Caught him on dating app

[introverted1]

It's not a matter of whether is a bad person (which is too much black/white thinking) but whether he is the right person for you.

I haven't read all 6 pages of this but it seems he has low interest in you, while also demonstrating some behaviors that suggest weakness.  The former would be enough of a deal-breaker for me -- I like a man whose interest is clear, direct, and consistent -- but you are not me or anyone else in this thread.  So the question for you is:  Is this the type of partner you want?   

[poppyfields]

I'm wondering, given that he has never attempted sex with you or even just a kiss, combined with what you described as his effeminate nature, I wonder if what he's confused about is his sexuality.  

I'm sorry I think its extremely weird for a 26 year old man to not want to pursue sex (with you or perhaps any woman).

I am sure he feels fondly for you but if he's sexually ambivalent leaning towards men, he is not sexually attracted to you,  but simply goes through the motions if/when you initiate, which would explain a lot of his actions.  His back and forth, push/pull, confusion, indecisiveness and overall weirdness.  

I wouldn't rule it out. 

 

Edited July 21, 2020 by poppyfields

[Gaeta]

8 minutes ago, lovesfool said:

 but just because some character trait is not appealing to you doesn't make him a bad person. Doing bad things doesn't even make you a bad person. Everyone has a mix of good and bad in them.

Sorry OP but this sounds like some philosophy you found inside a cereal box. The type of philosophy that keeps women in abusive relationships! Ya he cheats but he's such a good dad or he's such a nice person when he's not drunk. 

 

[poppyfields]

LF, when you found him on the app, could you tell whether he was searching for women or men?

If he is now suddenly bi-curious, that would explain the "just looking" comment on his profile, him suddenly deleting the app, and his defensive posture when you confronted him.  

He's feeling ashamed, or shamed, for having these feelings.  It might also explain his "I need help" on his FB.

My brain is spinning but it makes sense to me and not out of the realm of possibilities. 

Edited July 21, 2020 by poppyfields

[Allupinnit]

I don't think anyone said he was a bad person at all.  I just don't think he's into you and going silent for four days, followed by popping up on the dating site should tell you all you need to know.  Being not into someone doesn't make you a bad person.

It's a little cringe-y to watch you talk yourself into this lackluster relationship, though.  

[hippychick3]

This all just makes me sad, OP. Someone with healthy self-esteem and self-love would not think twice about letting this guy go. There is no reason to meet face to face other than you hoping it may spark more interest from him in person. That won’t fix anything and only makes you look desperate. He’s not hurt or broken up about losing you. If anything, his ego is bruised. Please keep your dignity and don’t contact him again. He is not invested in you at all and is not worthy. I know it hurts but it’s best to just grieve and then to work on yourself so in the future you’ll attract only quality men who are clearly interested in you. 

[ExpatInItaly]

9 hours ago, lovesfool said:

Option 4 is there because I know how horrible it is to break up and be broken up with over the phone and not have a proper goodbye. 

That's the other thing, though - this isn't a break-up. There wasn't a relationship to break up. 

You're projecting here.

[lovesfool]

Just to get this off the table, he's certainly not homosexual. I never had that feeling about him and am very sure that's not the issue.

I will admit this may be coming from a place of desperation. I liked this guy more than anyone I've met dating in the past 7 years. I may have rose tinted glasses on, trying to force myself to see the positives.

I come from a very small area as I said before where the dating options are very limited. So much so that this guy was a 2 hours drive away. I nearly recognise everyone on the dating apps after being on it for so long. I've spoken to a lot of them, I've gone on many dates. No one has captured my feelings in this way like this guy. It also doesn't help that I don't find many guys attractive at all. My friends have asked me about very handsome actors and I would honestly tell them I've no attraction to them.

I look at my siblings, my friends, my work colleagues, all in serious long-term relationships. It has me feeling terrible, absolutely awful. I know I shouldn't be comparing myself to them, but I can't help it. I don't think that there's anything wrong with me per se, as I have no difficulty in getting a date if I wanted one (without sounding big headed), it's just that I can't seem to find anyone I'm interested in, even slightly.

This felt like the guy. I can't explain it, but this is what I really believed and I never think like this. I was planning ahead, thinking what we could do for a holiday break, what to get him for his birthday. Maybe you think I was over invested, but how many stories have you heard through the years of couples who started off in the same way.

Every time I think about my dating life and going back to the apps or meeting guys in bars, it really depresses me. I feel lost at sea. I've thrown away so many relationships because I've had one doubt and picked and picked and picked away at it until I convince myself I should dump him. It feels like I will just find a problem with every man I date.

Maybe this guy is horrible, will cheat on me, isn't invested in me, will cause me heartbreak, but the opposite could also be true. He could be the most loving and committed person in the world. No one knows for sure.

Sorry for the ramble, but I just need somewhere to vent right now.

[Mystery4u]

2 hours ago, lovesfool said:

Just to get this off the table, he's certainly not homosexual. I never had that feeling about him and am very sure that's not the issue.

I will admit this may be coming from a place of desperation. I liked this guy more than anyone I've met dating in the past 7 years. I may have rose tinted glasses on, trying to force myself to see the positives.

I come from a very small area as I said before where the dating options are very limited. So much so that this guy was a 2 hours drive away. I nearly recognise everyone on the dating apps after being on it for so long. I've spoken to a lot of them, I've gone on many dates. No one has captured my feelings in this way like this guy. It also doesn't help that I don't find many guys attractive at all. My friends have asked me about very handsome actors and I would honestly tell them I've no attraction to them.

I look at my siblings, my friends, my work colleagues, all in serious long-term relationships. It has me feeling terrible, absolutely awful. I know I shouldn't be comparing myself to them, but I can't help it. I don't think that there's anything wrong with me per se, as I have no difficulty in getting a date if I wanted one (without sounding big headed), it's just that I can't seem to find anyone I'm interested in, even slightly.

This felt like the guy. I can't explain it, but this is what I really believed and I never think like this. I was planning ahead, thinking what we could do for a holiday break, what to get him for his birthday. Maybe you think I was over invested, but how many stories have you heard through the years of couples who started off in the same way.

Every time I think about my dating life and going back to the apps or meeting guys in bars, it really depresses me. I feel lost at sea. I've thrown away so many relationships because I've had one doubt and picked and picked and picked away at it until I convince myself I should dump him. It feels like I will just find a problem with every man I date.

Maybe this guy is horrible, will cheat on me, isn't invested in me, will cause me heartbreak, but the opposite could also be true. He could be the most loving and committed person in the world. No one knows for sure.

Sorry for the ramble, but I just need somewhere to vent right now.

That's all great, but means absolutely nothing if he doesn't feel the same about you, which he has shown he doesn't. A relationship is a two way thing.

[lovesfool]

35 minutes ago, Mystery4u said:

That's all great, but means absolutely nothing if he doesn't feel the same about you, which he has shown he doesn't. A relationship is a two way thing.

That's true. Maybe this is his wake up call and he can change himself when he is ready to commit to someone, whoever that may be.

[ExpatInItaly]

2 minutes ago, lovesfool said:

That's true. Maybe this is his wake up call and he can change himself when he is ready to commit to someone, whoever that may be.

A sincere question, but a wake-up call for what?

 

[lovesfool]

Just now, ExpatInItaly said:

A sincere question, but a wake-up call for what?

 

To appreciate what he has when he's dating someone. I know he's upset about the breakup and I hope that he sees he was in the wrong.

[ExpatInItaly]

2 minutes ago, lovesfool said:

To appreciate what he has when he's dating someone. I know he's upset about the breakup and I hope that he sees he was in the wrong.

There is a difference between not appreciating, and not being interested. 

I feel for you, LF. You seem to be in a lot of denial here. 

[lovesfool]

43 minutes ago, ExpatInItaly said:

There is a difference between not appreciating, and not being interested. 

I feel for you, LF. You seem to be in a lot of denial here. 

I understand that I'm being stupid, but I need to talk this through to get all my thoughts out. I haven't acted on anything besides dumping him.

[Gaeta]

1 hour ago, lovesfool said:

 I know he's upset about the breakup and I hope that he sees he was in the wrong.

You assume a lot about how he feels. 

[lovesfool]

5 minutes ago, Gaeta said:

You assume a lot about how he feels. 

That's true of everyone though. No one truly knows how another person feels.

[elaine567]

23 minutes ago, lovesfool said:

That's true of everyone though. No one truly knows how another person feels.

No, but there are actions that tell you how they feel.
This man was caught on a dating app twice, whilst he was supposedly interested in you.
No-one who is truly interested will be looking for other people behind your back, they will avoid doing anything that will ruin their chances too as they are scared of losing you.
The thought of other women on the dating app trumped any worry of upsetting you. 
Face it, he "future faked" you, told you what you wanted to hear, then he went off looking for a better model.
Yes he may be your best option in 7 years but you were not his.
You can't hang onto guys who are not "all in", hoping...
That is a complete waste of your time.
Even if you could persuade him to stick around, one whiff of a better offer and he would be off... or he would spend his life moaning he "settled" for you...
Let him go.

[balletomane]

1 hour ago, lovesfool said:

I understand that I'm being stupid, but I need to talk this through to get all my thoughts out. I haven't acted on anything besides dumping him.

You're not stupid. You feel hurt and sore that someone you cared about wasn't interested enough to be in an exclusive relationship with you, which is very natural. Denial is one way of coping with that. Telling yourself that he messed up, he feels bad about it, and he didn't appreciate what he had is easier than admitting to yourself that he just didn't feel the same way about you.

I've been in a similar position, and I know it stings. I made all sorts of excuses for the guy - he has problems communicating, he's emotionally avoidant and he got scared, and so on. But the simple truth was that he dated me long enough to realise that our relationship wasn't what he was looking for. I wasn't what he was looking for. End of story. I could concoct theories about why it had ended and hope to myself that he'd see what he'd lost one day all I liked, but eventually I had to face up to the reality, even though it didn't feel flattering.

Because it hasn't been easy for you to find dates, I think you pinned far too many hopes on this guy far too soon, in a way that isn't reasonable or healthy. He wasn't your only shot at a relationship. That's an idea of him you've built up in your head. Once you lose that idea, you'll be able to move on. Describing any man as "my last chance" makes you sound like a badly behaved dog who keeps getting returned to the shelter, and you aren't. It also makes you more likely to be clingy in the early stages of dating, which is what you were doing when you started checking up on him and creating fake profiles to message him. In a healthy relationship, that doesn't happen. The fact it did happen shows that you yourself weren't ready for anything long-term. Improving your own self-confidence and learning to let go of these anxieties about not finding anyone will leave you in a better place for your future relationships.

Edited July 22, 2020 by balletomane

[ExpatInItaly]

2 hours ago, lovesfool said:

I understand that I'm being stupid, but I need to talk this through to get all my thoughts out. I haven't acted on anything besides dumping him.

Talking it out helps, yes. 

And you're not stupid. You're hurt and upset that he's not the guy you thought he was, and the relationship you hoped for isn't going to happen. It's normal that it takes time to accept. My concern is that you will keep rationalizing his behaviour, thus keeping yourself in pain longer than necessary. 

[lovesfool]

53 minutes ago, balletomane said:

I've been in a similar position, and I know it stings. I made all sorts of excuses for the guy - he has problems communicating, he's emotionally avoidant and he got scared, and so on. But the simple truth was that he dated me long enough to realise that our relationship wasn't what he was looking for. I wasn't what he was looking for. End of story. I could concoct theories about why it had ended and hope to myself that he'd see what he'd lost one day all I liked, but eventually I had to face up to the reality, even though it didn't feel flattering.

Because it hasn't been easy for you to find dates, I think you pinned far too many hopes on this guy far too soon, in a way that isn't reasonable or healthy. He wasn't your only shot at a relationship. That's an idea of him you've built up in your head. Once you lose that idea, you'll be able to move on. Describing any man as "my last chance" makes you sound like a badly behaved dog who keeps getting returned to the shelter, and you aren't. It also makes you more likely to be clingy in the early stages of dating, which is what you were doing when you started checking up on him and creating fake profiles to message him. In a healthy relationship, that doesn't happen. The fact it did happen shows that you yourself weren't ready for anything long-term. Improving your own self-confidence and learning to let go of these anxieties about not finding anyone will leave you in a better place for your future relationships.

Did you have regrets about the time you spent together despite your doubts? Did anyone advise you not to keep seeing him? Did you tell him how you felt? It's good to see someone who was in the same position as me and I would hope to learn from it.

I find it hard not to get hopeful when someone different comes along. I wasn't banking on him to be "the one", but I thought it could go somewhere and that was enough for me.

Was what I did in checking in on the dating app wrong? I think if I didn't I would be in an entirely different position. I don't think I would have even thought seriously about his commitment to dating me if I didn't.

[Versacehottie]

4 hours ago, lovesfool said:

To appreciate what he has when he's dating someone. I know he's upset about the breakup and I hope that he sees he was in the wrong.

By your own logic, he is not a bad person....just because he doesn't want to date you.

You mention, that you haven't taken the next action except for dumping him....um what else is there to do? 

You are so focused on him that you have the "flawed" thought that he will somehow "learn his lesson for not choosing you.  Even in the aftermath almost all your thoughts are about him--wouldn't it make more sense to focus on yourself?? Even if it was in the very real was to acknowledge and ACCEPT your disappointment and find a way to dig yourself out of the hole that you've created for yourself and work on yourself and recovering from this "breakup".TBH, if you were making all these future plans in your mind with him, you really were taking the "relationship" you were getting on FACE-VALUE.  Maybe he hopes you will learn your lesson.  It feels like a lot of the future thoughts and over-promising came from your head or was a bit forced upon him.  Idk, but even on here as you talk through it, I have to be honest that it's so unattractive.  You would drive even a guy who is into you away with all of this--and if you think he can't read your energy even if it's just thoughts in your head, you are wrong.  It's so controlling; like you're trying to outmaneuver everything and the other person has so little choice in the matter.  It is VERY forced.

Hanging onto this guy or trying to force him back into a relationship because you are FEARFUL of looking for someone new and your prospects and think it's hard, blah blah, is the dumbest reason in the world.  I think you've watched one too many fairy tale or romantic comedy to get you to believe that there is something there with this guy!   He is not giving you the same impression back--by a long shot.  You are acting like it is FATED to be, when all the factual evidence points the other direction: that it is not.  I'm all for a little bit of magic, fate into things but it can't fly in the face of reality or be for the reasons that you trying to find someone who treats you well and is into you is too hard for you.  

I really wish you luck. You've been getting lots of great advice and have an excuse for everything.  This is no longer his fault that this is happening to you.  You have to accept reality. 

 

[balletomane]

2 hours ago, lovesfool said:

Did you have regrets about the time you spent together despite your doubts? Did anyone advise you not to keep seeing him? Did you tell him how you felt? It's good to see someone who was in the same position as me and I would hope to learn from it.

I find it hard not to get hopeful when someone different comes along. I wasn't banking on him to be "the one", but I thought it could go somewhere and that was enough for me.

At first I did have regrets. I had been in an abusive relationship that left me with PTSD, and I couldn't date for four years after I left my abuser. I just wasn't well enough. Then I met this new man through a close friend, we became friends in our own right (or so I thought), and he asked me on a date. I told him I wasn't in a frame of mind to date, and explained the reasons. Nine months later he asked me again. I agreed, as I had begun to develop some feelings for him, and I thought it was touching that he'd waited nine months for me. Surely this was a sign that he was really interested?

He dumped me out of the blue after barely five weeks - but not before he'd invited me to accompany him on an overseas trip to meet his family and I'd bought the plane ticket. He'd been so eager for me to go with him. I'd just started to relax and feel as if I'd found someone safe, dependable, and trustworthy who really wanted me around, and the break-up blindsided me. As I said, I made all kinds of excuses and rationalisations for his behaviour, and at first I agreed to his request to stay friends even though people in my life were telling me to just go no contact. The rejection hurt a lot, as I'd taken a risk in trying a new relationship. But over time I realised that the experience had been a valuable one, and I don't regret it any more. With the support of my therapist, I discovered these things:

1.) My self-confidence was still too low. I'd been attracted to this man mostly because he had seemed patient and willing to wait while I worked through my PTSD. I thought that it was unlikely I would find a man who could tolerate my difficulties. But my question should never have been "Who will tolerate me?" but "Who do I want to be with?" I'm not a burden, but without realising it, I'd been seeing myself as one.

2.) My expectations were too low. I was relieved to find that this man wasn't physically violent and didn't lash out with unpredictable rages and cruel comments, and that relief blossomed into a sense that he was a wonderful person. But as a friend pointed out, having "Not an abuser" as my main selection criterion was setting a spectacularly low bar. I realised that this way of thinking showed I was still expecting abusive treatment as my norm, so I thought I was in paradise when a boyfriend treated me with basic decency and that he must be some kind of angel. Not true.

3.) I was still behaving passively and as though I had limited choices. I realised I didn't have to wait around for a man to come along and want to be with me. If I wanted to, I could go looking myself. I joined Bumble, as this seemed like an empowering app for a woman in PTSD recovery - I had control over who could and couldn't message me. I knew that it would be unwise to start thinking about the future from the start of dating; that had been my mistake with the recent ex. On my first Bumble date, my only goal was to have fun conversation and a nice dinner with someone who seemed interesting. I told myself that even if he didn't want a second date and I did, I would have been successful in confronting my anxieties, so whatever happened it was a win. Approaching the date with this attitude made a very positive difference.

If I hadn't had that unpleasant rejection, these discoveries would have been unlikely. I would probably never have joined a dating app, and I would almost certainly have never met my boyfriend - and even if I had, I wouldn't have been self-assured enough for a relationship. If you treat each painful situation as a learning opportunity, some good will come of it.

Quote

Was what I did in checking in on the dating app wrong? I think if I didn't I would be in an entirely different position. I don't think I would have even thought seriously about his commitment to dating me if I didn't.

If you hadn't already been questioning his commitment to you, you wouldn't have checked the app. That's something people only do if they're already feeling mistrustful or having doubts.

Edited July 22, 2020 by balletomane

[Versacehottie]

1 hour ago, lovesfool said:

I find it hard not to get hopeful when someone different comes along. I wasn't banking on him to be "the one", but I thought it could go somewhere and that was enough for me.

Was what I did in checking in on the dating app wrong? I think if I didn't I would be in an entirely different position. I don't think I would have even thought seriously about his commitment to dating me if I didn't.

All of your posts on this thread suggest the opposite (from the bolded).

meh, I think it's somewhat wrong that you needed to check on the app.  I think it speaks to the subconscious idea that on some level you knew you were forcing things with him and making them to be more than they were; you also on some level didn't not have trust there (warranted or unwarranted); you have also demonstrated that you like to control things and this would be a version of that.  You are hanging on for dear life. It's overbearing.   That said, it's a happy accident that you found out and it forced what you undoubtedly would just be wasting more time on some fake relationship with him--so at least it brought this stuff to the surface without wasting more of your time.

You have anxious and fearful thinking.  And you are justifying all of what you do in analyzing it, monitoring him, "thinking it through" to help your mind and anxiety out but it's not helping the story that you tell yourself about yourself or to move on and get a result you want.  You have to take some personal responsibility. Slow down you're thinking. Deal with your anxiety.  And not jump into the future with the next person.  Take things on a day to day basis to keep yourself rooted in reality.  

I actually have no problem with the idea of thinking he f*cked up because YOU are a worthy person, and he missed out.  While you might not whole-heartedly believe it right now, if that helps you move on, good.  There is a shift in the thinking you've been doing and the thought I'm suggesting to help get you out of this.  In you wanting him to see the error of his ways, you have hopeful thinking, revenge thinking and it's all focused on him.  What I'm suggesting, focus on you and hopefully will give you power and strength to propel you to more productive dating and thinking.  

[Gaeta]

5 hours ago, lovesfool said:

Maybe this is his wake up call and he can change himself when he is ready to commit to someone, whoever that may be.

In the dating world everything is about our level of interest and our motivation. You were very interested and motivated to getting to know  him so you planned the 4 dates, even if he never initiated a meeting you didn't let this bring you down and you continued planning meeting #2 #3 #4. If this man was interested in getting to know you he would show the same type of excitement toward you and couldn't wait to plan dates and bring you places.

This man does not need a wake up call, he needs to meet a woman he's motivated about. Once he does he will do all the things you wished he'd done with you. He will plan dates, he will initiate intimacy and he will be off dating apps. He will do all that without being told, it will come to him naturally. 

You are going through a simple case of he's not that into you. 

 

[stillafool]

5 hours ago, lovesfool said:

To appreciate what he has when he's dating someone. I know he's upset about the breakup and I hope that he sees he was in the wrong.

This only happens when they actually want the person they are in a relationship with.   Appreciating what they had would mean they would do the work to get YOU back.  You two were never in a relationship so you didn't actually break up.