Asking for reason why she doesn't want to see me to get closure

[max3732]

I met someone from an online dating app and thought the first date went well. She was going to be 2 hours away for over a month after that and invited me to come see her there, which I did. I thought the 2nd date went well overall and we spent several hours together. During the 1st date I told her I was being very careful about covid, but in the 2nd I got closer and after spending so much time with her and then when we had dinner together and we got closer I couldn't help myself and kissed her and then she kissed me back several times. She asked me to text her when I got back and invited me to come up again, but she was going to be in my area soon and with the holidays it was tough so I said we should get back together when she was in my area.

I sent her a few texts and a pictures wishing her a merry Christmas and got nothing back. She used to respond right away and send me pictures and she sent nothing. Finally I asked if she was still interested by saying that I completely understand if she decided that she's not and if she didn't want to continue that was ok. She said yes she's still interested but she's just been very busy with work and will let me know when she'll be back in my area, which should be in the next few days. That was a couple weeks ago and I haven't heard back from her.

The fact that after our 2nd date she has ignored all my text, including the Christmas one until I asked if she was still interested and that she had said she'd contact me again by now and hasn't has obviously led me to believe she's not interested. So I've basically written her off at this point. I've been chatting with some other women online now and will hopefully get a 1st date with one of them.

I just have this nagging question about what happened in the 2nd date that made her not interested. We spent a lot of time together and talked about so many things. If there was something I did wrong or that I could learn from I'd like to do that. I just don't understand why she wouldn't just tell me in person or sometimes after the 2nd date, especially when I flat out asked that she wasn't interested. I keep thinking that she said she really respected how careful I'm being about covid (she was being careful too, but nowhere near as me) and then I ruined things by putting my arm around her at one point and then kissing her. If that was the case though then why'd she kiss me back more times than I was planning on?

Basically I'd like to get some closure out of her. Saying she's not interested because she learned x about me or that she wants someone who thinks a certain way or that I said something she didn't like. Why did she tell me she's still interested when she's obviously not? 

Would it be bad if I sent her another message asking her? It just keeps nagging at me.

[cleverusername]

She found someone closer

[trident_2020]

You aren't going to get closure.

Whatever her reasons were, she chose not to share, and she won't suddenly open up and say "ok it's because you smell bad" or any other personality defect or character flaw she may have discovered on that second date.

Or it could be completely unrelated to you as suggested by the poster above.

You need to let it go.

 

Edited January 10, 2021 by trident_2020

[elaine567]

Did you tell her you are in the extremely vulnerable group?
If you did, she may not want to be held responsible for potentially making you very ill if she gave the virus to you. 
 

[ExpatInItaly]

You could ask her, but understand that very few people will be brutally honest in such conversations, even if you assure her that you want to know. It's just an awkward position to be in, and many will probably give some version of "it's not you, it's me" anyway. Don't necessarily expect that it would be a very enlightening conversation, in other words. 

And why does it have to be something that you specifically did or said? It could simply be, as another poster mentioned, that she met someone closer to her and is spending time with him. Or maybe an ex popped back up. 

I think you're better to let it be. 

[poppyfields]

max, I think covid has got everyone messed up a bit.  If I weren't in a relationship, I wouldn't even be dating right now.  

I'd be limiting my interactions to on-line only and playing the long game until such time it's safe to meet.  Touch, kiss, have sex, develop a relationship.

Right now that is not possible.  There is so much anxiety and uncertainty about this virus, people are going to come and go; if they go, they might not know why themselves, only that they're uncomfortable continuing.

Learn to respect that.  She said she'd let you know when back in your area. Respect that.  Live your life.  

If she reaches out again, great, if not, so be.  It was two dates; it's important to keep things in proper perspective and keep yourself from becoming too attached to the outcome. 

 

Edited January 10, 2021 by poppyfields

[Wiseman2]

2 hours ago, max3732 said:

She said yes she's still interested but she's just been very busy with work and will let me know when she'll be back in my area, which should be in the next few days. That was a couple weeks ago and I haven't heard back from her.

I just have this nagging question about what happened in the 2nd date that made her not interested.

Sorry this happened. Often this early on, it's not about you at all. They may be dating others, talking to exes, whatever. Therefore any input would be some fabricated "so busy, so stressed" etc story. 

[basil67]

There's not always a tangible reason.  Sometimes, people just aren't feeling the vibe.

[Alvi]

2 hours ago, max3732 said:

She asked me to text her when I got back and invited me to come up again, but she was going to be in my area soon and with the holidays it was tough so I said we should get back together when she was in my area.

So she did invite you to see her but you said no to that. Maybe she interpreted that as a rejection or a disinterest on your part. Not saying you are at fault necessarily but maybe that how she sees it? I understand, Covid makes things more difficult but you did drive to see her twice already, right?

Of course, we can only guess. Could be many other reasons. In any case, it's only been two dates, don't think she owns you that much, or anything at all actually, at this point. I believe it would be a lot better if she was more direct and told you straight up that she is no longer interested. But hey, nowadays ghosting or slow fading is the new norm apparently.

Edited January 10, 2021 by Alvi

[Versacehottie]

People are different in the way they let people down some are direct...others are less so, even much less so. 

Things change all the time in relationships, even solid ones.  You have to be aware that a relationship is a fluid, dynamic entity, not boil it down to any one point in time after which you're in/set or out.  Of course, she could have picked one thing and thought "this is just insurmountable.  But more than likely it was a few factors together.

I think understanding there is NO one point in time that is perfect or that the other person's interest isn't set in stone will help free you up where you can just be yourself, make mistakes if you do but not freeze up because you are so worried about making a misstep.

I think the most important thing to learn from your OP as you wrote it here is that just because you filter and would do things a certain way does not mean other people do.  Understanding this concept would make dating so much easier for a lot of people. If you realize people do things very differently, you can proceed putting a higher value on good communication (while you have a chance, ie during the dating relationship, not after the fact to find out what went wrong).  I think you should take the silver lining of the lesson that sometimes it's as simple as if a person is no longer contacting you they are not interested.  One on hand it's good to keep learning about yourself but I get the feeling that you might want this information to change yourself or only expose what she liked and hide what she didn't--that's not the answer.  The answer is to keep moving to find someone who likes you as you are.  There are surely some things everyone has to do to keep growing and becoming better at dating but sometimes even with all that, it just doesn't work out, such as if you are too different or want different things out of life.  That's my 2 cents.

[Ruby Slippers]

It wouldn't hurt to ask nicely, but she may not give a genuine answer. What do you think the reason is?

[d0nnivain]

She won't answer you.  She may not have the words.  She may not want to hurt your feelings.  

Fact is, not talking to you is easier for her.  

There used to be a NYC radio call in show called Blown Off. People who were ghosted would call the local radio show.  The show would call the ghoster & get the info about why they stopped calling.  It was pretty brutal.  The show tended to play the most outlandish segments:  she showed up on the date 6 months pregnant; he offered me drugs; she french kissed her brother in front of me; he hit on my 16 year old; etc but the person got their answers.   I googled it & several other stations still do this; maybe try one near you.  

[chillii]

Well , she invited you back up there, you said no , that would've probably had her doubting and so feeling only half in right there. But she also said she'll be really busy anyway and she'll let you know when she's back , but you say that's still a few days away yet. So you might even still hear from her yet anyway .

Edited January 10, 2021 by chillii

[Ami1uwant]

If thiswas a temporary move then her finding someone closer to  her is unlikrly. Much more likely if this is more long term 

 

ive had this happen before to me where you thought you had something Thrn it pooped 

 

 

[ShyViolet]

Yes it would be bad if you sent her yet another message, after she's already made it clear she's not interested.  Take the hint and move on.  Usually in dating we don't get "closure."  "Closure" is this thing that people think they will magically get at the end of a relationship.  It's a myth.  You will probably never know the real reason that she lost interest.  It doesn't have to be something you specifically did, it could be that she just decided she wasn't that into you.  It was only two dates.  You barely know this woman.  She doesn't owe you anything.

Closure is something that you give YOURSELF by deciding to move on.

[max3732]

4 hours ago, elaine567 said:

Did you tell her you are in the extremely vulnerable group?
If you did, she may not want to be held responsible for potentially making you very ill if she gave the virus to you. 
 

Yes, but I also told her that based on the interactions she's had I felt comfortable being around her (not random people) so we had masks on around everyone else and I only got close to her. I told her I was getting tired of staying away from everyone and liked her enough that I was willing to take the risk.

1 hour ago, d0nnivain said:

She won't answer you.  She may not have the words.  She may not want to hurt your feelings.  

Fact is, not talking to you is easier for her.  

There used to be a NYC radio call in show called Blown Off. People who were ghosted would call the local radio show.  The show would call the ghoster & get the info about why they stopped calling.  It was pretty brutal.  The show tended to play the most outlandish segments:  she showed up on the date 6 months pregnant; he offered me drugs; she french kissed her brother in front of me; he hit on my 16 year old; etc but the person got their answers.   I googled it & several other stations still do this; maybe try one near you.  

Obviously I didn't do anything outrageous as far as I know. If I did do something like that I'd sure like to know about it. Basically I want to know if it's something specific to her or something that I could use going forward to improve. Like she won't date someone who won't relocate for her vs. I was chewing with my mouth open or acting too serious the whole time. 

I just don't understand why she kissed me more than I expected, invited me to come back and then when I asked if she is still interested she says yes and then just ignores me. It hurts my feelings a lot and I mean a lot more to have her say "let's get together when I'm back, you're welcome to come up and I am still interested in dating you" and then have her ignore me than to say "I didn't feel a spark" or something specific like I mentioned earlier.

To me while it's not nice to hear that someone's not interested in you (whatever the reason) but it's a lot worse to have them say they are and then ignore you and leave you in limbo.

41 minutes ago, ShyViolet said:

Yes it would be bad if you sent her yet another message, after she's already made it clear she's not interested.  Take the hint and move on.  Usually in dating we don't get "closure."  "Closure" is this thing that people think they will magically get at the end of a relationship.  It's a myth.  You will probably never know the real reason that she lost interest.  It doesn't have to be something you specifically did, it could be that she just decided she wasn't that into you.  It was only two dates.  You barely know this woman.  She doesn't owe you anything.

Closure is something that you give YOURSELF by deciding to move on.

What hint or message did she give to make it clear she's not interested? I asked if she was interested and she said yes she has just been busy. The only hint I guess is her ignoring me. She says she is so busy she doesn't check her messages. Like I said before why tell me and invite me to get together if she's not interested?

[cleverusername]

She is interested friend, just not as interested in you as you are with her.

If you were her top priority and on her mind, she wouldn’t ignore you. I personally believe she likes you, but the distance is too large so she’s keeping you on the back burner. Irregardless, you can’t force her to respond and you can’t control her feelings.

The best option IMO is to move on. If she reaches out and it’s all gravy baby, then do your thing. But until then just go enjoy your life and stay positive. Who knows, maybe you’ll find her twin sister living down the street  

 

[ShyViolet]

43 minutes ago, max3732 said:

What hint or message did she give to make it clear she's not interested? I asked if she was interested and she said yes she has just been busy. The only hint I guess is her ignoring me. She says she is so busy she doesn't check her messages. Like I said before why tell me and invite me to get together if she's not interested?

Ever since Christmas, she has not been texting you.  That is pretty clear.  Actions speak louder than words.  If she was excited about you and wanted you in her life, you'd be hearing from her.  

[Miss Spider]

The thing with ghosting is the lack of ‘finality’ sometimes leaves room for doubt in your mind to take off running with possibilities that might, but probably didn’t, occur. . Maybe they’re just busy. Maybe they forgot. Maybe they lost their phone.  Maybe they’re interested still a little bit and that one more text from you will possibly bring them around and everything will be fantastic from thereon out. 

 

It’s hard to keep in perspective the much more likely reason they’re ignoring and the message that they are sending with that. It’s more likely that they’re choosing not to respond out of disinterest. That might be hurtful, but remember that this is just one person of many who chose to handle things this way. 
 

Sending one more text may give you the clarity that you need to move on. It also may just drag things out even longer with a person who is not very interested. It also( I think most likely) might just lead to more silence. Eventually, you might have to find the closure from within yourself. Happy dating. 

[Versacehottie]

3 hours ago, max3732 said:

I just don't understand why she kissed me more than I expected, invited me to come back and then when I asked if she is still interested she says yes and then just ignores me. It hurts my feelings a lot and I mean a lot more to have her say "let's get together when I'm back, you're welcome to come up and I am still interested in dating you" and then have her ignore me than to say "I didn't feel a spark" or something specific like I mentioned earlier.

To me while it's not nice to hear that someone's not interested in you (whatever the reason) but it's a lot worse to have them say they are and then ignore you and leave you in limbo.

What hint or message did she give to make it clear she's not interested? I asked if she was interested and she said yes she has just been busy. The only hint I guess is her ignoring me. She says she is so busy she doesn't check her messages. Like I said before why tell me and invite me to get together if she's not interested?

Because you are using YOUR filter to decode the meaning of those actions.  Meaning if YOU did those actions they would mean something like xyz behind your motivations for doing them.  Her filter may cause her to say/do totally different things.  That's the reason for my post is saying that even if she does certain actions, you can't use your decoder to decipher what they mean.

For her 2 dates might be relatively insignificant and part of a much more active dating life with variety, whereas for you, you might have attached great meaning.  I'm just going to say to view it on a bell curve of what is more similar to average as far behaviors 2 dates in, and hers more mirrors the average IMO.  I'm saying this not to make you feel like an outlier but that if you understand what the average dating behavior is, you can calibrate your responses to what happens as far as understanding it's normal for a majority--even if it's not normal to you.

Also there are lots of "shoulds" and expectations in you wanting to decide how she lets you down when the inaction itself shows you what the bottom line IS.  You need to focus on that so you can move forward rather than get stuck for a month or two.  

I'm going to tell you that for the majority of my girlfriends & I've done it too: if I haven't liked a guy, haven't felt chemistry, or don't see it going anywhere, I wouldn't spell it out for him at this early interval. Maybeeeeeee.. if he was from a friend group or work where I would continue to see him and owed it to him as a friend. Otherwise from a dating app or meeting out socially with only the intention to date, no would not probably reach out to tell him I wasn't feeling it.  

Her actions are what you need to look at.  She is not being responsive to you; she is not reaching out as promise; she didn't follow up or take you up on your offer. Her conduct is markedly different than it was before.  You put her on the spot by asking her if she was interested.  Also she may have been slightly interested but lukewarm--with time away from the moment she was put on the spot--she did not feel compelled to follow through.  This is so common.  

The other thing is she made time for you twice before and not now--that's a clue.  At this point, she's not putting you in limbo--you are putting yourself in limbo.  At 2 dates in, even if it was going well, she might have been dating others and there is a presumption you are as well---it's a limbo-ish time inherently.  Not bad limbo unless you make it so.  BTW, let me be clear: I don't believe she's going to pop back up, it's only to illustrate that it's you that's putting yourself in limbo by holding onto something that even though she is not hitting you over the head with the words of it, she is with actions.  And about that bell curve again: at 2 dates in, the majority of those aren't going to work out; it's hard to find the right girlfriend/boyfriend.  Two dates in is a fragile time--where for majority of people's dates at the juncture, won't make it to a relationship or often another date.  I think you need to take stats/realities into account when you hold your own experience up against what is happening.  I.E. this is normal and common.

bolded: like I said, you are holding all interest into one point in time (BTW when you put her on the spot asking if she was still interested).  One point in time could mean that things have evolved since then; that someone else's interest became more of a priority for her; or like I said she was lukewarm and with a little time felt not interested in pursuing anything further.  It's all more fluid than that and secondly, you probably shouldn't have taken any of that as literally as you did.  Or linearly.  especially linearly!  It's not a flow chart

on to the next~ good luck!

 

 

Edited January 11, 2021 by Versacehottie

[basil67]

4 hours ago, max3732 said:

Obviously I didn't do anything outrageous as far as I know. If I did do something like that I'd sure like to know about it. Basically I want to know if it's something specific to her or something that I could use going forward to improve. Like she won't date someone who won't relocate for her vs. I was chewing with my mouth open or acting too serious the whole time. 

I do know a couple of women who've had men come back with this question and they've answered honestly.   Here's how to do it

1. Start with saying that you accept that she doesn't want to date you further

2. Say that you've been having trouble with not getting far dating and ask if there's anything she thinks you could improve on.   

3. Accept the answer graciously and thank her for her time.   If you do not agree with her view, don't argue with it.

4. If she says something which is vague "It's not you, it's me" "I'm not in the right space to have a relationship" accept it graciously and thank her for her time.

Quote

I just don't understand why she kissed me more than I expected, invited me to come back and then when I asked if she is still interested she says yes and then just ignores me. It hurts my feelings a lot and I mean a lot more to have her say "let's get together when I'm back, you're welcome to come up and I am still interested in dating you" and then have her ignore me than to say "I didn't feel a spark" or something specific like I mentioned earlier.

DO NOT DISCUSS THIS ^ WITH HER!   You're calling to find out if there's anything you can improve, not asking why she did X or Y.

Edited January 11, 2021 by basil67

[dramafreezone]

10 hours ago, max3732 said:

I met someone from an online dating app and thought the first date went well. She was going to be 2 hours away for over a month after that and invited me to come see her there, which I did. I thought the 2nd date went well overall and we spent several hours together. During the 1st date I told her I was being very careful about covid, but in the 2nd I got closer and after spending so much time with her and then when we had dinner together and we got closer I couldn't help myself and kissed her and then she kissed me back several times. She asked me to text her when I got back and invited me to come up again, but she was going to be in my area soon and with the holidays it was tough so I said we should get back together when she was in my area.

I sent her a few texts and a pictures wishing her a merry Christmas and got nothing back. She used to respond right away and send me pictures and she sent nothing. Finally I asked if she was still interested by saying that I completely understand if she decided that she's not and if she didn't want to continue that was ok. She said yes she's still interested but she's just been very busy with work and will let me know when she'll be back in my area, which should be in the next few days. That was a couple weeks ago and I haven't heard back from her.

The fact that after our 2nd date she has ignored all my text, including the Christmas one until I asked if she was still interested and that she had said she'd contact me again by now and hasn't has obviously led me to believe she's not interested. So I've basically written her off at this point. I've been chatting with some other women online now and will hopefully get a 1st date with one of them.

I just have this nagging question about what happened in the 2nd date that made her not interested. We spent a lot of time together and talked about so many things. If there was something I did wrong or that I could learn from I'd like to do that. I just don't understand why she wouldn't just tell me in person or sometimes after the 2nd date, especially when I flat out asked that she wasn't interested. I keep thinking that she said she really respected how careful I'm being about covid (she was being careful too, but nowhere near as me) and then I ruined things by putting my arm around her at one point and then kissing her. If that was the case though then why'd she kiss me back more times than I was planning on?

Basically I'd like to get some closure out of her. Saying she's not interested because she learned x about me or that she wants someone who thinks a certain way or that I said something she didn't like. Why did she tell me she's still interested when she's obviously not? 

Would it be bad if I sent her another message asking her? It just keeps nagging at me.

"Finally I asked if she was still interested by saying that I completely understand if she decided that she's not and if she didn't want to continue that was ok"....why would you say this?  This is not an attractive thing to say, makes it seem like you have low self-esteem, like you get blown off all the time.

In any event, this was just two dates right?  You don't have a right to "closure" after a second date.  These days you just get ghosted.  It sucks but it is what it is.  She's not busy with work.  She lost interest and moved on, that much is certain.

Why did she lose interest?  Who the frick knows for sure.  She may have thought that the way you were pursuing was weak (i.e. what you said above).  Double texting is very bad, makes you look needy.  Shoot one text out and if she doesn't respond you don't respond.  Frequent unanswered texting turns women off for a very good reason; the type of guys that call and text a lot turn into stalkers if the relationship doesn't work out.

Maybe she met a guy that she had a bit more interest in, so she's seeing what happens with that guy.  I'm 99% sure you blew it with the type of talk I quoted earlier and the frequent texting, but would not spend a great deal of time worrying about it at this point.   You have to have the mindset that *she's* the one that missed out.

Edited January 11, 2021 by dramafreezone

[dramafreezone]

35 minutes ago, basil67 said:

I do know a couple of women who've had men come back with this question and they've answered honestly.   Here's how to do it

1. Start with saying that you accept that she doesn't want to date you further

2. Say that you've been having trouble with not getting far dating and ask if there's anything she thinks you could improve on.   

3. Accept the answer graciously and thank her for her time.   If you do not agree with her view, don't argue with it.

4. If she says something which is vague "It's not you, it's me" "I'm not in the right space to have a relationship" accept it graciously and thank her for her time.

DO NOT DISCUSS THIS ^ WITH HER!   You're calling to find out if there's anything you can improve, not asking why she did X or Y.

No offense but I would not do any of this for a couple of reasons.

I'm 99% he's blown it already, but if he goes and asks her these questions he will have 100% blown it.  If he leaves it be, who knows she could come back around in a couple of months, six months, a year.  She did have a pretty decent amount of attraction for him at first.  But I think those questions would ruin any chance he might have with her later.  And I think there's a high probability that #4 will happen; she will not be straightforward with him anyway.  She will not want to hurt his feelings.

OP, just consider this a lesson learned and leave it alone.  Your best bet is to search youtube for someone like Corey Wayne and look up the topic on women that lose interest.  You'll find that it sounds just like what you're going through.

Edited January 11, 2021 by dramafreezone

[Saracena]

Agree 100% with the above. However, I do agree with what Basil suggested where more long-term relationships were concerned. Not where the OP's though.

From personal experience, I found it very off-putting when asked about why I didn't wish to see someone again or take things further, especially after only a few dates or two. In fact I lost any remaining attraction for them. They came across as clingy and a bit desperate, for one thing.

In contrast those who 'took the hint' very quickly and ceased contact completely were the ones who, although it didn't change my mind,  who I did have far more respect for in the long run. This is how I remembered them.

[Wiseman2]

To me, the personal opinions of someone who ghosted me after 2 dates would be utterly useless.

Just curious, what happened on date 2 that makes you think that's the reason she ghosted?