Gaeta Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, Redhead14 said: and who does it serve if that's the case? Environmentalists must be happy, don't see who else. 1
Redhead14 Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 1 minute ago, Azincourt said: Most people will probably get infected. Germany's Chancellor predicts 70% to 80% of the Germany population to get infected. Just a matter of time, if that happens, for the same situation to occur in the North American Countries. I'm worried about Mexico. Would that be the case if we shut down right now?
Azincourt Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, Redhead14 said: Would that be the case if we shut down right now? No idea. The problem is how easy it is for the virus to spread out and for people to catch it. It only takes one mistake and boom, you got it.
sothereiwas Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 7 minutes ago, Redhead14 said: Would that be the case if we shut down right now? Yep, I think so. It's going to be like H1N1 and so on - it will come back again. We just need time to get a vaccine developed and administered.
pepperbird Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 11 minutes ago, Redhead14 said: I really believe that there is more to this than we are being made privy to. I keep saying the whole thing is sketchy. And, who is doing the overblowing? Governments are not being driven by the media, are they??? I don't think so. And, what purpose does all this serve except to cause global disruption and who does it serve if that's the case? The media isn't helping. An example of this is the was it's confusing "presumptive" with "positive" cases. Here, it was reported there are seven presumptive cases in my province. That sounds bad, but when one looks a little deeper, you find that really doesn't mean much. the tests used are more the like screenings, and have quite a high rate of false positives. Further testing is needed, and apparently, a lot of those are coming back negative. Like I said before, out of almost 1,000 tests, one "positive" case that has actually been proven to be the virus.
Gaeta Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 7 minutes ago, Redhead14 said: Would that be the case if we shut down right now? I think it's too late for the US, you waited too long to react. We shut everything down at 50 positive. 1 1
Author gaius Posted March 18, 2020 Author Posted March 18, 2020 (edited) 41 minutes ago, Redhead14 said: By the way, Major Merrick said her county just got shut down. Does anyone know where she's located? What Merrick describes does not resemble any place in the US as far as I'm aware. The only area really forcibly shut down is one in New York and the demographics there don't match her described lifestyle. I guess all the stores in our area have been cleaned out of TP for close to a week now. My wife (Timshel) today went out and had to deal with one very sweet woman who was forced to buy napkins, which will mess up your plumbing, and another who like a doomsday preacher was slightly hysterical and ranting to one of our teenagers about how bad things are going to get and how screwed everyone is. Let's try and control ourselves around the kids please! Edited March 18, 2020 by gaius 1
pepperbird Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 16 minutes ago, Gaeta said: pepperbird: All the western countries are following the same curb as European countries, the difference is we are at the very beginning. In Quebec we started with 2 more cases a day, then 5 cases, and we are now at 25 cases a day. In a week we will count them by the 100s more a day. Hopefully because we hit the alarm button much faster than Europe we will be able to contain it meaning we still will have up to 60% of our population being infected with it but on a longer period of time so our hospital will be able to answer the demand. New Brunswick is the same as Québec 2 weeks ago. If that was the case,someone forgot to tell the virus. If this pattern was inevitable, it would have exploded through Toronto back in January when the first cases came in. before they knew they were sick, those people were freely circulating in the public. They weren't wearing mask,s precautions weren't being taken. No quarantine, because no one knew to do it. There were no travel restrictions between Canada and China, so it;s pretty hard to believe it wasn't here, and many other places. The virus has already been here for likely two months already-no explosion of cases. Why is that only happening now?
elaine567 Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 3 minutes ago, Gaeta said: I think it's too late for the US, you waited too long to react. We shut everything down at 50 positive. We in the UK are now thinking of shutting down with nearly 3000 cases and 104 deaths. That is with minimal testing too... Trying to put out a fire with a blindfold as the WHO chief said.. Far too late IMO. 1
lana-banana Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 There was no explosion of cases because nobody knew to test for it. The first cases in the United States were probably in December or early January, but the actual first confirmed case wasn't until later in February. I don't know about all areas but in New York City's hospital admissions you see a predicted seasonal spike (December-January) that started to fall in February, then suddenly started climbing again. It's very likely that early cases were/have been/are diagnosed as flu or other respiratory ailments prior to awareness of coronavirus. And let's not forget that about 80% of people have few or no symptoms, and are transmitting it without even knowing they're sick. (I have seen people try to play it down with "80% of symptoms are mild". But 20% require hospitalization. That's worse than Russian roulette, and people really want to act like it's no big deal?) 1
Azincourt Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 (edited) It was far too late in every Country, not just the UK. And it's not the first time a deadly pestilence has come out of China to infect the rest of the world. Quote The Black Death, also known as the Pestilence, Great Bubonic Plague, the Great Plague or the Plague, or less commonly the Great Mortality or Black Plague, was one of the most devastating pandemics in human history, resulting in the deaths of an estimated 75 to 200 million people in Eurasia, peaking in Europe from 1347 to 1351. Quote The Black Death, also known as the Pestilence, Great Bubonic Plague, the Great Plague or the ... In October 2010, medical geneticists suggested that all three of the great waves of the plague originated in China. Quote (I have seen people try to play it down with "80% of symptoms are mild". But 20% require hospitalization. That's worse than Russian roulette, and people really want to act like it's no big deal?) hundreds of millions infected would result in dozens of millions filling up hospitals. Can you imagine how impossible that is, to have tens of thousands of hospitals built in record time, and where would the doctors come from? Edited March 18, 2020 by Azincourt 1
Azincourt Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, lana-banana said: There was no explosion of cases because nobody knew to test for it. The first cases in the United States were probably in December or early January, but the actual first confirmed case wasn't until later in February. I don't know about all areas but in New York City's hospital admissions you see a predicted seasonal spike (December-January) that started to fall in February, then suddenly started climbing again. It's very likely that early cases were/have been/are diagnosed as flu or other respiratory ailments prior to awareness of coronavirus. And let's not forget that about 80% of people have few or no symptoms, and are transmitting it without even knowing they're sick. (I have seen people try to play it down with "80% of symptoms are mild". But 20% require hospitalization. That's worse than Russian roulette, and people really want to act like it's no big deal?) hundreds of millions infected would result in dozens of millions filling up hospitals. Can you imagine how impossible that is, to have tens of thousands of hospitals built in record time, and where would the doctors come from? 4 minutes ago, lana-banana said: Edited March 18, 2020 by Azincourt
Redhead14 Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 (edited) 41 minutes ago, Azincourt said: Most people will probably get infected. Germany's Chancellor predicts 70% to 80% of the Germany population to get infected. Just a matter of time, if that happens, for the same situation to occur in the North American Countries. I'm worried about Mexico. What do you mean? You think this is a man-made virus created with the purpose to kill of as many westerners as possible but it backfired and it infected the Chinese population instead? I'm wondering if it is a bio-engineering experiment that got away from "them" -- whoever that is. And, the bio-engineered part was really to eliminate at least one segment of the population or possibly two that is putting drain on the economy or represents a burden in some way to that country/entity. Since it happened in China, that isn't a far leap, IMO. They've gone to great lengths to keep their population down in ways that are morally objectionable and criminal to humanity. I don't think they are above trying to test it in a certain area and it just got out of control. Even they couldn't predict how much, etc. And, the only reason I care about whether that is the case or not, is that whoever might have engineered this virus would most certainly have what's needed to create a vaccine. So, if this is really the case, then we need to figure that out and squeeze them. Either that, or this is a bio-engineered virus and someone "let it out" by mistake or took it out of a lab and didn't handle it properly or something like that and won't admit it, therefore, preventing a vaccine from being readily available/created. Edited March 18, 2020 by Redhead14
Happy Lemming Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 11 minutes ago, gaius said: I guess all the stores in our area have been cleaned out of TP for close to a week now. Have you checked on ebay?? I found some for a "decent" price... 1
Gaeta Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 7 minutes ago, pepperbird said: If that was the case,someone forgot to tell the virus. If this pattern was inevitable, it would have exploded through Toronto back in January when the first cases came in I am not sure I follow you, are you supporting those conspiracy theory? When Toronto's first case came in we were aware already of the virus situation in China, it didn't hit us by surprise we expected it and this man being Asian knew of the virus symptoms so he reported himself. I am not pulling this out of my hat, all studies are showing each country develop the virus in the same way, that is why it's imperative to shut down everything asap even if you have only 1 case. 1
lana-banana Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 5 minutes ago, Azincourt said: hundreds of millions infected would result in dozens of millions filling up hospitals. Can you imagine how impossible that is, to have tens of thousands of hospitals built in record time, and where would the doctors come from? This is exactly the problem we're facing. We are looking at thousands of hospital beds needed and almost no capacity (it's not like other illnesses are going to sit and wait). Most models suggest the worst is yet to come. 2
Azincourt Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 It won't take long before doctors will have to decide between using resources and time on the elderly who are infected, and the young who are infected, resulting in one age group or the other, dying. 1 1
amaysngrace Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 (edited) 4 minutes ago, Azincourt said: It won't take long before doctors will have to decide between using resources and time on the elderly who are infected, and the young who are infected, resulting in one age group or the other, dying. They’ll probably go by the severity and the likelihood of survival, not by age. There are a ton of older people who enjoy better health than some young people do. But age isn’t necessarily a determining factor although usually the younger the person the better their health. Edited March 18, 2020 by amaysngrace
Author gaius Posted March 18, 2020 Author Posted March 18, 2020 2 minutes ago, Happy Lemming said: Have you checked on ebay?? I found some for a "decent" price... We've got a small reserve stock at home we haven't had to dip into yet. Glad there's still some sources out there though because our local ones don't seem to be restocking quickly. About an hour ago I watched a forklift take a pallet of TP across the parking lot at my work. I'm surprised he made it to the other end unmolested.
Gaeta Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 16 minutes ago, Redhead14 said: I'm wondering if it is a bio-engineering experiment that got away from "them" -- Historically experiment of that kind are done on remote areas or on military groups. Not on a central city of 11 million people and the most important transport transit. It would be like China picking to shoot himself in the foot for an experiment.
elaine567 Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 6 minutes ago, amaysngrace said: They’ll probably go by the severity and the likelihood of survival, not by age Not what is happening in Italy according to some accounts. Some over 65yos are not even getting assessed, never mind ventilated. Easier to filter due to age, than have to try to work out who is fitter or healthier. 1
2BGoodAgain Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 11 minutes ago, amaysngrace said: They’ll probably go by the severity and the likelihood of survival, not by age. There are a ton of older people who enjoy better health than some young people do. But age isn’t necessarily a determining factor although usually the younger the person the better their health. i'm sure... but there's the conflict... how do you really know? do you have time to look up someone's charts or medical history? do you wait or make a quick decision? in a perfect world where you have everyone's medical records and scans and latest charts... you can make an informed decision... but throw in chaos and an over loaded hospital system... and doctors will have to make a brief medical check and make a decision....
sothereiwas Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 So I went to Costco to get a few things today. They basically have everything with the possible exception of hand sanitizer, the really big bulk foods, and a few other small items. The high point for me was the dedicated mega-stack of pallets and pallets of TP, with a one-per-shopper limit. A veritable temple to the god of TP. I hope seeing that stack made the people who just got done hoarding it feel appropriately idiotic. But I doubt it. So yeah, no 25 pound bags of rice or beans but basically everything else, including everything* I wanted was there. *One exception: I normally get the 5 dozen egg pack, but that was all gone so I got 24 eggs, as they were also enforcing a one-egg-product per shopper limit ....
2BGoodAgain Posted March 18, 2020 Posted March 18, 2020 1 hour ago, Gaeta said: The problem with the younger generation is that they don't listen. They're out and about and partying as if they were invincible. Did you see Miami? Same with France right before they called in the Army. We experience the same difficulties here, groups of young people organizing secret parties. The young generation and the older generation, both are playing rebel and not taking this seriously. yeah... but when we were young...just how responsible were we? i'm not excusing their behavior, but the young are usually stupid for a reason.
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