M(29) Me and F(31 Single Mom)

[Venn]

So I met this single mom in Tinder for about 3 months now... I didn't court her yet but we had a lot in common and talk to the phone for like every day and eventually did video calls as well. I tried to be as honest as I can be in our conversations and even told about my pasts and negatives... she somehow still accepted for what I am and am sensing attraction in our conversations as she is always happy to hear from me or even call me (I think?). Sometimes she would be the one to initiate the call as well.

 

I told her everything about me being kind of a shut-in (or NEET), and that I am a bit weird which she still does accept for who I am. I sing songs for her every day (in the phone because she requested it) and even write poems although not really hinting that it's directed to her I also have a feeling that she kinda gets the signal (or so I think?)... she even records them in her phone and sometimes let her child listen to it (who I also talk on the phone sometimes in calls and video calls listen to my poems and me singing).

 

After around 3 months we decided that we will meet each other since we only have a 30-minute distance to each other... She did ask me about "will the late-night convos and all the singing stop all of a sudden when we meet?" she asked me... I assured her that nothing will change... and then she told me she was afraid that it will be gone if my parents knew that I am talking to a single mom... and said that if my parents know about it someday, she is "ready for it".

 

During the day when we were meeting, her daughter was confused why all of a sudden she was going to go somewhere without her as she always is with her every time she goes to the city. Also, she created an alibi to her mother (which takes care of her daughter while she is away). I forgot to mention that they are 1 hour apart from travel with her daughter and is living in an apartment near her workplace... she works 6 days a week as a sales clerk and only has 1 day off a week. In 1 month, she can only afford to go home twice in every 2 weeks as a travel fee is costly for her.

 

I was kind of hesitant as I did have phobias in past meetups with women because it's either I get ghosted or get slowly faded... the good thing on those women was I did not invest that much feelings for them so I didn't even get hurt. So we met in person, shaken hands, talked a lot about what we usually talked on the phone and This case, on the other hand, I do have feelings for her though I did not tell her about it yet at that time.

 

I always checked to see if some behavior has changed after our meeting... just right after the meeting, it all felt fine until the way she texts kinda changes... there's no usual smiley or that her texts felt kinda bland (or at least I thought it was kind of bland). During our conversations, we were always as honest as possible... though we never really opened up about what we feel for each other. But she did compare me to her ex a lot of times but she also assures that she has already moved on as it was already 2 years ago and they never spoke again...

 

So in the first day after the meeting, I sensed a small change in her behavior and I was asking what was wrong... she felt guilty that she lied to her mom and left her daughter having to spend some time with me. She had a heavy heart already even before we met. I told her that we are never doing things like this again.

 

She also told me about why she is afraid of my parents. It was because of her ex's parents that told them to break up with her because she is a single mom. And that because she was a single mom is what caused her parents and relatives to ultimately cause their relationship to break up. So she is afraid at some point that my parents will know that I am communicating with her... but she did say that she is "strong enough to fight it and is willing to go for it all over again if she has to"... I am not sure what it means... maybe you guys can translate?

 

So the next few days, the texts and calls got lesser and lesser as I was expecting and I was asking her about it again... and this is where I got a taste of how she is when she is angry:

 

(COPIED TEXT FROM HER)

"Why are you acting like this? you treat me like I am not your friend anymore and I came to a thought of "what are we?". Every day, I feel like you oblige me to respond to every message and call. Which is I don't know what you want to happen between the two of us? You care for me too much that I don't even know how to label it. If you don't have plans for me then put please put some boundaries.

 

It is annoying to the point that you are acting like a boyfriend which in fact you are not. I won't say it's okay cause it's really not. It's almost getting creepy like you will ask how busy I am, what time this and that, you are acting like my ex when we were together... not when he was still courting me. He is acting like you are right now when we were together and it became worse day by day.

It's almost I can't breathe... It is suffocating actually. It's like I don't have a will of my own... It's like every hour and every minute I have to update. I mean you are not even in a relationship yet and you are acting like that... how much more if you do get a relationship?

 

We have our own world... there are things that need privacy. Even husbands and wives should put a little space that respect and trust remains. We can't evolve our attention to one thing only. Everyone has their own life. The more you hold on to something, the more it slips, The more it loosens... and You are too innocent to realize that.

 

That doesn't mean that you cut the connection, you have just let them breathe. If living a sheltered innocent life is what you chose, then live with that if you are happy with it. No need to change your self just to please everybody. I hope in a way, you get my point. Anyways... what's bygone is bygone... May God bless you and your holy mind. (we are both Born Again Christians by the way).

 

After that, I was speechless and labeled myself with one sentence: CLINGY EVEN WHEN STILL NOT IN A RELATIONSHIP WITH HER. I was speechless because I thought she was okay with it... I didn't notice that I was getting annoying... or maybe I was just basing it to the tone of her voice from the calls/video calls, I posted a long list of "sorry for not noticing" and eventually told her what I felt for her but she just said, "just sleep".

 

And as of this writing, this is pretty much what happened between the two of us... hope you guys can give me your input on how to deal with the situation and hopefully I can sleep well tonight... I have a high chance of getting 3 AM Thoughts all over again as I have anxiety... but here's to me I get a good night's sleep.

 

TL;DR: Met someone on Tinder, talked for 3 months, became way too clingy and now she's annoyed. Hope I can sleep...

[lakerman34]

This seems very open and closed to me.

 

You said EXACTLY what happened....not much more to analyze. You met, spoke a bit, got too clingy, and she got annoyed. There's really nothing else to it.

 

I will say this: after reading your first paragraph, "talking about my past and negatives" -- this is just not the way to start conversation with someone you are trying to court. Next time, I'd air on the side of "light and fun." First dates should ALWAYS be light and fun (and if you were video chatting for hours, I'd consider those dates).

 

The heavy stuff comes out LATER. You jumped into the heavy stuff way too quickly. The woman may have thought you were friendly, so hung around for a bit. It became too much for her.

 

Also, everything she said to you seemed about spot on to me. You were trying to be her boyfriend when you weren't. You were making her feel like she was the center of your universe, and that upset her and made her feel like the whole thing was a lot.

 

She's right -- find something that is interesting to you. I've been on many dates in my life, and I'd say the time when I was the most successful at dating was also when I was at my busiest. I didn't have time to worry about how the woman I went out with the night before was feeling or thinking because, well, I had my own job and hobbies to attend to.

 

My advice -- find something that interests you. Something that would cause you to leave the house. It doesn't have to be something where you necessarily have to interact with a lot of other people (if you have social anxiety), but something that will get your mind off of other things, like this woman.

 

Then, eventually, join something a bit more social. Be nice, keep things light and easy. Talk about the weather. Talk about sports. Talk about the latest movies. Whatever.

 

Eventually, someone will want to talk to you a bit more...

Edited November 14, 2019 by a LoveShack.org Moderator

[PRW]

My advice...

Very good response to the OP.

 

With the OP being a Christian I wish there were good dating guides and materials from Christian authors,...but there are not. All the material I know of are secular and are probably too hedonistic for him to learn from.

 

The problem with the Christian material is that they completely skip over the Introduction, Pickup, and Casual Dating phases before you get to being Exclusive in a actual BF/GF Relationship. With them it is just all of a sudden one morning "Poof!" you are BF/GF with someone and their advice basically consists of, "Read your Bible, Go to church, and don't have sex till you are married". That is pretty much it. Nothing on approach, confidence, avoiding clingy-ness, regulating the process, maintaining balance, social awkwardness, social calibration. They leave out all the very things that everyone (Christian or not) has the most extremely difficult time with. Most people, if they can reach Exclusivity "cleanly" without mistakes & problems, then they tend to do OK from that point, but that is the hardest part to accomplish.

[fromheart]

Don't date 31 year old single moms man, your 29. You should be dating 21+ year old free and single young women, with no baggage and their lives in front of them.

[lakerman34]

There's nothing wrong with dating 31 year old moms, OP. Just understand exactly what you want and expect from the relationship, be very communicative about that, and if you want a relationship with the woman (and ONLY if you are serious with her), you will eventually have to interact with the kid.

 

If you are not trying to be serious, you should not meet the kid.

 

Still, in your shoes (I'm actually also 29), I would be dating someone 25-31 years old, give or take a year on both ends.

[Venn]

This seems very open and closed to me.

You said EXACTLY what happened....not much more to analyze. You met, spoke a bit, got too clingy, and she got annoyed. There's nothing else to it.

 

With the OP being a Christian I wish there were good dating guides and materials from Christian authors,...but there are not. All the material I know of is secular and are probably too hedonistic for him to learn from.

 

I was just shocked by the revelation that she hated the way I treated her. I mean there are times when I sing for her, she says "thank you for singing me that song, I will never forget it" and "thank you for singing me songs every day. It means so much to me" and also the "endless late-night convos where we don't run out of topics".

 

There was also a time when she got a catfight with her close friends at work I comforted her on what happened... she sobbed a lot when I called her and even wished I was there for her in person so I can comfort her... and at that time she said "I just wish you were here".

 

And then she was even worried that if my parents found out that I am talking to a single mom, she might get judged by them and even asked me:

 

"so will there be changes after we meet I wonder? Like maybe old habits will die... The way we used to do every day, every night, now and then... The chats, late convos... I am really just afraid your parents will judge me just because I am a single mom... it happened with my ex before and is the reason why we broke up.... depression is no joke at all and it really affected me before... but I am strong after all... and I am willing for that to happen all over again."

 

I don't know if I was too assuming? But the way she texts... the way her voice sounds during calls... it feels like she is attracted at least? Or is this all in my imagination and I am just assuming she is attracted to me? I don't want to ask her yet as it might seem rude to her if I ask her directly. I wanted to take things slow... but it got out of hand quick...

 

Is it a good time to message her I wonder? Maybe just 1 message a day? saying how good her day was going? and maybe some inspirational verses from the Bible?

Edited November 12, 2019 by Venn

[Interstellar]

I’d drop her, She’s out. Block and Delete. Next!

[ExpatInItaly]

It doesn't sound like either of you have the healthiest approach to relationships.

 

I would be wary of anyone who needs to lie to their parents to go on a date, OP. Ditto for anyone who needs 3 months of talking before they will meet you in person, when you only live 30 minutes apart. All this chatting about your own perceived flaws is a bad idea, too. Bonding over dysfunction is never a good sign.

 

Add to that your anxiety and apparent smothering behavior - this one is done.

[Venn]

It doesn't sound like either of you have the healthiest approach to relationships.

 

I would be wary of anyone who needs to lie to their parents to go on a date, OP. Ditto for anyone who needs 3 months of talking before they will meet you in person, when you only live 30 minutes apart. All this chatting about your own perceived flaws is a bad idea, too. Bonding over dysfunction is never a good sign.

 

Add to that your anxiety and apparent smothering behavior - this one is done.

 

I'll try to see if she is really done... if not, oh well... if she judges me because I smothered her for a time and not giving me any second chances, then I can't do anything about it.

[fromheart]

There's nothing wrong with dating 31 year old moms, OP. Just understand exactly what you want and expect from the relationship, be very communicative about that, and if you want a relationship with the woman (and ONLY if you are serious with her), you will eventually have to interact with the kid.

 

If you are not trying to be serious, you should not meet the kid.

 

Still, in your shoes (I'm actually also 29), I would be dating someone 25-31 years old, give or take a year on both ends.

 

I didn't say it was wrong, but if you want a relationship and maybe kids, there's a far better chance of that and less pressure, with a younger woman who has no children.

 

And the fact of the matter is that the best women are usually taken when they are younger. A harsh truth. A young woman in her physical prime, childbirth years, has femininity and isn't bat sh#i crazy will be snapped up quickly.

[ExpatInItaly]

I'll try to see if she is really done... if not, oh well... if she judges me because I smothered her for a time and not giving me any second chances, then I can't do anything about it.

 

That isn't the only problem here, though.

 

Why does a 31-year-old need to lie to her mother about going on a date?

[basil67]

I'll try to see if she is really done... if not, oh well... if she judges me because I smothered her for a time and not giving me any second chances, then I can't do anything about it.

 

This strikes me as an odd response. Is there nothing about your own behaviour here which you would do differently in future?

[basil67]

That isn't the only problem here, though.

 

Why does a 31-year-old need to lie to her mother about going on a date?

 

Possibly because grandmother is caring for the child 6 days a week and thinks that mom should be with the child for the other day? Not an unreasonable expectation.

[ExpatInItaly]

Possibly because grandmother is caring for the child 6 days a week and thinks that mom should be with the child for the other day? Not an unreasonable expectation.

 

This was my point, actually. It was a rhetorical question for OP.

 

If she can't go on one date without having to lie about it, I don't see how having an actual relationship is going to be feasible at this point in her life.

[lakerman34]

To each their own, but in your shoes, she wouldn't be worth all this headache to me.

 

There are sane women out there that want to meet you in person. Go find them.

[Venn]

.

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SO HERE IS ONE OF MY QUESTIONS"

What does it mean for her when she said "I am afraid I will be judged again because I am a single mom. But I am willing to go over at it again if I have to

 

"I miss our Bible Study sessions. Hopefully, if we have time we can go back at it again"

 

And her line "I want to be with someone who loves God more than himself. And eventually, love God more than me"

 

Sometimes she is even the one calling me

And sometimes count the number of minutes I haven't responded or straight-up "ooh took you a long time to respond"

 

Or "thank you for singing me that song. I will never forget it."

"I saved your video singing to me and playing your guitar so I can listen to it anytime"

"I'm having trouble sleeping. Maybe you can sing that favorite song for me?"

And "just to tell you, every time you sing a song, it means so much to me"

 

And when she had a terrible girl fight with her friend where they were pulling hairs, I kept on tabs with her... telling her what medicine to take, and just sleep it off. And then she would say "Thank you so much for caring for me. I just wish you were here"

 

"Now I know I can talk a lot of things for you... not just happy things and Bible studies but also things like this (her fight with her friend).

 

Or when I give her something new to learn on Bible study she would say "all of what you said is so crystal clear. May God Bless you in every way he can"...

 

And when I sang for her daughter she said: "thank you for singing to my daughter.. she likes it so much that I saved your video to my phone so she can listen to it anytime."

 

Her: "Oh you are going with your family today? Have fun? Can I come?"

Me: "Yeah Sure"

Her: "I'm not joking (not sure if she's really joking or not) how will you introduce me to them?"

Me: "This is (Her). She is a Hardworking Single mom"

 

NOTE: This was all before the incident happened.

Edited November 14, 2019 by Venn

[ExpatInItaly]

She built up a fantasy version of you in her mind, but didn't feel it in person. She sounds very child-like for a 31-year-old mother.

 

Next tine, don't communicate so long before meeting. You became attached to a fantasy rather than reality.

Edited November 14, 2019 by ExpatInItaly

[Venn]

By the next day when I tried to contact her last night and she told me not to call me as it is the best that we don't call. Then I told her that I loved her and asked if she feels the same way. She told me:

 

"No. I don't feel the same way anymore. Maybe before but not really that intimate. All of that was gone after I figured it out that you were acting like my ex. At least my ex was acting like that AFTER we were together. You, on the other hand, were acting like that when we were friends."

 

A searing pain I felt in my heart and then asked her if it was after the meeting.

 

"No after the meeting, that was it."

 

And then I thanked her for the time, told her that our meeting was not an accident, still thanked her for the time she had given me. Basically a long list of thank-yous and then not getting even one reply after that.

 

The next day (today) I discovered that there is a church near our area because she did look for a church somewhere near her area every time she goes back home. And just replied with a short text:

 

"thank you for telling".

 

I still have a long list of bucket lists to give her after it... back then she requested me to sing her daughter's favorite song this December 21 and her own birthday this January 8.