Searching realities

January 26, 2020

Well I decided to mix things up a bit this past holidays and did an rather interesting experiment and changed my profile pictures to something rather fake. Well suddenly I had lots of matches. Cool so lets see how superficial these people are, the answer is hugely. Granted it was a nice false sense of confidence to match with decent looking people as opposed to what I usually match with. Needless to say didn't bother meeting any of them, I was propositioned a few times and actually chased. This once again tells me the obvious looks are the ONLY thing most women seem to want. Granted its what most men want too.

I then went and had pictures taken, good one of me and well it was back to the usual sort of matches. OK so lets try Bumble, this was better actually with my new pictures but nobody could be bothered to make time to meet me so I pretty much gave up on that, at least I did get two decent looking matches so that wasn't half bad.

Then I did my usual and tried to chase what were obviously tourists on Tinder, not much success at that, bearing in mind in 2019 I met a great lady from Sweden like this another German lady, no such luck this year.

The point of this: ostensibly you can do whatever you like, read 10 books, 20 books but it matters nothing if you don't have the looks, men are expected to give the not so good looking lady a chance but the reverse is never true, why is this?

Then I did what some here wanted me to do, I went to a party, to give you an idea this party would have done Jay Gatsby proud, so outlandish and over the top it was. Full of pretty people and I may have not bothered to exist, the money was in the room and it was chased, I am not the money. But I sure I will hear some sob story "he slept with me and I never saw him again". Nevertheless it was interesting seeing the various charms being used to guys who do apparently have some value, the level of BS being off the metre and it was lapped up like the canapés were, swallowed like Moet and I am sure some guys did get lucky.

I could decry this but I just accept it, my life is easier to just accept this reality, I can complain about it, I can disagree with it but ultimately I cant do anything to change it. Another year starts and I know from a dating point of view it will be just like any of the past 20, largely fruitless and mostly a waste of time. I have had years to study what makes people successful at this and I have ZERO of those qualities, not one in fact. I have friends once again pushing me, applying the pressure mostly because they know I haven't had sex. In the past this would make me feel bad, but to be blunt I simply don't care anymore, none of these friends actually offer up much help in connecting me to people, one suggested I pay but there is no value in that and I don't want that sort of experience.

The reality is I cant change the rules and I don't have the traits to play the game, however I am learning BS allied with cynicism is a really great coping mechanism and because some blond in a low cut top doesn't seem value in me, doesn't mean I have no value. What I am going to avoid this year is going on dates with people I don't find attractive, this will probably mean I don't go on one date this year, so be it.

January 26, 2020

You're the one who's superficial. You're the one who won't date someone who would be attracted to you, someone at your own appeal level. I mean, it doesn't take a genius to know that more people are interested in better looking, more otherwise attractive people.

You need to accept that people online start with looks because it's all they have to go on and that no one has any reason to date someone less attractive than they are just for the crap of it. It's just as easy to find a nice attractive guy as a nice unattractive guy you wouldn't feel sexual towards for those in the same attractiveness range. You know this. You just can't accept it.

So now you're a catfish. Congratulations. You should be proud.

January 26, 2020

Not sure why you felt confidence in women liking the photos of someone else.

There is more to looks in a photo, there are hundreds of subtle cues we look for to personality in the smile, eyes, posture etc. Likely several unconscious. Sure you can fake those too, its called acting, but still people go by those.

Now if you used some smoking hot guy, you are going to attract those just interested in sex...especially if the photos provide indicia of wealth; those women could likely care less about ones profile. That doesn't mean anything, doesn't mean the majority of women only want that, just means the women who want that react to it and can imagine that such women use OLD heavily...why not, probably works great for what they are looking for.

I also don't get why you then bemoan getting only average women attracted to you? Also why you are surprised that good looking women were attracted to the good looking man photos you used? I don't think it is a matter of the good looking being expected to give the average looking a try, but you seem to want women to do it but you yourself do not want to do it or are offended by the notion.

January 26, 2020

36 minutes ago, preraph said:

You're the one who's superficial. You're the one who won't date someone who would be attracted to you, someone at your own appeal level. I mean, it doesn't take a genius to know that more people are interested in better looking, more otherwise attractive people.

You need to accept that people online start with looks because it's all they have to go on and that no one has any reason to date someone less attractive than they are just for the crap of it. It's just as easy to find a nice attractive guy as a nice unattractive guy you wouldn't feel sexual towards for those in the same attractiveness range. You know this. You just can't accept it.

So now you're a catfish. Congratulations. You should be proud.

Correction ALL people start with looks. Yes I am superficial just like everyone else. Sure and I don't see any reason to date overweight ladies either, I am not overweight so why I should I date at that attractiveness level?

Oh I forgot the same doesn't apply to men, we are just supposed to "give people a chance" but the reverse is never true. Cool.

January 26, 2020

No, Z, it's you. If you ever get out of the house, you will plainly see that there are all types of couples out there finding matches within their attractiveness realm and being happy. But oh, no, not you. Trust me, at this point, I am not suggesting you date anybody at all. Because I think that would be irresponsible of me! I would honestly hate to see a fat woman "give you a chance."

So you just keep catfishing and feeling sorry for yourself and nursing the fantasy that dating a good looking woman will somehow turn you into a prince and make all your friends think you're awesome.

Edited January 26, 2020 by preraph

January 26, 2020

3 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

Not sure why you felt confidence in women liking the photos of someone else.

There is more to looks in a photo, there are hundreds of subtle cues we look for to personality in the smile, eyes, posture etc. Likely several unconscious. Sure you can fake those too, its called acting, but still people go by those.

Now if you used some smoking hot guy, you are going to attract those just interested in sex...especially if the photos provide indicia of wealth; those women could likely care less about ones profile. That doesn't mean anything, doesn't mean the majority of women only want that, just means the women who want that react to it and can imagine that such women use OLD heavily...why not, probably works great for what they are looking for.

I also don't get why you then bemoan getting only average women attracted to you? Also why you are surprised that good looking women were attracted to the good looking man photos you used? I don't think it is a matter of the good looking being expected to give the average looking a try, but you seem to want women to do it but you yourself do not want to do it or are offended by the notion.

Here is the kicker, there wasn't much to the picture, hardly any face aspect either. Over the years I have played around with my own pictures to see what gets reaction and what does not, in fact the picture I used with not too over the top and no the pictures didn't provide any indication of wealth.

You forget that 99.9% of dates I have had were with very average people, most I didn't even find attractive but I met them anyway, should I have bothered to meet them? Probably not but I keep being told its numbers and "give them a chance you might find a gem" so I did but rather predictable that advice was pretty much rubbish no doubt dreamed up by some $200 snake oil salesperson otherwise know as a so called dating coach.

I frankly couldn't care what I saw last night combined with this Tinder nonsense pretty much ingrained that "couldn't care less" attitude. I just need to find some way of conjuring up one decent experience and I can tick off this on my to do list.

January 26, 2020

1 minute ago, preraph said:

No, Z, it's you. If you ever get out of the house, you will plainly see that there are all types of couples out there finding matches within their attractiveness realm and being happy. But oh, no, not you. Trust me, at this point, I am not suggesting you date anybody at all. Because I think that would be irresponsible of me! I would honestly hate to see a fat woman "give you a chance."

So you just keep catfishing and feeling sorry for yourself and nursing the fantasy that dating a good looking woman will somehow turn you into a price and make all your friends think you're awesome.

Hate to tell you but I did feel good going on dates with people I found attractive. Sorry.

I wouldn't be interested in a fat woman anyway but thanks for the such a kind thought, hugely appreciated. All types, sure, all types of what exactly, and what is an attractiveness realm, sometimes I wish I could post a picture on this forum because at the very least it would be nice to learn what my so called realm is.

Probably I just stuck in a situation of my own doing. But I am not going to mope, I can smile at that pretty blond, I can look over my shoulder at that brunette in her yoga outfit and in get some comfort in that I wont give up on what I want, even if I never get it.

January 26, 2020

Looks matter in online dating. In other news: water is wet.

Does it mean it’s the only thing that anyone cares about? No. Does it mean you can’t have your own success in OLD? Nope.

It may mean you’ll have to look harder for the right person. You might not get a influx of shallow people right to your inbox. Sorry.

It may mean you’ll need to adjust your standards. Maybe consider the things you want considered. If you’re only going after women with certain criteria and then complaining that women are shallow and you’ll never find some one, you might need to be more realistic.

It may mean, (and I feel like this a huge one and the case for a majority of men who struggle with online dating) you need to improve your looks. Hit the gym. Shave your neck beard. Update your hair and clothing style. Guys have a lot to work with too.

Good luck !!!

Edited January 26, 2020 by Cookiesandough

January 26, 2020

1 minute ago, ZA Dater said:

Here is the kicker, there wasn't much to the picture, hardly any face aspect either. Over the years I have played around with my own pictures to see what gets reaction and what does not, in fact the picture I used with not too over the top and no the pictures didn't provide any indication of wealth.

Without more it's hard to say. Not much of face aspect? Body counts as well on the good looking front, and in fact maybe more so for those just interested in sex.

Indicia of wealth can be subtle, of course depends on where you live. Haircut, clothing style choice, indicia of large amounts of free time. I'm not saying Ferrari in the background or gold watch. Frankly it can be enough when good looking to look like you just have it financially together. At least in the US. Have no idea what it is like in ZA, but my suspicion is that it is very different.

You forget that 99.9% of dates I have had were with very average people, most I didn't even find attractive but I met them anyway, should I have bothered to meet them? Probably not but I keep being told its numbers and "give them a chance you might find a gem" so I did but rather predictable that advice was pretty much rubbish no doubt dreamed up by some $200 snake oil salesperson otherwise know as a so called dating coach.

I think that "pitch" is for those who rank personality and connection right up there with looks. The same "pitch" is given to women. If average looks don't do it for you then they don't. Whatever is going through your head in not feeling it with these average women could be the same thing going through the head of the good looking women who are not wanting to date you.

January 26, 2020

Also hopefully you got consent of these people you are using for your online dating ‘experiments’ or they are just a stock photo....

nevermind the catfishing for science...

Edited January 26, 2020 by Cookiesandough

January 26, 2020

15 minutes ago, Cookiesandough said:

Also hopefully you got consent of these people you are using for your online dating ‘experiments’ or they are just a stock photo....

Yah you may have just be-smirched their OLD experience. You pretended to be them and now women who interacted with you as "them" will think that is how that person is.

You really should let those women know that the photo wasn't you.

It may also be illegal to impersonate someone (as you did holding out the picture of them as you) and possibly damaging their reputation. (Let alone copyright infringement or violation of the OLD site terms of service)

I strongly suspect that the excuse "but your honor I was conducting an OLD experiment" is not going to fly in ZA.

Edited January 26, 2020 by SumGuy

January 26, 2020

Well, I finally found a good reason to upload a profile photo. One of the suggestions for ZA was to update his hair style. (Other suggestions I'm less open to change i.e. I already 'hit the gym' - at home because I know how to exercise and have my own equipment - and I dress 'workplace casual' all the time. My neck and beard are always shaved though I do have a mustache - same color as my hair.) My hair is usually shorter than in the photo, lies flatter and doesn't fall over my ear as much. When it gets as long and 'wild' as in the photo, I schedule a cut. But I'm posting what I've got and listening for critique.

January 26, 2020

8 minutes ago, SumGuy said:

Yah you may have just be-smirched their OLD experience. You pretended to be them and now women who interacted with you as "them" will think that is how that person is.

You really should let those women know that the photo wasn't you.

It may also be illegal to impersonate someone (as you did holding out the picture of them as you) and possibly damaging their reputation. (Let alone copyright infringement or violation of the OLD site terms of service)

I strongly suspect that the excuse "but your honor I was conducting an OLD experiment" is not going to fly in ZA.

Relax..it was a picture of myself I had photo shopped to give me a six pack, changed the background a bit, omitted my face and so on. In the past I have subtly changed my pictures, changed the lighting to make me look a bit more tanned. SO no this wasn't being a catfish but it was creating a very different image based on my own pictures, perhaps I didn't make this clear enough.

January 26, 2020

Doing the exact same thing you made this thread to complain about. So hypocritical. And no, it's not you if you gave yourself a 6 pack and omitted your face. Still a catfish! You hate them for doing the exact same thing you do.

January 26, 2020

3 minutes ago, nospam99 said:

Well, I finally found a good reason to upload a profile photo. One of the suggestions for ZA was to update his hair style. (Other suggestions I'm less open to change i.e. I already 'hit the gym' - at home because I know how to exercise and have my own equipment - and I dress 'workplace casual' all the time. My neck and beard are always shaved though I do have a mustache - same color as my hair.) My hair is usually shorter than in the photo, lies flatter and doesn't fall over my ear as much. When it gets as long and 'wild' as in the photo, I schedule a cut. But I'm posting what I've got and listening for critique.

Why? Why change what you like simply in the HOPE someone might like it? Sorry, this makes no sense to me. I like my hairstyle and wont be changing it because some lady might like me because of my hairstyle. Likewise I like my casual wear so I not going to wear clothes I don't like in the hope someone else will.

Its largely back to the same old reality that many women do nothing when it comes to dating, average ones can get a guy, good looking ones can take a pick of any guy and well the rest they will always find some desperate guy to occupy their time. Sure I will get shot down but from where I sit this is absolutely true.

January 26, 2020

5 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Relax..it was a picture of myself I had photo shopped to give me a six pack, changed the background a bit, omitted my face and so on. In the past I have subtly changed my pictures, changed the lighting to make me look a bit more tanned. SO no this wasn't being a catfish but it was creating a very different image based on my own pictures, perhaps I didn't make this clear enough.

That's good it wasn't someone else. So you made you profile for those just interested in sex with a ripped body and you got a response, no surprise as that was the only criteria they look for, your words made no difference. Now you know how to attract those women.

Good news, you can make yourself into that picture. Get a tan, work on your diet and hit the gym/get a trainer. Can say from personal experience in my late 40s you can get a six pack in 6 months of diligent effort. It's all about getting that body fat % down. So you really have no reason to complain. You can get those hot women you want, it is well within your ability.

January 26, 2020

1 minute ago, preraph said:

Doing the exact same thing you made this thread to complain about. So hypocritical. And no, it's not you if you gave yourself a 6 pack and omitted your face. Still a catfish! You hate them for doing the exact same thing you do.

Not at all, I just know that its ALL about LOOKS and nothing ELSE because I actually chatted to a few and send them the same picture, unedited and guess what I called them out on being superficial, guess what I didn't give a continental either.

The fact is women will expect men to give them every opportunity, we must feel sorry of them, give them a chance BUT this is NEVER ever reciprocated. SO what the point really, men cannot win unless you are either

1: the top 1% of wealth and looks

2: Desperate enough to accept anything

3: Show the middle finger and win by virtue of not playing the game.

Of course I will be told I have a bad attitude but I don't, I am simply calling it as I see it, I have met amazing ladies, most went on to marry the so called equivalent, most never give me the time of day, should I feel inferior to them? No I don't.

January 26, 2020

9 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Why? Why change what you like simply in the HOPE someone might like it? Sorry, this makes no sense to me. I like my hairstyle and wont be changing it because some lady might like me because of my hairstyle. Likewise I like my casual wear so I not going to wear clothes I don't like in the hope someone else will.

Its largely back to the same old reality that many women do nothing when it comes to dating, average ones can get a guy, good looking ones can take a pick of any guy and well the rest they will always find some desperate guy to occupy their time. Sure I will get shot down but from where I sit this is absolutely true.

Yes. Women do nothing when it comes to dating. Are you serious, dude. You mentioned Blake Lively. Do you think she just wakes up looking like that.

Makeup, hair dye, hair and lash extensions, acrylic manicure, lifts, lipo, implants, filters, Multi billion dollar industries dedicated to women changing their looks often to make them more appealing to the opposite sex. Etc etc. And you are complaining about having to change your hair? As you have seen demonstrated, there are certain looks/styles more appealing to the opposite sex, but you’re going to ignore this based on some principle. Sounds a lot like cutting off your nose to spite your face. But you do you.

btw, nospam99 - it’s hard to be 100% sure, but I personally happen to like your hairstyle. Especially if it’s accompanied by a mustache. Cool.

Edited January 26, 2020 by Cookiesandough

January 26, 2020

1 minute ago, SumGuy said:

That's good it wasn't someone else. So you made you profile for those just interested in sex with a ripped body and you got a response, no surprise as that was the only criteria they look for, your words made no difference. Now you know how to attract those women.

Good news, you can make yourself into that picture. Get a tan, work on your diet and hit the gym/get a trainer. Can say from personal experience in my late 40s you can get a six pack in 6 months of diligent effort. It's all about getting that body fat % down. So you really have no reason to complain. You can get those hot women you want, it is well within your ability.

Not interested because the issue then becomes my face which I cant change or the way I speak or the colour of my eyes or some other completely stupid irrelevant fact. Women will just find any reason to reject, never, ever have I found any who actually give a modicum so why should I. If she does look after herself why should I date her, I at least am slim and slightly toned.

Oh then it will be "he has no experience" or "he has no friends" or "he has none of this" or "he doesn't drink" the list things to reject me are frankly endless. But woe is me for rejecting women who cannot bother to go the gym. At least I haven't had to resort to rejecting people for such pathetic and frankly petty reasons.

January 26, 2020

Yes, NoSpam, nice hair! I like hair that covers some forehead.

January 26, 2020

@ZA. I regard my hair as 'changeable'. Just like I could tell a woman 'I like long hair' and be flattered if she grew it out 'for me', I'd change my hair style for a woman I was dating (long term). I posted here because one of the posters suggested that, even for a man, changing hair style could improve appearance and I'm willing to listen to feedback. I'm not going to get something like a skateboard cut on the say-so of an LS poster.

January 26, 2020

4 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Of course I will be told I have a bad attitude but I don't, I am simply calling it as I see it,

Those are not mutually exclusive and in fact that is how it works, how you see it is your attitude.

Again though, not going to get into if this is objectively true, maybe in ZA it is. Luckily never have any intention of living in ZA so there you go. Can tell you that in the US know enough cases from personal experience that your world view of women is completely off for the US, and my experience with Canada, and women from China, and Brazil.

January 26, 2020

Ok so there is a profile pic......critique as you wish I have thick skin.

January 26, 2020

Can't see the most important things, your face and hair. Women care more about faces.

Edited January 26, 2020 by preraph

January 26, 2020

18 minutes ago, ZA Dater said:

Not interested because the issue then becomes my face which I cant change or the way I speak or the colour of my eyes or some other completely stupid irrelevant fact. Women will just find any reason to reject, never, ever have I found any who actually give a modicum so why should I. If she does look after herself why should I date her, I at least am slim and slightly toned.

Wow! You are really digging in. These women responded to you despite your face not showing I thought you said. I guess it could be your face is so awful that it undoes everything else, I doubt that but if that is how you feel. Again I will point to in my view women have a very broad range of men's faces they like. You know facial features, and body, are not stupid or irrelevant if you also go by them in choosing women.

The way you speak? Is that a thing in ZA? I recall a thread where a woman who was otherwise your type you decided against because of her ugly accent.

Never ever mentioned you should date someone who doesn't look after herself. You did an experiment and found out if you have a six pack, women respond to you in droves even without seeing your face.

Quote

Oh then it will be "he has no experience" or "he has no friends" or "he has none of this" or "he doesn't drink" the list things to reject me are frankly endless. But woe is me for rejecting women who cannot bother to go the gym. At least I haven't had to resort to rejecting people for such pathetic and frankly petty reasons.

Not sure where you got this. Sure they may reject you for all that, maybe one of those things alone is enough, maybe it is in combination. But you mentioning all that undermines your argument it is all about looks. Clearly it is not then in your mind (and in reality in my book). If it was all about looks none of that would matter.

I will say "having no friends" is not shallow. It can be a red flag, and it also goes to a persons life style and personality. People who are extroverts may not want to date an introvert who is perfectly fine with having no friends or staying in, and vice versa. That's not shallow, that's compatibility.

Edited January 26, 2020 by SumGuy

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