Mid morning OLD

[mortensorchid]

I had an OLD today.  He wanted to meet for a mid morning which I thought was a bit odd but it was alright for coffee and a bagel.  So I met him at a Panera, we ordered coffees and bagels (not like the past dumb ones where the guy didn't order anything to eat or drink, if he wasn't going to do that I would have walked out).  We sat outside and ... Well, he was an alright guy I guess.  However, I could tell he was a weak man.  It wasn't like talking to a brick wall but he would say things like "So, I like music, do you?" I'd say I do and listed a few artists I liked and he didn't elaborate on his likes.  I asked if he had any success with the app that we met on (Hinge) and I said I had connected with a few but it hasn't been that great.  Two I told him ended up backing out at the last minute, he didn't say anything about any of the women he'd met or hadn't or even talked to.  I left feeling like he wasn't that interested, or he wasn't interested enough to contact me afterwards.  He walked me to my car and we said goodbye.  No handshake or hug because we were practicing social distancing.  He asked me to text when I got home, I said I wasn't going home but going out to do some training as a driving instructor and would be on the road all day.

I guess I feel somewhat good that he was semi decent.  Here's to getting closer to something good.

[Gaeta]

And why do you consider this man weak? To me he was a gentleman for not going into details of his online adventures. You shoulnd't ask that question, if a man sits in front of you it's obviously because it has not worked out for him yet. Did he contact you again?

[basil67]

I'm not sure why you say that this is getting closer to good.    You've just described a cringe worthy date.   The two of you didn't connect at all - partly he seems to have poor conversational skills, but on the positive, it sounds like he's a decent fellow who chooses not to connect over criticising prior dates.   You calling him a 'weak man' reflects that you don't respect him anyway.

Please don't see him again.   

 

 

 

[Happy Lemming]

In the end, you got out of the house, got to interact with another person and got some fresh air. 

First dates (especially during a pandemic) are kind of hard.  Yes, he should have done some prep work for conversation starters, but he tried.

So what will you do if he asks you out again??

[basil67]

33 minutes ago, enigma32 said:

I think this line itself makes me cringe a bit. It's just a really bad way to try and connect with a woman. Men and women these days tend to have very different tastes in music. I know I don't like my GF's music and she doesn't like mine. Maybe this guy was hoping you would like the same stuff he does? Either way, it sounds like he is grasping at straws here. That doesn't mean he is a bad guy though, and yeah, maybe this is a step in the right direction. 

But on the flipside, when you find someone who will go to concerts with you and will agree with what you want to play in the car, it's a good thing to have in common.

[Ruby Slippers]

Hey, you went out and met a nice guy. That's a good thing! Whether he's the guy or not, progress and momentum are always good. 

[chillii]

Love the way women always call him something , like a weak man , just because he wasn't interested, how dare he eh. Ahh, he was stronger than you that's why he felt no need to bother sorry to say because nope, he just wasn't interested. lt happens , greener pastures ahead.

Edited August 1, 2020 by chillii

[basil67]

2 minutes ago, chillii said:

Love the way women always call him something , like a weak man , just because he wasn't interested, how dare he eh. 

Or because he has poor conversation skills.  There's really no need for insults. 

[chillii]

Ahhh, there ya go, now he has more faults , l rest my case. And no how do we know that , being male l'd say more like he sounded zero interest and just wanting to get out of there to me. ps, bit rude maybe, you really should still be nice even if you do see on sight this just isn't gonna happen , which is how it sounds to me.

Edited August 1, 2020 by chillii

[elaine567]

12 hours ago, mortensorchid said:

he would say things like "So, I like music, do you?" I'd say I do and listed a few artists I liked and he didn't elaborate on his likes.

That was your cue to ask him what his taste in music is like. people who say "I like music" can be seriously into music and had you asked you might have found that out,  but  as it was you didn't ask but went on to tell him what YOU liked...I guess your likes were of no interest to him so he did not pursue it further.

I also think discussing other failed dates is not  a great conversation topic.
If some guy were to tell me about his dating disasters with other women on the first date, it would be "NEXT".
Because.
A) I am on the date, so concentrate on me, not other women.
B) If these women rejected you, what makes you think I will put up with you... 

[nibelheim89]

I agree with the post above, there was a cue to ask him about his music tastes, also starting conversation topics isn't a one way street.

As a guy I also really don't like to give a blow by blow account of my experiences on dating apps with people I meet, and if a date wants to rattle off her experiences instead of trying to get to know me the red flags are getting raised.

 

I'm not sure why he was "weak" either?

[Versacehottie]

5 hours ago, basil67 said:

Or because he has poor conversation skills.  There's really no need for insults. 

OP, has a tendency to not see herself as also responsible for a good conversation.  And it's been a reoccurring theme with her dates so it's easy to draw a conclusion.

Why Panera, again? 

I can't imagine WHY in the world you are asking him how he is doing on the the app as far as dating others--talk about poor conversational skills!!!  It's such a jaded thing to say & turns you into friends at best.  It's like a bad business meeting: at Panera, who else have you been interviewing with.  

 

[Versacehottie]

I just thought of something else important or that you should take a look at OP.

Whenever you recount your dates to us you point out the things that stand out and they are always negative.  Maybe look for some positives.  Also, to be fair, perhaps these are why these dates go nowhere, which brings me to the next part that you should really take a look at is that most of the time you are actually the one equally if not more at fault for the negative part that is the standout point of the date.

I agree with those that said you can't blandly exchange facts, "i like music, do you?" and be disappointed in his lack of exciting facts in return that fail to stimulate your mind.  Really connecting with someone is also asking better questions yourself.  Perhaps bringing someone out of their shell.  I like music by itself isn't a particularly exciting statement either.  Pretty much everyone likes music.  It's the nuances and some good conversation around you sharing that basic fact that make what you say to him more interesting in itself.  

I think he was just trying to make it through the date politely. He could be a weak guy or maybe not--what you've described here doesn't really speak to that.  I don't think he will follow up but I could be wrong.  I think it is good that you went.  I think though if you don't change the parts you keep persisting on doing poorly, it adds to your frustration and you keep getting the same results and that doesn't help you.

[poppyfields]

21 hours ago, mortensorchid said:

 I left feeling like he wasn't that interested, or he wasn't interested enough to contact me afterwards. 

Were you interested in him?  Attracted to him?  

That is the question to be asking yourself.  Not whether you think he was interested in you.  

It doesn't sound like you were.  Which is fine, you weren't a match. 

No need to be calling him weak or even just "alright for a coffee and bagel." 

You didn't click, not his fault or your fault.

Next.  

Just keep going and best to stop analyzing things so much. 

Edited August 1, 2020 by poppyfields

[kendahke]

22 hours ago, mortensorchid said:

he would say things like "So, I like music, do you?" I'd say I do and listed a few artists I liked and he didn't elaborate on his likes. 

Then ask him a follow up question.

"Why" and "how" questions elicit explanatory responses. 
"Who", "what", "when", "where" and "do/don't/doesn't" questions only require yes, no or simple subject, object, verb answers. 

Phrase your questions better if you don't want one word answers.

Quote

I asked if he had any success with the app that we met on

You don't want to hear him talk about how great his other dates have been nor does he want to hear your laundry list of bad dates. That's not the question to ask on a first meeting.

Edited August 1, 2020 by kendahke

[Fox Sake]

Every failure brings you closer to success. If you don’t click with someone then you don’t click. That’s all there is too it. May there be many more good times come your way! 
In my experience, coffee shop dates never really go passed a friendship anyways!

[dangerous]

2 hours ago, Fox Sake said:

Every failure brings you closer to success. If you don’t click with someone then you don’t click. That’s all there is too it. May there be many more good times come your way! 
In my experience, coffee shop dates never really go passed a friendship anyways!

Oh dear, I've just now come back from a date in a coffee shop! We'll see lol

[Fresh_Start]

On 7/31/2020 at 8:19 PM, Gaeta said:

And why do you consider this man weak?

I'll field this one.

He's weak because he asked her to meet up for a midmorning coffee date and was a cringeworthy conversationalist, which is probably why he asked her out on a date with such a low probability of success in the first place.  It was a quick out for a man with little to no confidence.  

Coffee dates have about as much innate romantic chemistry as a job interview.  The only sparks I'd get from a midmorning date at a Starbucks or Panera would be from some pretentious tech weenie spilling his cup of jitter juice across his laptop.  Why not just meet up for a date at the public library or over a bowl of cereal?

I think everybody would have more success if they weren't afraid to go on a real date instead of conforming to the conventions of cookie cutter quickies.  Be bold and reap the rewards. 

[Fox Sake]

1 hour ago, dangerous said:

Oh dear, I've just now come back from a date in a coffee shop! We'll see lol

Let us know how it goes!  

Coffee shop - usually friend zones one of you, especially if done in the day time. If I get a coffee shop date I’m taking a game of Jenga with me, just to break the norm! Actually dying to try this out haha! 

Drinks or out for a meal, or both, usually has a better success rate, especially in the evening. Alcohol probably has a part to play, whereas coffee is almost like a business  date. 
 

Would be interested in hearing everyone else’s  experiences or thoughts 
 

Edited August 2, 2020 by Fox Sake
Dyslexic phone

[Fresh_Start]

9 minutes ago, Fox Sake said:

Drinks or out for a meal, or both, usually has a better success rate, especially in the evening. Alcohol probably has a part to play, whereas coffee is almost like a business  date. 
 

Would be interested in hearing everyone else’s  experiences or thoughts 

You already know how I feel.  I take potshots at coffee dates like I'm Django Unchained. 

[kendahke]

I've read posts on this site in past years where the guy walked out on the woman at a dinner date and women being left at the table where the guy excused himself to the bathroom and never returned.

Coffee dates are usually suggested because of having to fork out +$75 for someone who you regretted agreeing to meeting when they walked through the door. Dinner dates for the first meeting aren't any more successful than coffee dates.

[poppyfields]

2 hours ago, Fox Sake said:

Drinks or out for a meal, or both, usually has a better success rate, especially in the evening. Alcohol probably has a part to play, whereas coffee is almost like a business  date. 

Agree!  Ambience is important!  That combined with just a bit of alcohol adds to comfort factor which helps in making a connection with a virtual stranger. 

It does not have to be expensive!  One drink each, split an app at the bar and nibble, perfect!

Comfort combined with a bit of tension and you're on your way..

Ditch the coffee meets, ugh.  Especially in the mornings,  you might as well be meeting your business partner.

There are exceptions, but in most cases, nothing gonna happen.

Edited August 2, 2020 by poppyfields

[Fresh_Start]

2 hours ago, kendahke said:

I've read posts on this site in past years where the guy walked out on the woman at a dinner date and women being left at the table where the guy excused himself to the bathroom and never returned.

Coffee dates are usually suggested because of having to fork out +$75 for someone who you regretted agreeing to meeting when they walked through the door. Dinner dates for the first meeting aren't any more successful than coffee dates.

I respectfully disagree.

Coffee dates are for people who are more focused on an escape route than building a meaningful connection.  They are for people who lack the confidence to go on a real date, such as going out to dinner.  The arguments against dinner dates are all the same and they all betray an underlying lack of confidence as well as very negative and pessimistic mindsets about dinner dates or dating in general.  If you go into something worried about all of the ways in which it could possibly fail, it will fail. 

Dinner dates work for me because I make them work.  I ran my own business for 10 years and all of my clients were fellow business owners and self-employed people.  That was my target market and they did everything you could possibly dream of to earn a living, from a birthday clown to a multi-millionaire real estate developer and everything in between.  I can carry on a conversation for hours with anyone who has a set of ears and a voice box.  

Here's how it works for me (and for anyone out there who struggles with dating or getting into a relationship, take notes):

I get a woman's number and always have a conversation with her before even asking her out to dinner.  This is my opportunity to get to know her a little bit and build some initial chemistry and attraction that makes meeting up for dinner a very natural and exciting next step that both parties to the date are looking forward to.  I go into every dinner date with the mindset that it will be a great night with great conversation and further getting to know one another rather than negatively thinking about all of the things that could possibly go wrong and needing a quick escape.  That's not the way those dates have ever gone for me.  They offer a far more intimate setting than a daytime coffee date in a coffee shop full of people plugging away on their laptops and are a perfect setting to build the kind of chemistry and attraction that is naturally conducive to physical intimacy and a second date.  

It's very rare to verging on nonexistent that my dinner dates haven't been a success and for those that weren't, I didn't think of it as a waste of time or money.  I still had the opportunity to go out and enjoy a nice meal and a drink or two with someone I was interested in.  If the chemistry wasn't there on a romantic level I can still carry on a conversation without any awkwardness the same way I do with a client, colleague, friend, or family member.  If somebody doesn't have the confidence to manage that then most of their dates are going to bomb anyways.   

Edited August 2, 2020 by Fresh_Start

[elaine567]

Horses for courses.
But at least coffee in the middle of the day probably gives a more objective assessment, rather than an alcohol tainted dinner.
I guess many women may feel safer on a coffee date, than feel they are being pressurised into sex after dinner because she then feels she owes him... and she is then a bit tipsy too...

[Fresh_Start]

4 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

But at least coffee in the middle of the day probably gives a more objective assessment, rather than an alcohol tainted dinner.
I guess many women may feel safer on a coffee date, than feel they are being pressurised into sex after dinner because she then feels she owes him... and she is then a bit tipsy too...

Case in point.  Negativity and pessimism about dinner dates and dating in general.  There is no pressure, there are no concerns about safety.  That's the purpose of the initial phone call as well as the purpose of the date or we wouldn't be going out and meeting for dinner in the first place.  Most people also don't get tipsy after one drink nor have it "taint" their judgment to the point that they can't make an objective assessment about the person sitting across the table from them.  If you feel "unsafe" in a dating situation, that's on you and the man who asked you out for not making you feel comfortable enough.  These are some of the very same self-imposed mental obstacles that cause so many dating opportunities to fail when they don't have to. 

I've given my reasons for why dinner dates are superior to coffee dates.  It's up to you and everybody else who takes the time to read my post if you want to stay stuck by continuing to do the same things over and over again and expecting different results (the definition of insanity) or whether you want to improve your chances by making a more meaningful connection with the person you're going out with.  If you want an "assessment", meet up for a coffee in the morning or the middle of the day.  If you want a date, go out to dinner.   If you're feeling unsafe and pressured, you shouldn't be going out at all.