors]

14 minutes ago, divegrl said:

We will be talking tonight. I will be listening, really listening to what he is saying. 

Don't give away your power so easily. That statement says that you plan to do that. What about reframing it to one of more empowerment, "I will be talking, really talking to him about my feelings and expectations." Just be prepared for more double-talk from him as that is the language that all commitment phobic men speak.

The "I love you not sure I want to be with you" is double talk. Double talk is deliberately ambiguous language meant to confuse and undermine the other person, so that the double talker can avoid feeling guilty or taking responsibility for their actions. Double talk appears to be genuine and earnest but really is a mixture of sense and nonsense.

People who are emotionally manipulative use double talk all the time. They are very uncomfortable not shifting between total baloney and the truth, to just tell the truth. They are in fact, very exhausting people to communicate with because everything they say is a contradiction or nonsense. 

Edited February 12, 2021 by Watercolors

[Maldives]

Sounds like he's letting you down easy 

[mortensorchid]

Keep your options open because this guy is waffling.  And Don put all your eggs in this basket either. 

[divegrl]

Hi friends!

So we had an amazing conversation! I told him there was some things I wanted to talk about.... and he said, “finally, we can have a real conversation.”

 

He said he has been trying to talk to me on a more serious level for a while... but when he does, I shut him down. This is true, I have a very hard time handling my emotions when things get too deep... it puts me in serious fight or flight mode.

 

So he told me how he really cared for me, loved me and has adored me since forever. He asked about feelings for him, and I told him I felt the same. 
 

I asked him why he said that he wasn’t sure if he wanted to be with me. He said that it was just what we had been talking about.  How I keep things surface level, fun, flirty. How he needs more deeper, meaningful, serious and logical interactions. 
 

He says he feels much better about us and us being together. We both agreed that this conversation was really healthy and positive and needed to be happening more often. 
 

So yay!!!! I am so glad I truly talked to him. It felt so good to have courage and open my heart.

Thank you so much for listening and being here. Your replies have really helped!

[princessaurora]

2 hours ago, divegrl said:

Hi friends!

So we had an amazing conversation! I told him there was some things I wanted to talk about.... and he said, “finally, we can have a real conversation.”

 

He said he has been trying to talk to me on a more serious level for a while... but when he does, I shut him down. This is true, I have a very hard time handling my emotions when things get too deep... it puts me in serious fight or flight mode.

 

So he told me how he really cared for me, loved me and has adored me since forever. He asked about feelings for him, and I told him I felt the same. 
 

I asked him why he said that he wasn’t sure if he wanted to be with me. He said that it was just what we had been talking about.  How I keep things surface level, fun, flirty. How he needs more deeper, meaningful, serious and logical interactions. 
 

He says he feels much better about us and us being together. We both agreed that this conversation was really healthy and positive and needed to be happening more often. 
 

So yay!!!! I am so glad I truly talked to him. It felt so good to have courage and open my heart.

Thank you so much for listening and being here. Your replies have really helped!

See, that is why communication is key!  I'm so glad you confronted him about it and it turned out to be a positive outcome. Plus, you showed him what you have together means something to you by opening up to him.  I'm also thrilled I was right about him not trying to break things off with you. I know alot of people here thought that's what  was happening but my gut was telling me that wasn't the case because it happened in the same context it did for me with now hubby. Looks like your on/off guy may finally be ready to change  his ways  and put  a real effort into having  a stable, loving relationship. I'm happy for you divegrl! 

[elaine567]

4 hours ago, divegrl said:

I asked him why he said that he wasn’t sure if he wanted to be with me. He said that it was just what we had been talking about.  How I keep things surface level, fun, flirty. How he needs more deeper, meaningful, serious and logical interactions.

Is that in fact possible? Can you do that? 
I am always suspicious of men (and women) who want to actively steer others into being the person they want to be with.
He is asking you to change who you are... no pressure then...
I am a bit cynical and sceptical.
Had you been serious and intense, would be then want to make you more fun and flirty?

Edited February 12, 2021 by elaine567

[Gaeta]

Here is some reading. He too asked his girlfriend of 2 months to have more *substance*

Somehow I can't link the link the same way I used to....

Thread: He needs substance

 

Edited February 12, 2021 by Gaeta

[poppyfields]

16 hours ago, poppyfields said:

I keep saying this, but things are not always what they appear to be, that's why it's important to ask and talk about it.

^^Repeating for emphasis.

I'm glad you talked divegrl; continue observing and see how this plays out moving forward now that you've apparently given him what he needed.

The above quote can go the other way too; stay positive but also stay aware.  It's still very early stages. 

Good luck to you both! 

Edited February 12, 2021 by poppyfields