Complicated Toxic relationship

[Basil James jr]

I am struggling to achieve peace & harmony in my relationship. The respect has been lost and we are so out of sync that we can never seem to see eye to eye or communicate effectively . There is a lot of resentment  coming from my partner from issues that we have had in the past...however when we confront this  she acknowledges it and says that she has forgiven me  ,Vice versa. 

The reality is that her behaviour contradicts her words , she is so far gone that she has become comfortable with being disrespectful and has no intention of taking any accountability for her actions ,even though she apologises and promises to change .

She has mood swings like crazy , she is often depressed and has agreed to seek professional help  in times of crisis but she never follows through .

We have a 6month old baby that get's caught up in the middle of this . 

Due to covid and confinement the vibe has been rather dark , also made it complicated to have space .

I really don't know what to do anymore..

 

 

 

 

[Wiseman2]

1 hour ago, Basil James jr said:

I am struggling to achieve peace & harmony in my relationship.

We have a 6month old baby that get's caught up in the middle of this . 

Due to covid and confinement the vibe has been rather dark , also made it complicated to have space .

Sorry this is happening. Lots going on. 6 mos old, covid , etc. Try to step back and not change anyone or solve problems right now. One step at a time. Stay away from emotional topics right now. Stick with practicalities. Food, baby, chores, sleep, meals, helping  each other with those. etc. If things get hairy, shift to taking care of the newborn, or offer to go to the store for supplies. Break the cadence of arguing, etc. Are friend/family nearby? Have you had alone time or intimacy?

[Basil James jr]

26 minutes ago, Wiseman2 said:

Sorry this is happening. Lots going on. 6 mos old, covid , etc. Try to step back and not change anyone or solve problems right now. One step at a time. Stay away from emotional topics right now. Stick with practicalities. Food, baby, chores, sleep, meals, helping  each other with those. etc. If things get hairy, shift to taking care of the newborn, or offer to go to the store for supplies. Break the cadence of arguing, etc. Are friend/family nearby? Have you had alone time or intimacy?

Thank you .Good question , we haven't . It's crazy because my birthday just passed and i had such an amazing day filled with romantic surprises .

 

But just the day after we started fighting again .

Space and intimacy are definitely a rarity in this relationship , we always have members of her family around . We are an international couple , most of my close friends and family are oceans away .

We are suppose to go see my family for the first time in march , to introduce her and the baby to them. 

But things are as worse as they can get . 

 

 

 

[mark clemson]

Sorry to hear this. Consider researching something called the Drama Triangle and see if it "rings true" for her behavior.

If so, you're going to have to consider making some tough calls, such as insisting she actually get that therapy she keeps mentioning for the sake of keeping the family together and your sanity intact.

Edited February 2, 2021 by mark clemson

[BaileyB]

Is it possible that she is experiencing post-partum  depression? 

[Basil James jr]

4 hours ago, mark clemson said:

Sorry to hear this. Consider researching something called the Drama Triangle and see if it "rings true" for her behavior.

If so, you're going to have to consider making some tough calls, such as insisting she actually get that therapy she keeps mentioning for the sake of keeping the family together and your sanity intact.

I will definitely look into this .Thanks 

[ExpatInItaly]

9 hours ago, Basil James jr said:

I am struggling to achieve peace & harmony in my relationship. The respect has been lost and we are so out of sync that we can never seem to see eye to eye or communicate effectively . There is a lot of resentment  coming from my partner from issues that we have had in the past...however when we confront this  she acknowledges it and says that she has forgiven me  ,Vice versa. 

What sort of issues?

[Basil James jr]

1 hour ago, BaileyB said:

Is it possible that she is experiencing post-partum  depression? 

Umm..we have discussed this , she says that she isn't. 

Shortly after returning to work she was laid off , she's been trying to get back on her feet ever since applying for jobs etc however due to industries and companies downsizing or closing down it has proven to be difficult .   So she has also been having an identity crisis as a mother . 

Hence the idea of changing environments and going to spend time with my family to clear our heads and be around good vibes and people who care about us .

Considering the above i've been tolerant and tried to be as compassionate as i can . However issues of the past keep resurfacing and it feels like we are going around in circles .   

[basil67]

No matter what she says, if she's raising the past, then she hasn't forgiven or moved on.  She may well want to forgive and move on - hence the words - but it's often easier said than done, especially if it involves trust.    Can you tell us what she's holding on to from the past....and what she's mad about now?

She may deny that she has post partum depression, but you say she's depressed and has mood swings, so either way she needs help.  Have you flagged this possibility with her baby nurse/pediatrician?   While they can't share her health information with you, they can certainly listen to your concerns and take it into consideration.   

What about marriage counselling?   Perhaps a third party can help you get to the bottom of it.

Last question: Was the relationship ever good?   How long was it positive for, and for how long has it now been bad?   Was there any catalyst for the change from positive to negative relationship?

[Basil James jr]

4 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

What sort of issues?

Oh boy.. i wouldn't know where to start 

I think it's a deep rabbit hole and we have both participated to this . A lot has happened over 5 years . I try not to keep a tally .

I've acknowledged my mistakes and tried a list of ways to work through these issues , however it seems as though i'm the only one willing to do the work.

She has a hard time apologizing and taking responsibility for her actions , so instead of being self aware zooming out and holding herself accountable she will play the blame game and find something to pin on me . Then it gets messy. Once this escalates ,that becomes the focal point and what initially got us here in the first place becomes a debate. 

 

I.e if i call her out on something or ask her to do something she will take it personal and start taking subliminal shots at me , make snide remarks or be super shady . 

Whereas when it comes from her whether i like what i am hearing or not i have the decency to listen to her and keep it moving. 

 

She can not see herself and is not willing to consider the things that i tell her about herself . In moments where she does...it takes a few days until she falls back into the same behavioural  patterns . 

 

[ExpatInItaly]

5 minutes ago, Basil James jr said:

Oh boy.. i wouldn't know where to start 

I think it's a deep rabbit hole and we have both participated to this . A lot has happened over 5 years . I try not to keep a tally .

It's not about keeping tally, really.

It's just that it's little hard to comment without knowing the sort of issues that have caused conflict in the past, OP. Context is often important to current problems. Can you give us a general idea of how you've both gone wrong before? 

 

[Basil James jr]

2 minutes ago, basil67 said:

No matter what she says, if she's raising the past, then she hasn't forgiven or moved on.  She may well want to forgive and move on - hence the words - but it's often easier said than done, especially if it involves trust.    Can you tell us what she's holding on to from the past....and what she's mad about now?

She may deny that she has post partum depression, but you say she's depressed and has mood swings, so either way she needs help.  Have you flagged this possibility with her baby nurse/pediatrician?   While they can't share her health information with you, they can certainly listen to your concerns and take it into consideration.   

What about marriage counselling?   Perhaps a third party can help you get to the bottom of it.

Last question: Was the relationship ever good?   How long was it positive for, and for how long has it now been bad?   Was there any catalyst for the change from positive to negative relationship?

1.last week she broke down and admitted to being depressed and agreed to see someone . She said she would see her doctor first to get a prescription so that it would be subsidized by the state(because  it's expensive)  

2. She has agreed to see a relationship counselor , after a lot of convincing . But now she has been procrastinating and making excuses. 

3. She once had an abortion and she feels as though i was too emotional detached and that i was not there for her emotionally .

During her pregnancy , she felt neglected and that we didn't experience it together as a couple . She felt alone .

4. The relationship has definitely had good times but it's been bad for so long that i really can't recall where it took a shift .

 

I've always been optimistic and thought that if i do the work or make the effort that things will get better , which i have been doing but i can't say the same for her . 

I know she's had issues in her past relationship . That she hasn't dealt with but she no longer has the respect to listen to me and consider what i have to say at this point it has to come from a third party.

 

 

 

 

 

  

[Basil James jr]

20 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

It's not about keeping tally, really.

It's just that it's little hard to comment without knowing the sort of issues that have caused conflict in the past, OP. Context is often important to current problems. Can you give us a general idea of how you've both gone wrong before? 

 

I've had anger management issues ( during conflict resolution ,i've used fire to fight fire either going from 0-100 raising my voice and expressing extreme rage) .   Intimacy issues(emotional detachment ,In the past i was incapable of being vulnerable , i lacked empathy and found it hard to be openly affectionate  ) . 

Which i was able to unpack and trace back to my childhood upbringing . 

I've accepted it and really given into it so that i can work on myself .I know that we both have our own fare share of baggage i'm take full responsibility for mine.

 On her side she was previously in an abusive relationship. she has been domineering and controlling , she has always wanted to do things on her terms and never made any compromises or efforts to meet me halfway . So commitment and trust issues.

I moved continents for her and adapted to her "world" (it was suppose to be a footnote on our path just until she got her masters which took 2years)

Her lifestyle , her friends her family and her interests have been second to nothing . She has never wanted to leave her comfort zone and challenge herself to grow up and build a solid foundation for her future independantly

I.e getting our own place ,moving , couple business ventures /future goals   joint savings etc .

She's the only girl in a family of 4brothers. She comes from a wealthy background and she is super dependent on her parents .

Initially we had our own place ,but due to unforeseen events we were obligated to move into a flatshare with her two brothers. Only now after  3years and the departure of the two other flatmates as well as the arrival of the baby are we now obligated to leave  and find a new apartment . 

 

 And now everything is starting to back fire

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[basil67]

1 hour ago, Basil James jr said:

1.last week she broke down and admitted to being depressed and agreed to see someone . She said she would see her doctor first to get a prescription so that it would be subsidized by the state(because  it's expensive)  

2. She has agreed to see a relationship counselor , after a lot of convincing . But now she has been procrastinating and making excuses. 

3. She once had an abortion and she feels as though i was too emotional detached and that i was not there for her emotionally .

During her pregnancy , she felt neglected and that we didn't experience it together as a couple . She felt alone .

4. The relationship has definitely had good times but it's been bad for so long that i really can't recall where it took a shift .

 

I've always been optimistic and thought that if i do the work or make the effort that things will get better , which i have been doing but i can't say the same for her . 

I know she's had issues in her past relationship . That she hasn't dealt with but she no longer has the respect to listen to me and consider what i have to say at this point it has to come from a third party.  

So she's admitted to depression.  That's a great start.  I hope the doctor investigates causes.

She's agreed to see a counsellor, but you say that she's procrastinating.  What is there to procrastinate over?  You can make make an appointment and organise a sitter...all she's got to do is show up.  

You have my sympathy for the abortion.  In what current situations does she raise that you weren't there for her back then?    Why did she feel neglected in the pregnancy?  Did you attend ultrasound appointments, do birthing classes, decorate the nursery and enjoy holding her belly for kicks?  

Thinking about how long things have been bad for....for instance, were you happy when you were planning this baby?

Out of curiosity, what are your working hours like?   Do you do much socialising with mates while she's at home with baby?

[Basil James jr]

6 hours ago, basil67 said:

So she's admitted to depression.  That's a great start.  I hope the doctor investigates causes.

She's agreed to see a counsellor, but you say that she's procrastinating.  What is there to procrastinate over?  You can make make an appointment and organise a sitter...all she's got to do is show up.  

You have my sympathy for the abortion.  In what current situations does she raise that you weren't there for her back then?    Why did she feel neglected in the pregnancy?  Did you attend ultrasound appointments, do birthing classes, decorate the nursery and enjoy holding her belly for kicks?  

Thinking about how long things have been bad for....for instance, were you happy when you were planning this baby?

Out of curiosity, what are your working hours like?   Do you do much socialising with mates while she's at home with baby?

Yes i was present in all these moments . We ere excited . However her reality of the experience is very different from mine .

 

I only worked 4 days a week 8-5 throughout

Her pregnancy . During the 3last months we were under confinement

Her mother had come to visit prior to this ,however due to the borders closing she had to confine with us .Our daughter being the first grandchild in the family the grandmother was excited and really got involved in the preparation of birth to the point where they were spending a lot of their time together . She really took up a lot of space and  became very involved in a lot of decision making . I took a step back and thought that maybe it's a normal mother and daughter bonding moment . However that came across as me not being attentive.

Simultaneously while we were confined  i kept my self busy with a personal project that i had been excited about which took a lot of my time . 

The mom was around 24/7 . 

Everytime my gf needed something she would insist on doing it and try to make me look bad ,furthermore instigating drama in our relationship by insinuating that i wasn't doing enough.

At the same time she is a very eccentric character that is a bit obsessive over having control and being in charge of everything. 

[Basil James jr]

9 hours ago, basil67 said:

No matter what she says, if she's raising the past, then she hasn't forgiven or moved on.  She may well want to forgive and move on - hence the words - but it's often easier said than done, especially if it involves trust.    Can you tell us what she's holding on to from the past....and what she's mad about now?

She may deny that she has post partum depression, but you say she's depressed and has mood swings, so either way she needs help.  Have you flagged this possibility with her baby nurse/pediatrician?   While they can't share her health information with you, they can certainly listen to your concerns and take it into consideration.   

What about marriage counselling?   Perhaps a third party can help you get to the bottom of it.

Last question: Was the relationship ever good?   How long was it positive for, and for how long has it now been bad?   Was there any catalyst for the change from positive to negative relationship?

In hindsight It's been average from the beginning with exception to a few experiences.

I've always been optimistic about the relationship working once our circumstances changed or if i made the effort to change . 

 

  

[Basil James jr]

11 hours ago, BaileyB said:

Is it possible that she is experiencing post-partum  depression? 

She says that it's not possible.

 

[smackie9]

Your answer is her getting medical help and getting diagnosed/treatment. You can't talk your way out of this...it has to happen. Sounds to me she has borderline personalty disorder (just a guess).

[BaileyB]

1 hour ago, Basil James jr said:

She says that it's not possible.

 

As per your previous post, she admitted to being depressed and said she would seek treatment. 

It’s quite clear that you both bring a lot of baggage to this relationship. It’s also very clear to me that when people ask for more information about the issues in your relationship, you primarily bring forward “her” issues. That may/may not be the case, I’m not saying that you are necessarily wrong in your assessment. 

The title of your post says “complicated toxic relationship” and I would agree - this sounds like a complicated toxic relationship. I would agree, it sounds to me like your wife is experiencing mental health issues - whether they were preexisting or related to/resulting from the pregnancy, that is for a medical professional to decide. You both need counselling, as this doesn’t seem to be a problem that you can fix on your own. It’s very concerning for me because there is now a child who has been born into this complicated toxic relationship... I hope you get some help for the sake of the child, if nothing else. I just don’t see how this will improve without the help of medical and mental health providers. Best wishes. 

Edited February 2, 2021 by BaileyB

[Basil James jr]

5 hours ago, BaileyB said:

As per your previous post, she admitted to being depressed and said she would seek treatment. 

It’s quite clear that you both bring a lot of baggage to this relationship. It’s also very clear to me that when people ask for more information about the issues in your relationship, you primarily bring forward “her” issues. That may/may not be the case, I’m not saying that you are necessarily wrong in your assessment. 

The title of your post says “complicated toxic relationship” and I would agree - this sounds like a complicated toxic relationship. I would agree, it sounds to me like your wife is experiencing mental health issues - whether they were preexisting or related to/resulting from the pregnancy, that is for a medical professional to decide. You both need counselling, as this doesn’t seem to be a problem that you can fix on your own. It’s very concerning for me because there is now a child who has been born into this complicated toxic relationship... I hope you get some help for the sake of the child, if nothing else. I just don’t see how this will improve without the help of medical and mental health providers. Best wishes. 

Thank you , well said.

[Wiseman2]

15 hours ago, Basil James jr said:

Once this escalates ,that becomes the focal point and what initially got us here in the first place becomes a debate. 

if i call her out on something or ask her to do something she will take it personal and start taking subliminal shots at me , make snide remarks or be super shady . 

She can not see herself and is not willing to consider the things that i tell her about herself . In moments where she does...it takes a few days until she falls back into the same behavioural  patterns . 

Ok, none of this fixing, changing, "calling out" pointing out etc is your job. So save yourself a lot of grief and stop trying to change her. Focus on the new child and finding your own place. How she is with her parents is not your problem either. That's just the way it is with them.

[Basil James jr]

10 hours ago, Wiseman2 said:

Ok, none of this fixing, changing, "calling out" pointing out etc is your job. So save yourself a lot of grief and stop trying to change her. Focus on the new child and finding your own place. How she is with her parents is not your problem either. That's just the way it is with them.

Thank you , you are so right!

 

[Miss Spider]

I no don’t usually recommend couples therapy... but you guys have a new baby and with covid and that she might have some postpartum depression even if she says not. I think if you can get it, maybe give it a try. I don’t know how long is it been going on though. Wishing you the best 

Edited February 3, 2021 by Shortskirtslonglashes