Dating a single mother with three young children

[Kitty Tantrum]

My two boys were 5 and 7 when my fiance and I met. It's been four years now and we're getting married next month. He doesn't want to have any children of his own, but gets on quite well with mine - and they respect him.

 

He met my kids before we ever got involved, because we met socially. Personally I find the whole "don't meet the kids until you're in a relationship" thing to be REALLY WEIRD and NOT NORMAL - a product of our bass-ackwards modern dating culture. Basically you wanna bang but also keep one foot safely out the door. I don't see that as a formula for success on any level if you actually want a "proper relationship." I don't see how I could ever get INTO an actual established relationship with a man without first seeing how he interacts with and treats my children. I can't imagine being like "OK boys, here's this totally new person you've never met, and he's already my boyfriend!" I know you didn't ask for advice on that front and you seem pretty firm about your approach, but that's my two cents.

 

As for what's in it for HIM... well, it's certainly true that in the beginning there was less time for us to spend together than there would have been if I were childless, even though my ex-husband did have them sometimes. But now that we are IN a "proper relationship," it's not like there's anything he doesn't "get" out of the relationship that he would have gotten if we'd met while I was childless and I'd had kids with him - aside from the fact that the kids aren't his.

 

I'm going to say another unpopular thing here, but I attribute a lot of our relationship success to the fact that he's NOT "second place" to my children. Most people seem to think that "the kids are #1" is just the way it is or should be. You seem to have this same perspective with regard to your own kids - where companionship with a woman is just a "bonus" but the kids "always come first."

 

I have a RESPONSIBILITY and an OBLIGATION to my children, and I also love them deeply, and I would never neglect or marginalize them for the sake of a romantic interest or any other personal desire. HOWEVER, they're going to grow up and start families of their own, whereas the relationship I've built with my fiance is intended to be a lasting partnership, hopefully until one of us dies.

 

I am always responsible for making sure my children's needs are met. I am not always responsible for making sure my fiance's needs are met, because he's a grown man. But in matters of "wants" it's much more equal. Also, sometimes the kids' needs/wants can be outsourced while his cannot - and vice versa. There is no "kids always come first" in my book - at least in terms of bending over backwards to always be the person who does everything for them all the time, like what that phrase seems to mean most of the time. I don't think that's healthy.

 

I guess what I'm seeing here is that it's not really just a question of whether she has the time and energy to date and get into a relationship because she's a single mom. This is less about her reserves and more about your own stipulations and requirements for a potential relationship. I think these things are just as likely to limit your success with childless women because you are a single father, and these issues seem to boil more down to matters of principle than of time and energy.

 

That is, if what you really want is a "proper relationship" and not just dating/companionship/sex.

 

There's a huge difference between looking to squeeze some time and intimacy out of a woman, and looking to settle down with one.

 

If my fiance had just wanted a woman locked down and on-call for regular intimacy and companionship without actually settling down, that wouldn't have worked out with me. Because he didn't shy away from putting both feet in, now he's the King of the Castle.

 

Now, one thing you mentioned that does give me pause is her kids' extracurriculars (sports, etc.) and her animal fostering. Those are not "default good single mom things." They're also not necessarily BAD things. But I would give them a close look.

 

Some single moms might really be in a tight spot and not have much of a family/community network to fall back on, and they might legitimately not have a ton of time for "dating" - but if circumstances change (family member or good friend moves nearby and helps with kids, or they find a guy who helps ease up some of their other burdens) and they find themselves with more time on their hands, they WANT to use that time to focus on their man.

 

On the other hand, some single moms HAVE a good support network in place but don't take advantage of it because they prefer to be neurotic and helicoptering and always too busy. If you get one of those, it doesn't really matter if you're rich and you wife her up and let her quit her job and her parents are beating down the door offering to take the kids for this night or that weekend - she'll STILL be too busy with her special needs rescue dog or her important social organization meetings or whatever to prioritize her relationship.

 

It's a phenomenon that's not limited to single mothers, either. There are some folks out there who just will load their plates up with commitments and obligations, whether consciously or subconsciously, for the purpose of being UNAVAILABLE. I don't recommend getting involved with one of those, even if really hot and childless.

Edited October 7, 2019 by Kitty Tantrum

[Trail Blazer]

Why don't you date single, child free women?

 

Who says I don't? I have done so on multiple occasions. I date whoever piques my interest.

[Trail Blazer]

@Kitty, interesting perspective. I will give further thought to some of your points. Thanks!

[mark clemson]

I am not a parent, at 44 I am too old for kids now. But I am seeing someone now with 3 kids...

 

 

BTW, congrats on the relationship Mortensorchid!

[findingnemo]

Maybe it can work. Maybe it won't. It depends.

 

I am a mother of 3 kids aged 15, 12 and 10. I date but it has been hard. The first problem is time, of course. Where I live we have helpers and such so it is not about the work load. Rather, I spend time with them doing homework without fail every week day evening. The rest of the time I work and have my own school on the weekends. Dating with that kind of schedule has been doable for me, so I think it is possible for her.

 

The problem I encountered was the kids themselves. Maybe because mine are older, they have taken to voicing their opinion about all sorts of things. They couldn't stand me dating AT ALL. I met someone a few years ago and although he was nice enough, my children got upset when he started coming to visit me at home. When it looked like we were getting serious. They had nothing personal against him. Just hated the idea of him. That died a sudden death. So that could cause problems for her. As a mother, she will automatically sacrifice her own happiness if she senses that her children are not comfortable.

 

Time may not be the only problem potential problem. Perhaps both of you will figure out a way to ease the kids into it when/if things work out. I couldn't. Not with my culture and huge extended family of well-meaning busybodies. I am now dating someone who I have yet to introduce to them. Coming on 3 years... (Another story for another thread.)

 

Take it slow. Bear with her. And beware of the three little ones and their opinions. I am rooting for you!

[snowcones]

She's said in her bio that she's not in a rush to force a relationship. She wants to develop a good friendship before possibly moving forward.

 

That's all cool with me. I've been through a bit myself, so I'm in no means in a rush to push for a relationship, either. However, I don't want to invest in someone who has a confliction between what they desire and what they can handle in practical reality.

 

My ex was lonely and in the beginning told me how much she valued having another (male) adult around. She wanted someone to make her feel like she wasn't solely defined as a mother. She wanted to feel loved again, desired, which is what she got with me. She got her fix of having a man swooning over her, taking her (and her son) out for dinner, passionate sex, all of those things. It was as though I filled a need for a while and when I was no longer required I was expendable.

 

If I commit to someone I do it with the view of long-term. One night stands are different, most of us have had those. That's not what I'm after here, nor am I thinking that this girl would be anywhere close to wanting a FWB scenario. She doesn't seem like the type. So it's a committed relationship (eventually) or nothing. Amd that's what I need to work out, whether it's worth my time investing into.

 

 

Okay now that you've said you have kids, that changes thing. If you have 50% custody, then yes, I think this can work out. You are both still in the throws of taking care of kids. You probably don't mind that kind of family life and are ready for it. I say go for it then. Me personally? I'm past child-rearing and would not date someone with minor children anymore.

Edited October 8, 2019 by snowcones

[snowcones]

My two boys were 5 and 7 when my fiance and I met. It's been four years now and we're getting married next month. He doesn't want to have any children of his own, but gets on quite well with mine - and they respect him.

 

He met my kids before we ever got involved, because we met socially. Personally I find the whole "don't meet the kids until you're in a relationship" thing to be REALLY WEIRD and NOT NORMAL - a product of our bass-ackwards modern dating culture. Basically you wanna bang but also keep one foot safely out the door. I don't see that as a formula for success on any level if you actually want a "proper relationship." I don't see how I could ever get INTO an actual established relationship with a man without first seeing how he interacts with and treats my children. I can't imagine being like "OK boys, here's this totally new person you've never met, and he's already my boyfriend!" I know you didn't ask for advice on that front and you seem pretty firm about your approach, but that's my two cents.

 

As for what's in it for HIM... well, it's certainly true that in the beginning there was less time for us to spend together than there would have been if I were childless, even though my ex-husband did have them sometimes. But now that we are IN a "proper relationship," it's not like there's anything he doesn't "get" out of the relationship that he would have gotten if we'd met while I was childless and I'd had kids with him - aside from the fact that the kids aren't his.

 

I'm going to say another unpopular thing here, but I attribute a lot of our relationship success to the fact that he's NOT "second place" to my children. Most people seem to think that "the kids are #1" is just the way it is or should be. You seem to have this same perspective with regard to your own kids - where companionship with a woman is just a "bonus" but the kids "always come first."

 

I have a RESPONSIBILITY and an OBLIGATION to my children, and I also love them deeply, and I would never neglect or marginalize them for the sake of a romantic interest or any other personal desire. HOWEVER, they're going to grow up and start families of their own, whereas the relationship I've built with my fiance is intended to be a lasting partnership, hopefully until one of us dies.

 

I am always responsible for making sure my children's needs are met. I am not always responsible for making sure my fiance's needs are met, because he's a grown man. But in matters of "wants" it's much more equal. Also, sometimes the kids' needs/wants can be outsourced while his cannot - and vice versa. There is no "kids always come first" in my book - at least in terms of bending over backwards to always be the person who does everything for them all the time, like what that phrase seems to mean most of the time. I don't think that's healthy.

 

I guess what I'm seeing here is that it's not really just a question of whether she has the time and energy to date and get into a relationship because she's a single mom. This is less about her reserves and more about your own stipulations and requirements for a potential relationship. I think these things are just as likely to limit your success with childless women because you are a single father, and these issues seem to boil more down to matters of principle than of time and energy.

 

That is, if what you really want is a "proper relationship" and not just dating/companionship/sex.

 

There's a huge difference between looking to squeeze some time and intimacy out of a woman, and looking to settle down with one.

 

If my fiance had just wanted a woman locked down and on-call for regular intimacy and companionship without actually settling down, that wouldn't have worked out with me. Because he didn't shy away from putting both feet in, now he's the King of the Castle.

 

Now, one thing you mentioned that does give me pause is her kids' extracurriculars (sports, etc.) and her animal fostering. Those are not "default good single mom things." They're also not necessarily BAD things. But I would give them a close look.

 

Some single moms might really be in a tight spot and not have much of a family/community network to fall back on, and they might legitimately not have a ton of time for "dating" - but if circumstances change (family member or good friend moves nearby and helps with kids, or they find a guy who helps ease up some of their other burdens) and they find themselves with more time on their hands, they WANT to use that time to focus on their man.

 

On the other hand, some single moms HAVE a good support network in place but don't take advantage of it because they prefer to be neurotic and helicoptering and always too busy. If you get one of those, it doesn't really matter if you're rich and you wife her up and let her quit her job and her parents are beating down the door offering to take the kids for this night or that weekend - she'll STILL be too busy with her special needs rescue dog or her important social organization meetings or whatever to prioritize her relationship.

 

It's a phenomenon that's not limited to single mothers, either. There are some folks out there who just will load their plates up with commitments and obligations, whether consciously or subconsciously, for the purpose of being UNAVAILABLE. I don't recommend getting involved with one of those, even if really hot and childless.

 

 

So true, so true.

 

 

 

It's not easy to screen for someone who is going to make you their priority, like you make them your priority. It's something you find out along the way and then it gets hard and messy trying to breakup with them for not being attentive enough. They usually don't understand and are full of excuses and defensiveness. Men do this too, btw (they'll be workaholics, for example)

 

 

It's really difficult to navigate and even more difficult to find someone who's places just as much importance on it as you do.

[TheFinalWord]

Hi Trail,

 

Well, you're a grown man so I'm not going to try to tell you how to run your life

 

BUT...

 

You have to ask yourself, why would a guy leave an extremely attractive woman (I'm basing that off the post where the guy saw her pic and and understood why you want to try) that he created a family with (3 kids is a lot these days; you're all in with that many), to the point he would move to another state? I mean, these are young kids, so it's not like they are older and they grew apart over the years. They had one kid basically right after the other, and were all in at one point.

 

Not trying to be negative, but it's a question that would be in the back of my mind and would make me proceed with extreme caution.

Edited October 8, 2019 by TheFinalWord

[Trail Blazer]

Hi Trail,

 

Well, you're a grown man so I'm not going to try to tell you how to run your life

 

BUT...

 

You have to ask yourself, why would a guy leave an extremely attractive woman (I'm basing that off the post where the guy saw her pic and and understood why you want to try) that he created a family with (3 kids is a lot these days; you're all in with that many), to the point he would move to another state? I mean, these are young kids, so it's not like they are older and they grew apart over the years. They had one kid basically right after the other, and were all in at one point.

 

Not trying to be negative, but it's a question that would be in the back of my mind and would make me proceed with extreme caution.

 

Maybe she left him? For a number of reasons...

[TheFinalWord]

Maybe she left him? For a number of reasons...

 

Statistically, women initiate 70+% of divorces, so that is more likely. But why? Why would she go full in with a guy, have three kids, then divorce. I would wait until I knew the answer before going all in, or even considering her potential relationship material. But that's me.

 

Good luck bro!

[jspice]

Do you really think a woman who has three children and seems pretty together from what the OP has said, just randomly left their father without any forethought? Or that she’s so awful that it justifies that her husband left her and three kids and moved away?

It couldn’t be that HE is the problem. Or that they have some agreement where neither is the bad guy.

[elaine567]

Statistically, women initiate 70+% of divorces, so that is more likely. But why? Why would she go full in with a guy, have three kids, then divorce. I would wait until I knew the answer before going all in, or even considering her potential relationship material. But that's me.

 

Good luck bro!

 

The OP left his wife and kids then he left his recent long term gf and her kid, does that make him "bad" relationship material?

Or is it only women who need to be judged in that way?

[TheFinalWord]

Do you really think a woman who has three children and seems pretty together from what the OP has said, just randomly left their father without any forethought? Or that she’s so awful that it justifies that her husband left her and three kids and moved away?

It couldn’t be that HE is the problem. Or that they have some agreement where neither is the bad guy.

 

Could be! I would want to know all of that before I would go in with the intention that I wanted to make this a long-term relationship (the context OP placed this scenario in).

 

The OP left his wife and kids then he left his recent long term gf and her kid, does that make him "bad" relationship material?

Or is it only women who need to be judged in that way?

 

I'm pretty sure it was the girl that wanted to end things with OP in his previous relationship. But, yes, it could be the ex-husband of the new woman is the problem, but she isn't posting here. OP is, so that is the context I am coming from. OP wants a relationship. My advice is to find out why someone has three young children (three kids is A LOT in this day and age), and now the guy is in another state. Three kids implies they were both all in. Something fell apart. I would want to know what, before I would come into a new dating situation with a LTR as the primary goal.

 

My basic advice is to be outcome independent when dating. Then, if things seem to be heading towards a relationship, great!

 

Anyway, I don't really care that much. OP seems to have his mind made up, I'm just saying to proceed with caution. There's a backstory here that would make me leery about going in with a LTR in mind.

[Kitty Tantrum]

And if she were childless and never married by that age, you'd STILL have to wonder what might be wrong with her, that she wants a partner but hasn't found one by then. Everybody who is 20+ and not already happily married or well on their way should make you question why not, if they say a committed relationship is what they want.

 

At least this woman prioritized having a family.

 

History of divorce is as poor a reason to default to "pump and dump" as any.

 

(As an aside: men like to cite "divorce initiation" statistics as an indictment of women, but have you SEEN the state of men these days? Effeminate manlets posing as men just long enough to get a ticket out of Mommy's basement ABOUND - and an awful lot of the truly capable men squander their ability to lead a family by thinking that their rarity and market value in comparison to these relative buffoons entitles them to screw around with impunity.)

 

On the other hand, physical attractiveness is also as poor a reason to qualify someone for a serious relationship as any, so I can't entirely disagree: OP should definitely go in with his eyes open. Being hot is a fine reason to give her a chance, but don't let that blind you if she's otherwise unsuitable.

[Allupinnit]

Women initiate divorces more often than men because statistically we report being less satisfied in the marriage than men.

 

Men are happy to lope along in a mediocre marriage as time passes because they don't think about it as much as women do.

 

Men will do all of these things to romance you in the beginning, and after some time in the marriage all of that just stops while women are still expected to take on the bulk of the child care, household burdens and earn a paycheck.

 

Simply put, women don't have much use anymore for a husband that doesn't make them happy.

[Trail Blazer]

The OP left his wife and kids then he left his recent long term gf and her kid, does that make him "bad" relationship material?

Or is it only women who need to be judged in that way?

 

Nah, that's not really true. My ex-wife was the one who first put it out there that we separate. I agreed as I'd been thinking about doing the same. She had too, but got in before me.

 

My most recent ex, she wanted to break up with me, but, for whatever reason, was incapable of actually being upfront and honest about it. So, she just pulled away. Her actions ended the relationship, I just formalized it with words. That wasn't before confirming that she did in fact want to end it.

[Trail Blazer]

Could be! I would want to know all of that before I would go in with the intention that I wanted to make this a long-term relationship (the context OP placed this scenario in).

 

 

 

I'm pretty sure it was the girl that wanted to end things with OP in his previous relationship. But, yes, it could be the ex-husband of the new woman is the problem, but she isn't posting here. OP is, so that is the context I am coming from. OP wants a relationship. My advice is to find out why someone has three young children (three kids is A LOT in this day and age), and now the guy is in another state. Three kids implies they were both all in. Something fell apart. I would want to know what, before I would come into a new dating situation with a LTR as the primary goal.

 

My basic advice is to be outcome independent when dating. Then, if things seem to be heading towards a relationship, great!

 

Anyway, I don't really care that much. OP seems to have his mind made up, I'm just saying to proceed with caution. There's a backstory here that would make me leery about going in with a LTR in mind.

I'll actually just take it as it comes. I'm yet to even meet her, let alone know of I'd want a second date. Who knows, she might even be a no show. These things happen.

 

I don't want a relationship straight up. I actually want to take things really slow. My thread isn't really about a relationship. It's about whether she'd even be sufficiently available in practical reality to even progress beyond casually dating.

 

Only time will tell, and tonight is when that time begins.

[alphamale]

That reminds me: At the beginning of my career, my first boss after college started dating a single woman with three (!!) young boys, and she was also a pro NFL cheerleader. That was like 20+ years ago. He was single. She was single. They married pretty quickly. I was kind of in the middle of it, because he would fly her in (for extended weekends) when we had customer meetings, or conferences all over the U.S. or even internationally. She sometimes even joined dinners with clients. She was a hoot! They’re still happily married! He never had his own kids, but accepted hers like they were his. They’re now all grown and out of the house.

 

what a lovely story Artdeco

[TheFinalWord]

It's about whether she'd even be sufficiently available in practical reality to even progress beyond casually dating.

 

Only time will tell, and tonight is when that time begins.

 

My vote is no, but I think you are taking the right approach. Good luck!

[Calmandfocused]

I’m slightly offended by some of the responses on this thread.

 

I left my ex husband because he was an abuser, a narcissist and quite frankly: a less than adequate father to my two sons. I left for my sake but also the sake of my sons.

 

So you think I should (and any other single mother should in my position) volunteer this information to prospective dates upfront just so they can ensure that I’m datable?

 

No sorry I’m not going to tell you the intricate details of the breakdown of my marriage until I know you and trust you. To do otherwise would make me look odd ... and desperate.

 

Op you will find out these details but in time. It’s probably information that is highly personal and raw to her.

[Trail Blazer]

There's a first time for everything and this was definitely my first no-show! Not a last minute cancellation, not even a lame a$$ excuse afterwards. Just nothing. She just didn't turn up!

 

However, I wasn't going to allow my protesting stomach to be denied. Nor would I allow someone like her to deny a good, honest family-owned business the patronage it deserves. So, I ordered my meal and a drink and had a fantastic dinner despite the lack of company.

 

Whilst disappointed, I'll roll with the punches. I had a laugh with a couple of buddies of mine afterwards on Messenger. What else can you do? Laugh, acknowledge that it's the height of rudeness and that it's a reflection upon her character, not mine, and move on.

Edited October 9, 2019 by Trail Blazer

[Ruby Slippers]

Wow, that is incredibly rude. Being a parent doesn't excuse one from basic manners.

 

In looking at your thread, I kept thinking, "It won't take long for you to see how available she's gonna be." Hey, at least you got your answer super fast!

[Trail Blazer]

You're dead right. I learnt all I needed to know about her availability, or lack thereof! Being a mother isn't even an excuse as, from what she'd said, her kids are in Seattle with their father this week.

[Gretchen12]

Hmm I guess in hindsight that bit about losing her cell phone was probably fake. Makes you wonder if the photos were fake too.

[Trail Blazer]

It seems a little far fetched the whole "I lost my cell phone" and going off the radar for two weeks.

 

I very much doubt her photos were fake. I can spot the fake photos and accounts a mile away. Some of her shots were taken at local places I recognized. She only lives 7 miles from me and we spoke about things in our local area, etc.

 

She's just a rude cow who decided she couldn't be bothered turning up and didn't feel it was necessary to explain why. Her loss, I'm moving on.