What if I don't like dates?

[CaliforniaGirl]

13 hours ago, elaine567 said:

Unless he has changed his mind since September, redguitar is all about first date sex and moving on... one night stands.
Hence the perceived waste of his time and money sitting in a bar/restaurant getting to know women he has no interest in, bar one off sex...
This is not about dating, this is about hooking up. 

Well then why pretend it's a date? Isn't that lying? Isn't that just luring someone in?

"Hi! Want to play a board game?"

Just put it on your profile. "Not looking for anything serious." Everybody knows what that means.

It's just creepy to ask a girl to come over so you can sink your Battleship. And then really try to do it.

You want sex, say you want sex. You're a grownup. If you can't even tell US you just want sex then now it's just ridiculous....we're strangers who can't even see your face or ever know who you are.

Be upfront about it. If it's no it's no and you have to accept it. On to the next likely Scattergories victim.

Edited October 16, 2020 by CaliforniaGirl

[Redguitar35]

16 hours ago, SumGuy said:

Yes if connection is a goal.  OP can correct me if I am wrong but in his thread "I am bitter as hell over my dating life" pretty sure OP made it clear really only interested in sex and a "relationship" would be just a steady supply of sex.   

What gets me is there is a whole dating sub-culture that is all about just meeting for sex and sites dedicated to it I understand....explicitly stated, no chit chat, no "date", etc.  If one doesn't want to date, and just wants sex there is an app for that  , and plenty of PUA who are willing to teach you how to achieve that.

I can still pursue exclusively one night stands with some women while looking for something more with others. 

[Redguitar35]

16 hours ago, d0nnivain said:

In defense of @Redguitar35  I think the thread got off track.  I interpreted most of this to mean he feels awkward & pressured like he's on an interview during that initial meet thing & he likes when things are more relaxed & conversation flows.  

Yes. I think it’s unfair for people to say that Redguitar is just shallow or a rapist because I don’t feel I can enjoy myself with the traditional first meet format of meeting for coffee. A lot of people give up online dating after just one of those. You and another user described how awkward that type of dating is for an introvert. 

[CaliforniaGirl]

1 hour ago, Redguitar35 said:

I can still pursue exclusively one night stands with some women while looking for something more with others. 

Yeah, but then you have to SAY it's a ONS when it's a ONS, not "let's play board games for our first date" or whatever.

If there will only be one date you need to be clear that there will be only one date.

If she knows it will only be one date then she won't be "interviewing" you. She knows it's not going anywhere and she's down for that.

[CaliforniaGirl]

1 hour ago, Redguitar35 said:

Yes. I think it’s unfair for people to say that Redguitar is just shallow or a rapist because I don’t feel I can enjoy myself with the traditional first meet format of meeting for coffee. A lot of people give up online dating after just one of those. You and another user described how awkward that type of dating is for an introvert. 

No, not really. A ton of suggestions have already been made to simply find fun alternatives if you don't like sit down first dates.

As for taking offense, you can do that, or you can decide to be realistic. Many women will NOT want to go into a total stranger's home for a first date, sorry. You can complain that sounds rapey all you want. It sounds rapey because that is indeed one way rape happens and there you have it. That does not mean YOU are a rapist, it means women are smart and we have heard actual stories of women harmed by strangers. Find alternatives.

You say you're so introverted that apparently you can't even leave your house to look a strange woman in the eye but apparently you have no problem having however many over for board games, movies and sex. Yet you're mad that people think you sound predatory and lazy. You're not giving us much to work with here, dude.

Edited October 16, 2020 by CaliforniaGirl

[kismetkismet]

11 hours ago, Redguitar35 said:

Yes. I think it’s unfair for people to say that Redguitar is just shallow or a rapist because I don’t feel I can enjoy myself with the traditional first meet format of meeting for coffee. A lot of people give up online dating after just one of those. You and another user described how awkward that type of dating is for an introvert. 

People weren't criticizing the fact that you find first dates awkward. People were criticizing your ALTERNATIVE of inviting women over for sex without attempting to get to know them first and calling it 'dating.' Lots of first date alternatives were given, but you seem intent on pouting and blaming 'dating' for your romantic failures, when you're just trying to skip over dating entirely. 

[Redguitar35]

3 hours ago, kismetkismet said:

People weren't criticizing the fact that you find first dates awkward. People were criticizing your ALTERNATIVE of inviting women over for sex without attempting to get to know them first and calling it 'dating.' Lots of first date alternatives were given, but you seem intent on pouting and blaming 'dating' for your romantic failures, when you're just trying to skip over dating entirely. 

Not true. I just have a different style of dating. Just because sex occurs early sometimes does not make the woman a sl*t and does not make Reguitar a rapist. That is conservative and judgmental. I just have a different style of dating than you. I’ve had first date sex turn into relationships. But this thread isn’t about first date sex. It’s about how much the traditional first date of meeting for coffee or drinks sucks and is too businesslike. 

Edited October 16, 2020 by Redguitar35

[CaliforniaGirl]

32 minutes ago, Redguitar35 said:

Not true. I just have a different style of dating. Just because sex occurs early sometimes does not make the woman a sl*t and does not make Reguitar a rapist. That is conservative and judgmental. I just have a different style of dating than you. I’ve had first date sex turn into relationships. But this thread isn’t about first date sex. It’s about how much the traditional first date of meeting for coffee or drinks sucks and is too businesslike. 

Yes, and we said...so find alternatives.

But some of us also said that many women will not want to go to a stranger's house for a first date so again, just come up with alternatives. Just find dates that aren't sitting and staring at each other if you feel like that puts you on the spot. Do something more active.

 

Edited October 16, 2020 by CaliforniaGirl

[poppyfields]

16 hours ago, Redguitar35 said:

Yes. I think it’s unfair for people to say that Redguitar is just shallow or a rapist because I don’t feel I can enjoy myself with the traditional first meet format of meeting for coffee. A lot of people give up online dating after just one of those. You and another user described how awkward that type of dating is for an introvert. 

Redguitar, chiming in to say I agree with you!   Environment and ambience for a first meet is so important and I don't know anyone who has "clicked" with another person sitting in a coffee shop drinking a cup of joe, asking and answering a bunch of contrived questions.  It's got to be the most boring, uninspiring place to make a connection on the face of the planet!   No matter if you're introverted OR extroverted!  

Not saying it doesn't happen, I am sure it has, I just don't know of anyone who has connected that way.  You're right, it's awkward, boring, uninspiring.  No one is gonna be on top of their game in that sort of boring, cold environment, which is personally why I always refused to meet that way.

My boyfriend and met at an extremely lively and fun sports bar!  We ordered beers.  We clicked instantly and were kissing within 30 minutes!

Another poster mentioned finding alternatives to the coffee bar first meet.

1.   Buy a cheap bottle of wine and some cheese and go watch the sunset.

2.   Meet at the zoo

3.   Meet downtown and explore, window shop, get some ice cream.  

None of those things involve sitting across from them in a boring, uninspiring environment answering interview type questions.

OR, do what my boyfriend and I did!  Meet at a lively upbeat sports bar, with great music, sit at the bar, order a beer, laugh, joke with others around you and see if any sparks fly between you, naturally and effortlessly.

Anything forced and contrived like sitting across from them drinking coffee answering a bunch of questions is NOT going to work imo.  

 

Edited October 16, 2020 by poppyfields

[Watercolors]

1 hour ago, Redguitar35 said:

Not true. I just have a different style of dating. Just because sex occurs early sometimes does not make the woman a sl*t and does not make Reguitar a rapist. That is conservative and judgmental. I just have a different style of dating than you. I’ve had first date sex turn into relationships. But this thread isn’t about first date sex. It’s about how much the traditional first date of meeting for coffee or drinks sucks and is too businesslike. 

You remind me of Jimmy. 
 

 

[snowboy91]

40 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

Environment and ambience for a first meet is so important and I don't know anyone who has "clicked" with another person sitting in a coffee shop drinking a cup of joe, asking and answering a bunch of contrived questions.  It's got to be the most boring, uninspiring place to make a connection on the face of the planet!   No matter if you're introverted OR extroverted!  

I think the core part of the problem isn't the coffee shop, it's the contrived questions. Sure, the first few dates is about getting to know the person, but above all it has to be fun, so make it so. Make the questions interesting. Find stuff in common that you could literally just talk for hours about. It doesn't matter whether you're sitting in a coffee shop, bar, restaurant, park or whatever. Or find some other activity (some mentioned mini golf, zoos, etc) that you find fun and hope that the other person does too.

Personally I find additional activities distract from the getting to know the person, but everyone is different.

[poppyfields]

38 minutes ago, snowboy91 said:

I think the core part of the problem isn't the coffee shop, it's the contrived questions. Sure, the first few dates is about getting to know the person, but above all it has to be fun, so make it so. Make the questions interesting. Find stuff in common that you could literally just talk for hours about. It doesn't matter whether you're sitting in a coffee shop, bar, restaurant, park or whatever. Or find some other activity (some mentioned mini golf, zoos, etc) that you find fun and hope that the other person does too.

Personally I find additional activities distract from the getting to know the person, but everyone is different.

Agree it's the contrived questions, but for many people, the environment itself contributes to it being contrived, forced, and just plain blah.   I mean how inspired can one be to even think of "interesting" questions sitting in such a drab cold environment drinking coffee with a complete stranger?    

If it works for you, fabulous, but again I know of no one who has ever connected that way.  Now put those same two people in a different environment, where it's not so forced, and more spontaneous, and they may have a chance! 

I'm not big on activities first meets either, but at least you're not sitting there feeling forced to answer "questions" which no matter how interesting, still feels like an interview!   And you're doing something you both enjoy.  It also gives you a chance to interact spontaneously which is more conducive to making connection.

I mentioned the zoo, or exploring the city you live in and getting some ice cream. May sound corny to some people but that is actually fun!   It's just a lot more comfortable than sitting in a coffee shop and you can interact and get to know each other more naturally and spontaneously as well.  It doesn't feel as forced.

Or buying some wine and cheese and watching the sunset.  Get creative!  So many things you can do that don't cost money and don't involved sitting in a drab coffee shop with a complete stranger answering questions.

One thing I do agree with you about is that everyone is different and if the coffee shop first meet works for them, more power to em.  I simply wanted to let RedGuitar know that I understand where he's coming from about the coffee meets, that's all.

 

Edited October 17, 2020 by poppyfields

[ExpatInItaly]

On 10/14/2020 at 10:17 PM, Redguitar35 said:

Because at a certain point one wants to try something new.  That doesn’t mean I want to sit across the table at a coffee shop and get grilled for an hour. What makes you think a job interview like that is enjoyable and builds rapport? 

If most of your your dates feel like job interviews, you're doing something wrong, Red. 

[balletomane]

7 hours ago, poppyfields said:

One thing I do agree with you about is that everyone is different and if the coffee shop first meet works for them, more power to em.  I simply wanted to let RedGuitar know that I understand where he's coming from about the coffee meets, that's all.

 

I think Redguitar's issue is that he can't seem to see any middle ground between a Q&A style date in a coffee shop and inviting a total stranger round to his house, and he feels that he's being called a rapist when people point out that the majority of women wouldn't be comfortable doing that, no matter how happy they are to have casual sex.

Edited October 17, 2020 by balletomane

[Miss Spider]

I wouldn’t like dates either if I was a guy. You are expected to pay for it lol. On top of that,  the odds approach zero you’ll get play from it. Lol But I am a woman and I love dates . 
 

If you don’t like formulaic, cliche dates, be more creative 

Edited October 21, 2020 by Cookiesandough

[ZA Dater]

On 10/14/2020 at 4:40 AM, Ruby Slippers said:

Your attitude about dating is very negative. I only date when I'm excited about meeting someone new and look forward to it. It makes for a much more pleasant experience.

I do not disagree with you but I can understand why the OP is not excited about going on more of these formula type dates. Inherently this is the biggest weakness of OLD in my opinion, it constructs everything like an interview

Step 1: Is the person attractive

Pass that and move to step 2, meeting up. 

its all very rigid when you think about it. Being excited to meet new people is all good and well but when you look at what IS exciting about meeting a new person if there is nothing that says "wow".

[Ruby Slippers]

The solution is to do more screening up front. Get the interview-type questions out of the way before you agree to meet, so then you know there's potential and you can just have fun with the person.

A few of my online dates have said our first date was refreshing and a lot of fun because it didn't feel like an interview, but a DATE.

[ZA Dater]

3 hours ago, Ruby Slippers said:

The solution is to do more screening up front. Get the interview-type questions out of the way before you agree to meet, so then you know there's potential and you can just have fun with the person.

A few of my online dates have said our first date was refreshing and a lot of fun because it didn't feel like an interview, but a DATE.

I agree with this but the problem then is what to talk about when you do meet up? If you think about it you can make small talk but of what value is that really, I had one date which was interesting because because the conversation flowed in a very non Q&A fashion BUT it was about subjects but NOT about her.

Finding a middle ground can be very difficult and more so if you do not have a light personality to begin with. 

OP you can also find people who by nature are very outgoing and based on my experience they make for the most fun dates because they can talk about everything and have high levels of confidence.

[Ruby Slippers]

13 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

I agree with this but the problem then is what to talk about when you do meet up?

OP you can also find people who by nature are very outgoing and based on my experience they make for the most fun dates because they can talk about everything and have high levels of confidence.

Keeping a conversation going is a social skill. If I'm talking to someone I like and am interested in, who likes and is interested in me, I've never had any problem talking to them for hours, months, years. 

I'm not necessarily an outgoing person by nature, though I've learned to be more outgoing in the professional sphere since I'm in a leadership position and it's part of the job. But even an introvert can get really good at being curious, asking questions, and listening.

I've had hundreds of dates in my life and have never run out of things to talk about - the weather, current events, work, family, fitness, hobbies, goals, dreams, the food/drink we're having, and broader philosophical topics. It's interesting getting to know new people, especially when they're cute and you're romantically interested

[elaine567]

4 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

OP you can also find people who by nature are very outgoing and based on my experience they make for the most fun dates because they can talk about everything and have high levels of confidence.

Yes but what are they getting back from the encounter?
All very well to rely on their talkativeness and conversational skills and their ability to entertain, but what are they getting out of it?
Unless you are matching them in the conversational and fun stakes, then they will not be impressed.
Trying to get blood out of a stone is no fun at all.

[Trail Blazer]

On 10/17/2020 at 9:51 AM, poppyfields said:

Redguitar, chiming in to say I agree with you!   Environment and ambience for a first meet is so important and I don't know anyone who has "clicked" with another person sitting in a coffee shop drinking a cup of joe, asking and answering a bunch of contrived questions.  It's got to be the most boring, uninspiring place to make a connection on the face of the planet!   No matter if you're introverted OR extroverted!  

Not saying it doesn't happen, I am sure it has, I just don't know of anyone who has connected that way.  You're right, it's awkward, boring, uninspiring.  No one is gonna be on top of their game in that sort of boring, cold environment, which is personally why I always refused to meet that way.

My boyfriend and met at an extremely lively and fun sports bar!  We ordered beers.  We clicked instantly and were kissing within 30 minutes!

Another poster mentioned finding alternatives to the coffee bar first meet.

1.   Buy a cheap bottle of wine and some cheese and go watch the sunset.

2.   Meet at the zoo

3.   Meet downtown and explore, window shop, get some ice cream.  

None of those things involve sitting across from them in a boring, uninspiring environment answering interview type questions.

OR, do what my boyfriend and I did!  Meet at a lively upbeat sports bar, with great music, sit at the bar, order a beer, laugh, joke with others around you and see if any sparks fly between you, naturally and effortlessly.

Anything forced and contrived like sitting across from them drinking coffee answering a bunch of questions is NOT going to work imo.  

 

Whilst I agree to some degree about your coffew shop assessment, I really don't feel that it matters where you meet.  If you're going to click you're going to click.

I met my girlfriend at a local bar on a Sunday evening because it was spontaneous (connected that morning on Bumble) and all the coffee shops were shut.

Really, it would not have mattered one iota.  We could have met at a wastewater treatment plant and even the stench of raw sewage wouldn't have dampened the sparks and instant connection we both harbored for each other.

[poppyfields]

4 hours ago, ZA Dater said:

I agree with this but the problem then is what to talk about when you do meet up? 

You'd be surprised what two people who really click can find to talk about!  

I've never understood why folks advise to not talk/text too much before a date, otherwise what will you talk about during the date?  

This is NOT a concern when you truly click, and have high chemistry/ energy.  No way Jose. 

It's the opposite, you cannot stop talking!  And finding things to talk about.

It's easy, almost effortless.  No subject is off limits and it just flows.

I've been with my boyfriend three years and we still find plenty to talk about!  All the time. 

Edited October 22, 2020 by poppyfields

[poppyfields]

20 minutes ago, Trail Blazer said:

Whilst I agree to some degree about your coffew shop assessment, I really don't feel that it matters where you meet.  If you're going to click you're going to click.

I met my girlfriend at a local bar on a Sunday evening because it was spontaneous (connected that morning on Bumble) and all the coffee shops were shut.

Really, it would not have mattered one iota.  We could have met at a wastewater treatment plant and even the stench of raw sewage wouldn't have dampened the sparks and instant connection we both harbored for each other.

My bf and I met at a lively club too, sat at the bar.  The energy was so high in the entire place, great music, lots of people, it felt easy and comfortable.  We were kissing within 30 minutes! 

I don't know if I would have felt that same level of easiness and comfort sitting in a quiet coffee shop. 

I know myself, I'd be nervous, and it would have felt awkward.  

So I'm glad we met at the club! 

Everyone's different.

 

Edited October 22, 2020 by poppyfields

[poppyfields]

21 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

My bf and I met at a lively club too, sat at the bar.  The energy was so high in the entire place, great music, lots of people, it felt easy and comfortable.  We were kissing within 30 minutes! 

I don't know if I would have felt that same level of easiness and comfort sitting in a quiet coffee shop. 

I know myself, I'd be nervous, and it would have felt awkward.  

So I'm glad we met at the club! 

Everyone's different.

 

Too add @TB, not saying we wouldn't have connected, we already had, on line, prior to meeting.  We chatted for a couple of weeks. 

But meeting at the lively club made it a heck of a lot easier, more comfortable and fun!  

Less forced.  For ME.   I dunno hard to explain really. 

Edited October 22, 2020 by poppyfields

[Trail Blazer]

46 minutes ago, poppyfields said:

I've been with my boyfriend three years and we still find plenty to talk about!  All the time. 

That's good to hear.