some_username1 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 It's the time cost for me. Especially if I've been single and not dating for some time. Getting rid of body hair and facial hair, hair dye, hair cut, manicure, pedicure if it's summer. That alone is 3-4 hours of hard work. Add another hour if I'm buying new clothes and makeup. Let's assume that I've done all of the above regularly. It's still gonna be 1 or 2 hours of maintenance shaving n tweezing body n facial hair, showering, washing hair, drying hair, makeup, teeth, choosing outfit, get dressed and out the door. And I am LOW maintenance. This is so I can be accepted in society and has wider implications than "who's wallet hurts the most when dating?" Australia's one and only female PM did a comparison on time deficit of women versus men. When they do a TV interview and get full hair, makeup, outfit.. 2 hours. Men rock up in the usual attire and get a touch of face powder. 2 minutes. Time is money. That's not a great comparison though because the whole beauty industry is driven by women to give them a competitive advantage so if they resent time spent doing all this stuff they need to look at themselves first. A man has no such competitive advantage apart from maybe being fashionably aware and lucky to be 6ft+. Other than that it's down to the looks he was born with. On the other hand, makeup and hair care can make the pretty stunning, the average pretty/stunning, the unattractive average/pretty etc. It is absolutely staggering when you see the before/after mugshots online the difference that a woman can make to her appearance if her styling is on point. In fact I think it would be great if women rebelled en masse and rejected the whole beauty regimen thing as it would shake up sexual dynamics to the core and create a more level playing field between the sexes. All of a sudden men wouldn't be chasing after women so hard because most simply would not look that good without the help of a bit of slap and a hair dryer. A naturally pretty woman is a rare old thing.
Author Shining One Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 You currently live with your gf (or stay over fairly often), right? If you go out to a special event with her, you could observe how early she starts getting ready vs you. H definitely takes less than half the time I do to get ready for a special occasion, even if he irons his clothes that very night!We broke up in March, but I have seen her and other women getting ready for events. I know women take more time, that's not in question. However, I've also seen these women allocate the same amount of time to get ready for work, go out with their girlfriends, go shopping, etc.I do agree with smiley and basil that there is still a double standard in our society about how much time, effort, discomfort and money women are expected to invest into their appearance, compared to men.Agreed.
some_username1 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) Nah, opposite. I def don't do it for myself lol Yeah men demand this crap. Wasn't there a heel revival in the 70s? You’re doing it to compete with other women, the same way that some men probably pay for the meal: if they don’t do it someone else will. You and every other woman out there are perfectly free to ditch the make up and heels etc but you may find yourself single longer than you would like because unless the guys you are interested in are looking for a Tom boy they will have designs on the women who happily put the effort in. There really is no double standard at all- both sides have to make sacrifices if they want to maximise their dating options. That’s just the way it is. And speaking of which let me tell you girls something, all your complaints about heels and hair pales into insignificance compared to the hours and pain required in the gym to put on a lb of lean muscle mass so we men have bodies that appeal to you women. Never mind the dangerous over eating and under eating that can’t be healthy for our bodies in order to achieve the right mix of muscle mass and body fat. Do we do it for ourselves? To a certain extent, but I’m pretty sure that if having a hot body wasn’t a competitive advantage for men then most would not bother. Do you find us complaining on forums about double standards? No, we want the best options we can possibly get for ourselves and it’s what we have to do as a result. Edited June 15, 2019 by some_username1 1
some_username1 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 I dismiss such claims out of hand because a) they'd be spending xx on stuff [hair, nails, makeup, clothes] regardless, and b) they're just grasping at straws in an effort to justify not contributing to the actual expense of a date. And no, you don't get to count time in the bathroom as an expense. But, if these arguments are still being floated then it's good that you created this thread and put it to rest once and for all. When you apply the rules (which are reasonable and valid) they'll be hard pressed to name any expense other than prorating makeup used, and perhaps wear and tear on the soles of their shoes. The really interesting part is to see who takes the bait and who doesn't. Hahaha! Yep, they are *still* trying to complain about how tough they have it/double standards/men just wash and go etc
thefooloftheyear Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Hahaha! Yep, they are *still* trying to complain about how tough they have it/double standards/men just wash and go etc What's somewhat puzzling is most guys(even successful wealthy ones) wont really care if their gf/w is highly educated or has a high power job...In most cases, they'd gladly exchange a desirable hip/waist ratio over a six figure job and an expense account.. Most guys wont take a complete moron that cant do anything, but you get the drift... Yet, guys are probably more judged by their career and earning potential above anything else...As someone who maintains a good physique and a stressful career, the looks/physique is FAR easier to keep/maintain... TFY
Kitty Tantrum Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 She is doing those things for herself, which is why single ladies spend a fortune to look hot and once you are in a relationship you're lucky to get her to do anything with her hair besides putting it in a ponytail. Guess I got it all backwards, then. On a typical day as a young single lady, I'd shower, wash my hair, and put it in a bun fastened with a pencil. Sometimes I wouldn't even dry it first (long thick hair takes forever). Clothes were mostly secondhand, or things that still fit from when my dad still bought my clothes. Going on a date was a rare opportunity to transform from "awkward nerd" into "pretty girl." I only really started minding my appearance on the daily after my ex-husband and I got together - because I wanted to look nice for him. I might not be representative of the majority of women, but I do exist.
elaine567 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Men in general are prized for their earning capacity/wealth. Women in general are prized for their looks/appearance. Both, in order to attract top notch people need to invest in dates, that is the bottom line. For men that means spending money on dinners and entertainment and for women that means spending money on expensive clothes, hair and makeup. In order to attract someone who looks like a millionaire's wife you need to be a millionaire and in order to be a millionaire's wife you need to look like a millionaire's wife. Yes there are exceptions, not every one is so superficial, but in order to accumulate you need to speculate. There is no sense in being bitter about spending cash and then still expecting to bag a winner... Winners are attracted to winners, not cheapskates.. 6
Curiousroxy86 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) I wasn't going to participate simply because I dont make this argument about how much money we shell in looking pretty because I have no interest in trying to convince anyone on why I dont offer to pay for dates for the first 1-2 dates plus I DO proactively pay for both me and the guys date 3rd and 4th and then reciprocate thereafter AND if he wanted to go dutch before then I am ALWAYS prepared to pay my part with a smile and no fuss. so its not like im not shelling out my precious money and time on men but for those who are curious for me personally.... the sexy dresses, tops, skirts I wear are for dating/in a relationship. I dont wear those any other time (work, church, volleyball, dance aeorbics, grocery shopping, spending time with family). all of my other clothing bottoms such as jeans/shorts can be worn universally so I wont count those. the sexy panties I wear are for dating/in a relationship. any other time im perfectly fine wearing plain black cotton drawls. my sexy bras I would wear those anyway so I dont count those because the bras I buy are needed for my day to day. I only wear heels for dates/relationship ONLY if its a sitting down most of the time date so I count those. any other time im wearing flat shoes on more active dates or alot of walking but I also use those same flat shoes for other things in my life so those wont count. I would do basic hygiene anyway but I wouldnt do anything extra as far as smelling like dessert and making my skin super soft. so body sprays, perfumes, bubble baths, body oil, body butters throw that in the cost. otherwise all I need is deoderant, regular bodywash, toothpaste, mouthwash, lotion, and femine wash. I dont go to the hair salon. the times I wear my hair down is when I go out on dates. any other time for work, playing volleyball, dance aerobics, shopping, church I put this thick hair in a bun. by the way its ALOT to wear my hair down and have it looking sexy for a date btw. the styling product I use throw that in the cost. other wise shampoo, conditioner, deep conditioner, and my hair oil dont count. I dont paint my nails unless im going on a date/or in a relationship. I dont go to a nail salon. but you can count my nail polish and nail polish remover and them cotton balls. I dont shave my legs unless im going on a date/or in a relationship so count my shaving cream, razors, and electric shaver I replace every so often. I dont wax. I dont like pain lol. now playing in makeup is something I do for fun anyway so technically I cant count that. but the type of makeup I wear IS customized for when im going out on dates with a suitor/boyfriend so you can count my nuetral eyeshadow palettes and pinky nude lipsticks. I wouldnt bother working out if I truly stopped giving a damn about men in general to be honest. I like volleyball so that wont stop. but all the other things I do for fitness I wouldnt do lmao. so count that gym membership in the cost. that ish not for me. so all the things I do for dating/relationship/a man averages about 2000.00 a year. That does not include the fact that I do reciprocate and pay for dates so that cost would be much higher technically. And we not even going to begin to compare the time I put in to do these things. and that rule about only counting for a particular guy or date is trash. if I say yes to a date, keep saying yes to a date, and that guy becomes my boyfriend then it would be for him. miss me with that. and the money you men spend is for "dates/to get a woman/get to know a woman". it just so happen to be spent on that particular girl and if you dont see her again and you connect with someone else? guess what that money goes to another girl. so its the same bullshhhh...... Edited June 15, 2019 by Curiousroxy86
d0nnivain Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Monetizing dating & relationships doesn't add value to the equation. Everything has a cost. Going to work has a cost. Having a hobby cost money. If you enjoy it, do it. If you don't enjoy, do something else. 1
alphamale Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Winners are attracted to winners, not cheapskates.. birds of a feather flock together elaine567
thefooloftheyear Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Monetizing dating & relationships doesn't add value to the equation. Everything has a cost. Going to work has a cost. Having a hobby cost money. If you enjoy it, do it. If you don't enjoy, do something else. Very well put...agree... TFY
Gretchen12 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Doesn't cost me anything extra to go on a date (except for money spent during the date). I don't even spend extra time to get ready. But then I'm normally considered "too dressed up" running errands or meeting friends. I don't agree with the argument that women shouldn't pay for meals because she spent money to look good. Paying is not cost-sharing. It is treating someone. 2
Curiousroxy86 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) tell that to the guys complaining about costs and wanting a comparison so dag on bad Edited June 15, 2019 by Curiousroxy86 1
Author Shining One Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 tell that to the guys complaining about costs and wanting a comparison so dag on badThis thread was created specifically because women on this forum have said they spend a lot getting ready for each date. If those posts from women did not exist, this thread would not exist. I'm actually learning quite a bit from this thread.
Curiousroxy86 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 This thread was created specifically because women on this forum have said they spend a lot getting ready for each date. If those posts from women did not exist, this thread would not exist. I'm actually learning quite a bit from this thread. yea but that didnt come out of thin air. those women said that in defense because some men are complaining about paying for dates 1
alphamale Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 men have lots of costs too: nice clothes and shoesautomobile insurance, gas, oil, upkeepcost of the datemental and emotional costs of anxiety
Curiousroxy86 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 men have lots of costs too: nice clothes and shoesautomobile insurance, gas, oil, upkeepcost of the datemental and emotional costs of anxiety but if your going to count your car which you use for other things besides dating then that means we can throw in those costs for things we also would use besides dating that I had to throw out for this silly meaningless comparison. and I dont ride in the car on the first date. I take my own and meet him there for safety purposes unless I knew him well prior
NuevoYorko Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 men have lots of costs too: nice clothes and shoesautomobile insurance, gas, oil, upkeepcost of the datemental and emotional costs of anxiety Even if women don't pay for the dates, many of them have shoes, clothes, cars and anxiety. 3
Author Shining One Posted June 15, 2019 Author Posted June 15, 2019 yea but that didnt come out of thin air. those women said that in defense because some men are complaining about paying for datesI'll concede this point. This thread is primarily about quantifying. Many men, myself included, have quantified dating costs. I've never seen this from the women, hence why I asked.
FMW Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 The only time I've ever considered my costs of a date as a woman is if it's a very special occasion that requires clothing I don't already own (as in a really formal dress that I might not have another need for). I don't consider time and effort on my appearance to be a "cost" calculation. I generally spend the same amount of time on getting ready no matter where I'm going out. I do face masks, deep hair conditioning and other grooming items on a regular basis for my own enjoyment, so no extra expenditure there. 2
Kitty Tantrum Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 If we get to count the cost of anxiety, going on a date may be the single most expensive thing I've ever done.
alphamale Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 If we get to count the cost of anxiety, going on a date may be the single most expensive thing I've ever done. .... there is pre-date anxiety and post-date anxiety
Kitty Tantrum Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Don't forget mid-date anxiety! "Am I sitting too close? Am I sitting too far away? Too much eye contact? Not enough?? Do I look awkward because my feet don't touch the floor in this chair?? What do I do with my arms? Will he think I'm picking my nose if it really itches and I need to scratch it? Oh god, I put my elbows on the table, now he thinks I'm a neanderthal."
Iris The Butterfly Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 (edited) Depends what the date is. If it's a casual date, then I would do my hair, makeup and maybe get my nails done, but I keep up on that anyway, in my every day life. Nothing special and no extra money spent. If it was a fancy date, for example my bf took me to a work function that was more formal, I bought a new dress and had it altered, $200. But I'll wear it again so it wasn't special for the date. It's a formal dress and I intend to wear it for another of his work parties. For my Christmas party at work he bought a new shirt to match my dress, $50? I would say for a special date, getting my nails done and a new piece of clothing is my only extra cost. That dress was the most expensive purchase I made for a date. I'm low key. I never spend extra money on hair or makeup, even for a date. I get a trim every couple months and do my own makeup and consider myself a very girly girl. If I have a special event I will buy a new clutch purse or new shoes or a dress which costs me $25-150. That's it. Oh, I get a brazilian wax every 2 months because my bf loves it, so that's $40 every 2 months I wouldn't spend otherwise. I wouldn't get waxed for any old date, I reserve that expense for a boyfriend that I'm having regular sex with I dated a guy last year who was into feet. He liked to touch and suck on my toes during sex. So I got pedicures more often and that's $30 a month or so. Sorry if that's TMI but you did ask! Edited June 15, 2019 by littlebridge 2
guest569 Posted June 15, 2019 Posted June 15, 2019 Nice Post Roxy. And put it this way, majority of us are not going to be doing all of those things to look pretty when we are single and not looking. I am not using this as an excuse not to pay because i do split the bill or take in turns. But highlighting the time and expenses that women go through. If you guys want women to look stunning then you should appreciate the time and effort involved. Meanwhile she's also working full time, getting postgrad and paying a mortgage, working twice as hard to get half as far in her career, then spending her later years in poverty anyway. So cut the crap about how hard it is to be a man 1
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