contel3 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 I find this post fascinating. The discourse would be so different if the genders were reversed..... She was probably feeling lonely and horny. Once she got her fix she realised she's not actually attracted to OP that much. Especially the part where you mention she had to drink every time before sex seems like a red flag. If she was really feeling it she wouldn't have to get drunk. 3
poppyfields Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 4 hours ago, miranda561 said: You're telling him in other words to be a douchebag like most men. Which only women with no self respect like to go for Since when is being a man with high self confidence and self esteem a "d-bag"? I haven't encountered that, quite the opposite. Since apparently you have, it appears your picker needs some fine tuning. Xd And what the hell is an "alpha male" anyway? These terms get thrown around and I'm at a loss as to what they mean. To me, the best men are a combo of both - alpha and beta. Strong, confident, take no shyt, but also knows how to be soft and vulnerable. Is there a term for that? P.S. I can feel a "HAHA" or "shocked" emoji coming from Miranda, or "sad." Have at it, I'm ready! Edited June 3, 2020 by poppyfields 1 1 1 1
simpycurious Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) The term is "sensitive alpha".............at least that's what I have heard. I think men can definitely be both. There is a vast difference between TRUE confidence and being down right conceited. I think "d-bag" is a little extreme especially in that context. Edited June 3, 2020 by a LoveShack.org Moderator 1
elaine567 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 9 hours ago, Grey40 said: But I kindof felt like I couldn't be myself around her, and it made things awkward which untimely led to her questioning everything. I was in a perpetual state of "does she actually like me? and is she just messing around with these mean comments?" Her humor was very sarcastic but it was tough to tell how she was feeling, and I hate that. She was very hot and cold....would facetime me daily for like an hour or so, or call me on the phone and text me everyday....but then in person kind of criticized everything about me. Red flags everywhere. 1
Miss Spider Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, contel3 said: I find this post fascinating. The discourse would be so different if the genders were reversed..... She was probably feeling lonely and horny. Once she got her fix she realised she's not actually attracted to OP that much. Especially the part where you mention she had to drink every time before sex seems like a red flag. If she was really feeling it she wouldn't have to get drunk. agree... When a woman uses a man for sex and dumps him: she's a victim " she's confused, self esteem issues, stuck on someone else, likes him but playing some kind of game when she wants him to fight for her(?????)" When a man uses a woman for sex and dumps her - Torch the monster lol Edited June 3, 2020 by Cookiesandough 2
simpycurious Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 13 minutes ago, poppyfields said: @simpycurious, I was ready for yours too! lol Well, I am at least consistent if nothing else...........it was a good post. Agreed ^^^ the dude is now a scoundrel void of common decency or a moral compass. Edited June 3, 2020 by simpycurious 2
poppyfields Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 39 minutes ago, simpycurious said: I think "d-bag" is a little extreme especially in that context. Agree, and I'm starting to agree with what cookies said a couple of days ago -- that women (some) don't seem to think very highly of men. I mean comments such as "you're telling him to be a d-bag like most men"? Like most men? Really? SMH Edited June 3, 2020 by poppyfields 2
stillafool Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 14 minutes ago, poppyfields said: -- that women (some) don't seem to think very highly of men. But yet they are dying to get one. 1
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 5 hours ago, rjc149 said: The "mission" refers to a man's greater purpose and ambition in life. His career, studies, overall goals and objectives that he wants to accomplish. The concept is that when he places more importance on the woman he's dating than his own life, it's unattractive. As we've established on other threads, there are men who will be unattractive to a certain woman regardless of what he does because the cosmic vibez and feelz are just not jiving, and there are women who require their asses to be kissed by their men at all times. Generally speaking, if the OP had more focus on his own ambitions than on this girl, he could move past this more easily, and that abundance mindset of "I'm a high-value guy who can get another girl" will come through and make him more attractive to women in general, which will allow him to meet a new girl and move past this girl more quickly, which will give him an abundance mindset -- sort of like a circle. Look at it like the circle of life. Or something. Oh, I see what you're talking about. This is something everyone needs, a purpose. For so many reasons. People may fail us, a lot may fail us but if we know where we're going we have that. This makes sense.
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 5 hours ago, miranda561 said: You're telling him in other words to be a douchebag like most men. Which only women with no self respect like to go for I think both sexes protect ourselves from hurt while at the same time going for what we want, and these things both make sense. The same advice would go for a woman - don't keep calling this guy, don't beg him, I mean, what's the difference, really? The reasoning might be different but only slightly. I mean I see this usually touted as how to make the man seem more interesting, desirable, etc. but there's also a flip side to that coin that has NOTHING to do with the woman, IMO. (Or the man if situations were reversed.) That side is: when someone rejects you, continuing to chase and continuing to open your heart and just having that smacked down again with chilliness and platitiudes - it's not you, it's me; or, you're such a great guy, you'd make such a great catch for some great woman one day; or, oh, that was just so nice of you (then radio silence) - hurts more. Way way way way way more. But even worse than that, it makes you feel "less than," unwanted....that's a bad place to be in. Feeling negative toward yourself, feeling unlovable, like some kicked to the curb jerk, affects all parts of your life. Your friends. It can even affect your job. Low self-esteem is a big problem, it hurts, and basically asking to keep being rejected can definitely encourage it developing. This is why I asked the OP why he chose a woman he knew didn't think he was good enough. He said he didn't...but then immediately added that from the start he felt he had to work so hard to be enough for her. I wonder whether this has happened before, and whether feeling "less than" is what's making him subconsciously choose women who will reinforce that. Women do this too - and it is a BAD cycle to be in. It never gets better. It only keeps getting worse. For the OP's own sense of self and worth he needs to let this woman go. It hurts like hell now but continuing to chase would not only keep things feeling awful, it would eat away at his self esteem. Whereas having a life, having interests, wanting a relationship *if and when* it comes along but not "needing" it, are things we should all be doing, shouldn't we? Both single and coupled. We should keep who we are because if all else fails us, we still have ourselves. For a single person this is even stronger, because if you don't really have your own self-esteem, our love of yourself before some other person, what do you have left when that person pulls the plug? It's an awful place to be in and it makes you feel really low. I don't think guys are d-bags, I think they want something like women want something, and they don't want something else - to be hurt or used. Just like women. JMO. I haven't read the rest of the posts since last night...I'll go back now...it looked kinda scary so I thought I'd post my thoughts before going into the trenches, LOL... Edited June 3, 2020 by CaliforniaGirl
Author Grey40 Posted June 3, 2020 Author Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) In regards to the “alpha” discussion, it’s really just confidence. But look, some women just are attracted to specific types of guys more than others. I’ve met women who absolutely hate facial hair on any men, even celebrities. And I’ve met women who really aren’t attracted to the pretty boy types, only the really rugged, rough edgy dudes. To me there was no doubt whatsoever that she was initially really physically attracted to me. But that was very short-lived. My personality in person probably wasn’t as engaging and fun as it was over the phone. I have to work on being more congruent and getting out of head when in person. I was much more quiet and less outgoing when I hung out with her in person..conversation seem sort of difficult...but that’s on her too for not keeping it rolling also. Once she realized that aspect was lacking she started to lose attraction. unfortunately she decided to pull the plug instead of trying to talk to me or communicate to me about what was bothering her. If she ended it simply because I was too skinny or not “rugged” enough that seems too superficial a reason. She knew what I looked like for 2 months and multiple times in person. So that seems like a cop out Edited June 3, 2020 by Grey40 1
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 1 minute ago, Grey40 said: In regards to the “alpha” discussion, it’s really just confidence. But look, some women just are attracted to specific types of guys more than others. I’ve met women who absolutely hate facial hair on any men, even celebrities. And I’ve met women who really aren’t attracted to the pretty boy types, only the really rugged, rough edgy dudes. To me there was no doubt whatsoever that she was initially really physically attracted to me. But that was very short-lived. My personality in person probably wasn’t as engaging and fun as it was over the phone. I have to work on being more congruent and getting out of head when in person. I was much more quiet and less outgoing when I hung out with her in person..conversation seem sort of difficult...but that’s on her too for not keeping it rolling also. Once she realized that aspect was lacking she started to lose attraction. I always joke about the alpha thing because it's so exaggerated when it's part of PUA culture. And because when guys try to fake it it's just...yikes. But most women do want a man who's confident. You don't have to be standing on a mountaintop with your muscles ripping everywhere, legs spread to allow the pheromones to permeate while women crawl toward you in order to be confident. (Although that visual is making me laugh. Sometimes, I crack me up.) You DON'T have to be a d*ckweed to have confidence, or follow some script, but being confident is big. And I have seen many a skinny nerd have loads of confidence, be 100% happy with himself, think the rest of the world is nuts, and yes, get what he wants. The career he wants. The girlfriend or wife he wants. The family if that's what he wants. Keep your confidence and ditch that this girl's "type" is the right one. I agree with one thing the poster I quoted above said. That type of guy - the total POS - isn't what "most" women want. It's what crazy women with no self-esteem who will do you, all the while subtly negging you, then one day up and dump you (probably because Slade or Billy Jo Jim Bob or whomever came to her trailer with a peace offering of almost a sixer of beer). You aren't a total A-hole, ergo you aren't going to attract (for long) and keep (at all) a woman who wants to be hurt emotionally all the time by a friggin' bully. Let's put that check mark in your plus column, okay? 1
Author Grey40 Posted June 3, 2020 Author Posted June 3, 2020 And like Many have said in here, “no spark” could literally mean anything..and in some cases, is just the nicest and easiest excuse to end things. She’s not going to tell me she met another guy who’s hotter, or hurt my feelings by telling the truth. So it either means she didn’t feel a deep connection, or it means a s***load of other things that she won’t actually tell me anyway. 1
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 15 hours ago, rjc149 said: You're certainly entitled to give that advice. But since he's come here seeking closure and answers, I'm trying to offer him an alternative perspective on what happened, and instead of telling him he's perfect just the way he is and giving him a trophy just for trying, maybe trying to tell him where he can improve his confidence and emotional self-reliance. I can not believe I'm agreeing with rj twice - I think the only additional signs that are missing in this scenario are fires, floods, plagues and four horsemen, with pigs flying all around their heads - but here goes. A little bit back on this thread I asked the OP why *he chose* to be with, and pursue someone whom he describes from the beginning as being "off" enough, and critical enough to have made him feel uncomfortable this entire time. I do not think the OP is being himself in this regard. I think there is something going on there...when people deliberately go after others who make them feel awful there's some problem. Just IMO, I mean. I think he needs to fix whatever that is, because usually what causes it is low self-esteem (....she said, stroking her beard and stealing Freud's accent). Idealizing someone who thinks you're really not that great means you too think you're really not that great, at least on some level. It's just a "thing." You're attracted to someone you admire, and if you admire people who think you're dog doo, well...there's something to be fixed there. I'm not saying OP has done this his entire life, who knows, this might be a one-off but it is also something he pursued, and continued to pursue, and now misses. A woman who literally got down to insulting his lack of facial hair and looks in general, among other things. I do think that's something to be fixed, chirked up, self-esteem to be boosted. Because otherwise, even if this never happened to the OP before, it definitely will again. That will be $275 and I do take Paypal. 1
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 2 hours ago, poppyfields said: Since when is being a man with high self confidence and self esteem a "d-bag"? I haven't encountered that, quite the opposite. Since apparently you have, it appears your picker needs some fine tuning. Xd And what the hell is an "alpha male" anyway? These terms get thrown around and I'm at a loss as to what they mean. To me, the best men are a combo of both - alpha and beta. Strong, confident, take no shyt, but also knows how to be soft and vulnerable. Is there a term for that? P.S. I can feel a "HAHA" or "shocked" emoji coming from Miranda, or "sad." Have at it, I'm ready! Okay...re: alpha male, I think it's because sometimes (sometimes) around here, the advice given is pretty much obviously directly out of the PUA handbook, right down to the lingo...escalating...social value...all that stuff. So I do get why people are saying "alpha male." Let's not be coy here. However, my advice for this particular guy is that he seems to have low self-esteem. You don't need to practice PUA to know that people with low self-esteem tend to make really bad choices and have bad relationships. That's a thing. And this guy is hurting. JMO.
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 HA ha ha ha ha...anybody else getting ads for chaw and for "beard balm" now because of adding to this discussion? Oh internet, you funny dawg. Menopausal or not, I don't need beard balm. Yet. Maybe I'll keep it in mind for the future. Sorry, carry on. I'm glad I didn't talk about...well, never mind. I'm not going to bring up anything else I don't want ads on, LOL!
Author Grey40 Posted June 3, 2020 Author Posted June 3, 2020 I don’t have low self-esteem and she didn’t start acting this way until we started hanging out in person the 2nd or 3rd time. She always was complimenting me, supporting what I do, bragging about me to friends and in general seemed really into it. All women get like this when they lose attraction for the guy, the say things to spite and to hopefully make him leave the relationship so they don’t have to do it. slowly I started to act more insecure which she picked up on and started to amplify that by doing things and saying things to I guess see how deep the insecurities go or because she wants me to feel as uncomfortable as her. Essentially she just lost attraction for me, and I’ll never know the exact reason, all I can try to do is try to be more comfortable in person with women I like. 1
Author Grey40 Posted June 3, 2020 Author Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) It also didn’t help my insecurity that she has all these make orbiters she gives attention to a lot, and attention that frankly isn’t normal. FaceTiming them, flirty discussions etc. I don’t think many men would feel totally secure if the girl they’re seeing is doing that stuff pretty blatantly. I think I would be much more secure in a relationship where the women has much stronger boundaries with males. Edited June 3, 2020 by Grey40
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 2 minutes ago, Grey40 said: I don’t have low self-esteem and she didn’t start acting this way until we started hanging out in person the 2nd or 3rd time. She always was complimenting me, supporting what I do, bragging about me to friends and in general seemed really into it. All women get like this when they lose attraction for the guy, the say things to spite and to hopefully make him leave the relationship so they don’t have to do it. slowly I started to act more insecure which she picked up on and started to amplify that by doing things and saying things to I guess see how deep the insecurities go or because she wants me to feel as uncomfortable as her. Essentially she just lost attraction for me, and I’ll never know the exact reason, all I can try to do is try to be more comfortable in person with women I like. I'm sorry, Grey...from what you're describing...this is a place you may not be wanting to go. By the second or third date you already knew she wasn't all in? That IS right away. You then turn this around ^ (above) to: it's what you said and did...which translates to: next time, you'll pick a woman who thinks you're lesser, but you'll just act differently. I think you need to not go there. It's not that simple...IMO. I mean you don't have to listen to me. But do listen to yourself. You're "training" yourself in how to keep the attraction of a woman who likes other men more than you and who doesn't really think you're attractive. I do agree with: be more comfortable with women you like. But comfortable with yourself. Sure, there's such a thing as too clingy, too aggressive and being a turnoff. But "slowly (you) became more insecure..." Yes, because ****she was telling and showing you that you weren't good enough****. I won't say it again because now I'm just being a broken record and a pain, but these signs, and you pursuing anyway is the probably cause of the failure of this relationship. She already wasn't into you. You pushed it. She wasn't going to be more into you if you were just more secure with yourself. She TOLD you what she wants. She doesn't just want a confident guy. She wants a complete A-hole. And you wanted someone who wants a complete A-hole. People who love themselves don't want people who think they're lesser, not good enough, not attractive enough. They toss such people aside. Oh well. I do wish you luck because you sound like a good guy.
Author Grey40 Posted June 3, 2020 Author Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) 17 minutes ago, CaliforniaGirl said: I'm sorry, Grey...from what you're describing...this is a place you may not be wanting to go. By the second or third date you already knew she wasn't all in? That IS right away. You then turn this around ^ (above) to: it's what you said and did...which translates to: next time, you'll pick a woman who thinks you're lesser, but you'll just act differently. I think you need to not go there. It's not that simple...IMO. I mean you don't have to listen to me. But do listen to yourself. You're "training" yourself in how to keep the attraction of a woman who likes other men more than you and who doesn't really think you're attractive. I do agree with: be more comfortable with women you like. But comfortable with yourself. Sure, there's such a thing as too clingy, too aggressive and being a turnoff. But "slowly (you) became more insecure..." Yes, because ****she was telling and showing you that you weren't good enough****. I won't say it again because now I'm just being a broken record and a pain, but these signs, and you pursuing anyway is the probably cause of the failure of this relationship. She already wasn't into you. You pushed it. She wasn't going to be more into you if you were just more secure with yourself. She TOLD you what she wants. She doesn't just want a confident guy. She wants a complete A-hole. And you wanted someone who wants a complete A-hole. People who love themselves don't want people who think they're lesser, not good enough, not attractive enough. They toss such people aside. Oh well. I do wish you luck because you sound like a good guy. Thanks I appreciate your responses in here. The problem was that she was giving mixed signals which is why when I felt things were”off” and that she wasn’t into it, she would FaceTime me and tell me about Her day, ask about mine, tell me that she talked to her mom about me etc. and talk about future plans together, things we could do etc. so it made me think...”ok maybe I’m just over analyzing here, maybe she is actually into it”. Something happened that changed her behavior, something drastic like an old flame returning or her having hots for someone new. This has happened to me before, and that time it was a new guy that was reason. But I guess the fact that she’s even looking or considering other options shows that she was already out of attraction with me. Edited June 3, 2020 by Grey40 1
Author Grey40 Posted June 3, 2020 Author Posted June 3, 2020 (edited) My last ex was very similar in that she was a male user as well...jumping from guy to guy on a whim as soon as she got bored, or noticed that she didn’t want to be with them for the long term. As soon as she loses attraction she starts openly looking and seeking new options, which is why she always has a long list of dudes she’s talking to, to pull from. Some are there just for ego boosting, some for friend zone, some for booty call and some that if they became single again she’d want to date. They say they want one guy, but in reality they’ll never be satisfied with that until they get tired of the chase. I think I need a woman who doesn’t need that crazy amount of male attention, or at least someone that doesn’t actively talk to guys thinking they can be “just friends”. After dating now two women in a row like this, I need to be quicker at weeding these women out. Edited June 3, 2020 by Grey40
rjc149 Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 2 hours ago, poppyfields said: To me, the best men are a combo of both - alpha and beta. Strong, confident, take no shyt, but also knows how to be soft and vulnerable. Is there a term for that? Yes, the term is “optimal male.” 1
CaliforniaGirl Posted June 3, 2020 Posted June 3, 2020 9 minutes ago, Grey40 said: My last ex was very similar in that she was a male user as well...jumping from guy to guy on a whim as soon as she got bored, or noticed that she didn’t want to be with them for the long term. As soon as she loses attraction she starts openly looking and seeking new options, which is why she always has a long list of dudes she’s talking to, to pull from. Some are there just for ego boosting, some for friend zone, some for booty call and some that if they became single again she’d want to date. They say they want one guy, but in reality they’ll never be satisfied with that until they get tired of the chase. I think I need a woman who doesn’t need that crazy amount of male attention, or at least someone that doesn’t actively talk to guys thinking they can be “just friends”. After dating now two women in a row like this, I need to be quicker at weeding these women out. I think what you're seeing here is your pattern. Yes, you'll probably be happier with a woman who isn't like these women, but not definitely, because if that's what's attracting you...well...you need to look into that... There's a pattern. You want girls who make you feel really unstable, really insecure in their love.
Author Grey40 Posted June 3, 2020 Author Posted June 3, 2020 Just now, CaliforniaGirl said: I think what you're seeing here is your pattern. Yes, you'll probably be happier with a woman who isn't like these women, but not definitely, because if that's what's attracting you...well...you need to look into that... There's a pattern. You want girls who make you feel really unstable, really insecure in their love. What’s your solution then?
Recommended Posts