two divorcing people. where is this going?

[Pistachio0]

We met when we were both unhappy in our marriages but our spouses hadn't yet filed for divorce. We were just friends for months, then things turned sexual/romantic, but I didn't think he was serious (i.e. no explicit Talk about being exclusive, etc) so a few times I accepted dates with other men and didn't think much of it. Eventually I told him and he was extremely upset, saying we were dating exclusively, and he turned very serious in the way he talked about us and the future. He asked me on vacation with him to faraway countries twice, and I went.  

Currently he says after a 12-year marriage (with kids), he feels he doesn't believe in love and won't trust anyone ever again - not that I'm not trustworthy, but it's his issue. He said he thought he'd be ready to move on, and if there was any 1 person in the world who'd made him want to do that, it was me -- but actually he's not ready for commitment, and he needs to deal with his issues after such a long marriage in his own time. He says he's scared I'm going to get tired of him and leave him like I left my husband. He brings up how I used to say I loved my husband in social media posts, but what did that mean now that I left him? Yet he continues to want to see me (and my child, actually) multiple times per week. Most recently he took my child & me to dinner but didn't even try anything physically with me.

When I say "you clearly just want to be friends, so I can obviously date who I want," he doesn't agree and says he's not telling me to find someone else, he isn't letting me go, etc. This is ridiculous. He asks to go out with me at minimum twice per week and texts me all day every day.

[GeorgiaPeach1]

His excuses are just that--excuses. He is trying to keep you just enough on the hook to be able to be intimate with you, but not so much that he has to formally commit to you. Even men who want to keep things casual with a woman would prefer to be the only man she's seeing/sleeping with, so him getting upset that you're dating doesn't mean much. If I were you, I'd quit allowing him to use me.

[Redhead14]

Does the phrase "being strung along" ring a bell for you?  He wants the "convenience" of you and sex but doesn't want to commit in any way, shape or form.  You two shouldn't even be dating anyone for a long time, even after your divorces.  After a divorce it takes a long time to rebuild/regain your sense of independence and get to know yourself.  Walk away from this guy or you will be compounding the baggage you will be carrying around for yourself when/if the marriage ends by suffering another heartbreaking situation right on top of that.  Not a good idea.

[Fletch Lives]

- what redhead said.

 

He's fallen out of love with his wife but is not ready to fall in love with a new woman yet. You are the other woman. Also, he wants you to be exclusive with him, but he can multi-date. What a mess!

This is just one more example of why you should not play with married men, and men who don't love you.

[carhill]

Welcome to LS...

How long have you/he been divorced?

I noted a lot of 'he asks', 'he took', etc.... what proactive steps have you taken to promote this association other than accepting what he asks?

[smackie9]

Stop seeing him/cut him off...he just slammed you with repeated manipulative comments. Nothing about him is healthy.

[Pistachio0]

24 minutes ago, carhill said:

Welcome to LS...

How long have you/he been divorced?

I noted a lot of 'he asks', 'he took', etc.... what proactive steps have you taken to promote this association other than accepting what he asks?

Thanks. Neither of our divorces is finalized but both filed over 6 months ago. Part of me wanted to say forget about him because he’s noncommittal, but then I said wait, given both of our situations, is it more of a red flag to feel ready for a relationship and not need to work through issues on our own as he’s currently alluding to? 
I get the concern about me being strung along. My plan was to tell him that I’ll keep being “friends” but am free to see other people- and then do so- but again, would “waiting” for him actually be reasonable considering that we are both in process of divorce, his marriage Much longer than mine was?

[carhill]

Are either or both of you living separately? At this stage, that would be an important step. Since you both have children, I'd expect the process to be long and complex. Are your/his spouses being amicable?

One MW I was involved with decades ago had a similar situation with her exit affair; her D, with two kids, one adult and one minor, took about six years and she and MM dated/lived separately until after her D was final but his family was still a problem a good ten years after they first met. I saw some of it interacting with his family and her socially. The tension was palpable. However, they stuck it out, all their kids are adults now and they've been together about 20 years since the affair began. I'm in my 60's now and first met her in my early 20's, giving a sense of timeline.

IMO, no rush. Get the D's and co-parenting settled then the other stuff will work itself out.

[Pistachio0]

18 minutes ago, carhill said:

Are either or both of you living separately? At this stage, that would be an important step. Since you both have children, I'd expect the process to be long and complex. Are your/his spouses being amicable?

One MW I was involved with decades ago had a similar situation with her exit affair; her D, with two kids, one adult and one minor, took about six years and she and MM dated/lived separately until after her D was final but his family was still a problem a good ten years after they first met. I saw some of it interacting with his family and her socially. The tension was palpable. However, they stuck it out, all their kids are adults now and they've been together about 20 years since the affair began. I'm in my 60's now and first met her in my early 20's, giving a sense of timeline.

IMO, no rush. Get the D's and co-parenting settled then the other stuff will work itself out.

Thanks, he moved to opposite coast of US from his soon-to-be ex and child... I’ve lived apart from my ex for a year.

i really don’t want to wonder “what if” if I stop seeing this person and date others, but at the same time my life can’t be in an indefinite holding pattern.

[carhill]

OK, so you live in the same area as your co-parent/divorcing spouse and he lives opposite coast from his. Does he now live completely local to you or is it still bit of long distance?

Also, how long were you/he married? IME, long-marrieds have little experience with being alone and most I've known are loathe to be alone. Even with a busy life and children, they have a hard time being completely single and tend to line up new partners quickly. How does it go for you?

[elaine567]

13 hours ago, Pistachio0 said:

Currently he says after a 12-year marriage (with kids), he feels he doesn't believe in love and won't trust anyone ever again - not that I'm not trustworthy, but it's his issue. He said he thought he'd be ready to move on, and if there was any 1 person in the world who'd made him want to do that, it was me -- but actually he's not ready for commitment, and he needs to deal with his issues after such a long marriage in his own time.

You need to listen to this, the rest of what he says is just about  loneliness and not wanting to be alone and dare I say it sex if he wants it.
He is happy to stick around as long as you don't expect "more".
Of course he doesn't want you seeing others, few men do. even when they themselves are sleeping with every available women in sight...
You would be a fool to wait IMO.
 

 

[CloudyHead]

He is afraid of being alone . . . plain and simple.  You are what keeps him from being alone (and maybe reminds him of the "good parts" of his marriage).  When marriages/relationships end, you lose the person that you spoke to or texted every single day.   It is a difficult transition.  There is a hole inside of you.  I use the acronym "TP", i.e. transition person, who helps you transition from the end of a relationship to being steady on your feet being alone or onto another relationship.  I think you are his "TP".  We all need a "TP" at times and most of us have been a "TP" at some point in our lives.  

[Pistachio0]

9 minutes ago, CloudyHead said:

He is afraid of being alone . . . plain and simple.  You are what keeps him from being alone (and maybe reminds him of the "good parts" of his marriage).  When marriages/relationships end, you lose the person that you spoke to or texted every single day.   It is a difficult transition.  There is a hole inside of you.  I use the acronym "TP", i.e. transition person, who helps you transition from the end of a relationship to being steady on your feet being alone or onto another relationship.  I think you are his "TP".  We all need a "TP" at times and most of us have been a "TP" at some point in our lives.  

Got it. How can I be more than that? Should I just not be available at all if there’s no commitment? Again I feel that’s silly because it’s too soon to really be ready for one after such a long marriage imo

[Redhead14]

12 minutes ago, Pistachio0 said:

Got it. How can I be more than that? Should I just not be available at all if there’s no commitment? Again I feel that’s silly because it’s too soon to really be ready for one after such a long marriage imo

Of course you should not be available if there's no commitment.  No commitment and putting you on the back burner makes you an FWB (at best but more likely just WB . . . ).  If you're happy with that, great.  Otherwise, block, delete, forget, forever.  This is a dead end for you.  Focus on you and just you for a while.  Get focused on your future as a single woman working to be strong, secure and independent/on her own for a while and give yourself time to adjust to that life.  This guy is/was just a temporary "fix" and distraction from what's really in front of you -- YOU!  He is using you and you're allowing it.   As long as you keep in touch with him in any way you're letting him know you're willing to be his door mat and makes you complicit in your own misery down the road if you let yourself hang in limbo for this guy.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Redhead14

[Pistachio0]

7 minutes ago, Redhead14 said:

Of course you should not be available if there's no commitment.  No commitment and putting you on the back burner makes you an FWB (at best but more likely just WB . . . ).  If you're happy with that, great.  Otherwise, block, delete, forget, forever.  This is a dead end for you.  Focus on you and just you for a while.  Get focused on your future as a single woman working to be strong, secure and independent/on her own for a while and give yourself time to adjust to that life.  This guy is/was just a temporary "fix" and distraction from what's really in front of you -- YOU!  He is using you and you're allowing it.   As long as you keep in touch with him in any way you're letting him know you're willing to be his door mat and makes you complicit in your own misery down the road if you let yourself hang in limbo for this guy.

But how, functionally, would he act any differently if he actually saw something real in the future but simply isn’t ready after such a long marriage just ending?

[elaine567]

If he saw something real in the future he would not be trying to push you away with the "no commitment" talk. He wouldn't want to lose you.
That talk is a test to see if you will stick around knowing it is a dead end.
if you agree, be prepared to be used, that is how it usually works.

[Redhead14]

28 minutes ago, Pistachio0 said:

But how, functionally, would he act any differently if he actually saw something real in the future but simply isn’t ready after such a long marriage just ending?

He'd be putting in real effort to be with you!!!!  And, he wouldn't be telling you "no commitment".  When a man tells you something, believe him!!!  Anything else you infer from everything he says is about you not wanting to accept the reality of your situation.  You wouldn't be wondering.  And, he's really being a "sh*t" here.  He is being upfront while at the same time hoping you'll spin it to ambiguity . . . if he were a stand up guy, he'd end it himself knowing you want more.

Edited March 6, 2020 by Redhead14

[Pistachio0]

I’m just afraid that dating other people in meantime would potentially sabotage any chance of something in the future. Unless it was an impetus to realize that me being with someone else sucks for him and the only alternative is to be ready to make some commitment.

[Redhead14]

2 minutes ago, Pistachio0 said:

I’m just afraid that dating other people in meantime would potentially sabotage any chance of something in the future. Unless it was an impetus to realize that me being with someone else sucks for him and the only alternative is to be ready to make some commitment.

Stop mind-Fing yourself. 

[carhill]

As long as the marriages exist, no one here can be completely exclusive. It's not possible, no matter how much or little distance is involved. That ignores the reality that anyone can change their mind, for any reason or no reason, at any time.

In my opinion, if what you have is real, it will stand the test of time and, yes, either or both of you dating others. If it's indeed real, the divorces will be finalized, all the others will fade away and the two of you will remain and decide to be completely exclusive, no ifs, ands or buts. With both of you having children, I presume minor children, expect things to be 'complicated'. Worth it, perhaps, but a challenge.

[Backinthesaddleagain]

You guys are being pretty harsh towards the guy, and I see a HUGE double-standard here. Both parties are in almost the exact same situation! I was in a similar place, so I have my own opinions.

The guy is being honest about his feelings about trust issues and falling in love again, but the OP could feel the exact same way given that they both met while being married. This can create a lot of mixed emotions for both parties. OP, if he is opening up to you, and spending all of his free time with you, I don't think he is 'stringing' you along. I don't take trips to far away lands and invite a woman I am casually seeing along for the ride. He wants to be with you, and would like time to heal emotionally before he decides if you are going to stay for the long haul. I mean s***, he takes you on trips, you guys hang multiple times per week, he texts you all day, everyday. You were friends for months before things got physical. He has invested quite a bit into you. 

You guys always talk about how long it takes for true colors to show, and he just wants more time to see if you are going to turn crazy on him. What's the problem with that?

OP, as far as your "this is ridiculous" comment, the only one I see being ridiculous is you. This guy is spending too much $$$ & time with you and your child for him to be keeping you around for sex. And you said yourself that he takes you guys out and doesn't always try to get physical, who does that? Not someone just in it for sex. If it were me, and I was looking just for sex, I would avoid your kids like the plague. And we would only be going out when I knew the date would end with us naked. 

So, what I see is that you want to have "the talk" and get committed right away. He wants to as well, but needs more time. And the fact that you told him you were dating around, probably makes him even more gun shy.  

In closing, if you like him and want to be with him, stop dating others and see where this leads. Will it guarantee you end up together? Of course not! But love is always a gamble. If you don't want to risk it, and want to test the waters, then go date and have fun. I doubt he will stick around as he already told you this hurt him. 

Good luck. 

[Backinthesaddleagain]

4 hours ago, carhill said:

Welcome to LS...

How long have you/he been divorced?

I noted a lot of 'he asks', 'he took', etc.... what proactive steps have you taken to promote this association other than accepting what he asks?

A lot of "he asks"??? For real? He asked her to take a trip with him.... 

[smackie9]

Know your worth....keep dating other men.

[Backinthesaddleagain]

3 hours ago, CloudyHead said:

He is afraid of being alone . . . plain and simple.  You are what keeps him from being alone (and maybe reminds him of the "good parts" of his marriage).  When marriages/relationships end, you lose the person that you spoke to or texted every single day.   It is a difficult transition.  There is a hole inside of you.  I use the acronym "TP", i.e. transition person, who helps you transition from the end of a relationship to being steady on your feet being alone or onto another relationship.  I think you are his "TP".  We all need a "TP" at times and most of us have been a "TP" at some point in our lives.  

I agree with this, having gone through it. But without knowing all the info, timeline, and dynamics of everything, it is hard to say where either party is at. This isn't something I think any of us can accurately armchair quarterback with only a couple paragraphs of info quite honestly. Good post though. 

[Lotsgoingon]

Yeah, you're a temporary pacifier for him. On the other hand, you seem to be really moving on and exploring.

He sounds wounded and desperate and is thus oddly and inappropriately possessive. Hate to say it ... but he's showing all kinds of red flags. Back off!

He doesn't seem safe to me, and I'm a guy.