Author ZA Dater Posted January 8, 2019 Author Posted January 8, 2019 I know this might sound harsh, but just like in video games, we are all set with a certain "level." If you are level 10, you should not try to match with someone whose level is, for example, 100? Instead, if you are level 10, you should target women whose levels are 10 and below. That's the 1+1=2 logic. In OP's case, I think he should really lower his standards. I mean, there are many women out there with not so appealing appearance, even disable or crippled ones... whose levels are much lower than OP's. They were born for people like OP. Come on guys, if you keep doing the same thing over and over and over again expecting different results, you belong to an asylum, not LS. I would recommend you never say this to the face of "people like the OP" the response may not be a favourable one. Again have you dates these people? I suspect not. Dating lower is like setting for something you don't want, which for me is not what life is about, you strive to get what you do want and its not obtained by adopting a "that'll do attitude". I actually suspect you are a troll so I wont reply further to your posts.
Author ZA Dater Posted January 8, 2019 Author Posted January 8, 2019 Having never seen a picture, I can't comment 100% accurately, but guys like you likely do get to choose. I am a conventionally just ok looking guy. I get to choose all the time. That doesn't mean that I get every woman I want, but that if I want a second date, it's 95%+ of the time my choice. How? Because thankfully, women above the age of, say, 23, look for more than just physical attractiveness. I exude what they are looking for by the time of the first date or meet. You can too, but it's something you have to learn. And no...it's not about being a pick up artist. It's about recognizing that what is inside you is more important than what what you present physically. I cannot tell you how many women have told me that I physically turn them on more than anyone else before. But it's not because I have washboard abs or the perfectly square jawline. It's because I know how to attune myself to their desires and needs while at the same time remain something that is outside of their control. I'm not saying it's easy, only possible. But if I can do it, trust me, you can too. I don't get to choose because I don't conform. With this date I decided I was going to simply be me rather than try create a false personality and the date itself went ok. When it comes to looks, with respect I disagree, Tinder has proven this time and time again, use my pictures I get terrible matches, used some models pictures and get fantastic matches, if this applies to Tinder it applies in person to, people don't suddenly change there criteria. Why must I attune myself to anything when most put absolutely no effort, this date at least actually gave a lot back conversationally which was nice because it happens very seldom. And for the poster who said date down, that's the problem with dating down, conversationally I get even less back and that renders the whole thing a complete waste of time. I have inexperience written on the face, even people who just meet me comment on it behind my back. Women I deal with on a day to day basis say the same thing. So no I don't get much of a choice because wait for it WOMEN get to choose. In theory I agree it should be possible to appeal without being super good looking, a kind personality should be enough but it isn't, being motivated should be enough but it isn't. The fundamental problem here is I sit with another ultimately bad experience where I put everything into it and got nothing positive out of it. You tell me how many of these you had before you had success, bearing in mind I am 34 and been going on dates for 14 years.
Normm Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 I was saying for a guy like him, he needs to take babysteps first, which is getting used to the female bodies. And the fastest and easiest way to gain access to female bodies are by paying them. I've suggested ZA get laid by a hooker just to get a taste for it so to speak, and maybe get that milestone behind him to possibly build some confidence- but to think that screwing a hooker is going to "get him used to female bodies" and improve his dating success is simply ludicrous. And the fact that you, a woman, is getting all upset about me and my ideas proves that I am f**king right haha. I'm a guy and I think your advice is terrible, especially given the context. You don't know the history of ZA's dating failures so you're jumping in and dispensing irrelevant and just plain bad advice and getting defensive when the seasoned posters who are quite familiar with ZA's history take issue with the BS you're spewing all over this thread. To make it even worse and completely destroy any remaining credibility you might have you attack women particularly and assume their wrong simply because of their gender. You even topped yourself by saying "people are getting upset at my posts and that means I'm right". Yeah ok that must certainly be the reason. 1
Normm Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 (edited) They are never in to me so which I construe as a looks thing. You've described yourself as being so ugly that even you don't like to look at yourself in the mirror. Your looks are definitely a hindrance but even really ugly guys get decent looking chicks. You need to compensate for your looks in other ways and you've been given boatloads of advice in that area including dating coaches and therapist which you chose to ignore for questionable reasons. At least you got one on the hook however briefly. AND you didn't get blocked! As a few other posters have said, it's progress. Not much but some. I think you get a pat on the back. Edited January 8, 2019 by Normm 1
Garcon1986 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 Each time ZA Dater gets a date, I stand up and give a round of applause. That's genuine appreciation for his time and effort to stand up to rejection just a little bit, to learn something new about a woman and himself.
lurker74 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 In theory I agree it should be possible to appeal without being super good looking, a kind personality should be enough but it isn't, being motivated should be enough but it isn't. It hasn't been that way for you in the past because of your attitude. Sure, maybe you're not the best looking dude in the world. And maybe you reach for the stars too much and do try to date people out of your league, but it doesn't have to be that way. A guy friend of mine told me last week that I'm like a 6 or a 7, at best. But because of my sense of humor, style, and ability to converse, he thinks I should be able to consistently pull a 9. That hasn't been my experience in OLD (and though I loathe using 1-10 ratings, it may be useful in this instance). In OLD, I get matched with 6s and 7s. Occasionally an 8. But in person, I often am able to get the attention of 8s and 9s (only once a 10, but that was a good night). My ability to do that has nothing to do with looks and everything to do with attitude. It's possible for you too.
Author ZA Dater Posted January 8, 2019 Author Posted January 8, 2019 You've described yourself as being so ugly that even you don't like to look at yourself in the mirror. Your looks are definitely a hindrance but even really ugly guys get decent looking chicks. You need to compensate for your looks in other ways and you've been given boatloads of advice in that area including dating coaches and therapist which you chose to ignore for questionable reasons. At least you got one on the hook however briefly. AND you didn't get blocked! As a few other posters have said, it's progress. Not much but some. I think you get a pat on the back. Actually I don't think I am ugly at all, the dating world seems to think so based on the matches I get on Tinder. Yeah dating coaches there is another thread here which clearly and fundamentally shows their limited use and questionable benefit. Doesn't feel like much of a success and the reality is I just do what I always do and have just a little more confidence chipped away. So she wants to "hang out" I mean really, what's that supposed to actually mean.
Author ZA Dater Posted January 8, 2019 Author Posted January 8, 2019 It hasn't been that way for you in the past because of your attitude. Sure, maybe you're not the best looking dude in the world. And maybe you reach for the stars too much and do try to date people out of your league, but it doesn't have to be that way. A guy friend of mine told me last week that I'm like a 6 or a 7, at best. But because of my sense of humor, style, and ability to converse, he thinks I should be able to consistently pull a 9. That hasn't been my experience in OLD (and though I loathe using 1-10 ratings, it may be useful in this instance). In OLD, I get matched with 6s and 7s. Occasionally an 8. But in person, I often am able to get the attention of 8s and 9s (only once a 10, but that was a good night). My ability to do that has nothing to do with looks and everything to do with attitude. It's possible for you too. I wish I could believe you but my experience has never been of that. Yes, its true I constantly find myself around people who do choose, people I don't fit in with but try to, people who have interests which don't work with me. This date we had some aligned interests which was nice because it wasn't a case of me going on a date with someone who loves trance parties whereas I wouldn't be seen dead at one. Believe it or not I grew up believing what you typed above but none of it has ever proven to be true for me in reality, "kind hearted and very intelligent" even those things aren't enough so it begs the question what is? All I get out of this is more disdain towards dating, more cynical, more jaded and feel less inclined to try again. Look I am realistic, people try set me up with people who wont work for me, I don't club or drink so someone who does those things wont work for me. The fact this date went well and it still wasn't enough pretty much gives me the feeling of 'why bother the outcome is always the same".
manfrombelow2 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 ZA Dater, please believe when I say I only hope and wish and desire THE BEST for you, because I was exactly in your shoes years ago. A journey has to start somewhere, and I was giving you the starting point by sharing with you my own experience. I was once awkward and totally clueless before women. So I invested money into erotic massages and escorts so I could at least get used to the physical presence of women - and by "get used", I mean that I no longer found them alien creatures but just human beings like me, they too eat, they too sleep, they too fart, they too poop and so on. That's the babystep. Next up, I tried to date multiple women at once, so everytime I got turned down by one of them, I moved immediately to the next one on the list, so I increased my chance of scoring at least one woman. If you have been in this game for many years, but always achieving the same result, it's time you change your game, your method, your mindset.
Author ZA Dater Posted January 8, 2019 Author Posted January 8, 2019 ZA Dater, please believe when I say I only hope and wish and desire THE BEST for you, because I was exactly in your shoes years ago. A journey has to start somewhere, and I was giving you the starting point by sharing with you my own experience. I was once awkward and totally clueless before women. So I invested money into erotic massages and escorts so I could at least get used to the physical presence of women - and by "get used", I mean that I no longer found them alien creatures but just human beings like me, they too eat, they too sleep, they too fart, they too poop and so on. That's the babystep. Next up, I tried to date multiple women at once, so everytime I got turned down by one of them, I moved immediately to the next one on the list, so I increased my chance of scoring at least one woman. If you have been in this game for many years, but always achieving the same result, it's time you change your game, your method, your mindset. Escorts hold no interest for me at all, any and all attention from them is false because its paid for. What I want is someone to take to dinner and have an interesting conversation with. I, unlike many people don't see women as sex objects to be used, I see them as people and I with the right sort of women I really enjoy spending time with them. Hence the reason why given the choice between "dating down" and being stuck in the friend zone with someone I do like, I'd rather have the latter. I don't see my luck ever changing to be honest, its almost impossible to change a mind set when all I get is rejection over and over again, I can turn up looking like a clown and be rejected, I can take them to a fancy dinner I get rejected, I can buy them gifts I get rejected, nothing and absolutely nothing I seem to do or offer is ever good enough of what they want. Yet I am suppose to "date down" to what I don't want to give those people something they do want? I am not going to bother to reply to this lady, in fact I just blocked her. With this one I broke my own rule by opening myself up and trying, usually I don't bother because either the person cannot keep up with conversation or they just don't interest and because I always know the rejection is on its way at some point. I am glad you found solace with escorts and massages but for me that's not any sort of answer at all, that's instant monetary gratification and yes I did research this idea before but objectively there is no upside and they don't offer anything I really want, to be a number, perhaps 4 or 5 on that day, the 40th of that week. A simply disgusting thought.
Normm Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 Actually I don't think I am ugly at all Is that so? Because here you said you think you're really ugly: Post #13 at the bottom of the following thread: (I can't directly quote it because the thread is closed) https://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/530889-pay-date-bad-idea Originally Posted by ZA Dater: My issue is my face, its pretty ugly, even I don't like looking at it!
some_username1 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 (edited) Is that so? Because here you said you think you're really ugly: Post #13 at the bottom of the following thread: (I can't directly quote it because the thread is closed) https://www.loveshack.org/forums/romantic/dating/530889-pay-date-bad-idea The lack of self awareness is so desparately sad. I don't see how you can identify as ugly, demand a girl with a pretty face and then be so bitter that it doesn't happen. OP said upthread being kind should be enough, so being below average in looks and kind should entitle you to the top ~20% of women. It's so deluded it's unbelievable when you think about how many below average but kind men there are out there, let alone average to above average kind men, let alone the men who don't exhibit crippling negativity and entitlement. OP, kind should be the bare minimum anyone should expect of anyone else! It shouldn't be considered a stellar quality that separates you from anyone else unless you meet a woman so beaten down by life and the men she has been with that simply being kind makes her fall in love with you- and trust me, you of all people would not want to be with such a woman in thst sort of situation. Women want much more than kind, they don't always want looks, but what they ALL want is fun: laughter and escapism from the grind of life. I don't see how you can provide that given how negative you come across on here. Women DO NOT want negativity and they absolutely do not want a man who squeals about his woes being out of his control and the consequence of bad luck or, worse still, life being out to get him while others live high on the hog. You need to have a good long hard think about what your USP is- what makes you different from all the good looking guys. What can you offer the woman of your dreams? In fact, what sort of man is the woman of yoir dreams even looking for? Do you think she dreams of meeting a guy who spends his life complaining on the internet about how life itself has wronged him? I'm laughing at the thought because it's so ridiculous. I'm sorry to say this but women want the total opposite of the traits you exhibit in this thread. Like I say, think about your USP, a positive USP, and not just "I'm kind" and if you can't come up with one, come up with a USP you think your dream woman might want and aim to acquire it. In fact if I were you I would start with adding a happy go lucky attitude to my personality as a bare minimum before anything else. Kind is so 'blah' but genuinely having a carefree, take it or leave it attitude to all aspects of your life....well, THEN you would be starting to cook on gas.... ...but who am I kidding? Sadly I know I have just wasted my time typing this as in a year's time you will still be making the same complaints and getting the same results having listened to no-one. Edited January 8, 2019 by some_username1 2
Author ZA Dater Posted January 8, 2019 Author Posted January 8, 2019 The lack of self awareness is so desparately sad. I don't see how you can identify as ugly, demand a girl with a pretty face and then be so bitter that it doesn't happen. OP said upthread being kind should be enough, so being below average in looks and kind should entitle you to the top ~20% of women. It's so deluded it's unbelievable when you think about how many below average but kind men there are out there, let alone average to above average kind men, let alone the men who don't exhibit crippling negativity and entitlement. OP, kind should be the bare minimum anyone should expect of anyone else! It shouldn't be considered a stellar quality that separates you from anyone else unless you meet a woman so beaten down by life and the men she has been with that simply being kind makes her fall in love with you- and trust me, you of all people would not want to be with such a woman in thst sort of situation. Women want much more than kind, they don't always want looks, but what they ALL want is fun: laughter and escapism from the grind of life. I don't see how you can provide that given how negative you come across on here. Women DO NOT want negativity and they absolutely do not want a man who squeals about his woes being out of his control and the consequence of bad luck or, worse still, life being out to get him while others live high on the hog. You need to have a good long hard think about what your USP is- what makes you different from all the good looking guys. What can you offer the woman of your dreams? In fact, what sort of man is the woman of yoir dreams even looking for? Do you think she dreams of meeting a guy who spends his life complaining on the internet about how life itself has wronged him? I'm laughing at the thought because it's so ridiculous. I'm sorry to say this but women want the total opposite of the traits you exhibit in this thread. Like I say, think about your USP, a positive USP, and not just "I'm kind" and if you can't come up with one, come up with a USP you think your dream woman might want and aim to acquire it. In fact if I were you I would start with adding a happy go lucky attitude to my personality as a bare minimum before anything else. Kind is so 'blah' but genuinely having a carefree, take it or leave it attitude to all aspects of your life....well, THEN you would be starting to cook on gas.... ...but who am I kidding? Sadly I know I have just wasted my time typing this as in a year's time you will still be making the same complaints and getting the same results having listened to no-one. Where did I say she had a pretty face, she didn't. Where did I say she was in so called top 20% of women, I didn't, where did I say I go for those women, I didn't. There is no commonality with what women want, if there were it might be easy to see and understand why some pair up with layabouts who have no motivation and drive in life. Nobody has a dream anybody, its nothing more than a line spun way too often in way too many unrealistic romantic movies. We only know what we like when we meet them, we then try and find more of that like, some people do, some people prefer sex over anything else, physical renders everything else irrelevant. A friend of mine, all he wants is sex, they must be hot and they must want to sleep with him, whether they are nice people or have any motivation in life is irrelevant. I don't do happy go lucky and I don't get along well with people who do because to me they lack any sort of focus. You walk a mile in my shoes and see how much positive you will have toward dating, my guess is exactly the same amount I have. Anyone who thinks they can escape the realities of life is simply deluded. The wonderful thing is I can choose to care and choose not to care. Every time this happens I find myself caring a little less, I find myself a little less interested, I find myself questioning why and I find myself less likely to try but most I just find myself irritated with the entire process. But you know what perhaps I should be surprised, perhaps OLD is the bastion of the odd, the bastion of the unrealistic, the bastion of the "cant get a date so let me try this", perhaps its where misfits gather and players shine.
chillii Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 Trouble is ZADater's main problem is that he is too quiet and shy, the fact he did a lot of talking and put some effort in is to be applauded actually. It may not have worked here but I think in general it is an improvement. Yep , exactly what l think too. You made some great strides there za and lightened yourself up a bit and had a lot of two way convo and a nice time. Actually met someone that's good to talk to and enjoyed it. Pat yourself on the back l say and just because she didn't see romance in the end well, that's ok. That probably would've been the same no matter what you did anyway l'd suspect. Not everyone is right for us , you can still like someone.
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