ZA Dater Posted January 7, 2019 Posted January 7, 2019 So had a date last night which seemed to go relatively well. After the battering I took on the other forum I decided to try different things. What helped here was she was super chatty intelligent and could communicate. I got a kiss on the cheek and all seemed to be good, second date arranged for Wednesday. I really worked hard, she laughed, smiled and said she has a good time. There also seemed to be some common ground. All in all pretty good or so I thought but inevitably I got the following after a day of silence. ) thank YOU for last night! I had a great time! I would not mind hanging out again some other time but should let you know i think you are a very intelligent and a very kind hearted guy but did not quite feel a romantic connection and would not want to lead you on. At the end of the day it's just the same old over and over again.
AriesDude Posted January 7, 2019 Posted January 7, 2019 Yea sorry if i sound harsh but your "nice guy pants" were on too high. Had the same experience tons when i was younger. "You are the most amazing and decent man ever...just not meant for me" bla bla spiel. Usually because of one of 3 things 1. You didnt come across as sweet and wild in bed and passionate and badass at the same time early on. 2. She could see you "working too hard" as you mentioned. Sometimes you get a date by literally not even trying to ask for her number or another date. Too much effort can be off putting. The kiss on the cheek should have confirmed it for you unfortunately. 3. She just really didnt spark, which you cant blame her for...completely normal, we all are human...if our hearts dont scream for one another we basically don't want to try and force something which might not work for fear of wasting time. There are so many fishies out there man. Move on and take the experience with you
alphamale Posted January 7, 2019 Posted January 7, 2019 when it comes to dating and mating nice guys finish last 1
Author ZA Dater Posted January 7, 2019 Author Posted January 7, 2019 Yea sorry if i sound harsh but your "nice guy pants" were on too high. Had the same experience tons when i was younger. "You are the most amazing and decent man ever...just not meant for me" bla bla spiel. Usually because of one of 3 things 1. You didnt come across as sweet and wild in bed and passionate and badass at the same time early on. 2. She could see you "working too hard" as you mentioned. Sometimes you get a date by literally not even trying to ask for her number or another date. Too much effort can be off putting. The kiss on the cheek should have confirmed it for you unfortunately. 3. She just really didnt spark, which you cant blame her for...completely normal, we all are human...if our hearts dont scream for one another we basically don't want to try and force something which might not work for fear of wasting time. There are so many fishies out there man. Move on and take the experience with you I'll just put in less effort. I was surprised she agreed to meet me after texting for 30 Min. Bottom line is it appears dating is the most difficult thing to do, in my case there is always something "wrong"
AriesDude Posted January 7, 2019 Posted January 7, 2019 "I'll just put in less effort. I was surprised she agreed to meet me after texting for 30 Min. Bottom line is it appears dating is the most difficult thing to do, in my case there is always something "wrong"" Yea playing the fast game is usually not seen as a "normal" date by girls. You would have to peak her interest for at least 5 hours straight after a date like that starts which isnt easy but most times also not worth it as she could have just been looking for a one night stand with some fine dining if she agreed that fast. Nothing wrong with taking your time to meet someone for a first date man...give it a day at least in the future to really get some questions in before meeting. So my advice would be go for a slower date instead of just putting in less effort.
manfrombelow2 Posted January 7, 2019 Posted January 7, 2019 When it comes to the game of dating, there are only two kinds of men: 1/ Guys who knows the game. 2/ Guys who don't. There are no "nice guys". 2
lurker74 Posted January 7, 2019 Posted January 7, 2019 It's not about effort, or lack thereof. It's about caring too much about one outcome. It's about how invested you are. I am not a fan of pick up artists because they are invariably jerks and sometimes dangerous, but here's where they get it right (although I will use more psychology and biology than a typical PUA site): We are animals that have been programmed for hundreds of thousands of years to procreate successfully. By successfully, that means not just having sex but selecting a mate that will have a successful outcome of producing the offspring and then rearing said offspring until they too can begin mating. In humans (and elephants), this is a problem because our heads are really big, which means we're born essentially born helpless. That leads to us having to select not just based on what happens tonight, but what happens for many months (or years). So this creates this interesting dynamic when it comes to dating. Generally, for men, we seek genetic compatibility, which means we put a lot of weight on apparent health, symmetry, fertility (breasts and buttocks), and the like. Women generally put some weight on that but also on the apparent ability of the potential father to provide post-delivery. Yes, this is all very broad and potentially insulting to us individually, but on a gross scale, it's not at all surprising. It also happens to explain why men tend to only look at pictures in OLD and women are more interested in what the man does for a living, but perhaps that is for another day. How this has a tendency to manifest in in-person dating is that subconsciously, we are still seeking the same things. Men will be interested in the physical characteristics and women will be interested in the likelihood of long-term success. And this is where it gets difficult for you. In the same way that you feel you "deserve" a better than average looking woman, as you've said in other posts, women will have a tendency to believe that they deserve a better than average long-term mate. And what does that mean for you? It means that if they sense that you are too eager (or desperate or thirsty or whatever), they will subconsciously be turned away because if you are the one that appears to need them, their brain will tell them that they are too good for you. The number one way that manifests itself is telling her that there's no connection or attraction. It's like when Groucho Marx said that he'd never be a member of a club that would have him as a member. She thinks that if you really want her, she must be much better than you. Now, that DOES NOT MEAN YOU SHOULD TREAT HER LIKE CRAP or "neg" her as the PUAs say. It does mean, however, that you need to look at any one meet as no big deal. Be yourself but don't try too hard. Don't act interested...BE INTERESTED. But recognize that anyone you meet is just one of around 3.5 billion possibilities and it it TOTALLY fine if she doesn't like you because the next one will...or the next. Whether the next is on an app or on the next bar stool. The magic of this is once you actually believe that, the women will actually be attracted to you. It's totally messed up until you recognize that they no more have the choice than you have the choice of whether that hottie in the mini dress is attractive to you. Most of it is biology. Now, some will say this is painting with a broad brush, and it is. There are millions of people that don;t operate like that. But most of those have LEARNED not to operate like that after many, many failures. In the meantime, learn from your failures and don't care too much about any one date until the dates turn into an actual relationship. 2
manfrombelow2 Posted January 7, 2019 Posted January 7, 2019 (edited) It seems to me that you: 1/ Tried to arrange the next date right during the first date. 2/ Talking too much. With the first one, that's a big turnoff because by trying to arrange the next date when you didn't even finish the first date, you acted needy and desperate, and this is a big turnoff to women. Women are scared of needy and desprate guys. You should have allow the two of you to just enjoy the first date, because if there first date went well, the next dates come naturally without you having to force them. With the second one, talking too much or trying to prove yourself (verbally) too much is just approval seeking behaviour. You should always let the woman do 80% of the talking instead of trying to out-talk her. Your job there is to listen and engage her into talking, because that's masculine energy. A man who talks too much gives off beta and feminine energy. Dating and loving is all about relaxing and having fun, you're there to enjoy the vibe and to have FUN, not to "work hard". I suggest you buy the book "3% Man" by Corey Wayne. So had a date last night which seemed to go relatively well. After the battering I took on the other forum I decided to try different things. What helped here was she was super chatty intelligent and could communicate. I got a kiss on the cheek and all seemed to be good, second date arranged for Wednesday. I really worked hard, she laughed, smiled and said she has a good time. There also seemed to be some common ground. All in all pretty good or so I thought but inevitably I got the following after a day of silence. ) thank YOU for last night! I had a great time! I would not mind hanging out again some other time but should let you know i think you are a very intelligent and a very kind hearted guy but did not quite feel a romantic connection and would not want to lead you on. At the end of the day it's just the same old over and over again. Edited January 8, 2019 by thaygiaogiang
elaine567 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 With the second one, talking too much or trying to prove yourself (verbally) too much is just approval seeking behaviour. You should always let the woman do 80% of the talking instead of trying to out-talk her. Your job there is to listen and engage her into talking, because that's masculine energy. A man who talks too much gives off beta and feminine energy. Trouble is ZADater's main problem is that he is too quiet and shy, the fact he did a lot of talking and put some effort in is to be applauded actually. It may not have worked here but I think in general it is an improvement. 4
manfrombelow2 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 It's not a girl's fault that she is unable to have interest in a guy who cannot solve his problems before entering a date with her. Anyway, ZADater needs to fail in order to learn and grow into a better version of himself. It's called "life". Trouble is ZADater's main problem is that he is too quiet and shy, the fact he did a lot of talking and put some effort in is to be applauded actually. It may not have worked here but I think in general it is an improvement.
elaine567 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 It's not a girl's fault that she is unable to have interest in a guy who cannot solve his problems before entering a date with her. Anyway, ZADater needs to fail in order to learn and grow into a better version of himself. It's called "life". Yes and normally I would agree but ZA Daters dating adventure comprises of one failure after another for years and years and years, he is now 34. He now needs some successes. 1
Lotsgoingon Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 Well ... congratulations on the date ... though you're labeling it a failure, I don't see it that way. For one, this woman sent you a very respectful note and she complimented you ... I'll offer this, though: you want to fine-tune your radar ... In other words, YOU should be able to tell after a date if YOU feel excited and/or if the woman feels excited. Right now, your radar isn't working. Now, it takes time to fine-tune the radar ... and you may need to first have a fantastic date with someone, so that you can learn to distinguish a fantastic date from a polite, decent date. Polite, decent dates generally don't go anywhere. I also want to give you this perspective. You admit you were working really hard during the date. Ideally, unless you have some major neurological problem, you do NOT want to work so hard ... If the person is right for you, they'll like you without you working so dang hard. Plus the whole point of a relationship is to find someone who thinks you're great as you are ... flaws and all ... and then yes, they may encourage you to grow. But the main thing is they accept you now. So ... seems like fine-tuning your social skills is in order. Dude, assuming you didn't madly fall in love with this woman, use her a resource. See if she's interested in being friends, go hang with her and her friends. Have her introduce you to some of her friends ... Boldest of all, at some point ... take her out ... and ask her to give you some help on dating and connecting with women. She's in a perfect position to give you some constructive feedback and suggestions. Tell her you want some tips ... tell her she can be frank. She can even make observations about her interaction with you. I say this only because this woman wrote a really thoughtful note to you ... she didn't insult you ... she acknowledged your strengths. She likes you ... and though that might sound minor, it's not. She may tell you something simple--that turns out to be blockbuster helpful about meeting someone you like who likes you. Often we have to have other people tell us about some good quality we have ... because we don't otherwise believe it or even see this good quality. Now, if you're in love with this woman, don't pursue this ... but if you can swallow your ego a bit ... she's got to know good places to hang out, good dates ... I don't know if you're online dating but if you are, you can ask her how to strengthen your profile ... Make sure to spell out clearly and plainly that you are not trying to pursue her anymore. Say that up front, but you can even tell her you feel like you have some dating struggles. This woman sounds like a really good and safe person. So she's not interested in romance--so what? Add her to your network ... And keep rocking and rolling. Far from failure or rejection, this could be a great learning and improvement experience. 1
manfrombelow2 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 How do you know this unless you are inside his head or you're living real close to him in real life? Yes and normally I would agree but ZA Daters dating adventure comprises of one failure after another for years and years and years, he is now 34. He now needs some successes.
elaine567 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 How do you know this unless you are inside his head or you're living real close to him in real life? We have all on this forum been following ZA Dater for years, we know about every date, every twist and turn of his dating struggle.... 1
manfrombelow2 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 Understood. I'm quite new here so I wasn't aware of that. Thanks. We have all on this forum been following ZA Dater for years, we know about every date, every twist and turn of his dating struggle.... 1
alphamale Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 Yes and normally I would agree but ZA Daters dating adventure comprises of one failure after another for years and years and years, he is now 34. He now needs some successes. hire him an escort elaine567
elaine567 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 hire him an escort elaine567 Last time someone mentioned that he wasn't too keen. I kind of get that. He needs someone to want him for him and an escort would only be being nice to him for the money...
manfrombelow2 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 There are two tasks at hand for someone like him: 1/ Get used to the physical contact with women's bodies. 2/ Get to understand how the female brain works. With task no.1, prostitutes or erotic massages is a very good idea. Once a man is used to the physical contact with women's bodies and get bodily pleasures from it, he'd get more confident with the presence of women, which is a good thing. With taks no.2, well first he needs to complete task no.1 first. Last time someone mentioned that he wasn't too keen. I kind of get that. He needs someone to want him for him and an escort would only be being nice to him for the money...
alphamale Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 He needs someone to want him for him and an escort would only be being nice to him for the money... indeed, but experience with women leads to confidence with women
elaine567 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 indeed, but experience with women leads to confidence with women But does experience with escorts lead to confidence with women or does it just lead to more experiences with escorts? Especially for "the strugglers". 1
Wallysbears Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 When it comes to the game of dating, there are only two kinds of men: 1/ Guys who knows the game. 2/ Guys who don't. There are no "nice guys". Don’t listen to this drivel. Seriously do not. In reading his posts, he sounds like he has zero Clue. You had a decent date - there just wasn’t a spark. Replicate whatever you did with this date! It is progress! 1
Wallysbears Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 There are two tasks at hand for someone like him: 1/ Get used to the physical contact with women's bodies. 2/ Get to understand how the female brain works. With task no.1, prostitutes or erotic massages is a very good idea. Once a man is used to the physical contact with women's bodies and get bodily pleasures from it, he'd get more confident with the presence of women, which is a good thing. With taks no.2, well first he needs to complete task no.1 first. Women aren’t like prostitutes or erotic massages. Those women are paid nicely to treat their clients a specific way. It has zero bearing on reality. That’s like saying to watch porn to learn how to be good at sex. It is fantasy.
manfrombelow2 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 1/ How can you say it was a "decent" date if there was not a spark? 2/ There's a saying that "insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the same result". And that's what exactly you're telling him to do, honey. You had a decent date - there just wasn’t a spark. Replicate whatever you did with this date! It is progress!
Wallysbears Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 1/ How can you say it was a "decent" date if there was not a spark? 2/ There's a saying that "insanity is doing the same thing over and over again and expecting the same result". And that's what exactly you're telling him to do, honey. Because I’ve taken the time to read his post history. Unlike you 1
manfrombelow2 Posted January 8, 2019 Posted January 8, 2019 Please do not try to mis-interpret my idea on purpose just because you don't like me personally. I was saying for a guy like him, he needs to take babysteps first, which is getting used to the female bodies. And the fastest and easiest way to gain access to female bodies are by paying them. And there's nothing bad about that and please don't start a debate about the moral and legal aspect of prostitution or erotic massages. And the fact that you, a woman, is getting all upset about me and my ideas proves that I am f**king right haha. Women aren’t like prostitutes or erotic massages. Those women are paid nicely to treat their clients a specific way. It has zero bearing on reality. That’s like saying to watch porn to learn how to be good at sex. It is fantasy.
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