Girlfriend seems reluctant to move to a deeper level in the relationship.

April 27, 2019

I (43M) started dating a coworker (40F) of mine back in November. I was scared to ask her out, not only because of rejection, but because I had been involved in a workplace romance in the past and it didn't end well.

She seemed very low key, even shy, so I went with it. She accepted the invitation, and we have been going out since.

The relationship has been good for the most part. Obviously we provide each other with the moral support we need at work. Most of our dates have been great, and we have been intimate at times (o**l s*x).

However, some doubt entered my mind in early March. She wanted to go Salsa dancing. Now, I am pretty confident overall, but dancing is my absolute biggest weakness. Two left feet for me would be a compliment, that's how bad I am. So I am naturally very self conscious about this.

But I like her so much that I decided to go with it, as it was a Salsa class. So we went and at first it went well, but then we had to switch partners. As the steps got more and more difficult (it's more of a multi-level class than a true beginner's class), I got worse and worse and worse. I decided to flee to the bathroom for a bit. When I came back out, she was with a new partner. She seemed to be into him (even though he was doing just as bad as I was).

After we left, I asked her if she liked the guy. She said no, she was just explaining the steps to him. But the twinkle in her eye while they were practicing was a little unnerving for me.

After that, I felt that her affections toward me starting to drop.

Now, even before that, there was a weekend where we didn't text each other. When I saw her at work the next Monday (she came looking for me). All seemed well. But she started texting me, basically chewing me out for not texting her. I told her that she had seemed cold before the weekend and I felt that she didn't want to be bothered. She said that I should have reached out to her to find out. The length of her text made it seem like she was pretty anguished. So I promised to never do that again.

So, between the no-text weekend and the Salsa class (a week later), it seemed like it was going to fall apart.

Yet, it hasn't. Whenever we go out she seems happy enough. When we are intimate, the attraction in her eyes and body language is unmistakable. I have no doubt that she is at least physically attracted to me.

However, she also tells me often that I am "so nice" or "too nice" and things like that.

I have shown her a lot of affection but I am not sure really where she stands. I am terrible overall at body language and generally do better with women who express their feelings verbally.

All I really know about her past is that it appears she was hurt badly (ghosted), by someone out there. Naturally she doesn't want to talk about it and I respect that.

So this brings me to my next question: Why is she afraid to move to the step with me - s*x? We have had o**l s*x several times and she seems more comfortable each time, but for some reason she is afraid to go all the way.

I don't really know how to approach it. One time we were making out but she seemed very reluctant, so I told her, "Hey let's stop and get out of here." I figured she wasn't ready, but I also didn't want a huge class of b*** b*lls! I thought she'd be happy to get out the house. Instead, she said no and we continued on. However, when it came time to it, she backed out.

So, at this point, I really don't know what to do. Sex isn't really that important to me, but the lack of communication about things is. She has told me that she doesn't have much experience with sex and relationships and just isn't very expressive. I feel that we've been basically at the point where it would be natural between two human beings to have sex.

I would really like to get all your perspectives out there. Is she really into me and just doesn't show it in a way I can see? Is she almost ready for sex with me but still needs more time? Am I a rebound relationship to help her get over the pain of an ex she was dumped by? Is she just biding her time until she feels comfortable with finding someone else?

Tl;dr - Starting dating a coworker and my feelings grew out of control. She seems interested in me to some degree, but doesn't want to go all the way.

April 27, 2019

I can see why you're confused. I mean she's acting like a virgin. really oral is much more of an intimate act than intercourse. It's more advanced and less basic, and I'm from a different generation where intercourse would have happened before oral.

Are you prepared with condoms? maybe she just doesn't want to take any chance whatsoever on getting pregnant which is understandable. Ask her if she's on birth control. You're dating or so you certainly have a right to know.

Meanwhile go to a couple of salsa classes on your own and catch up. Look at it as insurance. If you stay with her you'll be a better dance partner. If you break up you'll have a great new way to meet new women.

April 27, 2019

I think I am from the same generation as you.

Today I didn't text her all day. She just texted me and told me I didn't reply to her text last night. I think whatever happened to her in the past really hurts her so she has to have the texting thing happen in a certain pattern.

She does seem to understand that I can't dance a lick. I mean, I'm like worse than can't dance.

Again the sex thing for me is not a huge issue because I enjoy her company more than anything. But it sucks that when we are naked and touching that we cannot consummate the relationship.

I really wouldn't be too interested in meeting anyone else after her for a while. It was unexpected (dating her and forming a relationship), but I fell in love. So you know how that goes...

Edited April 27, 2019 by AGoodFriend

April 27, 2019

I think I am from the same generation as you.

Today I didn't text her all day. She just texted me and told me I didn't reply to her text last night. I think whatever happened to her in the past really hurts her so she has to have the texting thing happen in a certain pattern.

She does seem to understand that I can't dance a lick. I mean, I'm like worse than can't dance.

Again the sex thing for me is not a huge issue because I enjoy her company more than anything. But it sucks that when we are naked and touching that we cannot consummate the relationship.

I really wouldn't be too interested in meeting anyone else after her for a while. It was unexpected (dating her and forming a relationship), but I fell in love. So you know how that goes...

I'm confused. You say you really like her and want her to be deeper in the relationship but then you just said you haven't text her all day? Why not?

You are the man, she expects you to take the lead, not wait for her.

Women like to feel special. Not texting her for the whole weekend previously then the whole day is not exactly going to make her feel like she is on your mind and special is it?

April 27, 2019

Normally I do. And I see where you're coming from, definitely. But today I am a little unsure. Every time I get her something, she says I'm so nice. But she has made it seem in the past like that's not such a good thing.

April 27, 2019

Normally I do. And I see where you're coming from, definitely. But today I am a little unsure. Every time I get her something, she says I'm so nice. But she has made it seem in the past like that's not such a good thing.

April 27, 2019

It makes very little sense to me.

About the dancing though . . . women appreciate men who give it a shot. We don't care that much if you can't win Dancing with the Stars. We do care that you try. The other guy danced. You hid in the bathroom. Half the game is showing up.

You need to talk to her. Is there any whacky possibility that even at 40 she's a virgin, hence the willingness for oral but refusal to consummate the relationship & the inability to talk about it. I know it's difficult but be direct, sensitive but direct.

Find a quiet time, maybe on the couch & just open up a conversation. Tell her your concerns & see where her head is.

April 27, 2019

Normally I do. And I see where you're coming from, definitely. But today I am a little unsure. Every time I get her something, she says I'm so nice. But she has made it seem in the past like that's not such a good thing.

What's wrong with saying you're so nice? If I ever say that to my BF it's because I'm thinking, "Wow, he's so nice and I can't believe he's mine. Best thing that's happened to me," etc. Didn't think it would make a man feel unsure the way you do.

It's important for you guys to talk and communicate about small problems like these. You should open up to her and see what she says

For the intimate part.. I really don't know why she's so hesitant given her age and whatnot. Again, you should talk to her. To move to a deeper level in the relationship you also have to communicate at a deeper level

April 27, 2019

What's wrong with saying you're so nice? I

Most of the time when a woman repeatedly says that to a man, it's telegraphing that she has a history of bad prior relationships & doesn't know what to do with a guy who is not a jerk. You know, the bad boy syndrome. These women think that men who treat them like dirt are the ones who care when those guys offer up a little crumb. The other extreme is that "nice" is synonymous with doormat & the woman is telling the guy he's boring.

Either way, for a 40 year old woman to repeatedly say that to her new guy in a context where the guy picks up on that it's not being said in a good way, it is indicative of a problem/

April 27, 2019

The relationship has been good for the most part. Obviously we provide each other with the moral support we need at work. Most of our dates have been great, and we have been intimate at times (o**l s*x).

It seems like a mediocre relationship to me. You've been dating 6 months only you shouldn't use words like *most part*, your relationship should be exciting and filled with passion...not this *intimate at times*.

She is killing time with you, I am just not sure if you're killing time as well. I don't know any man your age that would endure being in a relationship and only have sex *at times*.

April 27, 2019

I find what you describe confusing as well. I know it can be awkward, but you're not children - I think at this point I would just flat out ask her. Discuss the different aspects you listed, see what she has to say.

April 27, 2019

Dating since November and no sex yet? Only oral a few times? How is this possible? You must really, really like this woman to hold out for so long. I know you said sex isn't that important to you and she has not had much experience. But don't kid yourself, waiting this long is not good for you. You might end up resenting her and ever getting involved and since you work with her that could be problematic too, as you know. Sounds like you guys need to have another conversation.

April 27, 2019

Thank you all for the responses.

I have basically decided to protect myself and start pulling back. She texted me yesterday and we talked for a little bit, but I didn't offer to make any plans or anything.

All of you have told me to sit and talk with her. I have tried but she does not like to have the type of conversations that you and I all know are necessary to make sure this relationship is straight. If I try to talk about something like this, she'll say I'm being too sentimental.

That shows me that really wants to keep me at bay and not open up to me. Could she be killing time? Possibly. But she definitely wants to maintain the wall she's built up.

However, I am already mentally getting myself ready and am moving on.

April 27, 2019

@MightyBop - I have already left for a new job. Separation from her has helped me immensely. As long as I had to see her everyday, my feelings were always going to be in warp drive -- out of control. In a sense, I think that the fact we worked together may have had an early impact on the relationship. At first she chased really hard (like in the first few weeks), then I chased, and now we are kind of a cold war stalemate. It feels weird, unnecessary, and juvenile. Breaking away from her has "given me my heart back" so to speak.

If anything, I think I'm more dependent emotionally on the texting (we generally text throughout the day, every day) then anything else. The hardest thing for me in the next few weeks will not be the fact that I don't see, but that we don't communicate and share what is happening in our lives any more.

@Gaeta - I have had the sinking feeling that she is killing time with me as well. I'm nice enough, definitely attractive, have a career. But I don't think she is truly ready to settle down. And that's fine with me. I'm not going to stick around while she waits. She's 40 but looks very young (in her 20s). I'm 43, look decent for my age, but I have been married twice before so I think I am natural "shacker-upper." I understand this and that's why I'm willing to move on.

@d0nnivain - I do think that she suffered a very bad relationship. I believe that her first was probably the guy who ghosted her. When I asked what happened, all she offered up was that he didn't text or call her for a over a week. When she finally caught up with him, he simply said that he didn't feel like texting or calling her. I can imagine that was a bitter pill to swallow and I can totally understand if that's why she needs to protect herself and not open up. One day, she will find the right person.

Edited April 27, 2019 by AGoodFriend
Add important detail.

April 27, 2019

What's wrong with saying you're so nice? If I ever say that to my BF it's because I'm thinking, "Wow, he's so nice and I can't believe he's mine. Best thing that's happened to me," etc. Didn't think it would make a man feel unsure the way you do.

It's important for you guys to talk and communicate about small problems like these. You should open up to her and see what she says

For the intimate part.. I really don't know why she's so hesitant given her age and whatnot. Again, you should talk to her. To move to a deeper level in the relationship you also have to communicate at a deeper level

When she said I was nice, she said it in a tone of voice that made me think she actually doesn't appreciate it. She's brought it up several times.

April 27, 2019

@Finding my way - Tried several times to get her to open up to me about why she isn't ready. All she can say is that she is afraid and doesn't feel comfortable.

Earlier in the relationship I tried to get her to open up more, but recently I have kind of given up.

April 27, 2019

I really don’t see this going anywhere. If she’s still very young like in her early 20s, then I might see a point continuing a bit longer. But she’s well past that age. Since she has refused to communicate repeatedly, I’d just let her initiate things from now on and move on with your life. You don’t owe her anything.

April 27, 2019

I really don’t see this going anywhere. If she’s still very young like in her early 20s, then I might see a point continuing a bit longer. But she’s well past that age. Since she has refused to communicate repeatedly, I’d just let her initiate things from now on and move on with your life. You don’t owe her anything.

@JuneL, I agree. I have also been reading up on dating coworkers and one thing I've learned is that a lot of coworkers don't have anything to talk about other than work. She and I have some things in common, but not much really.

To sum it up, she's a young 40-something and I'm an old 40-something. Yeah, probably not gonna work in the long term.

It's probably been a convenient relationship for her to explore and get her bearings before getting back out there for real (she said it had been a while since she had dated or even come close to being intimate with someone). And for me I learned a lot about myself and what I need to work on if I really want to do traditional dating.

April 27, 2019

@JuneL, I agree. I have also been reading up on dating coworkers and one thing I've learned is that a lot of coworkers don't have anything to talk about other than work. She and I have some things in common, but not much really.

To sum it up, she's a young 40-something and I'm an old 40-something. Yeah, probably not gonna work in the long term.

It's probably been a convenient relationship for her to explore and get her bearings before getting back out there for real (she said it had been a while since she had dated or even come close to being intimate with someone). And for me I learned a lot about myself and what I need to work on if I really want to do traditional dating.

I’m not sure why you kept bringing up the fact that she looks (much) younger than her age. Does it really matter in your relationship? I’m East Asian ethnically and have the misfortune (for lack of a better word) of being mistaken to be 10-15 younger. It’s not a blessing, as I used to be constantly hit on by guys way younger.

April 27, 2019

I’m not sure why you kept bringing up the fact that she looks (much) younger than her age. Does it really matter in your relationship? I’m East Asian ethnically and have the misfortune (for lack of a better word) of being mistaken to be 10-15 younger. It’s not a blessing, as I used to be constantly hit on by guys way younger.

It is something I definitely consider, but don't dwell on. I'm probably subconsciously thinking that she'd dump me for a younger guy down the road.

As you can see, I have insecurities that I need to work on, and I acknowledge that.

April 27, 2019

Most of the time when a woman repeatedly says that to a man, it's telegraphing that she has a history of bad prior relationships & doesn't know what to do with a guy who is not a jerk. You know, the bad boy syndrome. These women think that men who treat them like dirt are the ones who care when those guys offer up a little crumb. The other extreme is that "nice" is synonymous with doormat & the woman is telling the guy he's boring.

Either way, for a 40 year old woman to repeatedly say that to her new guy in a context where the guy picks up on that it's not being said in a good way, it is indicative of a problem/

And, normally when women say you're too nice it's because they are attracted to bad boys. Pure and simple. That is why they end up with creeps because that's who turns them on. I would back away from this woman if I were you OP.

April 27, 2019

And, normally when women say you're too nice it's because they are attracted to bad boys. Pure and simple. That is why they end up with creeps because that's who turns them on. I would back away from this woman if I were you OP.

@stillafool - I am in the process of that backing away now. She's a good woman and lovely. But I can see that I am not the one and I don't want to suffer real heartbreak down the road trying to be.

Not working with her has "broken the spell" so to speak. Now long periods of not texting don't bother me as much. Also I am not interested in going out with her anymore (she did ask on Thursday when we were going to the movies) because I know that I AM A TOTAL BORE anyway. I'll eventually find someone more my speed.

Just to add -- I actually probably came across to her as a bad boy initially, especially when she was chasing and I wasn't showing much interest. When I asked her out I was extremely assertive, and when I grabbed her and kissed her the first time. She was sending pics with hearts and everything.

But once I saw that she seemed genuine and I started to reciprocate, then she started pulling away. It was weird, and definitely not what I am used to.

Edited April 27, 2019 by AGoodFriend

April 27, 2019

No you are not a bore. Some women just don't appreciate guys who treat them nicely. It doesn't raise their sexual desire. I have friends like her. I think you are doing the right thing. You won't have any problems finding another woman because the majority of women are looking for someone just like you.

April 27, 2019

No you are not a bore. Some women just don't appreciate guys who treat them nicely. It doesn't raise their sexual desire. I have friends like her. I think you are doing the right thing. You won't have any problems finding another woman because the majority of women are looking for someone just like you.

Thank you for the kind words.

I think another thing that started the slow death of this relationship was the fact that when we first went out, she was in a different department on the other side of the campus, and worked rotating shifts. So we rarely saw each other. But when we did, everything was fresh.

Then she transferred departments and ended up in the main office with me. I think that took a toll on the relationship, though we continued texting and going out. I think we were work spouses who had already been intimate. And seeing her everyday drove my feelings into overdrive (I was perfectly fine and "normal" when we didn't see each other at work).

I do think that she knows she wants a good man, though. I definitely wish her well. She's a wonderful person.

April 27, 2019

It is something I definitely consider, but don't dwell on. I'm probably subconsciously thinking that she'd dump me for a younger guy down the road.

As you can see, I have insecurities that I need to work on, and I acknowledge that.

Why do you think a younger guy is better? I’m exactly her age, and my bf is your age. I tend to be attracted to men a few years older.

You mentioned that you’re twice divorced. Do you have kids? If yes, does having kids play a role in your relationship?

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Girlfriend seems reluctant to move to a deeper level in the relationship.

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