JimmyNorth Posted May 29, 2020 Posted May 29, 2020 10 minutes ago, Husbandssecret said: I was reading your posts the other day! The similarities are crazy. Especially with the constant goalpost moving. He was/is so good at that. At one point he told me he could be separated by the end of April and divorced by June. Now he says he thinks he can be divorced by July 15th. Not sure why that date specifically but I knew what was going to happen. His kids bday is the following week so I knew all too well he was likely going to use that as a reason why he couldn’t file July 15th etc. you know the story. Yes it’s the same story! When they first “separated” things felt off, I didn’t think she moved out. I know it’s not usual for the woman to move out but she couldn’t afford the house payments so it made more sense for him to take over the house and for her to start over. I hate jumping to conclusions that he’s lying based on the generalizations that the men should move out and all those assumptions. What was off to me was that he was weird about going in the master bedroom. Since that one event happened, we have been sleeping in the master bedroom (prior to me ending things). What bothered me most about it was he claimed he has spent the last 4 years sleeping in the guest bedroom but then his stuff was in the master bedroom. I was more thinking about the fact that he was likely lying to me about that setup. There’s a bathroom right next to the guest bedroom so it didn’t make sense to me that he had all his belongings tucked away and at home in the master bedroom. I also snooped a little and his bedside table on the side of the bed he sleeps on has sooo many things on it and in it (books, cuff links, other junk). The master bedroom seemed more lived in than the guest bedroom. He may be lying to you about his wife because he’s probably scared to lose you. I agree that it’s weird how some of us MM’s get used to the double life. I ended up getting sick of the work involved with it. I remember when I was in that situation. I’ll give it to you straight and unfiltered. I was very into my OW and the sex was very powerful. And boy, She knew how to put me to sleep.....BUT... that did not mean my OW was accepting my procrastination or lagging of divorcing and being with her. It was taking a toll. She HATED feeling like an insurance piece or second choice. I was just so blind at the time. The difference here is I really wanted my OW and I hated the thought of her losing faith in me, so I had to step up. Your MM is making you feel as if he wants to possibly save his marriage. Your MM needs to wake up before your GONE FOR GOOD!!! 1
JimmyNorth Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 6 hours ago, Husbandssecret said: Yes agreed!! He needs to stop asking me to hang in there and “prove my love” I was thinking about this statement you said he made. This really reminded me of myself. I actually do remember myself having these thoughts of wanting my OW prove her love for me, which was actually very very ridiculous of me to think that. My OW did EVERYTHING AND ANYTHING I wanted....I mean anything!!! So why did I have this need to “test her love”??? I think what it comes down to is that I DID NOT BELIEVE that I WAS WORTHY OR DESIRABLE. I remember thinking at times “yeah, she would probably do this for any other guy, I’m NOT that special”. So I almost, kind of in a way, self sabotage the relationship as if to see how much she would take or do in order for me to see if I should keep her. EVEN WHEN she was treating me like a absolute king (and she still does to this very day) and was always giving in to what ever I desires, I STILL was comfortable living a double life and did not make any move for an actual divorce for over 3 years. His statement that he made really leads me to believe that he does not have a healthy self esteem. It may seem like he has one, and seems stupid that he may not be as confident, but he may have deep rooted issues about his self worth. Sounds like me. I have no issues with women wanting me and I’ve been told practically all my adult life by woman that they would love to have me, whether it was for love or for sex. I’m in no way trying to sound shallow, but many women think I’m good looking and I “appear” to be confident...BUT, I have this issue with my own self worth and my self image. It truly boggled my OW mind on how I could even think that way. When you get MM like this, it can truly be a chore to be with some guy that has this type of issue. 2
Allupinnit Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 Right! On the same mattress! Are the family photos still up with her in them too?
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 30, 2020 Author Posted May 30, 2020 16 hours ago, LilKatKat said: Did you check out if her stuff was in the other night table, the dressers, the closet? That's more telling. He could easily say he "moved" back in. I'm amazed how many seemingly credible reasons they can come up with on the spot. I was the love of his life, never felt so strongly about anyone before, never the connection blah, blah blah. Funny how like yours he was able to just let you walk away. Let that sink in. As my friend said to me when he came back in January "run, run for your life and never look back". Maybe you'll do a better job than I did. Her stuff is all gone, the closets are empty and so are the dressers she used. There’s nothing in the other bedside table. He called me and sent me texts a bunch last night begging for me to not give up on him. He used his old “we do things better together” and “we can reach our goal without having to be apart, creating damage”. Like I said, he can’t bear to deal with this on his own. He’s so desperate to have my aid that he can’t see what it’s doing to me or how selfish it is. Also funny enough this is his best connection, he’s never felt like this before, I’m the love of his life. You get it 1
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 30, 2020 Author Posted May 30, 2020 14 minutes ago, Allupinnit said: Right! On the same mattress! Are the family photos still up with her in them too? Not the same bed or mattress. He got new ones after she moved out. The family pics are still up though. I had nightmares the whole night when sleeping in that room, so it was clearly uncomfortable for me. 2
Allupinnit Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 Just now, Husbandssecret said: Not the same bed or mattress. He got new ones after she moved out. The family pics are still up though. I had nightmares the whole night when sleeping in that room, so it was clearly uncomfortable for me. Girl you are so much better than her leftovers! 2
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 30, 2020 Author Posted May 30, 2020 12 hours ago, JimmyNorth said: I was thinking about this statement you said he made. This really reminded me of myself. I actually do remember myself having these thoughts of wanting my OW prove her love for me, which was actually very very ridiculous of me to think that. My OW did EVERYTHING AND ANYTHING I wanted....I mean anything!!! So why did I have this need to “test her love”??? I think what it comes down to is that I DID NOT BELIEVE that I WAS WORTHY OR DESIRABLE. I remember thinking at times “yeah, she would probably do this for any other guy, I’m NOT that special”. So I almost, kind of in a way, self sabotage the relationship as if to see how much she would take or do in order for me to see if I should keep her. EVEN WHEN she was treating me like a absolute king (and she still does to this very day) and was always giving in to what ever I desires, I STILL was comfortable living a double life and did not make any move for an actual divorce for over 3 years. His statement that he made really leads me to believe that he does not have a healthy self esteem. It may seem like he has one, and seems stupid that he may not be as confident, but he may have deep rooted issues about his self worth. Sounds like me. I have no issues with women wanting me and I’ve been told practically all my adult life by woman that they would love to have me, whether it was for love or for sex. I’m in no way trying to sound shallow, but many women think I’m good looking and I “appear” to be confident...BUT, I have this issue with my own self worth and my self image. It truly boggled my OW mind on how I could even think that way. When you get MM like this, it can truly be a chore to be with some guy that has this type of issue. I think you’re spot on!! He’s someone who shouldn’t be insecure but has deeply rooted insecurities. He will never openly admit it either because he wouldn’t dare admit weakness. I don’t think he intends to, but I agree that this type of person makes a relationship exhausting. It’s constantly feeling like I’m not doing enough while at the same time showering him with love and treating him perfectly.
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 30, 2020 Author Posted May 30, 2020 16 hours ago, JimmyNorth said: He may be lying to you about his wife because he’s probably scared to lose you. I agree that it’s weird how some of us MM’s get used to the double life. I ended up getting sick of the work involved with it. I remember when I was in that situation. I’ll give it to you straight and unfiltered. I was very into my OW and the sex was very powerful. And boy, She knew how to put me to sleep.....BUT... that did not mean my OW was accepting my procrastination or lagging of divorcing and being with her. It was taking a toll. She HATED feeling like an insurance piece or second choice. I was just so blind at the time. The difference here is I really wanted my OW and I hated the thought of her losing faith in me, so I had to step up. Your MM is making you feel as if he wants to possibly save his marriage. Your MM needs to wake up before your GONE FOR GOOD!!! He has days where it seems like he understands his lack of drive to move this forward has created a rift between us. But then other days he says I’m “going down the rabbit hole” which is what he has termed me trying to tell him this isn’t working the way we are doing things. I think he has a lot of internal conflict. He’s gotten used to the double life living and no matter how hard it is, it’s somehow easier than just being honest and moving things forward for us.
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 30, 2020 Author Posted May 30, 2020 16 hours ago, BaileyB said: He does sound like a child. He needs you to hold his hand and offer reassurance while he divorces his wife. And, he has been quite literally throwing a tantrum when you don’t... It would not be attractive to me, at all. It’s super unattractive! It’s like he’s saying stick by me now, on my terms, or don’t have this at all. Its very entitled. I’ve never understood how he so easily just expected me to put my head down and keep pushing forward by his side. He’s never once asked how I was doing in the situation, he never once wondered if having the affair for so long was hurting me. All the power was in his hands and only now that I’m leaving he’s chosen to see the light. The frustrating part is that he would be so derogatory when I tried to get him to see before that we needed things to be moved along. He’d cut off the conversation and say I’m going down my rabbit hole. But now he “understands the pain” and he should’ve done it sooner. He “didn’t understand before”.
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 30, 2020 Author Posted May 30, 2020 Also this may come off as materialistic, but he never once got me a gift. My sister got me a pair of ray bans for Christmas and he said “oh no way I was going to get that exact pair for you! Now I can’t get them.” And then didn’t get anything. The only gift I got was just this last month and it was a journal that he wanted us to “write our travel memories in” because I’m huge into traveling.
Allupinnit Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 6 minutes ago, Husbandssecret said: Also this may come off as materialistic, but he never once got me a gift. My sister got me a pair of ray bans for Christmas and he said “oh no way I was going to get that exact pair for you! Now I can’t get them.” And then didn’t get anything. The only gift I got was just this last month and it was a journal that he wanted us to “write our travel memories in” because I’m huge into traveling. Wonder why his wife got sick of him. LOL 2
BaileyB Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 (edited) 35 minutes ago, Husbandssecret said: Not the same bed or mattress. He got new ones after she moved out. The family pics are still up though. I had nightmares the whole night when sleeping in that room, so it was clearly uncomfortable for me. No, no, no, no... I understand the need to keep consistency for the children, but this is exactly why he needs to take time after his divorce. It’s not going to feel good, moving into a home where her hair is still in the drain of the sink. I moved into my boyfriends home, the one he shared with his ex wife. But, she has been out of the home for four years and they lived in the home for less than a year. I think of the home as more of the home in which he has raised his son - I call it their bachelor pad. It’s a fine home, but it’s not my home. Even last night, I made a comment about my house (my old house) and he said “this is your house now.” It is, but it’s not. Which is why we are building a home together. I would never be able to move into another woman’s home so soon after she left. I would be having nightmares too. And I would be fighting the urge to flee... Edited May 30, 2020 by BaileyB 2
BaileyB Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 18 minutes ago, Husbandssecret said: The frustrating part is that he would be so derogatory when I tried to get him to see before that we needed things to be moved along. He’d cut off the conversation and say I’m going down my rabbit hole. But now he “understands the pain” and he should’ve done it sooner. He “didn’t understand before”. Too little, way too late... 1
elaine567 Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 Many people on leaving a marriage need a "bridge". Someone they can rely on to support them through the transition from married to single life. Someone to hold their hand, pat them on the back and say "There there", someone to absorb all their anger and frustration... BUT once they heal and feel better and realise they are "free", then they often dispense with the services of their "bridge"... Be careful. 3
Luna66star Posted May 30, 2020 Posted May 30, 2020 Right on Elaine....very good point! Letting go after a long term relationship involves deep grief and difficulty in being alone to deal with the loss. Granted some look to professional counselors but my experience is that many men are reluctant to seek out this type of support. It's much more comfortable to find a bridge relationship for support - for listening, hand holding, sex, affection and companionship. All you do with a counselor is "talk the talk". While it can be very helpful to self-reflect with a counselor, there is no one there to hug you, hang out with or alleviate the loneliness on a day to day basis. As you point out, when this bridge person has helped them traverse through the various stages of grief, they look for someone else to start over. Unfortunately the bridge person (whose job it was to make them feel better) is left behind. Their compassion and comfort will certainly be remembered. In my experience, a one sided relationship like this will fail. The OP is very likely the bridger for this MM. Being an empath is a wonderful trait. The challenge for us is to be aware of those relationships that draw us into the "rescuer" mode and avoid them at all costs. I got drawn in so many times over the years that the ramifications literally manifested in various forms of medical illnesses. Self-awareness was the key. 2 1
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 31, 2020 Author Posted May 31, 2020 On 5/30/2020 at 10:58 AM, BaileyB said: Too little, way too late... Exactly... He took so long that I have started to see him differently. I’ve started to question his motives. Now he needs to live with the decisions he’s made. He’s ruined an amazing love by being stagnant and not standing by his words.
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 31, 2020 Author Posted May 31, 2020 (edited) On 5/30/2020 at 1:29 PM, Luna66star said: Being an empath is a wonderful trait. The challenge for us is to be aware of those relationships that draw us into the "rescuer" mode and avoid them at all costs. I got drawn in so many times over the years that the ramifications literally manifested in various forms of medical illnesses. Self-awareness was the key. I agree! Being empathetic is a wonderful trait but if we let ourselves become a “rescuer” we can find ourselves in significant pain. As for being the Bridger, I don’t disagree. There’s been many times I’ve wondered to myself if he would have been content seeing his marriage through at least until his kids were out of the house. He’s made comments before that he could have done that before meeting me. It’s almost like I taught him that he’s allowed to be happy and just because he has kids doesn’t mean he has to put that happiness to the side. He often says he doesn’t need to grieve the marriage, that he did that years ago. But it’s completely natural to grieve the end of an almost 20 year marriage. It doesn’t mean he’s still in love. It’s the end of an era. I felt grief when I moved out of my place that I was at for 4 years. I couldn’t imagine ending a marriage of that length of time. Overall, I just wish he was more realistic. He convinces himself that he doesn’t need to grieve the end of his marriage. He has wild dreams for us that are great to talk about but he states them as promises. Ex: “we’re going on a family trip in December.” When I told him that he can’t promise things like that when he’s not even divorced, especially with kids involved, he says he’s not doing anything wrong by daydreaming and setting goals. I think it’s childish and reflects that he has no grasp on reality. That or he purposely misleads me and this is his tactic to keep stringing me along. Maybe I’m just more aware that those kinds of statements are nuts. Edited May 31, 2020 by Husbandssecret
Author Husbandssecret Posted May 31, 2020 Author Posted May 31, 2020 Yesterday was hard. He called me and I answered. We basically hashed out the same conversation we usually do, but this time I told him I needed him to leave me alone. My intention when I ended things wasn’t a goodbye forever, but it felt like that’s where we were yesterday. I refuse to go back to being the OW, and if that means losing him forever then that’s okay with me. It’s just sad. He sounded defeated. I don’t wish that feeling on anyone. I know all too well about regretting mistakes I’ve made and I don’t want him to suffer those feelings of regret. But at the same time, he has the potential to have our relationship back if he divorces her for real and does things the right way. Just having a lot of emotions today-tired, angry, sad, anxious. I woke up today and remembered our conversation yesterday. I had an immediate pit in my stomach. Surpassingly though, I don’t find it hard to not send him a text or reach out to him, so at least I have that. 1
Spainglish Posted May 31, 2020 Posted May 31, 2020 You're doing well. I know it's hard, but if you continue to focus on what you deserve it will start to get easier. He's also going to start realizing that he can't play games any more and he's either going to come through with all his promises or he's going to set you free. Either way, you will finally have closure. Hang in there. 1
BaileyB Posted May 31, 2020 Posted May 31, 2020 (edited) 2 hours ago, Husbandssecret said: Overall, I just wish he was more realistic. He convinces himself that he doesn’t need to grieve the end of his marriage. He has wild dreams for us that are great to talk about but he states them as promises. Ex: “we’re going on a family trip in December.” When I told him that he can’t promise things like that when he’s not even divorced, especially with kids involved, he says he’s not doing anything wrong by daydreaming and setting goals. I think it’s childish and reflects that he has no grasp on reality. Maybe I’m just more aware that those kinds of statements are nuts. I don’t think anybody is travelling anywhere in December with Covid this year, but that’s another matter entirely. I agree with you. My dad was like this after my mom passed away. He couldn’t deal with reality so he created his own happy existence... He wasn’t going to waste time grieving the loss of his wife, he kept telling us to “think positive” and “move on...” The thing was, he would either cry or walk out of the room whenever anyone mentioned her name - so he had the feelings, he just couldn’t allow himself to feel them. I’m not sold that your MM has the feelings... he just seems to do whatever he wants and live in his own reality... Because let’s face it, even if this wasn’t complicated by an extramarital affair it’s totally ridiculous to think about doing a family trip with a new woman six months after he left/divorced their mother. That’s delusional, and it’s unfair to expect the children to accept a new person so soon after their parent’s divorce. He thinks of nobody but himself, and he does seem to have this delusional belief, like he also expects you to move into her home and sleep in her bedroom, and all will be well. It doesn’t work that way... To me, it’s just another HUGE red flag. As you say, these kinds of statements are nuts. Edited May 31, 2020 by BaileyB 3
Author Husbandssecret Posted June 1, 2020 Author Posted June 1, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, S2B said: Best way to gain more power in this relationship ship is to NOT take his calls right now. Stay strong! the one who cares the least has the most power. its normal for the MM to chase when his OW pulls back...he wants you back in your usual position. Hold out knowing you deserve so much better. I usually agree that talking to him isn’t helpful, but last night it was really helpful to answer his call. He’s tried to recreate my memories before and I always just thought maybe I remembered things incorrectly. This might sound dumb but I was actively aware that he was gaslighting me last night. I remember so specifically the events around the death of my father down to what I was doing when I found out. He tried to tell me the time of day that it happened and where I was when it happened (because when I found out he passed I was with MM). He was so adamant that I remembered it wrong. I stood by my memory of those events and told him I’m done for good. When I said that, he backed down and apologized. I was dumbfounded. There’s many times he has told me adamantly that I was remembering something wrong and then would convince me that his version was correct. I’m now seeing him for who he is and I can’t unsee it. Last night was despicable. To try to eff with someone’s head to the point to get them to remember your version of such an important and vivid memory?!!? What was he trying to do at that point? It makes me think this is pathological. He has no self awareness that he’s doing this. He’s manipulated everyone in his life so much that it now comes naturally. Holy smokes am I dodging a bullet. I can’t believe it took me this long to realize that he’s this person. I’ve always thought he’s a good person, who was caught in a bad situation. Now I know he’s a self absorbed manipulative narcissist. I’m so angry right now. Edited June 1, 2020 by Husbandssecret 2
BaileyB Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 “There is no force equal to a woman determined to rise.” You have subjugated yourself to this man too many times - you have let him determine your worth, your future, your very sanity. You have ignored your own instinct, put your own needs aside - again and again... and for what? For a man who would manipulate you and use you for his own purpose. No longer. This man doesn’t know better than you. He is not more important or more worthy than you. Today, you take back your power. You tell this man - no more. And you begin to move forward to a healthier and happier future... It is a good day. Well done. 5
heartwhole2 Posted June 1, 2020 Posted June 1, 2020 And if he'll gaslight you when there's nothing in it for him -- what does he gain by convincing you you're wrong about how you learned of your father's death? -- then imagine how much he'll gaslight you when it benefits him in some way. And even if he was 100% confident that he was right about the details, why wouldn't his empathy for you concerning the loss of your father make him think, "Well that's not how I remember it, but no big deal, she was suffering a huge shock and loss"? This guy is bad news. 4
Author Husbandssecret Posted June 1, 2020 Author Posted June 1, 2020 4 hours ago, heartwhole2 said: And if he'll gaslight you when there's nothing in it for him -- what does he gain by convincing you you're wrong about how you learned of your father's death? -- then imagine how much he'll gaslight you when it benefits him in some way. And even if he was 100% confident that he was right about the details, why wouldn't his empathy for you concerning the loss of your father make him think, "Well that's not how I remember it, but no big deal, she was suffering a huge shock and loss"? This guy is bad news. EXACTLY!! It’s like I’ve known all along that he’s been gaslighting me, but I know without a doubt that I have that memory down correctly, I even have flight information to prove it. He did exactly what he’s done many times-recreate the past to make him sound like he’s a hero or he’s been there for me when he hasn’t. He’s even tried to convince me he made homemade chicken noodle soup for me once when I was really sick. This dude SUCKS. Not sure why it took so long to get there. I can’t even wrap my head around this. All the times I’ve mistrusted myself (which is a red flag too) because he’s made me think I have a poor memory. It’s absolutely crazy!!!
Recommended Posts