He takes ages to respond to a text message!

[poppyfields]

2 minutes ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

No, I was going to delete him and he texted me apologizing (must have a crystal ball lol), and we ended up talking. Yes we want to reschedule but guess what, we are on lockdown now...

So you're back to liking him again?    Just teasing, that's okay, I'm sort of like that too.  I like you, I don't like you, back to liking.

The truth is I always liked him (or loved him), I'm just mad, or hurt or whatever.

It can be confusing and exhausting sometimes, but SO worth it, don't you think?

 

[Watercolors]

2 hours ago, ExpatInItaly said:

Sometimes those of us who bark about having high standards are actually looking for ways to get a one-up on people they feel have rejected them. 

It can be a thinly-disguised attempt to regain control in a situation where the other party has already demonstrated that they're not altogether bothered about where it goes. A "well, he (or she) is not good enough for me anyway, so there!"-type mental maneuver. 

Speak for yourself!

I’m not barking, or trying to one up anybody when I have high standards. I’m trying to weed out the losers and incompatible guys, by having very clear expectations and boundaries.

There’s nothing manipulative about having clear standards for dating.

I think it’s better to have consistently high standards than to be wishy-washy “I like you. I don’t like you. I like you.” 

When you’re flaky and  waffle with your standards and boundaries, you set yourself up for failure. Then you’ll just choose guys who are wrong fit you, because you aren’t  clear and upfront, with yourself or with prospective relationship partners, on what you’re willing to put up with and what are deal breakers. 

Edited January 19, 2021 by Watercolors

[poppyfields]

19 minutes ago, Watercolors said:

I think it’s better to have consistently high standards than to be wishy-washy “I like you. I don’t like you. I like you.” 

Hey WC, my comment (I like you, don't like you, back to liking), was tongue-n-cheek, but the fact is in a LTR (or even short term or just starting out) feelings can be fluid.  

The feelings never truly change though, they just ebb and flow.  

I mean look at GND, she was hurt so she told herself (and us) "I don't like him."  We ALL knew she still liked him, she was just hurt or mad.  I mean, wasn't it obvious?

Now that they've talked and cleared the air (hopefully) she's not hurt anymore, so back to liking.

These early stages can be so precarious.  Both people are uncertain and navigating the process of connecting.

I think all this is perfectly normal, but if you don't, I respect that!

 

 

Edited January 19, 2021 by poppyfields

[Watercolors]

39 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Hey WC, my comment (I like you, don't like you, back to liking), was tongue-n-cheek, but the fact is in a LTR (or even short term or just starting out) feelings can be fluid.  

The feelings never truly change though, they just ebb and flow.  

I mean look at GND, she was hurt so she told herself (and us) "I don't like him."  We ALL knew she still liked him, she was just hurt or mad.  I mean, wasn't it obvious?

Now that they've talked and cleared the air (hopefully) she's not hurt anymore, so back to liking.

These early stages can be so precarious.  Both people are uncertain and navigating the process of connecting.

I think all this is perfectly normal, but if you don't, I respect that!

 

 

Yeah we're not on the same page here, poppy.   Don't speak for girlnextdoor...just speak for yourself. It's easier that way. 

I'm not talking about feelings. I'm talking about tangible standards, boundaries, expectations. And our feelings are what reflect those standards, boundaries, and expectations. Hence, if you are flaky and wishy washy about your feelings "ebbing and flowing," well, that's because you don't have clearcut, strong, consistent standards, boundaries, or expectations with the other person. Feelings shouldn't "ebb and flow" where boundaries are concerned. If I was in the situation where my boyfriend gave me the ultimatum, "it's me or [other choice]," it would be [other choice] every time.  

Girlnextdoor is multi-dating 5 guys. Online dating is about choices; and, prioritizing and optioning those choices. She has 5 guys to choose from. She likes Guy A but deleted him b/c he didn't respond to her texts as quickly as she expected (but didn't communicate to him). By the time she deleted him, he reached out to her to apologize for not being in touch. She demonstrated one of her standards: the guy HAS to text her back immediately or she makes assumptions, and assumes the worst about him. That's fine. But, moving forward, she needs to communicate to these other 4 guys, "Hey. I love texting and that's how I mainly communicate, so if you don't like to text, we're probably not going to be a good match." That's one way for her to communicate her boundary and her expectation as she multi-dates. It will help her in the long run, and help the guys know that if they hate texting, she's not a good match for them. 

This isn't about early stages. This is about communicating your standards, your boundaries, and your expectations CLEARLY and consistently, not waffling back and forth, which sends mixed messages and can royally screw everything up. 

We just have different viewpoints, poppy. But don't speak for girlnextdoor or for me or anyone else. Just speak for yourself. K? 

[poppyfields]

16 minutes ago, Watercolors said:

We just have different viewpoints, poppy. But don't speak for girlnextdoor or for me or anyone else. Just speak for yourself. K? 

Of course WC, but I wasn't doing that.  I was only speaking to what I observed from her.  From her posts on this forum.  Is that the same thing?  Maybe it is.

That being, she had a date, she felt they connected.  Thereafter his texting dropped off.  She very clearly was bothered by that.  She stated she was turned off, she didn't like him anymore, she was going to delete him.  She posted that.

Fast forward to today.  He reached out and apologized, they cleared the air and are planning another date.  She's back to feeling good about him again (liking him).

So what does that tell you? It tells me that her feelings ebbed and flowed based on his actions of dropping off then apologizing and planning another date.

Just my opinion based on what I've read on this thread, on other forums, in books and articles and my own experience.

EDIT:  We can agree to disagree WC, I am okay with that.   Differing opinions are part of life, no one is going to agree on everything, life would be quite a bore if we did!

 

 

 

 

Edited January 20, 2021 by poppyfields

[dramafreezone]

19 minutes ago, Watercolors said:

Yeah we're not on the same page here, poppy.   Don't speak for girlnextdoor...just speak for yourself. It's easier that way. 

I'm not talking about feelings. I'm talking about tangible standards, boundaries, expectations. And our feelings are what reflect those standards, boundaries, and expectations. Hence, if you are flaky and wishy washy about your feelings "ebbing and flowing," well, that's because you don't have clearcut, strong, consistent standards, boundaries, or expectations with the other person. Feelings shouldn't "ebb and flow" where boundaries are concerned. If I was in the situation where my boyfriend gave me the ultimatum, "it's me or [other choice]," it would be [other choice] every time.  

Girlnextdoor is multi-dating 5 guys. Online dating is about choices; and, prioritizing and optioning those choices. She has 5 guys to choose from. She likes Guy A but deleted him b/c he didn't respond to her texts as quickly as she expected (but didn't communicate to him). By the time she deleted him, he reached out to her to apologize for not being in touch. She demonstrated one of her standards: the guy HAS to text her back immediately or she makes assumptions, and assumes the worst about him. That's fine. But, moving forward, she needs to communicate to these other 4 guys, "Hey. I love texting and that's how I mainly communicate, so if you don't like to text, we're probably not going to be a good match." That's one way for her to communicate her boundary and her expectation as she multi-dates. It will help her in the long run, and help the guys know that if they hate texting, she's not a good match for them. 

This isn't about early stages. This is about communicating your standards, your boundaries, and your expectations CLEARLY and consistently, not waffling back and forth, which sends mixed messages and can royally screw everything up. 

We just have different viewpoints, poppy. But don't speak for girlnextdoor or for me or anyone else. Just speak for yourself. K? 

Standards are good to have but there comes a point to where the person doesn't just have standards, they're rigid, inflexible.

And she's talking to those other 4 guys sure, but I'd bet dollars to donuts that she likes the guy that didn't conform to her standard a hell of a lot more than those other guys.  Otherwise she wouldn't have even made a thread, she would've just moved on.

I don't like smokers, but if a Margot Robbie lookalike that smoked was giving me googly-eyes and we ended up going out, I'd probably overlook it.

I guess she has to decide what she priortizes, these behavior standards or a guy that does it for her.  Ideally you get both but frequently the guys that don't conform to rules are the guys that do it for you.  Qualities/behaviors in men are usually a package deal.  The ones with charisma, highly masculine, assertive, they don't do a lot of texting.

Edited January 20, 2021 by dramafreezone

[poppyfields]

2 minutes ago, dramafreezone said:

Standards are good to have but there comes a point to where the person doesn't just have standards, they're rigid, inflexible.

And she's talking to those other 4 guys sure, but I'd bet dollars to donuts that she likes the guy that didn't conform to her standard a hell of a lot more than those other guys.  Otherwise she wouldn't have even made a thread, she would've just moved on.

Not only did she not move on, she has planned another date with him.  

I dunno, hopefully she has learned something from this.   That things are not always what they appear to be, to remain open and flexible to changing nuances, and that things are not always so black and white.

[Watercolors]

35 minutes ago, dramafreezone said:

Standards are good to have but there comes a point to where the person doesn't just have standards, they're rigid, inflexible.

And she's talking to those other 4 guys sure, but I'd bet dollars to donuts that she likes the guy that didn't conform to her standard a hell of a lot more than those other guys.  Otherwise she wouldn't have even made a thread, she would've just moved on.

I don't like smokers, but if a Margot Robbie lookalike that smoked was giving me googly-eyes and we ended up going out, I'd probably overlook it.

I guess she has to decide what she priortizes, these behavior standards or a guy that does it for her.  Ideally you get both but frequently the guys that don't conform to rules are the guys that do it for you.  Qualities/behaviors in men are usually a package deal.  The ones with charisma, highly masculine, assertive, they don't do a lot of texting.

True. I agree. Standards can be rigid and inflexible. But..the trick (I think) is not to bend your standards for everyone. Then you just end up lowering your standards, and reduce the likelihood of ever finding the right, compatible person for yourself. 

For me, I hate texters. I can't stand texting or any online communication which is why I won't do online dating (plus, I can't be bothered wasting the monthly fee money for OLD). I'm GenX, so I would gel with a GenX guy who still would talk on the phone with me, versus sending me silly texts. Words (texts) show you who the person pretends to be, but actions shows you who the person really is. I realize that online dating is all about "words" and not about actions. That's probably why I failed at it, when i did do online dating. I hated it. 

Yes, girlnextdoor needs to decide of these 5 guys, how to prioritize them; who will she make just back up options. 

 

[Watercolors]

51 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Of course WC, but I wasn't doing that.  I was only speaking to what I observed from her.  From her posts on this forum.  Is that the same thing?  Maybe it is.

That being, she had a date, she felt they connected.  Thereafter his texting dropped off.  She very clearly was bothered by that.  She stated she was turned off, she didn't like him anymore, she was going to delete him.  She posted that.

Fast forward to today.  He reached out and apologized, they cleared the air and are planning another date.  She's back to feeling good about him again (liking him).

So what does that tell you? It tells me that her feelings ebbed and flowed based on his actions of dropping off then apologizing and planning another date.

Just my opinion based on what I've read on this thread, on other forums, in books and articles and my own experience.

EDIT:  We can agree to disagree WC, I am okay with that.   Differing opinions are part of life, no one is going to agree on everything, life would be quite a bore if we did!

 

 

 

 

Right and she waffled about her interest in him because he didn't respond to her texts timely enough for her, which I suppose is her right. If she need that constant text banter from these OLD guys no matter if its pre-first-date or post-first-date, that's her standards. Her mistake, in hindsight, was setting her standards too high with him.

She deleted him because he didn't meet her standards for texting. But now she's going to go on another date with him because he reached out to her again? To me, that comes across like optioning, which again, is her call. I guess, with online dating, everyone's an option, until you find someone to be exclusive with. 

I just would encourage girlnextdoor to stop expecting these guys to read her mind about what her standards are. Instead, she needs to text her standards to these guys so that they know where they stand early on. If she needs that incessant text banter, she needs to tell them that in some way.

Not communicating what you need to another person, is literally the worst thing you can do to yourself, b/c no one can read your mind. Online dating seems rampant with the whole mind reading behavior. If people just asked for what they needed, they have a 50/50 chance of the other person giving them what they need. If you don't ask for something you have zero chance of receiving it. 

Nah. We're good. You and I disagree almost always  so when we do agree on something here, it's rare but good. 

[Wiseman2]

If you were into him this would be crystal clear. You would be deliberating this much.

[ExpatInItaly]

13 hours ago, Watercolors said:

Speak for yourself!

I’m not barking, or trying to one up anybody when I have high standards. I’m trying to weed out the losers and incompatible guys, by having very clear expectations and boundaries.

That post wasn't directed at you, WC. 

[girlnextdoor2020]

13 hours ago, poppyfields said:

Not only did she not move on, she has planned another date with him.  

I dunno, hopefully she has learned something from this.   That things are not always what they appear to be, to remain open and flexible to changing nuances, and that things are not always so black and white.

Well, yes I did like him and then didn't like him. Now I'm at a point where I am giving him the benefit of the doubt but I am cautious about him now. Didn't go back to liking him just like that no.

He is now texting me a lot again. So I should be happy with that, right? But now I am just thinking "what if he was dating other woman he was more interested and she kicked him out and now he's back talking to me more"?

I like consistency a lot. So when I don't see consistency, my guard is up.

I am talking to another guy who likes communicating as much as I do and up until now is being consistent. So, all is open now and let's see what happens.

[introverted1]

19 hours ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

You do not have competition because with the right person there is nothing you can do or say that will ruin things. Both will be attracted enough to go on dates and feel good. Simple.

It sounds like you have watched one too many romcoms.  In the early stages of dating both people are getting to know each other.  There is no way to know if someone is the "right person" after one date!  Yes, you can have strong feelings of attraction (limerance) but that doesn't necessarily translate to lasting rightness. 

There's nothing wrong with having standards.  In fact, there is a lot right with it!  But there is a huge difference between having standards and demanding that others approach early dating exactly as you do.  Of course you can do this and set arbitrary rules about number of texts and so on, but there is nothing to say that the man who has the time or inclination to spend his days texting you will be the person who is overall right for you in the long run.

[FMW]

1 hour ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

I am talking to another guy who likes communicating as much as I do and up until now is being consistent

I don't get worrying the other guy was talking to someone else that didn't work out and so now that's why he's paying more attention to you -  when you're talking to other guys as well.  Your regular texting with one guy while still keeping the lines open with the other guy(s) is pretty much the same thing.  This other guy's consistency doesn't mean he has any more real interest in you personally than the first guy does - could be he's just more into texting and makes the time to text you - and other women.  

 

[poppyfields]

1 hour ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

I like consistency a lot. So when I don't see consistency, my guard is up.

Well, you yourself were not consistent. 

You liked him, didn't like him, kept him on read, were thinking of deleting, now you like again, but cautious.  One can't get more inconsistent than that.

You're also talking to several other guys. 

But yet you expect men (him) to be consistent.  To never have a doubt, never feel any uncertainty.

You will probably say that you were inconsistent because of his lack of consistency.  

Fair enough but perhaps he was inconsistent due to something you did, on the date, after the date or due to his own anxieties that have nothing to do with you (which would be my best guess.) 

I've said this before but flexibility is so important.  

Expectations such as men must adhere to strict standards such as always being consistent, or wanting to focus on only you, when you don't hold yourself to those same rigid standards is one long road to never-never land. 

Feelings can and do fluctuate in these precarious early stages, as evidenced by your own feelings fluctuating.

Do him the courtesy and have the flexibility of allowing him the same and you will fare much better in your dating experiences as you navigate the process of moving closer to each other. 

Edited January 20, 2021 by poppyfields

[stillafool]

2 hours ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

But now I am just thinking "what if he was dating other woman he was more interested and she kicked him out and now he's back talking to me more"?

You should be able to figure this out quickly as you are doing the same thing.  You may not be actually dating the other guys but you are texting them all to see who you like best.  I imagine he is doing pretty much the same thing as you are in one way or the other.

[peach302]

2 hours ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

Well, yes I did like him and then didn't like him. Now I'm at a point where I am giving him the benefit of the doubt but I am cautious about him now. Didn't go back to liking him just like that no.

He is now texting me a lot again. So I should be happy with that, right? But now I am just thinking "what if he was dating other woman he was more interested and she kicked him out and now he's back talking to me more"?

I like consistency a lot. So when I don't see consistency, my guard is up.

I am talking to another guy who likes communicating as much as I do and up until now is being consistent. So, all is open now and let's see what happens.

He probably thinks or realised he was close to losing you as an option. So he's working harder. 

As soon as you start the texting back and forth again too much. .he may draw back.

But just wait and see.

 

[girlnextdoor2020]

5 hours ago, introverted1 said:

It sounds like you have watched one too many romcoms.  In the early stages of dating both people are getting to know each other.  There is no way to know if someone is the "right person" after one date!  Yes, you can have strong feelings of attraction (limerance) but that doesn't necessarily translate to lasting rightness. 

There's nothing wrong with having standards.  In fact, there is a lot right with it!  But there is a huge difference between having standards and demanding that others approach early dating exactly as you do.  Of course you can do this and set arbitrary rules about number of texts and so on, but there is nothing to say that the man who has the time or inclination to spend his days texting you will be the person who is overall right for you in the long run.

I never said at early stages of dating people know they are meant to be (although many people do).

What I said is when two people are right to each other and meant to be, there will be no other men or women that will come between them. 

There is like a special ‘glue’ that bond them together, even if it takes time to acknowledge that.

They will like each other simple. There’s just no competition for true love.

 

 

[girlnextdoor2020]

4 hours ago, peach302 said:

He probably thinks or realised he was close to losing you as an option. So he's working harder. 

As soon as you start the texting back and forth again too much. .he may draw back.

But just wait and see.

 

Yes that was my point exactly. Let’s see.

[girlnextdoor2020]

4 hours ago, stillafool said:

You should be able to figure this out quickly as you are doing the same thing.  You may not be actually dating the other guys but you are texting them all to see who you like best.  I imagine he is doing pretty much the same thing as you are in one way or the other.

I didn’t text a lot before our date and then texted a lot less and just basic stuff after. 

He was the one showing inconsistency and then what i did was simply mirror him. 

This is not about talking to other people or not, which is fine both ways since we are not in a relationship.

This is about showing interest, then showing less, then more again, etc. Sorry I don’t like that.

I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt but I think he is going to do the same again and I’m off when he does.

[dramafreezone]

7 minutes ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

I didn’t text a lot before our date and then texted a lot less and just basic stuff after. 

He was the one showing inconsistency and then what i did was simply mirror him. 

This is not about talking to other people or not, which is fine both ways since we are not in a relationship.

This is about showing interest, then showing less, then more again, etc. Sorry I don’t like that.

I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt but I think he is going to do the same again and I’m off when he does.

People have lives.  If someone that you just met has an actual career and hobbies they're not going to be able to maintain the exact same level of communication all the time.  It will ebb and flow, and that doens't mean that they'd doing it intentionally to get on your nerves.  I'm 100% certain it will happen again, and it probably has nothing to do with you.  Maybe that might change in the future once you've actually been out on more than two dates but I think your expectations this early on are just way out of wack with reality.

If someone you just met is able to text you as often as you think this guy should should chances are they don't have a lot going on in their lives.

Edited January 20, 2021 by dramafreezone

[poppyfields]

15 minutes ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

He was the one showing inconsistency and then what i did was simply mirror him. 

This is about showing interest, then showing less, then more again, etc. Sorry I don’t like that.

Forget mirroring.  Mirroring has screwed so many would-be relationships up, I've lost count.  It's such a freakin game.

Might he be saying the same about you?  Maybe he was mirroring you!  Or maybe he had expectations of his own that you failed to meet.

Was there anything preventing you from initiating a text?   A fun, lighthearted text?  Maybe that is what HE needed.

I actually have no idea what happened here, except you had expectations of how he "should" behave (which he failed), and no doubt HE also had expectations.

Good on him for being the bigger person and breaking that toxic cycle.

However, sadly you still don't trust him.

Move on from him GND, with your current attitude this is not going to work.

Wish him well and focus on the other guy who meets your rigid (imo) standards and expectations and good luck!

Edited January 20, 2021 by poppyfields

[Perdu]

2 minutes ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

I didn’t text a lot before our date and then texted a lot less and just basic stuff after. 

He was the one showing inconsistency and then what i did was simply mirror him. 

This is not about talking to other people or not, which is fine both ways since we are not in a relationship.

This is about showing interest, then showing less, then more again, etc. Sorry I don’t like that.

I’m giving him the benefit of the doubt but I think he is going to do the same again and I’m off when he does.

 

10 minutes ago, girlnextdoor2020 said:

I never said at early stages of dating people know they are meant to be (although many people do).

What I said is when two people are right to each other and meant to be, there will be no other men or women that will come between them. 

There is like a special ‘glue’ that bond them together, even if it takes time to acknowledge that.

They will like each other simple. There’s just no competition for true love.

 

 

You may feel attraction, but you can't be sure after two dates that the you 2 are "right for eachother and ment to be".

You were attracted to him, showed interest, felt offended by him not reciprocating till the point where you consider deleting him and now you are exploring other options. These are all impulse fueled actions from your side, but not everybody acts on impulse, some people need to take more time in order to further pursue something. 

And we do live in the age of multiple/simultaneous dating, so you must take that into consideration. Given the opportunity, even somebody with good/sincere intentions can be  interested in checking out what else is there available, before moving forward with his best option so far.  

Maybe you should do that too, instead of putting too much pressure on one person, you can have better chances of finding the one who can better syncronize on all aspects.

 

[girlnextdoor2020]

28 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Forget mirroring.  Mirroring has screwed so many would-be relationships up, I've lost count.  It's such a freakin game.

Might he be saying the same about you?  Maybe he was mirroring you!  Or maybe he had expectations of his own that you failed to meet.

Was there anything preventing you from initiating a text?   A fun, lighthearted text?  Maybe that is what HE needed.

I actually have no idea what happened here, except you had expectations of how he "should" behave (which he failed), and no doubt HE also had expectations.

Good on him for being the bigger person and breaking that toxic cycle.

However, sadly you still don't trust him.

Move on from him GND, with your current attitude this is not going to work.

Wish him well and focus on the other guy who meets your rigid (imo) standards and expectations and good luck!

The other guy doesn’t meet my rigid standards and expectations, he is just more of a match to me and I feel more at ease talking to him because we have the same vibe. Simple.

What you call rigid expectations is nothing more than my intuition kicking in telling me something is off about this person. I wish in the past I heard it more and gave less opportunities to guys who didn’t deserve them.

One of those guys I remember would take ages to reply as well and later I found out he was engaged. 

That is why I’m thinking if I should give this guy a chance or not.

Edited January 20, 2021 by girlnextdoor2020

[dramafreezone]

Bottom line is no one knows what's going on in the other person's life unless you live with him.  Most people with a lot going on can't just drop everything or change their pattern for the other person.  Sometimes he may be more attentive and other times less attentitve because he has other people and things to tend to in his life.  Stop assuming it's about you or that  you should've been made a priority after two dates.  If you want to stick to these rules you're going to sabatoge your own happiness.