JimmyNorth Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 hour ago, elaine567 said: I know you are projecting here, but this MM is not you, this MM is a man who has been cheating through-out his 34 year marriage. I concur with you. We must observe the fact that MM’s behavior may be indicative of him really never being “in love” with his wife over the past 34 years. What if OP is an actual woman that he wants to keep? Could be?!? .... But I also have to keep in mind that he may be a serial cheater too. However, it gets harder to be a serial cheater as men get older, uglier, fatter, wrinkles, etc....so maybe OP is his final destination. Obviously this is all theory and just for discussion.
Amethyst68 Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 2 hours ago, JimmyNorth said: Very true. But we must be keep an open mind that their just might be some real feelings of love from both sides. It happens. Of course many here are going to look at the many failures that come out of an AP becoming a real full blown open relationship. However, you have to admit that some spouses really have fell out of love long before any affair has started. Some divorce and meet someone after the divorce is done, and some people may meet there “soul mate” during rough times of a marriage. Im just saying it happens. I 100% wish I would have divorced first and then went on to have a real relationship that doesn’t involve a double life and keeping a mistress secret. It hurts ALL parties. But I did not do that...why you ask?? Because I was stuck in my own mind with the chaos that was happening in my own head. I never had a OW before and I was not prepared for what my own mind was going through. I know my OW did not want to be a OW. I’m fact she hated it! I had to take my head out of my butt and wake up. I had to logically think everything through. That’s what OP’s MM might be heading toward. And what's that got to do with the OP going to meet with her MM when there's a lockdown and quarantine in place? No matter what you say, NOTHING excuses putting her family's lives in needless danger just because she wanted to see her AP. It's not romantic, it's careless and dangerous in situations like this pandemic. 2
stillafool Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 minute ago, JimmyNorth said: Yes, MM admits love for his wife. BUT...what kind of love?? Obviously he’s not loving his wife the way one would think of. I think it’s more of the fact that he “feels bad” for his wife. He loves his wife, but that passion is not there, because if it was, he wouldn’t even be thinking of OP st all. If this is true why would MM get jealous because his wife goes out drinking and afraid she may be having an affair? If so, then he's going to divorce her? These are perfect reasons to walk away from a woman he no longer wants (doesn't seem like she wants him either) and go with his OW who he has undying love for. Why put this on hold? Why would he care if his W is having sex with another man? He should be cheering her on if for no other reason than to declare his own freedom and leave guilt free. His kids are grown adults able to take care of themselves so that isn't a good excuse either. It just isn't adding up. 2
Amethyst68 Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 This is a MM terrified and jealous at the thought his wife is having an affair with his best friend and who repeatedly tells the OP he loves his wife. The only way the OP gets this man is if his wife boots him out! Hopefully the OP will leave her husband, he deserves a hell of a lot more than someone who puts his health at risk without a second thought. 3
SummerDreams Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 6 minutes ago, stillafool said: Why would he care if his W is having sex with another man? Because he's very proud! Don't forget! :S 1
stillafool Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 minute ago, SummerDreams said: Because he's very proud! Don't forget! :S I'm sorry Summer I don't understand?
sandylee1 Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 2 minutes ago, stillafool said: I'm sorry Summer I don't understand? It's because The OP said in an earlier post that MM was a very proud man in relation to his wife possibly having an affair. 2 1
elaine567 Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 21 hours ago, MadlyDeeply said: Think he is just clinging on to all those yrs and history, also he is a v proud man.
stillafool Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 minute ago, sandylee1 said: It's because The OP said in an earlier post that MM was a very proud man in relation to his wife possibly having an affair. Proud men are divorcing their wives everyday so I call bull on that excuse. Most older men would be prouder to show off their younger gf and leave the old wife behind. 2
elaine567 Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 He had 34 years of cheating in which he could have left his wife for an OW. He never did. 2
pepperbird Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 8 hours ago, JimmyNorth said: It’s quite possible that OP was no longer attracted to her H. Or maybe the relationship was just no longer appealing. Maybe the MM produced a great attraction and OP could not fight her feelings. These things could have slowly developed over time which inevitably built up a giant snowball of romantic tension that exploded. OP and MM most likely have intense feelings toward eachother, even if it’s wrong, that will be hard to turn off. this isn't what happened. She made the choice to put her husband and kids at risk. This goes beyond some nebulous "an affair can cause them mental/emotional damage"" to potentially causing them physical harm. If where she live sis anything like her, she also put her family at financial risk, because tickets and fines are being handed out to people who ignore social distancing rules. I'm not getting the vibe from the OP that she's okay with any of that, yet she did it anyway. That's what I mean by saying this doesn't seem like it fits who she is at heart. She may not care that much for her husband, but I don't think she wants him to get sick either. 1
pepperbird Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 hour ago, JimmyNorth said: Yes, MM admits love for his wife. BUT...what kind of love?? Obviously he’s not loving his wife the way one would think of. I think it’s more of the fact that he “feels bad” for his wife. He loves his wife, but that passion is not there, because if it was, he wouldn’t even be thinking of OP st all. Please don’t mistake my thought as support for MM’s to be bad. I just want everyone to know to keep an open mind to some elements of real feelings that OP and MM might have and share! An abused wife may well love her husband to pieces. That doesn't make one damned but of difference. My take on this guy? He's not capable of being with just one person ( he's cheated before, no?) , but that doesn't mesh with his vision of who he is. He wants to see himself as the good guy, so he shifts responsibility for his actions on to others. It's his wife's fault, the op's fault, anyone elses fault but his. he's like a little boy who got stuck at the emotional level of a teenager. Proof of this? Here is a man with a wife and kids who would expose them to a virus that could kill them, just so he can get his emotional fix. That smacks of arrogance and self centredness. Would you have asked your SO to do this, o matter how much you missed her and wnated to see her? Wouldn't her health and the health of her family been more important? I get a different vibe from the OP, She sound really confused, lonely and actually quite vulnerable. Perfect quarry for this type of cheating married man. He'll use her up, spit her out on then move on to the next.
BaileyB Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) 8 hours ago, JimmyNorth said: Oops, wrong post. Sorry. Edited April 12, 2020 by BaileyB
ExpatInItaly Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 hour ago, JimmyNorth said: What if OP is an actual woman that he wants to keep? Could be?!? .... But I also have to keep in mind that he may be a serial cheater too. However, it gets harder to be a serial cheater as men get older, uglier, fatter, wrinkles, etc....so maybe OP is his final destination. Obviously this is all theory and just for discussion. For a personal anecdote, have a look back in this thread at my post about my partner's estranged father. The man is still a cheater, at 81. Who does he cheat with? My partner's mother (now 80 herself), whom he walked out on years back to marry his OW. He cheated on her throughout their whole marriage, and shocker, he came back around (two times) after leaving for other women He has never been faithful, and he still isn't. Crazy and dysfunctional yes. Unusual, yes. But it does indeed happen, insane as it may sound!
sandylee1 Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 24 minutes ago, pepperbird said: An abused wife may well love her husband to pieces. That doesn't make one damned but of difference. My take on this guy? He's not capable of being with just one person ( he's cheated before, no?) , but that doesn't mesh with his vision of who he is. He wants to see himself as the good guy, so he shifts responsibility for his actions on to others. It's his wife's fault, the op's fault, anyone elses fault but his. he's like a little boy who got stuck at the emotional level of a teenager. Proof of this? Here is a man with a wife and kids who would expose them to a virus that could kill them, just so he can get his emotional fix. That smacks of arrogance and self centredness. Would you have asked your SO to do this, o matter how much you missed her and wnated to see her? Wouldn't her health and the health of her family been more important? I get a different vibe from the OP, She sound really confused, lonely and actually quite vulnerable. Perfect quarry for this type of cheating married man. He'll use her up, spit her out on then move on to the next. There's only so much one can blame MM. At some point individuals need to take responsibility for their behavior. The notion of bud bad wolf in the guise of MM, does not absolve a fully functioning adult from taking personal responsibility for their wreckless behaviour. 1
elaine567 Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 minute ago, ExpatInItaly said: He cheated on her throughout their whole marriage, and shocker, he came back around (two times) after leaving for other women He has never been faithful, and he still isn't. I think it is a bit like paying for sex, once that "hurdle" is jumped, then it is very easy to just keep jumping those hurdles. It becomes the norm. These men are not monogamous, never were, despite getting married and apparently playing the game...
ExpatInItaly Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 1 minute ago, elaine567 said: I think it is a bit like paying for sex, once that "hurdle" is jumped, then it is very easy to just keep jumping those hurdles. It becomes the norm. These men are not monogamous, never were, despite getting married and apparently playing the game... Yes, I agree. In my experience, lifelong serial cheats never truly commit. They might lack opportunity later in life, yes, but the underlying desire to seek out other women is still there. Their heart and mind are always on the lookout for others. Believing these types will settle once they meet that one "special" woman is naive and unrealistic, in my opinion. 2
stillafool Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 Thank you Sandy. I'm so sick and tired of hearing about he Big Bad MM who lures the sweet, innocent wife of another man into his arms as if she doesn't have one brain cell in her head to tell her differently. At some point morals and personal responsibility has to come into play. These women are no more innocent than the MM. 4 minutes ago, sandylee1 said: There's only so much one can blame MM. At some point individuals need to take responsibility for their behavior. The notion of big bad wolf in the guise of MM, does not absolve a fully functioning adult from taking personal responsibility for their wreckless behaviour. 1
Bittersweetie Posted April 12, 2020 Posted April 12, 2020 (edited) 1 hour ago, elaine567 said: I think it is a bit like paying for sex, once that "hurdle" is jumped, then it is very easy to just keep jumping those hurdles. It becomes the norm. I also think this can be a wayward spouse kind of thinking...moving the goalposts. Like we think: "X is okay, but Y is not okay." Then later: "Well, Y really is okay, but Z is definitely not okay." Then we do Z. We keep moving the goalposts to make what we're doing okay and acceptable in our own heads so we don't have to actually face our choices. Edited April 12, 2020 by Bittersweetie 2
JimmyNorth Posted April 13, 2020 Posted April 13, 2020 16 hours ago, elaine567 said: I think it is a bit like paying for sex, once that "hurdle" is jumped, then it is very easy to just keep jumping those hurdles. It becomes the norm. These men are not monogamous, never were, despite getting married and apparently playing the game... I agree. Do you also believe, that there can be times where a serial cheater MM can have his ways changed by that “one amazing woman”?
Author MadlyDeeply Posted April 13, 2020 Author Posted April 13, 2020 Hello to you all. Hope you all had a lovely Easter. I really don't know where to begin. I ended my last message feeling terribly sick about all my actions and mistakes which i regret but at the time i didn't think i was risking too much as my mm is in his own room, not going out or seeing anyone so not much chance of being infected. I know i shouldn't have met him but i did what i thought was right at that moment. Obviously i wouldn't have met him if he was going about life as normal. Didn't want to end our a with a text. I will NOT be meeting him again until lockdown is over. Answers to some questions: I used to be a very emotional person, now i can't cry. I always considered myself as quite a sensible person, loyal, honest, quiet but a fun loving happy person. My h and i had lots of chats about our m, i asked for an open m but he didn't want one. We both love our children and enjoy the family unit, we get on well as friends. My h had said there won't be much between us once the children have grown so we both agree. My h is choosing to stay and bring up our children too even though he knows we don't have a love how it should be. We don't argue at all by the way, children are v happy. Bailey thank you so much for all the effort you went to. I can't believe he has stayed in his marriage for so long but think he stayed for the children and he does love her in his way just not how he should, which i can relate to. I still love my h but im not in love with him and would definitely not want him to come to any harm. Also you said about mm being best friends with his wife, that they are not, don't know where that came from. Everything else was accurate on the list. It was v interesting for me what you did. It sounds absolutely crazy that this is the man i say i love and would want to be with. I have painted a terrible picture of him. I do feel sorry his wife too but they really don't get on most of the time. I don't talk to her but my h does. Jimmy your right, we knew each other for ten yrs, has been a slow burner. He really didn't think he stood a chance with me, especially being 15yrs older. He admits he thought i would just be a fling like all the others, he can't believe it has come to this. We both never thought after nearly 2.5 yrs we would still be seeing each other. He can't describe what makes me special from the rest, it's just how we are together, he says i complete him. It's just all the history he shares with his W, obviously he does love her after all they have shared but it's not like the love we share. Can a man love more than one woman at once, is it possible? I think just in different ways. He loves her like i love my h but we are in love with each other. If he really was in love with his W he wouldn't have cheated on her from day no 1 surely? He seems so genuine, I can't believe that he doesn't love me. Beca you are doing so well, i am so proud of you, bet you feel like you have come a long way. Are you beginning to feel like your old self again? Sending many hugs. Answer to your question, Yes Mm is one of my husband's friends, they are not best friends though by any means. My h is 99% trustworthy, would never have an a. Elaine It's my h that talks to his wife so i get a lot of information that way. I would never discuss anything with her, don't even want to look at her to be honest cause of guilt.
Author MadlyDeeply Posted April 13, 2020 Author Posted April 13, 2020 LlyaLou I ask myself that all the time would i ever be able to trust him, I would never feel at peace wondering what he was up to. I am so pleased you have managed to move on, thank you for joining in. Bittersweetie I want to be where you are now in your head. Bet you can't believe how you used to be. You sound like you have come along way too. I just don't know how to stop loving him. Amethyst I have apologised over and over, wish i hadn't been so honest here now, it's backfired, you can only see my bad mistakes. I should have just said i had spoken to him on the phone but that is not me, wanted to speak the truth. Infact i have never lied to my mm, not once, i can honestly say that. I never lie to anyone it's not me. The only person i have to lie to is my poor h so that i can see my mm, but i hate it every single time. Pepperbird. I'm a women in love, yes so confused i can't think straight most of the time. Know i need help that's why i started this post. My best friend is a trained counselor but think i need somebody separate. I agree I think he has got stuck at an emotional level of a teenager, glad you said that as its made me think he has serious problems going back to when he was a teenager. Sandylee I take full responsibility, i didn't have to get sucked in by mm. I have chosen to believe in him and his lies. I think cause I knew him all that time before, I felt safe with him but obviously you never truly know somebody until you really start getting to know them! ExpatinItaly thank you for reminding me and all about your story, just proves that they don't change. Interesting story for all. Stillafool I totally agree with you, it isn't all adding up is it? Thank you for trying to understand. I do take full responsibility in my decision to start this a with him, I am just as guilty. I completely and utterly fell in love that's why i went into this a, it wasn't for fun. Question for all. There is a post on Ls about a W who's h has been having an a for 12 yrs he sounds like my mm, obviously not a good thing but people on there think he loves his ow why is he different from my mm loving me? Is it the length of the a? Things like this confuse me further.
Author MadlyDeeply Posted April 13, 2020 Author Posted April 13, 2020 Thank you to all of you, I know I don't know any of you, but I will always remember you all for being here for me and trying to make me wake up and see sense. X
SummerDreams Posted April 13, 2020 Posted April 13, 2020 OP my point of view is the following: you are stuck in a marriage where you are not happy but you can't leave it because you recognise that your H is a good man and a good father and your kids are happy so you are feeling you don't have the right to stop this. There are millions of couples though that are unhappy in their marriages and they stay for the kids or for financial reasons. Some of them open their marriages to find some happiness in other people. The OM is just an outlet you have found to manage being in an unhappy marriage. I think that if it wasn't him, you would have found someone else. I mean, I don't think you love this specific man because to be honest he doesn't have many positive attributes for you to love. You just love the outlet he gives you and the way he makes you feel loved, something you miss in your marriage and life in general. The OM knows well that love is all you are missing and that's what he is selling you. The OM is just a heartless salesman. He is saying openly that he loves his W and he won't leave her, he is feeding you the lies you want to hear about love and you complete me and you are my sould mate and so on, and this way he is keeping you where he wants you. Both of you is gaining something from this relationship. The problem is that his W and your H don't get what they deserve, they are getting lies and betrayal. As I said there are millions of couples in unhappy marriages, you are not the only one. You are in the affair fog at the moment and you are thinking you are living in a telenovela or something. This is real life. Wake up. If you can't tolerate being unhappy in your marriage, get a divorce. Your kids will still have their father. Your H will find a woman who loves and appreciates him and you will find someone as well. This is the right way. The way you are going now is the typical of the cake eater. You can't have both. Nobody pressed you into marrying this man and having kids with him. You should have known that you were going to end not in love with him and deal with it. If you can't deal with it, only a divorce is the right thing to do. 3
elaine567 Posted April 13, 2020 Posted April 13, 2020 2 hours ago, JimmyNorth said: I agree. Do you also believe, that there can be times where a serial cheater MM can have his ways changed by that “one amazing woman”? I agree that such a man can find that "one amazing woman", but after a while, sooner or later, given the opportunity, he will cheat on her. It is in his DNA, he likes the chase, he needs the "variety", he seeks the excitement...people don't usually change the habits of a lifetime. 4
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