ZA Dater Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 3 hours ago, Trail Blazer said: My point has always been that Chads are less likely to commit because they have so much choice. Please don't twist what I've said. Exactly and would that choice be so easy without OLD....I doubt it.
Fletch Lives Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 Let me make a few points: Welcome to dating, the world's biggest cat-and-mouse game. Not all men are players. You just need to find one good one. Forget the rest. My advice on sex - wait for sex as long as you can. People can fall in love before sex. To some extent, men want a comfortable relationship which stays the same (just dating). Women want the relationship to progress..... to marriage, kids, and a picket fence of their own. Many women have put their foot down and demanded marriage or they will leave. If the man loves you and is reasonable, he'll go along with it, rather than lose you. Hey, I'm all for it..........as long as long as they stay together, I don't care how they got there! 1
Zona Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 7 hours ago, CaliforniaGirl said: Unless the OP is dating 19-year-old freakishly handsome guys exclusively then this example simply does not apply to her. Just an example of what life is like for the lucky guys in the top 20% and why getting commitment will be damn nigh impossible. The same applies to women, if not even more so. Beautiful women are hit on constantly, even averagely good looking women get that too. But that doesn't mean they have any interest in committing to a long term relationship. As for the OP, she seems to be saying that she will continue doing the same thing and expect a different result after 10 futile years of failure to find Mr. Right. I would suggest shaking things up and trying different ways of meeting single guys in person, rather than through OLD. Edited October 23, 2020 by Zona 1 1
mark clemson Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 10 hours ago, Interstellar said: Ideally, you wait until marriage before you have sex, but that’s not a hard and fast rule. *Boggle*. What decade is it again?? 3 1 2
Zona Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 3 hours ago, MeadowFlower said: Oh my gosh, some of the mentality of 21st century men is off-putting. If this is what all men are like these days then, no thank you. Ugh. Maybe men are evolving back into cavemen. Oh, and any man who thinks that it is wrong for a woman to not have sex with you until you're in an actual relationship, you are incorrect. Women can be just as guilty of crappy behavior. I do agree though about holding sex back at first. If the guy is really interested in you, that will increase his respect for you. 1
smackie9 Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 Gosh I'm so glad I'm married lol. My advice, stay off dating apps...they are tainted. Guys looking to bang are opportunists, and with dating apps is like shooting fish in a barrel. If you are looking for substance, you have to go out and do things, and meet irl. Yes I get it we are in a pandemic...still doesn't stop people from going out to parks, beaches, hiking, etc to keep active and interact with others. 2
poppyfields Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) If you want commitment from a man, you need to bring more to the table than just good looks. Something unique, something special to that man. Men are committing. But you're right, the really good ones (Chads) have many options. And don't take commitment lightly. It takes time, shared experiences (not just sexually), and trust before many men will commit. Trust not only in the sense she won't cheat, but trust that she is stable, independent and won't engulf him. Jmo from reading your posts, but I sense an underlying hostility towards men and a certain desperation. Men can sense this no matter how hard you try to hide. This may be why they hesitate to commit, while in your mind, they "played" you. Dating is a huge risk. There are never ever any guarantees. If you're not ready or willing to take that risk, then don't date. Work on you until you are ready. Have sex when you're comfortable, and enjoy! Detach from the outcone and embrace the present. Stop stressing about commitment and allow whomever you're dating to see your uniqueness and how special you are, beyond your physical beauty and beyond sex. Allow it all to develop naturally and organically. With that attitude, a man will be much more inclined to commit than with your current mindset. Even men who initially didn't think they would ever want commitment will commit! I've witnessed this happening, it's also happened to me! All the best. Edited October 23, 2020 by poppyfields 1
elaine567 Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 BUT are these Chads, "the really good ones", the pick of the crop... or are they just superficial, shady, selfish guys, obsessed with sex and using women as objects? They may be good looking, but there is actually more to life than looks surely? 2
Author CalipsoRose Posted October 23, 2020 Author Posted October 23, 2020 I think it is really strange to assume that because a woman wants a relationship with you, that this is somehow not genuine. What if she really likes you and doesnt want to date anyone else and she realizes this sooner rather than later? What if she isnt just looking for a commitment from anyone, but from YOU specifically. What if she isnt desperate for a relationship, but she is ready for one and has fallen for you and wants to express that? This recently happened to me. I was single for an entire year, but knew I was ready for a relationship. Then I met a guy and I instantly felt that connection and fell for him pretty fast and he fell for me fast too. He was the first one to start saying "Wow you are so special and I could see myself long term with you. I am really falling in love with you." So we agreed to be GF and BF. Then he got cold feet and started saying it was MY idea and forced him into this relationship and that he isnt ready all the sudden and had already started seeing other "female friends" from tinder. Obviously I broke up with him, but this really broke my heart recently and confused the hell out of me. He made it sound like I was just desperate for a relationship when I actually really just wanted to be with HIM not just ANYONE. I havent even been with another guy since the break up so that should prove that I'm not just desperate for any man to commit to me. So when a woman says she wants a relationship with you, for you to assume she is not being genuine and even dishonest for wanting a commitment with you is such backwards thinking to me. It could be that she genuinely has real feelings for you. Sad that some guys dont seem to understand this and just run away from it like shes crazy for wanting to be with him.
mark clemson Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) Well, some guys are "commitment-phobic" and others feel a need to monkey branch. Unfortunately it sounds like you got one with both tendencies. If it's any consolation we get a fairly regular drumbeat of posts similar to yours. I think there's a lot of truth to some of the generalizations being made by posters above, and there is a tendency among some men to "want sex first and figure the rest out later". Some women have little issue with "playing the game" this way, and then there are those who it bothers. You are who you are. I think you are facing the fact that you need to walk the same line that most like you face in the dating pool, balancing what the guy is willing to accept with what you are in terms of progressing the relationship. There is no "I win" button, but I would suggest you keep at it and stick with what feels acceptable to you. If you like a guy enough to "risk" intimacy on the 2nd date, great, if it's not until week 6 but he flies the coop, oh well - if you're attractive there will always be other men out there. Many players and Chads eventually DO settle down, but I think that has a lot more to do with how they feel about "what they're doing with their life" than about who they're with (since they have little trouble finding women). There are also those "regular guys" who are looking for commitment as well as those who aren't. One tip - I think a guy who's genuinely "looking for a relationship" WILL be willing to take things a little slower. But IMO this is only "a little" (by female standards). You seem to have realized that, but it's probably worth repeating. You may be able to suss out some guys who are (really) interested in committing by paying attention to that. There is also nothing wrong with putting your foot down about multidating. Once you're "in a relationship" (to many, but not all, men this will be after sex has occurred), it's quite common to insist on exclusivity if you want that, and men who won't give THAT to you are probably not worth your time (not because it's inherently wrong, but since it's an expectation for you). Edited October 23, 2020 by mark clemson 1
major_merrick Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 10 hours ago, Zona said: Sorry to be blunt, but I do think a lot of women have an over-inflated view of their attractiveness, especially as they get into their 30's. THIS ^^^^ These days, it seems to me that women who are still single have their standards way to high. There are LOTS of single men out there who want to find somebody to marry but literally have no choices. Much of this is for socio-economic reasons. The powers-that-be have marketed a certain way of life to women - that they can have career, family, and a guy who is not only wealthy but will give them everything they want. Many women seem perpetually dissatisfied, when that dissatisfaction in their lives has been created by marketing. I'm in my mid-30's, and I started to settle down a few years back. I changed the parameters of what I was looking for in a relationship (I eliminated the idea monogamy....not for everybody, but it worked for me.) I stopped looking for one single person who would satisfy all my needs. I married an old childhood friend. Not the most stunning or athletic guy on the block or one who shares all my views, but he's a stable and trustworthy choice. I should have done all of this years ago. I'd say that you should re-evaluate what you are looking for in a partner (or partners). Sit down and make a list. Find out what character trait is your priority, and what other things you are willing to overlook in order to obtain that #1 thing. 1
poppyfields Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 53 minutes ago, elaine567 said: BUT are these Chads, "the really good ones", the pick of the crop... or are they just superficial, shady, selfish guys, obsessed with sex and using women as objects?They may be good looking, but there is actually more to life than looks surely? Absolutely! And true for both men and women. That was precisely my point as it relates to women, bring something unique to the table beyond good looks. A lot of it is attitude imo. Negative versus positive. The more bad experiences, the more negative your mindset and attitude, which leads to more negativity and more bad experiences. Lather, rinse, repeat. It can become a vicious cycle! There are good guys out there, guys who do want to commit. Change the mindset, change the attitude. I realize there are d-bags too, plenty of! But learn to read the early signs, become discretionary about who you choose to date, continue dating and having sex with. Read, learn, understand. Have higher standards and choose wisely. And be willing to take a risk. Edited October 23, 2020 by poppyfields
poppyfields Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, CalipsoRose said: Then I met a guy and I instantly felt that connection and fell for him pretty fast and he fell for me fast too. He was the first one to start saying "Wow you are so special and I could see myself long term with you. I am really falling in love with you." So we agreed to be GF and BF. Then he got cold feet and started saying it was MY idea and forced him into this relationship and that he isnt ready all the sudden and had already started seeing other "female friends" from tinder. Obviously I broke up with him, but this really broke my heart recently and confused the hell out of me. He made it sound like I was just desperate for a relationship... Well, that was HIS perception, not sure how you can fault him for that. Whether it was your intention or not, to him, you gave off the vibe of desperation, even if you did only want a RL with him. He may have felt pressured by all of it, and eventually turned off. I don't know just speculating but my dad said something to me years ago that I have never forgotten. "Two people can be on the same date, or in the same relationship but having two entirely different experiences and perceptions of that date or relationship." You're the common denominator, look within. Try something different, relating to men differently. Experiment with new behaviors and attitudes. Anyway, apologies if this sounds preachy, but I've learned a ton over the years, so just sharing what I myself have learned. Good luck. Edited October 23, 2020 by poppyfields
Miss Spider Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, CalipsoRose said: I think it is really strange to assume that because a woman wants a relationship with you, that this is somehow not genuine. What if she really likes you and doesnt want to date anyone else and she realizes this sooner rather than later? What if she isnt just looking for a commitment from anyone, but from YOU specifically. What if she isnt desperate for a relationship, but she is ready for one and has fallen for you and wants to express that? This recently happened to me. I was single for an entire year, but knew I was ready for a relationship. Then I met a guy and I instantly felt that connection and fell for him pretty fast and he fell for me fast too. He was the first one to start saying "Wow you are so special and I could see myself long term with you. I am really falling in love with you." So we agreed to be GF and BF. Then he got cold feet and started saying it was MY idea and forced him into this relationship and that he isnt ready all the sudden and had already started seeing other "female friends" from tinder. Obviously I broke up with him, but this really broke my heart recently and confused the hell out of me. He made it sound like I was just desperate for a relationship when I actually really just wanted to be with HIM not just ANYONE. I havent even been with another guy since the break up so that should prove that I'm not just desperate for any man to commit to me. So when a woman says she wants a relationship with you, for you to assume she is not being genuine and even dishonest for wanting a commitment with you is such backwards thinking to me. It could be that she genuinely has real feelings for you. Sad that some guys dont seem to understand this and just run away from it like shes crazy for wanting to be with him. Good point. Being on the other side of this, I want to say that there are a lot of tricks your mind plays on you in “love”. You can think you want a relationship or that you are compatible with someone initially, and then randomly one day it hits you that you’re not really compatible at all. Or you can be having a great time with someone and the next minute you look at them and think, ‘I don’t want to hang out with them anymore ’. Or you see someone else and you realize how much happier you’d be with them or just without the person you’re with. I guess what I’m trying to say is that even if you get to the point where you fall for someone, it’s not etched in stone. One day you may want to commit and the next day not. Commitment takes a second to agree to, but the rest of the relationship to maintain. I feel like in a relationship you are always on this unspoken expectation to keep the person’s interest. Hopefully just being yourself is enough for them and for the right person, it is. Again on the other side, I think the reasons people give for a “break up” or to explain their disinterest in the relationship should be taken with a grain of salt. I don’t think much rumination over it helps. often times, I think when people say things like that— in your case your ex turning it around and saying that you “tricked” him into the relationship — they don’t even know how to explain how they are feeling themselves or they want to shift blame to feel less guilty, etc. etc. So of course it makes the other person feel confused. Edited October 23, 2020 by Cookiesandough 3
CaliforniaGirl Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, Zona said: Just an example of what life is like for the lucky guys in the top 20% and why getting commitment will be damn nigh impossible. The same applies to women, if not even more so. Beautiful women are hit on constantly, even averagely good looking women get that too. But that doesn't mean they have any interest in committing to a long term relationship. As for the OP, she seems to be saying that she will continue doing the same thing and expect a different result after 10 futile years of failure to find Mr. Right. I would suggest shaking things up and trying different ways of meeting single guys in person, rather than through OLD. Oh, I don’t think she’s saying that at all. In fact, she said she came here to find out what to do differently. FWIW, I’m not sure your intel about how extraordinary-looking people have lots of options is a revelation. Everybody knows that. But they are the minority and the OP gave no indication that this is who she is going for. And she’s definitely not going for your example. Edited October 23, 2020 by CaliforniaGirl
CaliforniaGirl Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 2 hours ago, elaine567 said: BUT are these Chads, "the really good ones", the pick of the crop... or are they just superficial, shady, selfish guys, obsessed with sex and using women as objects? They may be good looking, but there is actually more to life than looks surely? We can’t know, because “chad” is a catch all manosphere term about someone the speaker doesn’t even know. It’s actually pretty much meaningless, since nobody is just one category, just one set of characteristics. 1
Wiseman2 Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 1 hour ago, CalipsoRose said: I could see myself long term with you. I am really falling in love with you. Get off tinder and don't buy these future-talk sound-alike lines.
Interstellar Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 3 hours ago, mark clemson said: *Boggle*. What decade is it again?? Just because everyone’s doing it doesn’t make it right. Just because everyone’s not doing it doesn’t make it wrong. Like I said, it’s up to the individual couple to decide on what they want to do with their lives. Edited October 23, 2020 by Interstellar 2 1
Interstellar Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 1 minute ago, CaliforniaGirl said: My guess is he does not have a 6-figure job, great car and so on, the stuff that puts a man in the OP’s dating pool in the tip-top. These designations are so silly and meaningless. This. No money, no honey.
GorillaTheater Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 I have the income, but I drive a 2000 Ford pickup. I'm like a Stealth Chad. 3 1
Interstellar Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, GorillaTheater said: I have the income, but I drive a 2000 Ford pickup. I'm like a Stealth Chad. Hahaha...you’re like the Batman of Chads. Edited October 23, 2020 by Interstellar
mark clemson Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 19 minutes ago, Interstellar said: Just because everyone’s doing it doesn’t make it right. Just because everyone’s not doing it doesn’t make it wrong. Like I said, it’s up to the individual couple to decide on what they want to do with their lives. Fair enough. When read literally, you initially stated "ideally" as if that were an objective fact. Perhaps you didn't actually mean that. I interpreted it that way, which is what prompted my comment.
Interstellar Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 (edited) 3 minutes ago, mark clemson said: Fair enough. When read literally, you initially stated "ideally" as if that were an objective fact. Perhaps you didn't actually mean that. I interpreted it that way, which is what prompted my comment. Well, I look at it this way too. For the past fifty years, the divorce rate has been 50 percent and it’s the woman who file for divorce first, or the (guy gets dumped in relationships 50 percent of the time). Majority of those have sex before marriage, so it certainly wouldn’t hurt to try something new. And I’m not some right wing, conservative republican. I always like to keep an open mind. Edited October 23, 2020 by Interstellar
GorillaTheater Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 1 minute ago, Interstellar said: Majority of those have sex before marriage, so it certainly wouldn’t hurt to try something new. I dunno, man. It's a good way to not catch sexual incompatibilities until after the nuptials. I'm not sure that would do much for the divorce rate, either. 1
ZA Dater Posted October 23, 2020 Posted October 23, 2020 2 hours ago, elaine567 said: BUT are these Chads, "the really good ones", the pick of the crop... or are they just superficial, shady, selfish guys, obsessed with sex and using women as objects? They may be good looking, but there is actually more to life than looks surely? Well that is a whole discussion on its own. I know a few Chads and I tend to concur with your belief, everything is easy for them, easy come easy go but the women also need to take responsibility for putting themselves in that position. In my city pre covid virtually every night spot was full of Chads trying to compete with each and many starry eyed women besotted with an idea. Its not so much the looks issue its the outlook issue, using people, selfish, manipulative those qualities abound but you then present a non Chad and women are not interested. A few years ago I went out with Chads for a night out "come with we will find you a lady",needless to say that did not happen but what I saw was some incredible acting by these Chads, blatant lies,blatant deception and they only had one goal.....take someone home for the night. Now you put a lady or a guy who is looking for more and the whole balance is gone because on the one hand you have ladies who have been used by Chad who are cynical and jaded and on the other you have guys who cant compete with Chad so are also jaded and cynical. I have said this often, women deserve to be treated with respect, trying to bed them on date one is not showing them respect, even less so when you use deception and lies to accomplish that. BUT again women need to wise up but not so much that they ignore the non Chad sitting the corner. Guys do not commit because well Chad does not so why must they, women don't give non Chad a chance because their friends all chase Chad.This whole dynamic needs to be challenged BUT when you do, you then encounter the fact its impossible to change. Women enjoy Chads attention much like the guy int the corner would be captivated if Miss Blond Blue eyes even greeted him. 1
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