Is it reasonable for me to be upset?

[NomiMalone]

OP, to me the issue isn't whether or not he's feeling it anymore. It's that his communication style isn't suitable for you. It wouldn't be for me, either, and I'd dump him whether he liked me or not.

 

I don't believe his behavior has anything to do with his age. I date men who are in their sixties and have found most are quite communicative.

 

However, for a woman who doesn't need much communication he might be fine. So be it, if that's suitable for such a woman.

 

Thank you LivingWaterPlease, I agree so much with this! I felt much better after reading your comment. It allowed me to realise that I deserve better FROM MYSELF - to remove myself from situations that were making me unhappy, regardless of what others in the same shoes would’ve done.

 

From now on, I’m only going to make decisions based on whether something is good for ME

[NomiMalone]

His age might explain a lot. I imagine he was gung-ho about texting initially because he's realized that it's many people's primary form of communication. But, now that you two are exclusive and he likes where things are at, he's might be showing he dislikes texting.

 

This is something that I struggle with as well. It's almost a necessity to text with many women early on to communicate. I dislike holding conversations via text and it but I'm open with women I am dating about this from the get-go. I will chit chat here and there via text but I won't hold long conversations; I'd rather chat over the phone.

 

The difference is that you are upfront from the get go about not being a texter (which there is absolutely nothing wrong with). Communication and letting your partner know what to expect is the key.

[NomiMalone]

I noticed you say you would be fine with low level texting if it was set like that from the beginning, but not ok with it when it was high at first then dropped down, correct ?

 

So you dont need texts to keep up your emotions, you are just simply worrying he is losing interest, right ?

 

If he can prove his love to you in other ways, would you still need high level of texting ?

 

Thank you, your comment really made me try to get to the bottom of WHY his lack of texts was upsetting me, and what I’d be happy to accept in a future relationship.

[NomiMalone]

Minimum effort, maximum return from his POV.

 

Wasn’t that the truth! I just wanted to say thank you for your replies, which are always spot on and full of insight.

[Lotsgoingon]

You stood and walked out in real time ... that's fantastic. I mean, most folks would have endured a miserable night, felt bad ... gone home ... felt like dirt ... and only then realized they wanted things to end.

 

You did great!

 

The entire goal of dating (and practicing dating) is to be real in the moment, to be assertive and clear in the moment, to stop when you know you're betraying yourself. And doing all of that is REALLY hard for most of us, especially those of us with weak boundaries or those of us who are people pleasers ... and of course hard for folks who are desperate.

 

So use that anger to solidify your conviction that in the future, at any moment in a relationship if things don't feel right, you can say something, ask for clarification (sometimes there's an innocent explanation for why someone is distant) ... or just leave.

 

It often takes disappointing, painful experiences like this to build that conviction, to build that new behavior, that new reflex. I can think of many moments in previous relationships where, if they happened now, I am standing up and leaving.

 

If you call him, keep the conversation really short. He knows why you walked out. He might pretend not to know. But he knows. You do not owe him some deep heart-felt explanation/justification. The relationship is working for me. Good luck.

 

Sometimes in the breakup explanation, you can lose emotional ground if you don't frame the conversation in the right way. The frame you want: you are unhappy, the relationship ain't working for you. You are announcing, not explaining.

[LivingWaterPlease]

Very classy how you handled the situation, NomiMalone! Way to go!

[NomiMalone]

Truth is I was already half checked out of the “relationship” and the way he jumped me on the couch last night was my “get out of jail free card” which I seized with both hands, to walk out and end it. TBH if he’d pulled that earlier in the relationship (when things were still good), I would’ve gone along with it. Sure I would’ve felt like crap, but I would’ve gone along anyway, not wanting to spoil the night.

 

I couldn’t bring myself to call him today to end it, I just sent a text saying that I felt we weren’t a match after all, but thank you for the fun times we did have, which were honestly great. I didn’t think there was any point in elaborating. Clearly something had happened between his birthday dinner (the night we had the serious conversation), and two days later when he abruptly withdrew and became cold. I guess I’ll never know what happened and I’ll find a way to close this chapter without knowing.

[LivingWaterPlease]

Truth is I was already half checked out of the “relationship” and the way he jumped me on the couch last night was my “get out of jail free card” which I seized with both hands, to walk out and end it...

 

You are one smart lady!

[rjc149]

On 11/28/2019 at 6:49 AM, NomiMalone said:

Update:

 

So the texting situation has not improved, even know he’s completely over his cold. He didn’t text me at all the day before. Mid-morning yesterday I received what seemed like an obligatory “Hi, how’s your day?” I promptly sent back a friendly, affectionate reply (the kind of texts we used to send) and used the nickname I have for him (he has not called me by mine since before the birthday dinner). I purposely didn’t ask any questions so I wouldn’t be hurt if he didn’t reply. Early in the evening, he sent a short, typo-riddled text about something he saw on the news.

 

I’m so fed up. It’s like he’s abruptly stopped being warm and affectionate after we had our serious conversation because he no longer feels he needs to make the effort. I’d have been ok with the lack of texts if he’d just said from the get go that he’s not a texter and never love bombed me to begin with. It was his very sudden and very marked withdrawal from texting that I’m unhappy with. I just feel neglected and upset.

 

We’d planned an evening at his place and I realised, for the first time since we started dating, I have no desire to sleep with him anymore. I don’t feel connected to him at all right now.

 

I really like this guy and I’m going to sit on this and wait and see if in time I can get used to the “new him”. If not, then we might have to go our separate ways because I don’t want to feel like this every day. I also know you can’t force someone to want to contact you. (Him sending a daily obligatory text devoid of affection just to appease me would be just as disappointing.)

 

FYI, I am 34, he just turned 51 in mid November. As much as I hate and don’t believe in generalisations, could it possibly be that men and women of his generation doesn’t see texting in between dates as much of a necessity?

 

I swear if it doesn’t work out with him (which is looking more and more likely by the day), I’m going to give up on relationships. I’m genuinely way happier and more content as a single person, and I strongly believe coupledom isn’t for everyone, despite what the norm in society is.

Hey Nomi, 

 

Reading this actually added a lot of insight to my most recent dating debacle. It really helped me understand how she was feeling, and why she checked out. I'm avoidant, she's anxious, it was long distance, and the communication simply wasn't enough for her. 

 

I'm sorry to hear that this went south for you, all the best. 

[NomiMalone]

Thanks rjc.

 

I suggest the book “Attached” by Amir Levine.

 

Are you looking for a long term relationship?

 

I’m happier, healthier and lead a more productive life when I’m single. I’m fully present at work and when I’m with family and friends. I enjoy food, cooking and exercise. I sleep better. I’m calm, contented and motivated, and I enjoy the little things in life, like taking the scenic route home from work. I’m not someone who feels like there is “something missing” when I’m single. One of my jobs is nightclub hostess/bartender which means I don’t feel like I’m lacking male attention in my life. 

 

Whereas in a relationship, half the time I find myself in flight/fight mode which is surely damaging to my health. When things are bad with my partner, I can’t eat and I waste loads of time cos I’m too anxious and pre-occupied to do anything. Im cranky with people. I stay in relationships long after I realise the guy is emotionally abusive (not the guy whom this thread is about, I’m referring to previous long term partners.) 

 

I’m starting to think that, for me, the benefits of having a partner are not worth the bad stuff. Sure the whole limerance thing and being on cloud nine is great, but I’d rather be happy everyday. 

 

Having said that, it’s from experiences in my relationships that I’ve derived the most self growth, and learnt some valuable lessons. Relationships teach us important lessons about how to communicate, and resolve conflict, how to see things from other perspectives, and how to become better people. 
 

All the best to you too.

Edited December 10, 2019 by NomiMalone

[NomiMalone]

I’d meant to write this update.

 

I’m writing to vent more than anything else as I know I only have myself to blame for my misery.

 

I’m ashamed to admit that I took the guy back after he spent 3 days love bombing me with declarations via phone and texts that he was sorry, that I meant so much to him, that he had never felt a connection like this with anyone else etc. His texts were back to how they used to be - flirty and affectionate. I stupidly agreed to meet for a coffee. And now I am back at square one, with him doing the fade out again. 

 

He was just so convincing, and I admit part of the reason I took him back was because I didn’t want him to remember me as the “crazy woman who walked out on him and dumped him”.  I just didn’t want to be that person. And we have loads of mutual friends and acquaintances and I didn’t want them to hear that from him and think I’m crazy. 

 

So now I have to think of a way to dump him, again, once and for all.

 

I can’t help but focus on how unfair this is - HE was the one who ruined our “relationship” by fading out, but I’M the crazy woman? Uggghhhh. 
 

I regret this so much.

Edited December 10, 2019 by NomiMalone

[PegNosePete]

Why do you care what he thinks of you? All this "crazy" stuff is your own interpretation right? He hasn't actually called you that - it's just your own imagination at what he might have said...?

 

And mutual friends, if they're really friends at all, will ask for your side of the story. If they believe the "crazy" story (if he even tells it...) without even asking you what happened then they aren't much of friends are they?

 

The text you sent to ditch him last time is perfectly good for this time too. Just text him that you don't feel you're a good match and you don't want to see him again, and you don't want him to text or call you any more. Then DON'T REPLY to ANYTHING he sends you!

 

[rjc149]

13 hours ago, NomiMalone said:

Having said that, it’s from experiences in my relationships that I’ve derived the most self growth, and learnt some valuable lessons. Relationships teach us important lessons about how to communicate, and resolve conflict, how to see things from other perspectives, and how to become better people. 

 

I am looking for something longer-term but I don't think I'm suited for one. Luckily, I've learned some very valuable lessons about women, communication, and emotional connection from painful heartbreak. No pain no gain. 

 

10 hours ago, NomiMalone said:

I didn’t want him to remember me as the “crazy woman who walked out on him and dumped him”.  I just didn’t want to be that person. And we have loads of mutual friends and acquaintances and I didn’t want them to hear that from him and think I’m crazy. 

 

So now I have to think of a way to dump him, again, once and for all.

 

Well, a lot of women mate-select based on reputation and peer approval (pre-selection) so while it's easy to simply say "why do you give a f--k what your friends think?" I totally get where you're coming from. Especially considering that while this guy isn't meeting your needs, he hasn't done anything objectively "wrong" per se except trigger your emotional anxiety. It's just wrong for you. 

 

Have you had an explicit face to face discussion with this guy about your communication needs? Some guys need to be given instructions. You can't always assume or expect that they know better. They're not under-performing because they don't care about you -- some guys really do not have a clue that they are hurting you and alienating you with their communication style, unless you tell them. 

 

I woman I loved told me (albeit in the form of a manipulative fake breakup) that the lack of frequency and affection in my communication was extremely hurtful to her. In so many words I told her "whatever, I'm not changing for you, go date someone else." And that's eventually what she did. And it broke me heart. And I had that coming. 

 

But why not at least give this guy a warning and a chance to shape up. I dunno. 

Edited December 10, 2019 by rjc149

[NomiMalone]

@rjc149 Sorry to hear it didn’t work out with your girlfriend. You seem very self aware. I think for me, the hardest thing to accept sometimes is that you can’t change the other person, or some things about yourself, like your attachment style. You just have to do the right thing by both of you even if it means parting ways. 

 

I’d told the guy earlier (when he first started fading out) that receiving texts from him made me happy and would love it if he sent me a little one every day. I said that once and don’t want to push the issue again. 

 

I can’t make him want to text me, and receiving obligatory texts from him would be just as bad. It feels like a bait and switch where he does the love bombing thing as part of the chase, and once he’s “hooked” me, he switches.  

[stillafool]

Did you send him the second "we aren't going to work" text yet?

[NomiMalone]

I haven’t yet. I plan to say it face to face and have asked him out for coffee on Sunday morning. I plan to give him the Christmas gift I’d bought (a month or so ago, the day after we had the serious conversation about our “relationship”). I think he’ll really like it and I still want him to have it. 

 

How do you all think I should phrase it when I tell him? 

[rjc149]

I honestly don't believe you've had enough of a relationship to warrant the courtesy of an in-person breakup. A phone call would be fine, I would at least give him the courtesy of hearing you explain your decision rather than a curt text. But sitting face to face could draw the conversation out unnecessarily and lead it to an unintended destination. With a phone call, you say your piece, ask him to respect your wishes, and hang up. It's a clean break. Face to face could get messy. You could also end up taking him back for another shot, since it doesn't seem like you're totally over him. 

 

If you're trying to present a united front, then the gift would give him very mixed signals. Again, I don't think you've been together long enough to warrant a parting gift. He now has something to remind him of being dumped by you.

Edited December 12, 2019 by rjc149

[Lotsgoingon]

Giving someone a present at a breakup is not good. I'm sorry. You're sending double messages--to yourself as much as to him.

 

A breakup meeting should be we meet for 5 minutes. I tell you I want to end things. And we move on. You get together with him ... I guarantee--would put money on it!--you'll send him again ... He'll lovebomb you once more and you'll come running back to him. The reason isn't weakness. The reason is because the gift is totally misplaced. Remember gift-giving, if done right, is exciting for the giver ... but in this case, any excitement will blur and cross over into affection ... Return the gift or burn it. 

 

Your job right now is to NOT CARE about what he thinks or feels. You're not his mom. 

 

And as for getting back with him out of worry of being a "crazy woman"--where did you get that nutty idea? When I was younger and inconsistent with women (hot and cold like this guy), the women who marched out the door, who took a stand, were the women I really respected. I was blown away by their forcefulness, their confidence, their sanity, their willingness to call things out--even when I didn't have words for it. I learned from those women. I learned that it's OK to say you're unhappy and bolt out of misery-making, inconsistent relationship. 

 

Your task #1: interrogate that "crazy woman" narrative you got going in your head. Somehow you are conflating looking after yourself with being labeled crazy? ... Save that label for stalkers! And yes, you have to stomp, crush and burn the idea that what he thinks about you matters. It doesn't.

 

That's a completely self-destructive, self-harming idea. No one would quit a terrible job, complain about an abusive boss, stand up to an abusive government or stand up themselves in any way if they embraced this line of thinking. Write out that idea on some paper ... and go somewhere and burn the paper. And start burning the idea in your mind as well. 

 

 

 

Edited December 12, 2019 by Lotsgoingon

[Ambereyes]

To be honest Im very confused why you are so sad and wants to break up with him....You were texting like 24/7 for 2 months, it's about time someone slows down? We are all busy after all, and he still texted every day anyway, isnt that enough? You said yourself you didnt need a lot of text,  and he told you how much he likes you, I can't see the problem here..

 

Then you got really sad and angry because he wanted to have sex with you? I really dont understand this part..you should be worried if he doesnt want sex, not the other way round? 

 

Maybe I missed something..but sounds like you dont believe he is genuine. It's you decided to break this for good, fair enough. Just tell him how you truly feel and wish him bye

 

 

 

[fishlips]

On 11/28/2019 at 3:49 AM, NomiMalone said:

FYI, I am 34, he just turned 51 in mid November. As much as I hate and don’t believe in generalisations, could it possibly be that men and women of his generation doesn’t see texting in between dates as much of a necessity?

 

Yes, absolutely. I'm close to his age and people that age don't text much. Cell phones weren't around when I was a teenager and in my 20s. I wouldn't throw out your relationship because he doesn't text as much as you do. Is he attentive when you are together? How often do you see him?

[NomiMalone]

Ok... y’all right. I’ll keep the gift. 

 

Thanks @Lotsgoingon Can I ask why you were hot and cold towards girls in the past? Just trying to understand this guy’s mindset.

 

@fishlips That makes so much sense. We see each other about once a week. He has family visiting for Christmas but he hasn’t said when. I asked him (in small talk) yesterday and all he said was, “soon”. He hasn’t asked what I’m doing for Christmas (going interstate). I think he sees me as more of a FWB which is not what I want. 

 

[Lotsgoingon]

NomiMalone, you ask why I was so hot and cold in my younger years. 

 

There are several reasons ... hard to quickly explain. But basically I like people ... love people ... and there were women I would meet, and love interacting with ... and assume I wanted to date them ... and then ... when we started to date, I would sorta wake up and go, hey, I don't really want to date this person. Only I didn't know how to say that directly. 

 

The bottom line is I was immature and impulsive ... and I had terrible boundaries. With terrible boundaries, I was bad at being clear about what I wanted and didn't want ... and terrible at saying that. So I would withdraw instead of telling the other person what I was thinking and feeling. Now, I know I need to tell the person ... because sometimes they can (we can) make an adjustment that satisfies me. I grew up in a family where people didn't know how to set boundaries ... and it's boundaries that allow us the freedom to get involved ...because you know, hey if I'm unhappy I can say so ... if I don't like something someone does, I will say so, I need to say so. 

 

That's some of what was going on. So, yes, I recognize my own behavior so often when people come onto LS and report dealing with a guy who is hot-and-cold. And as I say, the sharpest women I got involved with did not tolerate my inconsistency. They would speak their minds and move on. It was only later, when I learned about boundaries ... and got better at really dating people I truly liked ... that I can look back and see how maddening the younger me was.

 

And in an irony, I later in life encountered women who were hot and cold, and I got a taste of my own medicine ... And unlike the sharpest women who would dump me quickly back in the day, I actually hung around and got burned. Putting those two experiences together (being the hot and cold on and later dating people who were hot and cold) has convinced me that encountering any ambivalence early on ... is a red flag. Someone who is ready to date and wants to be with you ... will prioritize you. If you have to think about whether you're prioritized, in my experience, that means you are not. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[stillafool]

11 hours ago, NomiMalone said:

Quote

Ok... y’all right. I’ll keep the gift. 

 

Are you still planning to meet him to break up?  I also don't see the purpose of this.  You make a quick call and end it.  I thought you had blocked him before?

 

 

[Eternal Sunshine]

Because she is not going to end it until he dumps her. I always see it in threads like this, it's all talk - OP doesn't have the strength to walk away.

 

I'm not saying this to be mean. It actually reminds me of myself when I was younger.

[2BGoodAgain]

On ‎11‎/‎21‎/‎2019 at 5:32 AM, NomiMalone said:

So I’ve been dating a guy for almost 2 months. Things have been great and we’ve been meeting up a few times a week. We send flirty texts to each other daily, with him initiating 95% of the time. Last Thursday was his birthday and after going for dinner, we had the most open, candid conversation we’ve had so far about future plans. We were both on the same page about wanting commitment (him initiating, seeming very genuine, and me agreeing.) He suggested we go to a show the Friday after (tomorrow evening now).

 

2 days after his birthday however, I felt things between us change quite tangibly. Firstly, he no longer texted me during the day, only in the evenings, so we’d go the whole day without texting. He no longer called me by the nickname he has for me, and the texts were no longer flirty, just “how was your day” type texts. I knew he’d come down with a cold so I just put it down to him not feeling well. I also gave him space by not replying for hours, and not calling. (Which led to him sending even more texts, but still not our usual type of texts.) Then, today, I initiated the texting by asking him how he was feeling, and suggested that we didn’t have to go to the show tomorrow night if he wasn’t feeling up to it, we could just have a bite at mine. He replied that he was feeling way better, with a smiley emoji. No mention about the show at all. This was half an hour ago.

 

I’m beyond crushed by his sudden change of demeanour. I haven’t replied. I just needed to know what our plans for tomorrow night were. I don’t care if we go to the show or not. I do realise there’s a school of thought out there that believes men retreat into these “caves” or whatever when they need space, and we women are supposed to patiently wait for them to come out. But I personally don’t think that’s acceptable behaviour for an adult. Surely he’d know I’d be hurt.

 

No one will never know the real reason for his change of behaviour. But what I want to know is - do you think it’s reasonable for me to be upset over this?

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Edited December 13, 2019 by 2BGoodAgain
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