Dating a guy who is homeless

[Ellener]

@Cookiesandough

I made friends with a homeless guy a couple of years ago, he came to stay for a few nights during some bad weather; the people around me were protective but worldly themselves and not so judgmental! but I was recovering from a mental illness and people were worried...my background was in social work too and my property manager said 'you are not at work right now'.

Another word used about homelessness is 'transient' and it's a telling one. Finding someone a home does not 'cure' homelessness, several homeless people during my career told me they no longer feel safe in the basic situations which make the rest of us feel safer: houses, relationships, jobs, commitments...

This broken-ness is often caused by 'institutionalisation' from situations such as being in the forces or children's homes or detention, or by a major trauma such as family breakdown, so at some point the structure of life falls apart and a new set of coping mechanisms based on 'fight or flight' instincts kicks in.

It is very difficult for someone at your guy's point to trust or to stay in any place for long.

He already knows that some of his habits will cause chaos if he sticks around someone who cares for too long, so he will always have one foot out of the door, won't burden his parents...

11 hours ago, Cookiesandough said:

always the feeling I just want to cuddle him and be there for him as a friend. But I  The more he spoke, the. more attractive he became. 

Yes. Your compassion is motivating greater attraction. 

This depth of communication and confronting life's most basic raw issues is a compelling connection.

Caring is an honourable trait and the ability to connect to others in deep need is frankly a spiritual gift. 

Use that to help others and be your best self, absolutely, but not as the basis for a relationship.

You have an unmet need within yourself here, and your psyche is putting you in touch with it:

11 hours ago, Cookiesandough said:

He makes me feel something in a way I never felt before.

but this guy is already struggling to keep body and soul together, don't ask him to meet your needs too.

((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((((( ))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))))

 

 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Ellener
wording

[kendahke]

he's what my daughter calls a "hobosexual"... he falls in love to machine a place to live.

what is he doing to get employment enough to afford his own dwelling?  What is doing to address his mental health issues?  What is he doing to stop drinking?

Until those issues are resolved for a consistent and long length of time, do not invest your heart in him. All of this is going to get really old in about 5 - 8 months when the honeymoon phase is gone.  Doesn't matter how he is right now--he's on his best behavior to find someone new to live off of.

It's a good thing you are with your folks because he'd be on the hard press to move in with you---then he'll be inviting others into your house while you're at work like that one poster whose homeless boyfriend moved in with her and he invited his kids to come live in her apartment without asking her.

[Redhead14]

Covid exposure and distancing guidelines aside, you should also realize that homeless people often have lice and/or scabies and other hygiene related issues.  Lice and/or scabies cannot be showered away either.  These creatures are parasites, this guy probably is too. 

He didn't make any "moves".  Alcoholics often have very low libido and significant ED.  But, would you have allowed any physical contact considering the virus???  Did you practice distancing at least.  Now you have to wonder about your exposure to the virus and taking it back home to your parents.  You live with them.  If something happens to them, where will you go? 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Redhead14

[smackie9]

Dating a fixer upper is how codependency is created. He needs a social worker not a GF. Even if the help is offered, he isn't going to accept it. He has to hit rock bottom before he will ever want it. Basically being there for him, sacrificing your needs will only enable him to do nothing of his situation...you would just be a distraction. Sure he's a nice guy, somewhat attractive, but he has nothing to offer you in the relationship dept. That is what you should be focusing on when you meet someone...are they stable financially and mentally. Loyal, good work ethic, kind, supportive, considerate, integrity. Can you see yourself marrying this person, can you see them raising children with you, provide a stable environment for them, etc.

Time to get you head out of your butt, and find someone who ticks off all those boxes or your string of dysfunctional relationships will continue.

Edited June 4, 2020 by smackie9

[poppyfields]

1 hour ago, Redhead14 said:

Covid exposure and distancing guidelines aside, you should also realize that homeless people often have lice and/or scabies and other hygiene related issues.  Lice and/or scabies cannot be showered away either.  These creatures are parasites, this guy probably is too. 

He didn't make any "moves".  Alcoholics often have very low libido and significant ED.  But, would you have allowed any physical contact considering the virus???  Did you practice distancing at least.  Now you have to wonder about your exposure to the virus and taking it back home to your parents.  You live with them.  If something happens to them, where will you go? 

Best post^^.   

[Calmandfocused]

8 hours ago, balletomane said:

I think the question you need to ask yourself isn't, "Should I date this man?" but, "Why am I attracted to someone with these very significant difficulties?"

I think you're in danger of getting swept up in a fantasy where you're the only one who understands a badly misunderstood man, and he's the special person who truly understands you. All the people who warn you about him don't have your unique insight. This type of thinking is characteristic of BPD - at first a sufferer will treat you as if you are extraordinary. "You're the only one who..." But he will have said this before to many other people. He can go in seconds from seeing you as an angel to thinking you're the worst person in the world, all because you brought him a different kind of sandwich from the one you promised.

I know because I was in a relationship with a man diagnosed with BPD for two years. It was devastating. He abused me, but even without the abuse, his illness would have had a terrible effect on my own mental health. An example of what he could be like: he got convinced that two complete strangers in a shop wanted him dead because they looked at him in a way he considered nasty. (I doubt they were looking at him at all.) When I tried to comfort him, he blew up at me for not just agreeing that these people were terrible. He spent the whole night crying, accusing me of being uncaring and making his suffering worse, and saying some frankly vicious things. I stayed because I reasoned it wasn't his fault he was so ill and if I could only be a better girlfriend he wouldn't have outbursts like that.

This guy is already setting you up for some blame when he tells you that his self-perception is based on how he thinks others see him. He feels awful about himself soday? That must be because you see him badly. Sooner or later you'll be accused of that, and worse.

I don't believe it's impossible to have a relationship with people with BPD. But those people will be participating in regular therapy and committed to stabilising their lives, not actively addicted to alcohol and living out of a car "on principle". Do not let yourself start seeing his situation as somehow deep and complex and romantic. It's a mess and it doesn't need to become your mess.

This is excellent advice on all accounts. 
 

Ballet, it seems like you and I have been on the same rollercoaster at the same Fun Fair. What a ride! 
 

Cookies, I’m older than you but some of what you describe reminds me how I used to operate. I’d be turned off my men who were “nice” and right for me and turned on by men who were “broken” and wrong for me. Let me tell you that more often than not the latter group turned out to be a**eholes. 
 

So you find his chaotic lifestyle and instability attractive? Why?
 

 Instead of focusing on how he makes you feel,  look at the facts: There is no stability with this guy. Absolutely none. At age 30 plus he should have his s**t together. 
 

Personally I think you’re enamoured with this guy because he didn’t openly flirt with you and you’re after your validation like I mentioned in another thread. 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Calmandfocused

[stillafool]

I don't think it's validation she's after because let's get real,  the way Cookie looks I'm sure she gets that every time she leaves the house.  I do think she is attracted to him because he isn't all over her because of the way she looks like other guys are which helps her to see value in him.  I have a feeling that the novelty of dating him will wear off soon, Cookie will retreat and this guy will get hurt.  Maybe start acting out and then you're going to have problems getting rid of him.

[elaine567]

14 hours ago, Cookiesandough said:

He is living out of his car and bouncing from friend house to friend house at the moment.

He is not actually living on the streets or mixing with other homeless people.
He has a car and is sofa surfing with friends, so I doubt he will have lice or scabies.

[contel3]

I'll try to reserve judgement on him being homeless. Life can be brutal.

You have to be aware though that given the issues he's been experiencing if you stick around....life is going to be rough for you. Like very rough. 

Edited June 4, 2020 by contel3

[OatsAndHall]

Whenever I started dating a woman with "issues" I always asked myself if I was willing to take on those issues as we went along. Because, that's the reality; it feels like their "baggage" at this point but some will eventually come to be your "baggage" later on. Nine times out of ten, my answer was a hard "NO"; I don't want to add drama to my life. I dated a woman who had a great job, was stable and pleasant enough but she let it slip that her ex is a cop who ran off her boyfriends and her teenage daughter was a nightmare. I called it off with her because, eventually, those two issues were probably going to impact me in some way. And, I would rather be home alone, playing video games and watching GoT reruns than deal with that.

[Art_Critic]

IMO, after being married to a woman (my first marriage, 5 years) who was diagnosed with BPD I can tell you that they are very sexual, very fun to be around, can be very into you and put you on a pedestal and then they can be very scary and alter your life like no other... in a flash you don't know what hit you but then they keep you up all night with great sex and you are all about that, then bam..something crazy happens again and you are so close to the situation you have no idea how sucked into the chaos you are that it all looks normal to you.

It took me getting away from her till I realized that kind of turmoil my life had actually become, it was totally focused and centered on her and her chaos.

BTW, self harm is also a trait of BPD, and that can take many forms, such as financial, spending, cutting.. most people think of self harm as cutting but him being homeless may also be part of his self harm.

I'm not going to tell you what to do but man at least he was honest with you so you should know that your life is about to get turned upside down unless you don't engage.

There is a wonderful book out there called "Stop Walking on Eggshells: Taking Your Life Back When Someone You Care About Has Borderline Personality Disorder" I would suggest reading it if you are going to go into this relationship, the first time I read it I cried, as I was reading my life in that book, almost literally.

 

 

 

 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Art_Critic

[simpycurious]

It is admirable to want to FIX/HELP someone and I do believe EVERYONE deserves to be loved and treated with dignity.  Attraction is a very difficult piece of the equation to qualify and is so unique to each individual.  So, if the OP is truly INTO THIS GUY who's to question her reasoning?  Does it look like a potential disaster...........YES.  

Edited June 4, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[Ellener]

1 hour ago, contel3 said:

I'll try to reserve judgement on him being homeless. Life can be brutal.

It can, a sequence of unfortunate events...I almost found myself homeless a few weeks ago just when the pandemic first broke and no one knew how bad it was going to be...fortunately my mental health is intact these days. I stayed calm and have some non-judgmental empathetic friends or 'there but for the grace of god go I'...

 

 

[Art_Critic]

4 minutes ago, simpycurious said:

 who's to question her reasoning?

We aren't questioning her reasoning, but she did post a thread about it looking for perspectives other than her own.

 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Art_Critic

[Redhead14]

44 minutes ago, elaine567 said:

He is not actually living on the streets or mixing with other homeless people.
He has a car and is sofa surfing with friends, so I doubt he will have lice or scabies.

We really don't know where he is hanging or with whom with in between "bounces".  Homeless people don't have good hygiene practices in general and he isn't "well" on top of that, so err on side of caution.  The friends aren't being very safety-minded either with Covid. 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Redhead14

[anika99]

As someone who was in a long term relationship with a man who had BPD I can assure you that you are better off not dating this man. Yes BPD people lack a core identity which means they are very good at adopting the identity of the person they are focused on which is why people are attracted to them, because they are so good at mirroring people, because they can so easily makes themselves into who we want them to be. When I met my BPD man (had no idea what BPD was or that he was BPD at that time) I thought I had met the most brilliant, sensitive caring man on the planet, I thought perhaps soul mates were real because I felt a connection with him that I had never experienced before. Over time by talking to him, his exes. other women who would openly pursue him, I came to realize that he made most women feel the way I felt. Even men could be charmed by him in a non-sexual way. He just had an innate ability to hone in on a person and make them feel special and he could easily talk sincerely and passionately about any subject. If you told him you wanted to fly to moon he would happily discuss that with you for hours as if he also wanted to fly to the moon. Maybe that wouldn't be so bad but while people with BPD can be intellectually very gifted, they are children emotionally, which is also charming when they are a happy child but when they are unhappy it becomes hell on earth for their intimate partner. They are needy, demanding, insecure, mentally abusive and sometimes even physically abusive. They can engage in crazy making behavior that will send you over the edge and have you seeking out therapy for yourself. They sabotage themselves and others, often self harming or engaging in reckless behaviors and addictions. Some people with BPD can have somewhat normal healthy romantic relationships but only after several years of therapy, sometimes meds and lots of hard work on their part. Since the man you are talking about is homeless and alcoholic he is clearly not working on his issues. 

Edited June 4, 2020 by anika99

[Fox Sake]

15 hours ago, Cookiesandough said:

I know I said I wouldn't date again or make a thread again...But I feel like it is noteworthy to say this.

 

I had a date this evening with this guy who made me think for the first time I could actually fall for someone. There are just a couple problems.

First issue is that he is homeless. I don't care. My whole life I've dated guys with homes.  I have never been impressed by a single one of them.

The only problem with that is that we really don't have very many places to go. I am living back with my folks while I finish my program (which he knows).He is living out of his car and bouncing from friend house to friend house at the moment. Our date was at the park. The logistics of dating homeless person are complicated. 

 

His mind has a depth I just don't witness in many people. There are very few concepts I feel like I can talk to with my dates and have them be as interested in them as I am. This guy and I were having gut-level conversations like we'd known each other years.. He was so open, honest, vulnerable in a way most people aren't. Most people are fake af on a first date. Don't know his age, but he looks to be early 30s max. My ex was a temp bassist for him 3 years ago.Years ago, they were playing a lot of shows and I would go to some (that's how we met and we reconnected on FB). His undergrad is in theatre. He is divorced officially since last September. He has been struggling bad due to some things but refuses to move back into his parents home on principle. He doesn't like to go too long without drinking. Probably the most notable thing is He has borderline personality disorder. Supposedly that means doesn't have a stable indentity. He explained that his his perception of himself was a direct result of how he perceived OTHERS perceived him. 

He makes me feel something in a way I never felt before. I am physically attracted to him, but always the feeling I just want to cuddle him and be there for him as a friend. But I  The more he spoke, the. more attractive he became. 

 

One other thing. Though he did tell me he found me physically attractive, he didn't make any physical moves, even when we went back to cars. By moves Im including those stares that make you feel the sexual tension. There was just 0.  I've been learning not to take this as a bad thing and maybe he didn't see it as the right time.  

 

Our date got broken up by the police (just the park was closing) but he did message me he wants to see me again. I think one more date definitely wouldn't hurt. Especially since technically we're still only friends at this point. I guess I'm a little afraid that if this really is the first time I fall for someone and he has all these issues he is battling,  I might get hurt. But I am open to (and actually might prefer) something more casual. So I feel like it should be okay as long as my parents never find out. But then another part isn't really sure he even likes me that much.   Any thoughts on this?

 

Wow cookies. Quite a situation you got there. Bless your heart. 
 

I’ll play devils advocate but only cos I want you to be happy. 
If you really like this guy and feel that chemistry then I say go for it. But only if you think you’re strong enough to deal with someone with BPD. They can be extremely hurtful sometimes in the things they say when they have a bad day and sometimes it is IMPOSSIBLE to get through. 
A good friend of mine did that for 6 years and it was quite distressing to be around sometimes. I also know people currently who suffer from it and struggle to maintain relationships. 
 

I do worry tho that you feel a bit sorry for him,  and that’s causing some confusion somewhere.  As you said-  the more he told you, the more you liked him. Do you like fixing guys or a challenge? 

Do you think you have a tendency of going for the wrong people?
I only say that because you say this is the first time you think you’ve felt like this. There are plenty of folk out there who can communicate their deepest thoughts and put themselves in a position to understand someone. That’s maybe what you’re after, not someone with the darkest thoughts all the time? 
it’s really difficult to find the whole package tho....
 

You seem equally as much an intellect as a very caring , genuine and helpful person. So I would say the feeling like you had known each other years, Is because you have, essentially. Maybe It was because he felt comfortable enough to open up to you that you saw him in a different light? 
 

I know after spending any reasonable amount of time here, how refreshing it would be , to be able to have unbiased LS level conversations , in the real world with people who we found attractive. That’s the goal right? 
 

I definitely think you can do better, but if you think you can handle it then why not try ... bear in mind that if you date him, you also date all of his issues and insecurities too. You won’t be able to fix him. 
If he’s homeless and not in a position to take care of himself and sort himself out, I fail to see how someone in that position can make a relationship work without you feeling like the support network 5/7 days. He needs to be in a better place I think before anything happens, or you’ll be stuck and feel trapped after a few months because he’s got no one else to rely on or open to. Maybe friends is the best way , only you really know tho. 
 

Sorry In the crappy reply , I just got a mate round so I’ll reply properly later on when it’s not rude  for me to do so. Hugsx
 

[Redhead14]

The homelessness is actually just a secondary concern, it's the paranoia and it's cause on top of the severe alcoholism that seems to be apparent.  The paranoia is actually more scary overall.  Paranoia is not just part of BPD, it may be the result of schizophrenia.  Has he been officially diagnosed or is he diagnosing himself?  If the OP takes on a relationship with this guy, she could be in for a very tough road that will ultimately affect her in very significant ways.  If he is BPD, like I said earlier, the the guy she went on the date with is not really the guy she will come to know as time goes by. 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Redhead14

[Miss Spider]

Thank you all so much. This is why I love you guys!!! You really do care about people who need advice and you know what you're saying. BEST advice on the internet.

He contacted me today saying he is free today until he is going to crash and catch up at another friends house tonight. He goes from friend to friend so he does not wear out his welcome. With all the comments I have decided with certainty that I cannot continue with this person as more than a friend. I do not have the resources to help him and I do not want to be used either.

  It is hard, because I think I am confusing desire with compassion. I usually run from people like this, but for  the first time I can understand firsthand when I've heard some women say they "want to fix him"  I do see so much potential there. He is very intelligent.  And there is a very Bukowski, free spirit , wanderer vibe there that is very romantic...

So I decided to write to him " The depth and breadth of your knowledge and insight is astounding. I am so lucky I met and spent time with someone like you.  " Not answering requests to meet up. I will say that I will be friends with him if that is what he needs.

I appreciate you guys.

Edited June 4, 2020 by Cookiesandough

[Miss Spider]

Oh and I wanted to add for those who are concerned (thank you), social distancing guidelines in my state/county have eased and people are coming into contact with people again. Bars and restaurants open, and clubs opening in a week. But pls still check where you are and do what feels safe for you

Edited June 4, 2020 by Cookiesandough

[Redhead14]

2 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said:

Oh and I wanted to add for those who are concerned, social distancing guidelines is my state/county have eased and people are regularly meeting with people again. But pls still check where you are.

That doesn't mean that you should let your guard down.  There is a good chance that the virus will upsurge and especially now since there have been protests and riots and lots of people ignoring guidelines anyway.  In my opinion, people should sit back a bit and observe what happens over the next couple of weeks or so before blindly following the herd.  Let them test the waters for you.

[simpycurious]

Nobody should ever BE SORRY for wanting to help another person.  I fully recognize that some situations SCREAM don't get involved but I have given and helped people that I knew maybe I shouldn't.  It's HARD for your heart to sometimes convince your brain as to what the best course of action is.  

[SumGuy]

31 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said:

.  And there is a very Bukowski, free spirit , wanderer vibe there that is very romantic...

Indeed, but you really have to be down for that ride...from zoo to zoo, town to town, keepin’ truckin’ ...some love it...even then it is much more romantic from the outside than inside.  

[simpycurious]

2 hours ago, SumGuy said:

Indeed, but you really have to be down for that ride...from zoo to zoo, town to town, keepin’ truckin’ ...some love it...even then it is much more romantic from the outside than inside.  

You never know what MIGHT bring someone happiness.......a free bird type lifestyle?  Who knows................

Edited June 4, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
off topic

[preraph]

Cookies, no, ma'am!  This guy is a mess and probably a violent mess.  They never admit it.  They always make it sound like a false accusation.  He's homeless and mentally ill and an alcoholic.  You are young and gorgeous and smart.  Does he remind you of anyone from your childhood that makes you want to cuddle him and brings out your empathy?  Because really, please no.