My gf is poor. Our finances.

[elaine567]

... would you not encourage her to return to education and give herself a chance of a higher paid job.

 

Not everyone is cut out for higher education, not all are capable of securing a higher paid job.

We like to think with opportunity, all can be CEOs but that isn't true.

Some are stuck in low paid jobs as that is just their level.

Some also like the lack of responsibility, they do not want the stress and competitiveness of a higher paid job.

Yes they may want more money, but it may come at a price they are not willing to pay.

[thefooloftheyear]

Gotta agree with Elaine here...

 

You picked her....

 

And newsflash, your situation is really not rare...Most guys I know make more than their partner does, Many MUCH more...I always have...

 

If you consider her your life partner, then you have to just chalk it up to what it is...I think as some of the other posters mentioned, that helping her elevate her earning power by assisting with a higher education or some other way to get a higher paying career going is wise advice and a good investment for both of you, but at the end of the day, she may(and probably will) always make a lot less than you do...

 

If you decide to stay in it for the long haul, my advice is to not let it cause resentment...On the bright side, if you have kids with this woman, and she decides to be a SAHM, then it wont change your financial situation as dramatically as if she was a high income earner...

 

You could consider a pre nup if you decide to marry her, or just don't marry her.....A lot of women would not be too happy with that idea, but its something a lot of guys in your position wished the had done when the fun and games are over and the shyt finally hits the fan..

 

TFY

[traditional]

I met my wife at school, she was one year behind me with grades. I went to University after school and got a degree. She never did meaning for the past almost twenty years I was sole provider, I literally raised and supported her providing everything even after kids came. I sacrificed so much for their convenience and life, I neglected my mother everything else. But I felt happy to provide for her and kids as my sole purpose in life, it fulfilled me.

 

 

Fast forward three years ago, she had the opportunity to upgrade, I supported her and she became a qualified nurse. Problem is I realized she does not see herself in our picture with the things she started to do, I was never consulted, its like she started to have her own house separate from me and the kids inside the house. She took loans and things that disables her to stand for financial responsibilities etc. Unfortunate due to economy around the same time she started working, my supplementary finances fell away and I started become very worried, that it affected me in all ways, mentally, emotionally and physically. This situation brought unbearable strain because we started to have fights, argue-it became brutal-you please imagine. There were other problems but will be too long and maybe not too relevant for this.

 

 

I want to point out some things to consider,

1. Are you going to or willing to provide for her to your own detriment, health, resources etc.

2. After two decades, will you be happy if you have nothing to show for all your sacrifices and compromises through the years.

3. Is she willing to work to upgrade herself for her own sake as well as for yours both.

3. If she never does anything to upgrade or anything, and after twenty years you find that you are both broke and miserable, will you be able to accept it and say-ok it was a good run we tried to live a life.

4. If she goes away for some reason after ten or whatever years, and you find you have not enjoyed your hobbies because of just work, you have not upgraded yourself with education to get better opportunities because there is not enough money, will it be ok.

 

 

I just think, please think about this for your own sake. I know you feel deep love and you don't want to loose her, you want to love nd care for her. It is something I found hard and evil to do is to first care for and consider yourself first. In other words, you eat first and then let others eat. As we speak, I lived this life, I am forty three and look fifty or sixty, broke etc. I started to accept my situation and stop blaming my wife because the decisions I made are the ones to bring me here, even if they were either good at the time or bad, I chose to be with her. Please be real and consider this carefully.

[schlumpy]

BD post #31

There must be something similar in USA?

 

Each state has it's rules but I believe it falls under the very English term of "common law." If you are living together for a certain amount of time then any breakup is treated as if you were married. That of course can vary from state to state.

 

Is there any doubt as to why the USA has more lawyers then doctors? IF that's not true it sure feels like it.

 

Best Wishes

[schlumpy]

She never did meaning for the past almost twenty years I was sole provider, I literally raised and supported her providing everything even after kids came. I sacrificed so much for their convenience and life, I neglected my mother everything else. But I felt happy to provide for her and kids as my sole purpose in life, it fulfilled me.

 

This is a typical internal male characteristic for many men that I've noted over the years although it doesn't always have an unhappy ending. You stated it with remarkable clarity.

 

The supervisor of one of our sections at work was like that. He was way past retirement age but he was always saying just one more year to help his kids buy that new car or a down payment for the new house. They finally took him out in a body bag but I don't think he would have had it any other way.

 

It's only a bad thing when you look back on your life with regret and the full understanding of how you got to where you are.

 

I think you have time to recover if you can get your wife to agree to boundaries that will allow financial success to once again be a part of your life and if you can suppress your driving need to be seen as the provider. You can still salvage something good from your situation.

 

 

Best Wishes

[Arieswoman]

elaine #24

 

 

Paying bills wasn't your husband's problem.

His problem I guess was that household chores were not his job -> woman's work.

Now he just pays the bills and can be as lazy as he wants to be... he doesn't need to lift a finger...

He has a "paid" housekeeper - being minimum wage she has little option but to comply...

 

 

You got it in one

 

 

Still, it beats me why he ever married a professional women first time (me) if all he wanted was a "sexual housekeeper".

[snowcones]

We are both around 26 and have been dating for almost a year now. We moved in together a couple of months ago. Now the problem is our finances. She works full time for a minimum wage, whereas I have a very good job and make literally 8-9x the amount she does, if not more on a good month. I have got used to a certain lifestyle, where I go out to eat often, go on trips, buy myself nice clothes, and have enough money to save etc. But the problem is, without my help, she couldn't do any of these things. And simply giving her money seems wrong, and not doing these things would make me resentful.

 

She never went to university due to her difficult family situation - she had to take care of her grandparents when young, so she never really started or trained for a career. It's hard to imagine her getting a better job now without a massive effort, both in terms of education cost and time needed.

 

Where I live, minimum wage is not enough to live on. There is a huge discrepancy between salaries. On the lower end of the spectrum, it's not uncommon for people well into their 30s to still live with their parents for financial reasons. For example, she doesn't have a private dental plan. She got a toothache, and was forced to either live in extreme pain or get money from me, because the cost of the treatment was MORE than her monthly salary. In my country, if she wasn't living with me, most likely she would be getting help and money from her parents. It's the sad reality here.

 

What should I do? On one hand I wouldn't feel bad about being the main breadwinner, but then again I don't have the heart to expect her to take care of the home, as she works even longer hours than me. We don't have kids, so being stay at home mom is not an option.

 

Do you guys simply give your partners money if you earn more than them, and they can't afford healthcare, etc? If not, how do you manage to do things like travelling, hobbies, etc.? Should I do these things alone? Her salary is so low that splitting rent and utilities takes the most of it - so I couldn't really plan for anything cheaper.

 

 

This is where you learn that love does not pay the rent. Here are your two choices:

1. suck it up and support her, and BOTH of you will have to accept that you will make ends meet and with nothing extra, but you will have each other.

2. dump her and date women with better jobs (be sure to check if they have massive debt).

 

That's it. Both choices are taking a risk but this is real life.

[snowcones]

OP says they've been living together for a year. I wonder if it's even occurred to him that she may end up pregnant....

[Arieswoman]

OP says they've been living together for a year. I wonder if it's even occurred to him that she may end up pregnant....

 

 

 

 

Probably not, this guy seems to be a bit 'slow caching on' as we say in UK

[elaine567]

....and BOTH of you will have to accept that you will make ends meet and with nothing extra, but you will have each other.

 

Nowhere does the OP say he would struggle to make ends meet if he was to "support" her, he makes 9 times her salary...

This is about the finer things in life that HE enjoys and SHE cannot afford. He has got used to an affluent lifestyle.

He feels resentful that in order for her to share in those expensive activities, he would have to pay for her too and he doesn't really want do that.

[snowcones]

Nowhere does the OP say he would struggle to make ends meet if he was to "support" her, he makes 9 times her salary...

This is about the finer things in life that HE enjoys and SHE cannot afford. He has got used to an affluent lifestyle.

He feels resentful that in order for her to share in those expensive activities, he would have to pay for her too and he doesn't really want do that.

 

 

I see.

To answer your question OP, if you want to keep this woman around, and it sounds like you do, yes, you're going to have to pay for her to do things like go on vacation, etc. You moved her in before marrying, so now you can't go on vacation by yourself. You probably should not have moved her in. And what if you breakup anyway? Would she be moving out or you moving out? Would she go back to her parents house?

[BettyDraper]

This is a typical internal male characteristic for many men that I've noted over the years although it doesn't always have an unhappy ending. You stated it with remarkable clarity.

 

The supervisor of one of our sections at work was like that. He was way past retirement age but he was always saying just one more year to help his kids buy that new car or a down payment for the new house. They finally took him out in a body bag but I don't think he would have had it any other way.

 

It's only a bad thing when you look back on your life with regret and the full understanding of how you got to where you are.

 

I think you have time to recover if you can get your wife to agree to boundaries that will allow financial success to once again be a part of your life and if you can suppress your driving need to be seen as the provider. You can still salvage something good from your situation.

 

 

Best Wishes

 

My husband is also the type to gladly provide for the woman he loves.

I have not worked outside the home in years. My contributions to our marriage are not financial. I take care of household chores and errands because my husband's career is too demanding to be concerned about such things. I'm also mostly responsible for our dog since I am the one who wanted a dog. My husband walks our dog in the mornings and brushes our dog's teeth but that's it.

 

To be honest, our marriage became much happier once I left the corporate world. I am calmer and much more fulfilled. I am working toward the B.A that I never completed back when I was younger. Our home is spotless and I have become a much better cook. I am in in great shape because I have ample time to exercise. My husband loves coming home to delicious meals, a clean home, and a happy wife.

 

We have a post nuptial agreement which protects me in the event of divorce. I also have savings and investments in my name in case the marriage doesn't work out. In the event that my husband passes suddenly, there is a substantial life insurance policy along with hundreds of thousands in investments for which I am the beneficiary.

 

The OP isn't the kind of man who wants to share his income or support anyone. I think his approach to finances is very stingy and cold but he has the right to be that way if he wants to. I think the OP would be happier with a successful career woman who wanted to keep finances completely separate.

[Ruby Slippers]

Why did you move in and start mixing finances with a woman you're not married to, especially given that you resent the income disparity? Now you're subsidizing a roommate instead of a wife and potential mother of your children.

 

You could consider a pre nup if you decide to marry her, or just don't marry her.....A lot of women would not be too happy with that idea, but its something a lot of guys in your position wished the had done when the fun and games are over and the shyt finally hits the fan..

A prenup likely won't help, as in most states, any assets acquired during the marriage are considered community property to be split 50/50 in case of divorce.

 

If you intend to continue with her and marry her, given that you're so resentful about the income disparity, you could encourage her to go back to school and get a degree that will lead to a lucrative career, such as a nursing degree. She can work on the side while going to college, and she should go to an affordable school that won't require going into debt.

 

Don't marry her without putting all this on the table and beginning steps toward workable solutions. It's not going to work if you're simmering with resentment all along the way.

 

By the way, you're smart to think about this. As a woman, I have zero desire to subsidize a man's income, no matter how great he is in other areas, and I'm pretty sure that if I were a man, I wouldn't want to pull along the weight of a dramatically lower-earning woman, either. It would be far too painful to have a huge chunk of my assets ripped away in case of divorce.

[frus69]

Nothing wrong with giving her money. Back in the day the husband is the only breadwinner. Wives never worked. If you both fine you guys can do that too, what's wrong with that

[preraph]

When I was in my twenties, I lived in I how's my dad bought as an investment, run down house on an acreage, and I just paid the bills. I was a manager in retail making more money than him at the time.

 

When I moved to another state, I had to start all over in the same industry and was working for $2.50 an hour. I had the grossest old grease covered apartment that I chose because it was right across the street from work and was the cheapest one nearby.

 

I took a second job to work on my days off, which was motorcycle escort rider. I eventually moved to a better apartment up the street and got a roommate.

 

All in all it was one of the most fun times of my life. It was the time I made the best lifelong friends.

 

I have had to have second jobs most of my life. I recommend your girlfriend get herself a second job. Even if it's minimum wage and she only works another 15 hours a week that is another $4,800 a year. It makes all the difference. Also she would be better off working warehouse work or being a server somewhere and make better money doing that than whatever she's doing for minimum wage.

 

She at least needs to be someplace where you can move up. Remind her that now that she has experienced she should be able to go get a job for more money. But she's got to be motivated. You don't want to have to become her daddy. It will kill your relationship.

[Ruby Slippers]

Nothing wrong with giving her money. Back in the day the husband is the only breadwinner. Wives never worked. If you both fine you guys can do that too, what's wrong with that

She's his girlfriend, not his wife. They have zero legal binding, so subsidizing her is equal to subsidizing a roommate.

 

I've moved in or discussed moving in with boyfriends before, and the handling of finances was always a major part of the discussion. Usually they offered to pay for everything, and I said I'd prefer to split things unless we get married, at which point everything would become shared.

 

It was a terrible idea to move in together without being clear on how finances and the disparity in income would be handled. How did you think this was going to work, given that you make almost 10 times as much as she does?

[frus69]

Well he can marry her if they both want? Millionaires can marry waitresses, its not news. There are plenty of full time housewives these days

 

I assume OP is not the kind of guy who cares so much about financial independence or he wouldn't have get involved with her at the first place.

Edited August 4, 2019 by frus69

[Sunlight72]

...It's only a bad thing when you look back on your life with regret and the full understanding of how you got to where you are.

OP - ^this^ is a thought that strikes me in your case.

 

I know you only wrote one post, so I have to guess a bit at what is important to you, and I may be incorrect, but I will do my best.

 

It seems that you value money as a measurable contribution greater than other contributions your girlfriend can make. That is, I don't get the feeling that you would view her as equal to you simply if she is as loving toward you as you are to her, if she is as kind to you as you are to her, if she is classy and warm with your family and your friends as you are with hers, if she is supportive of your efforts and struggles as you are with hers, if you feel you can count on her to be honest, not cheat on you, and make a team with you as you do with her; if being together with her makes your life sweeter and more fulfilling than it would be without her, unless she also earns much closer to the amount of money you earn.

 

If that paragraph is accurate, then you should find a respectful way to break up with her.

 

Think about it first though - you have been together a long time. I expect you do value the love you share with her, and respect her as a person or you wouldn't have been together so long. If that is accurate, then please read the ^quote^ from schlumpy again. I am 47 years old. I have not yet found a woman I loved who loved me enough to be together for more than about 3 years, though I have tried very hard. To me it seems a very rare thing for two people to find and love each other through the challenges and the good times. If you have found such a woman, consider how she enriches your life besides the finances, and then consider if you think you can replace that relationship more or less, except with someone who earns more money. I have not found it to be simple to find a "great woman like this one", except also add xxxx and leave out xxxxx. Maybe it is easier for you.

 

That is the test for you to work through.

 

Then again, maybe just by writing your post, thinking about it after writing it out and reading other people's thoughts, you have already realized it still bothers you to make more money. Be honest with yourself, it's better now than later.

 

Best Wishes,

Sunlight

[kendahke]

Not everyone is cut out for higher education, not all are capable of securing a higher paid job.

 

 

We don't know enough about OP's girlfriend from only one post to make that judgment on her intellectual abilities. He's got an agenda to spin on this, so his description of her abilities is sketchy from the jump.

Edited August 4, 2019 by kendahke

[thefooloftheyear]

As a woman, I have zero desire to subsidize a man's income, no matter how great he is in other areas, and I'm pretty sure that if I were a man, I wouldn't want to pull along the weight of a dramatically lower-earning woman, either. It would be far too painful to have a huge chunk of my assets ripped away in case of divorce.

\

 

Typical of many woman when it comes to money in a relationship dynamic ...…

 

"What's his is ours and what's mine is mine.."

 

Just mind boggling that guys have been doing it since the beginning of time, and often still do, yet women somehow consider it an insult....I'm not surprised that younger guys are saying a big eff you to chivalrous/generous and gentlemanly type of treatment of women..

 

TFY

[Ruby Slippers]

^ Did you miss the part where I said I'm pretty sure if I were a man, I wouldn't want to accept the risk of marrying a dramatically lower-earning woman, either?

 

I think anybody considering marrying someone who earns much less than they do should be very careful, as the risk is simply much greater in case things don't work out.

[schlumpy]

^ I think anybody considering marrying someone who earns much less than they do should be very careful, as the risk is simply much greater in case things don't work out.

 

I think one qualifier for your statement is age. I think the older you are the more relevant your statement becomes.

[Ruby Slippers]

I think one qualifier for your statement is age. I think the older you are the more relevant your statement becomes.

Probably. But I genuinely feel for men who married a woman, provided for the family for years, then after a life of relative leisure, she leaves and takes half the assets he worked hard to earn, and gets ongoing child support and alimony payments on top of it. It doesn't seem fair. If he's abusive or cheated, ok. But even if he was a model husband and she just got bored, or if she cheated, she can still take half, which doesn't seem right. Those men, in spite of doing everything right, are screwed.

[frus69]

lol I dont know why you are worried for those men. They make their own choice for marrying those women. They have their reasons. Maybe those women make them happy in a way no one else can? No need to judge. Not everyone shares your value on money

[BadDog1]

Thanks everyone for your input.

 

There were a lot of questions asked, mainly about my attitude, my stinginess, or whether the love I feel is stronger than the monetary "cost" of the relationship.

 

My question here is motivated mostly by insecurity. In all my previous relationships, before I moved up in my career and was usually making less than my partners - money was a huge, huge point of contention. I remember once having to borrow money from my then girlfriend. It was then when all our troubles started, and even in couple's therapy she said she feels insecure because she didn't feel I was a good provider.

 

Literally 99% of the couples I know have the man earning significantly more than the girl. What I am afraid of is that if my earning powers disappeared, the whole thing would just come crumbling down.

 

I feel this strong biological imperative to be the provider, and it's nice, empowering, etc. but at the same time it clashes with the fact that it's not under my direct control, and also with the intellectual climate nowadays. We say that women should be completely independent, except: not really - we say it's alright for a woman to secure a place in a relationship with being caring, sexual and attentive, and for a man to secure that place with financial stability, drive, etc. I searched the internet for similar discussions, and the average answer is 100% dependant on the gender of the OP. Men get the answer: if you're stingy you don't really love her. And women: don't sell yourself short for a guy who can't provide.

Edited August 5, 2019 by BadDog1