Timshel Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Christian Bale, 'American Psycho,' now I get it. I'm up past my bedtime.
Versacehottie Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 (edited) Well there are a multitude of reasons why he would be interested in your daughter. Including her looks, her relative inaccessibility compared to other girls who are hitting on him, she also might be shy, she does it for him in some way, perhaps her own lack of experience is something he is looking for. Probably too multi-layered to answer outright. Far too simplified IMO to say if he just wants sex = he will go where it will be easy to get it. If he is a player, on one hand it comes with the territory for good looking 20 year old guys. The encounter you described though was more creepy and awkward and aggressive than player IMO. Taken in the worst context of what it could be, he could strike me as someone who lets his own issues of feeling inadequate transfer to his treatment of women and sees your daughter as both a challenge and an easy target, if that makes sense. For the record, lots of conventionally good looking guys have all sorts of issues that are from what goes on inside their heads and less to do with what their actual dating marketability is as other perceive it based on looks alone. Edited September 19, 2019 by Versacehottie
Gretchen12 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Unless... he suddenly felt unwell, about to pass out or puke and quickly reached for the wall to support himself, and the girl happened to be standing at the wrong place. I can think of no other excuse.
elaine567 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Try not to get too hung upon his film star looks and try not to see it as something of a privilege he has noticed your daughter... With the new info, he definitely sounds like he has "issues" interacting with women or maybe even people in general. I am not too worried concerning the player/Casanova angle, he is 20, he is going to have sex on his mind, I am more worried from the potential abuse angle... He showed no respect for your daughter. He normally acts weird, and he did something weird and controlling to your daughter, with a smile on his face. Forget "Christian Bale", if this was your average spotty geek, you'd be telling her to stay well away, as he is actually quite scary... 2
Redhead14 Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 (edited) After talking to her girlfriends and hearing about how often girls are hitting on him, I would think if he were looking for just sex he would just go with one of them. So why focus on my daughter? I mean, she's beautiful, not to brag, but they showed me a picture of this kid and he's a dead ringer for a young Christian Bale. I know times have changed, but a guy who looks like that isn't going to have any trouble finding a girl to sleep with, so why is he targeting her when I'm sure plenty of these other girls are a sure thing? I'm not trying to defend him because he very well may be a casanova, but he seems to be completely focused on my daughter which is sort of baffling. Princess, these guys sometimes just feel entitled and they do it just because "they can". And, judging by your daughter's reaction, I'd say he has a sense that she is just very young and, perhaps, easy prey in the sense that she doesn't understand boundaries, etc. They aren't going to attempt to do something like this with a more seasoned confident girl who probably would have kneed him in the nuts. I know I would. If not that, I would have firmly and adamantly demanded that he back away at least. And, how do we know he hasn't "gone" with some of these other girls anyway and they ditched him because he's a casanova or too aggressive? It might be a very interesting story to talk to some of his past romantic partners. Maybe he doesn't want to be saddled with just one girl. Maybe he likes challenge. There are a ton of maybes here. There is only one important point -- your daughter needs to establish boundaries and let people know when they are crossing them, when they cross them. She didn't know what his intentions were when he unexpectedly pinned her up against a wall. She wasn't even sure what his intentions were after he did it either. Her reaction was, passive, at best. She didn't know what to do. If this situation had gone down a more ominous path, would she know what to do or try to do? Edited September 19, 2019 by Redhead14
kendahke Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 The fact that he didn't stick his hands down OP's daughter's shirt or in her crotch doesn't mean that him pinning her against the wall wasn't aggressive and presumptive. In their immaturity and lack of life experience, she and her friends are more caught up on him being "harmless" because he's "cute" than she is on seeing if he was some ogre-looking guy whose attention she wasn't fishing for, her hair (and OP's hair) would be on fire over this. Him being cute doesn't excuse his aggressive behavior--that's what Ted Bundy used to get over on the girls who stopped at how cute he was and put their lives in danger by getting in his VW bug with him. try not to see it as something of a privilege he has noticed your daughter. ^^^this. right. here. Don't be a "pick me" chick. 1
Gaeta Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Ok, so I asked my daughter to go over it a little more. She said she didn't find it forceful, just unexpected. He wasn't looking at her in a seductive way, just smiling at her. She said it was,sweet and like they were having a moment. Thanks for clarifying. See, when you first make a post you have to be-careful of the words you use. Now people are stuck on the word 'pinning' and even if you've clarified it was not done in a forceful way people aren't gonna drop it and by the end of this tread he'll be identified as a dangerous rapist. 1
Timshel Posted September 19, 2019 Posted September 19, 2019 Gaeta, I read that line, I also read between the lines in such a way that has has earned myself as an expert witness. There is no way that my interpretation is bent toward vilifying this young man, on the contrary. To be honest this thread has my skepticism in the red as I have already posted. Taking this all at face value, these young people are at a bar and likely intoxicated. Any feedback will be hindered by a lack of lucid reporting to begin with, then that the daughter is already smitten with the fellow will further con volute her interpretation of events. Objectively, the exchange was bizarre. Is it alcohol, is it alcohol combined with social awkwardness, or was a young man contemplating taking advantage of a young woman who was momentarily isolated from her friends? We can't properly know the answer to any of these questions but we can say or I will say woman to other women, be careful, be safe. I sure as hall teach my own daughters this, I am no hypocrite. 2
Author princessaurora Posted September 20, 2019 Author Posted September 20, 2019 Hey guys, princess' daughter here. After reading everyone's post, y'all just about have me convinced he's a sexual predator! But I thought a lot about it and I don't think that's very fair to assume that off of one incident. Plus, the metoo movement has people on high alert and sometimes a guy is completely harmless. Yes, he made a forward move, but like my mom said it could just be nerves. We've been flirting for over a month now and there's chemistry between us. He joins in with my guy friends when they sing to me and were always exchanging flirty glances. I hate to write him off based on one momentary lapse of judgement. I was freaked out yes, only because it seemed out of character for him. And after watching him reject girl after girl in the bar just didn't seem to fit with this sudden behavior. I never feared for my life or that he was going to force himself sexually on me. That's why I didn't kick his behind. I was just like "ok, I'm just going to wait till he gets himself together and we'll go from there". Our friends were only a few feet away. I just needed to get some distance from the noise so I could listen to my voicemail. And if I'm wrong and he does something undeniably inappropriate, I know how to defend myself. My parents taught me that at a very young age. I've had guys try to cross a line with me before and I've used force and mild violence to show them who they're dealing with. But, I just don't get that vibe from him, and it's not because he's attractive. I've dated guys as cute as him before. I was just baffled by his sudden change in behavior. That's why I had my mom make the post. I was hoping someone could explain it. And I'm not a "pick me" girl. He came to me, I didn't go to him. But if we like each other, which is a good possibility, why shouldn't we hang out together and see how it goes? I've decided to confront him about it as soon as we meet up Sat night and clear the air. If he doesnt show up, I'm going to get his info from my friend and reach out to him. But I will keep my guard up because I do appreciate everyone here's concern, but I'm also going to give him a chance to redeem himself because I think he deserves it. Thanks everyone for your opinions and advice. I'll let you know what happens this weekend. 3
Lotsgoingon Posted September 21, 2019 Posted September 21, 2019 Princess Daughter, I trust you and your judgment ... I think this guy really likes you ... but is suffering from the young male syndrome of going for some over-the-drop dramatic act ... in this case ... his approaching you as he did was way beyond his zone of competence. I'm a teacher, and there's a great idea in learning where you want to challenge people to work just slightly above what their natural-comfort level is. If you're terrified speaking before five people ... don't jump up to an audience of 200 people or 2,000 people. Try to relax speaking with five people ... or perhaps ten. I do think he's feeling really stupid right now ... when you make a move way beyond your comfort and confidence zone ... you are walking on air ... there's no ground beneath you ... And yet young people buy into the idea that they should be able to do this kinda dramatic thing, that's ten levels above their comfort zone. If you are into him, I say reach out soon. The more time elapses the more he'll be too embarrassed to open up again ... And just a tip: guys do get scared. That's normal. Guys get scared approaching women they like even when they are in their comfort zone! ... I was a little concerned that you worried he backed off because he decided that he wasn't into you ... Anyway, I'm trusting your interpretation and your account, but many of us older folks ... have seen many times ... have been involved in many encounters ... when someone acted suddenly and inappropriately ... and there were no friends around ... and the woman wasn't interested ... This guy needs to learn smaller steps ... which themselves will be scary enough when you're approaching someone you really like ... holding hands ... arms around waist ... and so on! Those smaller steps (in which the guy then sees if the woman reciprocates by squeezing his hand or leaning close to him and extending her arm around his) are a reasonable way to go ... before #metoo and certainly in the era of #metoo. And he should have started there with you. I work with young people, and trust me when I say there are a lot of guys out there who always think a woman is interested ... when there is no objective basis for that thought. And several young women I know have been assaulted on dates ... and the irony is that these were young women who weren't at all interested in feminism or #metoo issues. So we're just trying to protect you. And next time, tell the guy to kiss you if you really want him to kiss you. Yes, he froze ... but sounds like you froze as well. 2
Author princessaurora Posted September 21, 2019 Author Posted September 21, 2019 ... I was a little concerned that you worried he backed off because he decided that he wasn't into you ... I actually was lotsgoingon. I thought maybe he changed his mind about me. I have watched many girls try to get his attention and he's ignored them all. There was a girl 2 weeks ago who actually broke into our group and started dancing in front of him. She looked like a bird of paradise doing a mating dance! ( I watch a lot of discovery channel, lol) and all he did was just stand there and let her make an ass out of herself. I was thinking " this guy has impossibly high standards that I could never live up to" So yeah, him suddenly showing undeniable signs of interest kind of blew my mind. But I never thought of him as a threat or potential rapist. I just didn't understand how he could come on so hot and then just shut the water off. But what you said totally makes sense, so thanks for shedding some light. And yes I did freeze because I didn't know what else to do. Plus I wasn't about to make out with him with my friends standing just a few feet away. Some of my friends think the reason he's been blowing off girls is because he had already set his sights on me, but I'm not full of myself enough to entertain that thought. I do hope he comes tomorrow night, though. I'll be really sad if he doesnt. 1
Author princessaurora Posted September 23, 2019 Author Posted September 23, 2019 Hey, princess' daughter again, So we all met up last night and I noticed right away he wasn't there. Our mutual friend pulled me aside and told me he wanted to come but didn't want to do anything to make me uncomfortable. He said he feels like a total ass for what he did. So I told my friend I wanted to talk to him and he gave me his number. I finally worked up the nerve to call him this afternoon. He apologized and said he doesn't know what he was thinking. He was just coming over to talk to me since for once I wasn't surrounded by other people and the way I was looking at him he thought I wanted him to kiss me. (To be fair i was smiling and gazing into his eyes up until he put his hands up) He swears he's never done anything like that before, but I just make him really nervous. I told him I was trying to let him know I liked him, but I would never initiate a kiss with our friends standing right there. He then asked me to go to dinner with him on Thursday. I accepted but then joked around about how i'm going to pull out my kung fu moves if he does something like that again. So, I feel I've set my boundaries in a playful way because I don't want to make him feel any worse than he already does, but at the same time I'm getting my message across. My mom is still a little concerned so she will be here when he comes to pick me up on Thursday so she can meet him. I feel so much better now. Talking to him has lifted a huge weight off my chest and I feel really excited about getting some one on one time with him. Thanks everyone for your feedback and letting me hijack my mom's post. 3
Gaeta Posted September 23, 2019 Posted September 23, 2019 Princess Daughter: It sounds good to me. Like Lotsgoingon said 'baby steps' and be observant of how he treats you. Please report back after your date I am interested to know how it unfolds :-) 1
Lotsgoingon Posted September 24, 2019 Posted September 24, 2019 Oh, you are the woman, Princess Daughter!!!!!!!!!!! You should know that anytime we're interested in someone, we'll be nervous. If I'm not nervous, I don't really like the person. Great job to not be paralyzed by nervousness. ... and to give him credit. He didn't stay stuck in his own regret and embarrassment and his friends (also your friends) were really helpful! Good luck ... love to hear more as things go on. 1
Author princessaurora Posted September 29, 2019 Author Posted September 29, 2019 Hey everyone, it's princess daughter again So, everything went really well for the most part. He brought me a single flower which my mom absolutely loved and after having a brief conversation with him she was comfortable with us going out. He was definitely trying to play it safe on the date, though. I basically had to coax him along. We had a nice dinner where the conversation flowed really well and we shared common interest. He asked if I wanted to go to the movies afterwards and we went to see that scary clown movie. The theatre didn't have flip up armrests, so I made a comment about how that was a bummer because when I get scared I need something to snuggle up to. He then extended his hand and I held it for awhile. Then after the movie when we walked to the car, he took my hand and when we get there I stand against the passenger door hoping he'll take the hint, but all he does is kiss my cheek, and the same thing when he brought me home. Not to complain, it was still really sweet, just not what I was expecting. I assume he likes me because he asked me to go to the zoo with him on Sunday. I guess he's still a little freaked out about what he did 2 weekends ago. I had a wedding last night so I didn't get to see him but my friends talked to him and he told them he had a great time and he was looking forward to seeing me today. I really hope he kisses me today. I'm going to be so frustrated if he doesnt. I'm not the forward type, but I may be making an exception today because I really like him and I want a kiss! Wish me luck! 1
Gaeta Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 Princess Daughter: I am happy you had a good time. Let him court you at his pace. There is no rush for a kiss, let him build his courage and he'll get there. Enjoy your time and don't stress over a 1st kiss and don't make your disappointment show, it will make him even more nervous. 2
Gretchen12 Posted September 30, 2019 Posted September 30, 2019 I really hope he kisses me today. I'm going to be so frustrated if he doesnt. I'm not the forward type, but I may be making an exception today because I really like him and I want a kiss! Wish me luck! Do NOT push for a first kiss. The idea needs to stew in his mind and build up anticipation. He does not lack other girls who'd kiss him. I get that you like him but you need to exercise some self control. Let the tension build up more. 3
Author princessaurora Posted October 2, 2019 Author Posted October 2, 2019 Hi, princess daughter still taking over my mom's page. We had a great time at the zoo. He held my hand as we were walking around and touched me a lot. At one point he stood behind me and put his hands on my waist while I was watching the monkeys and I leaned into him. He then wrapped his arms completely around me and kissed my cheek but kind of lingered there for a minute. I could actually feel his heart racing. It's crazy that he's so nervous. I wanted to reassure him, so I leaned back and gave him a quick peck on the cheek and he had the biggest smile after that. There were alot of kids around so I wasn't expecting anything else. I'm pretty confident he likes me because of how much he touches me and just the way he looks at me. When he brought me home, my parents were outside doing yardwork, so no opportunity for a kiss there. (thanks a lot mom and dad) I had my friend invite him Friday night to my birthday dinner so we'll see what happens then, but I gotta tell you he is killing me because I wanna kiss him so bad. I feel like I traumatized him with my reaction to what he did a few weeks ago. Hopefully,he'll get over it soon and I'll get my birthday wish.
Gaeta Posted October 2, 2019 Posted October 2, 2019 Princess Daughter: I am glad you had a great time. You have your entire life ahead to be kissed, be patient. Let us know how the b'day dinner goes :-)
nospam99 Posted October 3, 2019 Posted October 3, 2019 I understand these 'kids' are 'young'. But ... princess daughter, why is it that you haven't taken the initiative to kiss this guy? and other posters, is there a reason that I'm missing why she shouldn't?
Author princessaurora Posted October 4, 2019 Author Posted October 4, 2019 I understand these 'kids' are 'young'. But ... princess daughter, why is it that you haven't taken the initiative to kiss this guy? and other posters, is there a reason that I'm missing why she shouldn't? Nospam, it's a complex situation. This guy has been hanging out with our group for a few months now and we've been flirting pretty heavily. A few weeks ago, he made a very aggressive move on me and many posters here think he stepped over some major boundaries and that I needed to set him straight. (He came up to me while I was standing outside the bar and put his hands up on both sides of me, then just froze.) Now we've been on 2 dates and he's been nothing but polite and respectful, but only cheek kisses. I really think he was just nervous that night but now he's walking on eggshells around me and I can sense he's afraid to kiss me because of what happened that night. I'm not the forward type, so I'm not just going to grab him, but my friends think that may be the only way to overcome this awkward situation. I'm not promiscuous, but I'm also not inexperienced and at this point there's generally a real kiss, especially considering we weren't strangers. Uhh, what a mess. I wish I knew how to get him over this. But at the same time, have him make the move. If anyone has any advice, please share!
Timshel Posted October 4, 2019 Posted October 4, 2019 So we can rest easy so far that the first night can be chalked to awkwardness. I wouldn't do anything princess' daughter, just take time to get to know each other, there's no rush. You may give him hints that it's safe to move ahead by touching him, leaning in or holding his hand etc... I wouldn't stress over it, give him his time and enjoy his company. Get to know him and allow him to get to know you as well. We didn't have sex too soon, said no one ever. Well people say that but in all truth waiting for sexual contact only destroys what would be destroyed anyway. Let him set the pace and both of you will decide if kissing and sex makes sense.
nospam99 Posted October 4, 2019 Posted October 4, 2019 A few weeks ago, he made a very aggressive move on me and many posters here think he stepped over some major boundaries and that I needed to set him straight. (He came up to me while I was standing outside the bar and put his hands up on both sides of me, then just froze FWIW, I've been following this thread from the beginning. IIRC your mom started it and described the 'awkward' move. As an 'older' male I'm in the camp where I don't think he stepped over major boundaries and if there was any need to set him straight that need is long gone. When the event was first posted, the word 'pinned' was used, suggesting to me that he grabbed each of your upper arms with his hands and held them against a wall - MUCH worse. But my current understanding is that he set his hands directly against the wall on either side of you. Then froze ... awkward .... and not that I ever played that card I read his freezing as a 'uh-oh, NOW what do I do next' moment. Regardless, I still think that if you want a kiss you need to give him an unequivocal 'green light'. Either initiate the kiss yourself or SAY something along the lines of 'Why haven't you tried to kiss me?' or even 'You know, I wouldn't mind if you wanted to kiss me.' 2
Gretchen12 Posted October 4, 2019 Posted October 4, 2019 But Prince Charming has not read this thread. He doesn't know about talk of him being kneed in the nuts. He's probably slow to kiss for the same reason he frozen at the wall. It's his thing. It's why he's in a young adult drama. If Daughter of Princess says I want you to kiss me NOW! He'd do it. Then we wrap this up and move on. 1
Author princessaurora Posted October 5, 2019 Author Posted October 5, 2019 princess daughter here again and so relieved! So the birthday dinner went pretty well. One of my bff's did kind of light a fire under his ass though and I wanted to kill her for the moment. He meets us at the restaurant and comes and sits next to me , tells me Happy Birthday and kisses me on the cheek. As soon as he sits down,my slightly buzzed girlfriend gets up and walks around to where we are, leans over him and whispers "if you ever wanna get into that p, you're going to have to do a lot better than that. " I could actually see him turning slightly pink and decided it was best to act like I didn't hear her to spare him further embarrassment. He looked over at me and I said " what did she say? " , and he said " something crass as usual" which is true because my bff is pretty crude and he's been hanging out with us long enough to know that. I responded "Yeah, she doesn't have a filter. I've been friends with her since we were in grade school and she's always been like that." I then excused myself to go to the bathroom and then chewed her ass out and told her not to say anything else regarding our situation. Things were fine after that. He gave me some really cute elephant earrings that he apparently picked up at the zoo last weekend. After dinner, we went on the riverboat and he asked me to take a walk with him. We found a sparsely populated area and I walked up to the railing and just looked out at the city lights. He came and put his arms around me, and after a few minutes started nuzzling my neck and pulling my hair back, and then his breathing increased and I was like, crap not this again. I was not going to let this moment pass by or risk he was going to chicken out so I turned around and we kissed! I'm not even sure who started it because his lips were like right there, but it was an amazing kiss. It started off soft and tender and then got pretty passionate. But most importantly, it just felt right and I think we've finally overcome the awkwardness of that night. My bff says I should thank her for making that comment, but I'm still pretty pissed about it. Did it push him to kiss me? I don't know, but I'm just so glad he finally did. My mom's going to have a few choice words to say to her though if she reads this. lol Thanks everyone for helping me out. As Gretchen12, said y'all can wrap up now and move on.
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