Guys that do low effort to plan a first date

[poppyfields]

8 hours ago, ladybug2021 said:

A man who asks me where do I want to go without giving ANY suggestion is basically telling me to be the man. That’s how I see it.

Wow, I see that as him trying to be "thoughtful."  This is a first meet after all, and he wants you to be comfortable.  That's his intention!  

LB, I mean no offense but you sound jaded, borderline bitter.  Where did you get this notion that when a man thoughtfully asks you where you might like to meet for the first time, he's asking you to be the "man"?  

Me thinks you need to revisit this masculine and feminine energy you so often speak about.  It's way out of whack!  

If you're not careful, you're gonna end up with some "macho" controlling a**hole who squelches your voice, shuts you down whenever you have an opinion.  Is that what you want?

Learn balance.  The best men are a combo of masculine and feminine energy, alpha AND beta qualities.

I have to be honest. When reading your initial post, the part where you wrote "you're the man, you're supposed to decide," I literally cringed.  I'm shocked he continued talking to you.

 

Edited November 20, 2020 by poppyfields

[ladybug2021]

51 minutes ago, boymommy said:

Okay I might be missing something because what I dont understand is why the PLACE he takes you matters so much. Its the person that counts! I could care less if a guy took me to a walk in a park for a first date..if it was romantic and special I would be happy. 

What you are indicating is not masculine or feminine but in reality more of a materialistic attitude about dating. Which I mean thats fine if thats how you feel..I think there will be a guy out there for you. Its just you may need to adjust your expectations because men may be put off by a trivial hangup as to where the first date takes place. I understand not trivial to you..but it can come across as trivial to lots of men. 

I couldn’t care less about the men who find it trivial. It is important to me and that’s enough.

To me the place IS important, and the place he chooses says a lot about how he is as a person. 

It is not materialistic at all, as I said before I’m not asking to take me on a private jet to Paris. I’m asking for some consideration and effort in  choosing the place.

Choosing a shopping mall food court sounds cheesy, lazy and vulgar to say the least. Not interested.

Edited November 20, 2020 by ladybug2021

[SumGuy]

55 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

....

And by the way, the shopping mall food court was not to eat any food, was just for coffee! God forbid he spends any money on chicken wings on a first date! lol

Chicken wings on a first date?  Now that is true risk taking, a small step below bbq ribs.  Chicken wings though are a good venue for applying the spicy food filter and if she was raised by wolves like me  

Now grabbing a coffee at a mall, and walking, talking, window shopping, and people watching could be something if you are in to that.  I avoid the mall like the plague (even before the actual one) it is just a soul sucking environment to me ...except for all the toys at Hammacher Schlemmer.   

I read all this as just because you have a bound (food court) doesn't mean you exclude the middle; even though I don't buy the idea of masculine energy as objective reality, but certainly a social construct with implications.   

[ladybug2021]

28 minutes ago, smackie9 said:

Some people choose to skype over going to a coffee shop. I would be down for that. You are in the comfort of your own home, costs nothing, no stress having to suggest or pick a place.

*Breweries here are coming up with some kool covid ideas. One has set up heated tents (nice canvas ones) in a farmers field with benches made from packing crates, ...so hipster lol. It's booked solid til NYE already. Lots of fun ideas for official first dates that are like this. It so west coast. Don't forget to wear your plaid.

Exactly! It does not need to be expensive at all!

It needs to be original, fun, showing he put some thought into it. Simple.

[ladybug2021]

12 minutes ago, CollinW said:

No you want something to validate you and validate your femininity and the easiest way to get that is through a man doing specific things through dating. If a woman was secure with herself a man could take her to Chuck E Cheese and she'd make the best out of it. 

lol I am secure enough to say no to a lazy guy.

[poppyfields]

13 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

To me the place IS important....

Agree, the place is important to me too.  I've posted this before but I'm big on ambiance, atmosphere,  the energy of the place so to speak.  It adds to my comfort level during a first meet/date.

Which is precisely why he asked YOU to select!  

Not him asking you to be "the man."  Lord. 

 

Edited November 20, 2020 by poppyfields

[ladybug2021]

10 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Wow, I see that as him trying to be "thoughtful."  This is a first meet after all, and he wants you to be comfortable.  That's his intention!  

LB, I mean no offense but you sound jaded, borderline bitter.  Where did you get this notion that when a man thoughtfully asks you where you might like to meet for the first time, he's asking you to be the "man"?  

Me thinks you need to revisit this masculine and feminine energy you so often speak about.  It's way out of whack!  

If you're not careful, you're gonna end up with some "macho" controlling a**hole who squelches your voice, shuts you down whenever you have an opinion.  Is that what you want?

Learn balance.  The best men are a combo of masculine and feminine energy, alpha AND beta qualities.

I have to be honest. When reading your initial post, the part where you wrote "you're the man, you're supposed to decide," I literally cringed.  I'm shocked he continued talking to you.

 

Simple, because my experiences have been (and I had many) where a guy asks me where I want to go, I choose a really nice and cozy place by the seaside and actually put some thought into it, asking him if he likes that, etc, and then he invites me for a second date to the shopping mall food court or equivalent... 

This happened many times. So now I do not choose the place for first dates anymore. He chooses the place and from that choice I can quickly see how he is. 

[boymommy]

12 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

I couldn’t care less about the men who find it trivial. It is important to me and that’s enough.

To me the place IS important, and the place he chooses says a lot about how he is as a person. 

It is not materialistic at all, as I said before I’m not asking to take me on a private jet to Paris. I’m asking for some consideration and effort in  choosing the place.

Choosing a shopping mall food court sounds cheesy, lazy and vulgar to say the least. Not interested.

But my point is to YOU it sounds cheesy, lazy, vulgar. To a guy maybe he is just clueless. But I'm thinking clueless is equivalent to lazy?

To poppyfields point..what you want sounds out of whack like you change your mind when the mood strikes you. This is fine but can be awfully confusing in a dating situation, and is confusing for us because when everyone is reacting to your posts you switch gears and say something else. So how are we supposed to give you sound advice when you keep saying something different and switching around what it is you want or need? It's possible what you want and need changes depending on how you feel..you want a guy who can roll with that and be someone who not only has great communication skills but be uber flexible and roll with the punches..more specificially your punches since it seems like you want to the one calling the shots. That's fine you are just looking for more of a passive go with the flow guy who is good at communicating. NOT what you are indicating you want though which is a masculine type leader guy who takes control. You would be fighting for control every step of the way!

Edited November 20, 2020 by boymommy

[SumGuy]

1 minute ago, ladybug2021 said:

Exactly! It does not need to be expensive at all!

It needs to be original, fun, showing he put some thought into it. Simple.

What if he invited you to the mall, to grab a coffee and walk around and talk to get to know each other?

If me I'd admit right up front it is odd, but find it a compromise between avoiding closed indoor spaces and the outdoors.  The modern day version of an agora, but climate controlled.  There are some malls near me that have wonderful spaces in them, indoor gardens really with benches, fountains etc., high glass ceiling etc.  A pretty nice space actually.   Then if things going well can buy a snack or even pop into a restaurant or bar if comfortable with the social distance. 

Just curious if that was proposed how would you feel?

My feeling is if your are going to propose the mall (which is outside the realm of what most consider conducive to getting to know someone in the dating realm) you need to explain/sell it a bit...nip those negative preconceptions in the bud and replace them with positive expectations.

[ladybug2021]

2 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Agree, the place is important to me too.  I've posted this before but I'm big on ambiance, atmosphere,  the energy of the place so to speak.  It adds to my comfort level during a first meet/date.

Which is precisely why he asked YOU to select!  

Not him asking you to be "the man."  Lord. 

Yes I am like that too. I am an empath so I am very sensitive to the surrounding environment, ambiance, etc.

Busy and loud shopping malls are a killer to me.

I prefer cozy places, chill out low music, not many people around us, etc. 

If a guy invites me to the shopping mall I know immediately we are not a match.

[ladybug2021]

5 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

What if he invited you to the mall, to grab a coffee and walk around and talk to get to know each other?

If me I'd admit right up front it is odd, but find it a compromise between avoiding closed indoor spaces and the outdoors.  The modern day version of an agora, but climate controlled.  There are some malls near me that have wonderful spaces in them, indoor gardens really with benches, fountains etc., high glass ceiling etc.  A pretty nice space actually.   Then if things going well can buy a snack or even pop into a restaurant or bar if comfortable with the social distance. 

Just curious if that was proposed how would you feel?

My feeling is if your are going to propose the mall (which is outside the realm of what most consider conducive to getting to know someone in the dating realm) you need to explain/sell it a bit...nip those negative preconceptions in the bud and replace them with positive expectations.

I get it. In this particular case, he invited me for coffee in the food court area. No nice garden with benches, any of that. 

Coffee in the food court area, surrounded by kids screaming, people around us listening to our conversation, people carrying food plates, etc. 

I’ve learned long ago to not try to change someone or want them to be different than they are. This guy is fine with that as per his suggestion, I am not, so things are not starting well and I can see we are not a match.

I wish him well taking women to the food court and I rather talk with other guys.

Edited November 20, 2020 by ladybug2021

[Miss Spider]

46 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Just out of curiosity, what did you text him from your car?   

This happened to me once too.  OLD first time round years ago before I became real discerning about who I chose to meet.  

First meet, guy wanted to take me to dinner.  Beautiful restaurant right on coast of the Pacific Ocean.  Good looking man actually, dressed well, successful.

Anyway, he proceeded to talk ad nauseam about his EX, how she cheated on him, how "f'cked in the head" she was, and to get back at her for all the shyt she caused him, he began harassing her, stalking her, out to make her life a living hell!  Pretty much his exact words. 

That was MY cue to excuse myself to restroom and slip out the door.  Wasn't far from my apt so walked home.

I did not text him, but HE called me!  From a blocked number so I answered.

Asked me what happened, where did I go?  Told me he was actually having a great time and asked me out again!

Can you believe?  I ditch him with no explanation and he's asking me out again. Lol

I posted this story on another forum when it happened, but the way this jerk was describing his sitch with his ex, him harassing and stalking her, I was actually frightened, he sounded like a freakin psychopath! 

So no I did not feel guilty or bad about skipping out, I believe I dodged a huge bullet!

So I get it shortskirts.  

Yikes. That’s scary, poppy. I just said sorry I had an emergency and had to leave and then I just blocked him. This was before I was more... refined. 

13 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

lol I am secure enough to say no to a lazy guy.

But you didn’t it say no. That would have been more understandable.  In your 0P, you told him to suggest another place. He was the one who decided to say no to you by not responding. 

And like I said, it’s not necessarily about laziness. Maybe they prefer that date and thought you would too. Maybe they  want to give you the option. A Skype date and walking date is not more effort to suggest than a coffee date. It’s just a different venue. 

 

You said it best earlier, he is just not a match. That’s it. 

Edited November 20, 2020 by Shortskirtslonglashes

[Happy Lemming]

5 minutes ago, boymommy said:

To a guy maybe he is just clueless.

 

And after enough rejection, he will learn how to date.

Dating is not "Rocket Science", it is just a basic formula of showing a woman a nice time.  Extra points if it is unique and fun.

[ladybug2021]

1 minute ago, Shortskirtslonglashes said:

Yikes. That’s scary, poppy. I just said sorry I had an emergency and had to leave and then I just blocked him. This was before I was more... refined. 

But you didn’t it say no. That would have been more understandable.  In your 0P, you told him to suggest another place. He was the one who decided to say no to you by not responding. 

And like I said, it’s not necessarily about laziness. Maybe they prefer that date and thought you would too. Maybe they  want to give you the option. A Skype date and walking date is not more effort to suggest than a coffee date. It’s just a different venue. 

 

You said it best earlier, he is just not a match. That’s it. 

He did suggest other option, it was basically another food court but outside. And then I said no.

Again, you can tell a LOT abot a man by his choice of places to meet.

[ladybug2021]

2 minutes ago, Happy Lemming said:

And after enough rejection, he will learn how to date.

Dating is not "Rocket Science", it is just a basic formula of showing a woman a nice time.  Extra points if it is unique and fun.

Exactly. That has been my point this whole thread. Simple.

[boymommy]

4 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

Yes I am like that too. I am an empath so I am very sensitive to the surrounding environment, ambiance, etc.

Busy and loud shopping malls are a killer to me.

I prefer cozy places, chill out low music, not many people around us, etc. 

If a guy invites me to the shopping mall I know immediately we are not a match.

I'm an empath as well but I actually LOVE busy places and going to the mall. But I could also go to a quiet secluded place as well. Depends totally on what mood I am in. My boyfriend would almost always rather be at a secluded cozy place with not many people around. He likes peace and quiet. I like to alternate back and forth so we compromise by doing dates in both settings that meet both our needs. 

So this is your need, but what about the person you are dating? Are you open to compromising in any way with him? Or do you just want to find someone who fits only your needs? It just may be more difficult if you attempt to date with those types of expectations because compromise in any relationship is so important. However there are certainly men who will put their needs on the backburner for you time and time again and not give it a second thought..there are just few of those men! 

[Miss Spider]

21 hours ago, ladybug2021 said:

 

He laughed it off and then again asked me where do I wanna go, and I said to him well you are the man you decide and plan. He said ok but didn’t suggest anything else.

 

You mean you he made a suggestion after this? What did he suggest?

 

Different women have different idea of what constitutes “a good time“ at a first MEET. Personally, I will not accept anything more than a low effort, low-key first meet anymore. It’s  my preference

[d0nnivain]

It's your life & you can set your boundaries & expectations however you deem appropriate.   Like you I wouldn't want a food court venue for a date but I'm open to suggesting alternatives.  

I think you may have to adjust your tolerance / disappointment levels because more men are not going to be able to achieve what you seek then those who will.  If you find that unicorn, good for you.  

But crying that every man fails to meet your expectations just seems a waste of energy that will drain you.  Let all the missteps roll off your back or you will end up emotionally poisoning yourself.  

[boymommy]

4 minutes ago, Happy Lemming said:

And after enough rejection, he will learn how to date.

Dating is not "Rocket Science", it is just a basic formula of showing a woman a nice time.  Extra points if it is unique and fun.

Well maybe I'm willing to "clue a guy in" moreso then the next gal if I see something special in a guy rather then just automatically kick him the curb. Probably where we are missing each other in this thread. I'm an extremely loyal and committed person and not quick to reject anyone. Especially if I see something positive there. 

[poppyfields]

20 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

If a guy invites me to the shopping mall I know immediately we are not a match.

Ok, then end it right there. Try to not get so wound up about it.  Or accuse him of wanting you to be the man, that is so warped.  

"You're the man, you're supposed to decide."

I would strongly advise you to not ever say this to a man again.  Like I said, I'm shocked he continued talking to you.

What's interesting is, you claim you want masculine, but that comment along with your general attitude IS masculine!

You essentially "ordered" him to decide!  Told him, he's the man, he decides. Like it's a demand, an order.

Can you not see how that was masculine?   Your entire attitude on this thread is masculine.

If you want to attract a masculine man, then YOU need to be feminine.  A "feminine" woman would have graciously suggested a place she'd like to go, not demanded he decide, because he's the man.   That's masculine.

 

Edited November 20, 2020 by poppyfields

[Miss Spider]

15 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

He did suggest other option, it was basically another food court but outside. And then I said no.

Again, you can tell a LOT abot a man by his choice of places to meet.

Oh okay just saw this. I agree that you can tell a lot about man by place that they suggest to go. You can also tell a lot about someone by how they respond to a suggestion. If you knew how this guy was by his suggestion to go to the food court and you didn’t like it, I don’t understand why you are telling him to choose again. Also why you have all this discussion on it 

Edited November 20, 2020 by Shortskirtslonglashes

[peach302]

14 minutes ago, ladybug2021 said:

Exactly. That has been my point this whole thread. Simple.

All this talk and discussion over someone you rejected in the end any way . 

Waste of time isnt it 

You aint any closer to a date and everyone just spent hours giving advice here.

Edited November 20, 2020 by peach302

[boymommy]

Just now, poppyfields said:

Ok, then end it right there. Try to not get so wound up about it.  Or accuse him of wanting you to be the man, that is so warped.  

"You're the man, you're supposed to decide."

I would strongly advise you to not ever say this to a man again.  Like I said, I'm shocked he continued talking to you.

What's interesting is, you claim you want masculine, but that comment along with your general attitude IS masculine!

You essentially "ordered" him to decide!  Told him, he's the man, he decides. Like it's a demand, an order.

Can you not see that?  Your entire attitude on this thread is masculine.

If you want to attract a masculine man, then YOU need to be feminine.  A "feminine" woman would have graciously suggested a place she'd like to go, not demanded he decide, because he's the man.   That's masculine.

 

Totally agree poppyfields. I think she's masculine as well but just has yet to come to terms with this fact or is wrestling with it because it's not what society deems appropriate in a women as far as dating goes. But there are men out there who like a masculine women who takes charge! Accept who you are and what you want and go after a feminine super flexible passive guy who will let you call the shots in the relationship! You will be so much happier! 

For myself I have spent so much of my relationship trying to get my boyfriend to be the guy but in reality he is a really flexible passive go with the flow type person. I am a stronger type personality who is direct and says what they want! Is that masculine? Sort of. I can be flexible about a lot of things that are more casual..like where we eat or just more everday mundane type things. But as far as our relationship goes or marriage or finances..I call the shots! I have recently started telling him this and he needs to understand this fact. Thankfully he is so flexible and understanding and super committed to our relationship which is why I love him so much. And I think he really loves my strong personality! We mesh well. It's not "bad" to wear the pants in the relationship..you just have to find a guy who is receptive to that! 

[boymommy]

1 minute ago, peach302 said:

All this talk and discussion over someone you rejected in the end any way . 

Waste of time isnt it 

You aint any closer to a date and everyone just spent hours giving advice here.

Disagree. If we can help her figure out what it is that she's after that will help her in the dating scene. The original guy she posted about may not have worked out but the issue has not gone away. People think they have issues in dating because of the other person but usually it something within themselves they need to examine

[ladybug2021]

2 minutes ago, boymommy said:

Totally agree poppyfields. I think she's masculine as well but just has yet to come to terms with this fact or is wrestling with it because it's not what society deems appropriate in a women as far as dating goes. But there are men out there who like a masculine women who takes charge! Accept who you are and what you want and go after a feminine super flexible passive guy who will let you call the shots in the relationship! You will be so much happier! 

For myself I have spent so much of my relationship trying to get my boyfriend to be the guy but in reality he is a really flexible passive go with the flow type person. I am a stronger type personality who is direct and says what they want! Is that masculine? Sort of. I can be flexible about a lot of things that are more casual..like where we eat or just more everday mundane type things. But as far as our relationship goes or marriage or finances..I call the shots! I have recently started telling him this and he needs to understand this fact. Thankfully he is so flexible and understanding and super committed to our relationship which is why I love him so much. And I think he really loves my strong personality! We mesh well. It's not "bad" to wear the pants in the relationship..you just have to find a guy who is receptive to that! 

I do not like or want beta passive males for a relationship. I sound masculine in this thread because this kind of BS makes my masculine energy of protection come out. But in dating I like a man who takes charge and makes decisions. I can too of course, but beta males are not for me.