catchmeifyoucan Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 (edited) When I was in University, I had the biggest crush on my law professor (he is 8 years older than me). I acted on that crush and 6 years later we are still together. However, our relationship has never been easy as he is very critical and judgmental. I am more of a relaxed type of person. He has often said things like we are not compatible sexually. We were engaged for a few years and he recently told me he does not want to marry me, but still wants to be with me. So I agreed, with the condition that I can see other people. (Note, we do not have any type of sex life!) About 3 years ago I started seeing a new Dr because of depression caused by my very difficult relationship. I had almost no self-esteem and was thinking about taking my own life (That is how useless my then fiance had made me feel). I was having financial difficulties, and so I only paid for one consultation and thereafter the Dr was seeing me for free. (He is just that type of person - always helping everyone) There was absolutely nothing unethical happening for a long time. During the years, the Dr himself went through some tough times. Slowly a friendship grew and I supported him emotionally. About 3 months ago, we started seeing each other socially. Things have progressed and we are now in a very happy relationship (we do not consider ourselves as boyfriend and girlfriend yet - I am also still officially dating the professor). We are however having sex. He makes me so happy, he is respectful, caring and looks at me as if he is the luckiest man in the world to have me. He has told me that although he is not ready for a relationship (as he has only been divorced for about half a year) he does see a future with me and can see himself marrying me. He also often tells me he loves me and that I am his best friend. He says his favourite part of our relationship is the way we can communicate so well. This is very true, but there are some things I cant really talk to him about as it will seem like I do not trust him. 1. Should I be worried that he says he is not ready for a relationship right now? I honestly believe him when he says he can see himself marrying me. Am I being stupid? 2. He is 20 years older than me. Does age really matter? He is much fitter than me and is an active cyclist. I also do not plan to have any children. 3. He says he has never fallen for a patient before. Can this be true? I believe him in my heart (even my ex-fiance had never been with his student before, I am the one who initiated these things). I guess I just need advice. I cant talk to my friends as they do not know that my engagement has fallen through. Edited August 28, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
Redhead14 Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 Should I be worried that he says he is not ready for a relationship right now? - You bet you should be. This man is being honest and you don't like what you're hearing so you're just stringing yourself along. I cant talk to my friends - You can talk to your friends, you just don't want to hear what they will tell you. there are some things I cant really talk to him about as it will seem like I do not trust him - You don't trust him a) because you can't communicate, b) he has communicated with you and you don't want to believe what he's saying. You're stringing yourself along. I honestly believe him when he says he can see himself marrying me - When a man is sending you mixed messages like this guy does, he's just stringing you along. He says his favourite part of our relationship is the way we can communicate so well. - Hmm, you can't talk to him and he's giving you mixed messages. That's not good communication. This guy is blowing smoke up your a*s and keeping you around for arm-candy and "convenience". 3
BaileyB Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 When a man tells you that he is not ready for a relationship, believe him. And know, he can and should lose his license for having a personal and sexual relationship with a patient. What he has done is not ethical or professionally responsible.
stillafool Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 If you are now seeing the Doc and having sex with him why are you still involved with the Professor? Especially since he is the cause of you having to see the Doc in the first place? You continue to ask questions about the men and what they want. What do you want? 3
ExpatInItaly Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 Oh dear. I think both of these men spotted your vulnerability and insecurity a mile away, and use it to their full advantage. You would be best to cut off both of them and stay single for a while. Get emotionally healthy, improve your self-confidence and learn to develop better boundaries. You'd be surprised how quickly sketchy men like these ones will disappear when you do. 8
Zahara Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 You jumped from one emotionally unavailable man to another. In my past experience, when a man is telling you that he is not ready for a relationship, it usually means he's not wanting to be in a relationship with you. The best thing you can do for yourself right now is to be rid of these two because they smell your insecurities and your vulnerabilities and most times, these types will use that to their benefit. Step away from them. Learn to stand on your own two feet without using men as crutches, work on your self-esteem, build your independence and find courage to be alone. 3
smackie9 Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 I'm so sorry you are stuck with this situation. From an outsider's point of view I see both these men taking advantage of you, especially this newest fellow. He's feeling lucky because of your age, and hasn't has sex or a nice time with someone in a long time. What got me is that he over stepped his professional boundaries, and has lost all integrity. He's keeping it quiet because it will jeopardize his job as a therapist. You are a vulnerable person, and both these men have taken advantage of that.....and I think you are finally starting to see that. IMO you are in a unhealthy arrangement with the both of them. If you are going to get anywhere in life, you need to stand on your own two feet. You don't need any of these guys to have a happy satisfying, fulfilling life. 2
Radarsat Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 I went through this with an ex who fell in love with her doctor. Even if you guys (doctor and yourself) are together, which clearly you are....do yourself a favor and look up "transference". This is a highly imbalanced relationship and extremely unethical of him imo. 3
d0nnivain Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 What is it with you and emotionally unavailable older men? As soon as you figure out the answer to that Q you will solve many of your problems
ExpatInItaly Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 I went through this with an ex who fell in love with her doctor. Even if you guys (doctor and yourself) are together, which clearly you are....do yourself a favor and look up "transference". This is a highly imbalanced relationship and extremely unethical of him imo. Yes, that is a good point. OP, please follow this suggestion and read up on transference. It could be very enlightening for you. I also agree about the extremely questionable ethics of your doctor, OP. You don't see it, but him treating you for free was the first of his many moves on you. He knew what he was doing, and I would not believe for a moment you're the first patient he's stepped out of bounds with. 3
Radarsat Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 Yes, that is a good point. OP, please follow this suggestion and read up on transference. It could be very enlightening for you. I also agree about the extremely questionable ethics of your doctor, OP. You don't see it, but him treating you for free was the first of his many moves on you. He knew what he was doing, and I would not believe for a moment you're the first patient he's stepped out of bounds with. Absolutely nailed it ^^^. The problem I dealt with my ex, is with transference, the victim(s) are under a spell of sorts. They don't want to believe anything else other than what they are feeling. And they can become extremely defensive when confronted on it by friends or family. It's a horrible horrible situation to be in. I hope you can at least see a counselor and get a professional perspective on this. But bottom line, both relationships (teacher and doctor) are really imbalanced power relationships. I wish you well.
JuneL Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 Did you start dating while you were still his patient? Is this a psychiatrist we’re talking about? If either of your answers is yes, then this doctor has violated his professional code of conduct big time. A psychiatrist is not allowed to have a romantic or sexual relationship even with a former patient.
JuneL Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 Absolutely nailed it ^^^. The problem I dealt with my ex, is with transference, the victim(s) are under a spell of sorts. They don't want to believe anything else other than what they are feeling. And they can become extremely defensive when confronted on it by friends or family. It's a horrible horrible situation to be in. I hope you can at least see a counselor and get a professional perspective on this. But bottom line, both relationships (teacher and doctor) are really imbalanced power relationships. I wish you well. What happened to the relationship between your ex and her doctor? 1
kendahke Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 You don't trust him a) because you can't communicate, b) he has communicated with you and you don't want to believe what he's saying. You're stringing yourself along.. Good to see you back posting again, Redhead!
Redhead14 Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 Good to see you back posting again, Redhead! Good to see you too Kendahke! 1
kendahke Posted August 28, 2018 Posted August 28, 2018 About 3 years ago I started seeing a new Dr . I was having financial difficulties, and so I only paid for one consultation and thereafter the Dr was seeing me for free. (He is just that type of person - always helping everyone) There was absolutely nothing unethical happening for a long time. I'm glad you recognize that there is unethical behavior afoot between you two now. During the years, the Dr himself went through some tough times. Slowly a friendship grew and I supported him emotionally. About 3 months ago, we started seeing each other socially. Things have progressed and we are now in a very happy relationship (we do not consider ourselves as boyfriend and girlfriend yet - I am also still officially dating the professor). We are however having sex. And he has remained your therapist while you were having sex with him? Did you two stop therapy and assume this relationship? If you didn't, then he's broken all ethical rules doing this--no wonder he gives out therapy for free. He makes me so happy, he is respectful, caring and looks at me as if he is the luckiest man in the world to have me. He has told me that although he is not ready for a relationship (as he has only been divorced for about half a year) he does see a future with me and can see himself marrying me. He also often tells me he loves me and that I am his best friend. He says his favourite part of our relationship is the way we can communicate so well. This is very true, but there are some things I cant really talk to him about The communication must not be all that good if you cannot speak plainly to him for fear he will bolt. If he would bolt so easily, then he's not all he's claiming to be. as it will seem like I do not trust him. Do you? 1. Should I be worried that he says he is not ready for a relationship right now? I honestly believe him when he says he can see himself marrying me. Am I being stupid? He can say anything and it still not be true--or as a means to manipulate you. What are his actions? If he's not moving, emotionally and intimately, closer to you, then he's just talking isht to keep the hook in your cheek. If he's just gotten out of a marriage, then you're a rebound relationship (and he's your rebound because you just monkey-branched your way over to him while still being involved with another man) and those, by and large, do not last. 2. He is 20 years older than me. Does age really matter? He is much fitter than me and is an active cyclist. I also do not plan to have any children. 3. He says he has never fallen for a patient before. Yes, in this case age and profession and what your relationship started out as matters. A lot, because he knows better than to get involved with a patient. Do yourself a huge favor: get rid of him as your boyfriend and your therapist and find someone who has integrity in those areas. What you're doing is called transference and it's a psychological thing that all therapists are trained to notice and avoid.
Author catchmeifyoucan Posted August 29, 2018 Author Posted August 29, 2018 If you are now seeing the Doc and having sex with him why are you still involved with the Professor? Especially since he is the cause of you having to see the Doc in the first place? You continue to ask questions about the men and what they want. What do you want? The professor has told me he still wants to be with me as we are... which is a sort of room mate/friendship situation (nothing sexual). Neither of us have told our parents or friends about calling off the engagement. He is a very private person and I think he is afraid of what people may think. We also have animals together, which makes it difficult to separate as we both love them. If/when I leave his house, my lifestyle will have to change a lot, and I probably would not be able to afford a house with a large enough backyard for the animals. This is going to sound so stupid, but I am scared to be alone, emotionally. I don't feel strong enough to go through a breakup.
Author catchmeifyoucan Posted August 29, 2018 Author Posted August 29, 2018 Did you start dating while you were still his patient? Is this a psychiatrist we’re talking about? If either of your answers is yes, then this doctor has violated his professional code of conduct big time. A psychiatrist is not allowed to have a romantic or sexual relationship even with a former patient. We did not start dating while I was his patient. I asked him to make a note on his system that I was changing doctors. I am a lawyer, so I was very scared to cause any trouble for him in the future. He is not a psychiatrist, he is a GP. I was only his patient officially for 1 consultation, however he did continue to write repeat prescriptions for me.
Author catchmeifyoucan Posted August 29, 2018 Author Posted August 29, 2018 @kendahke, In my heart I trust him. But I know better than to trust my heart. We did not start any emotional or sexual relationship while he was treating me. He also was never my therapist. He is just a GP that prescribed anti-depressant and anti-anxiety medication to me. I don't know what is wrong with me or why I fall for people in positions of power over me. But with the doctor, it has never felt that way. He treats me as an equal and often asks me for advice etc. I guess I am just so in love that I am blinded. It feels like he is the thing that has been missing my entire life. I guess I am just a sucker for punishment. He is also not really hiding me. He has introduced me to a few of his friends and he talks about our future often by saying that he can see us being a couple in the future. He is also always availble, I dont get the feeling he is seeing anyone else. I suppose I am just seeing what I want to see.
TheBathWater Posted August 29, 2018 Posted August 29, 2018 (edited) When I was in University, I had the biggest crush on my law professor (he is 8 years older than me). I acted on that crush and 6 years later we are still together. However, our relationship has never been easy as he is very critical and judgmental. I am more of a relaxed type of person. He has often said things like we are not compatible sexually. We were engaged for a few years and he recently told me he does not want to marry me, but still wants to be with me. So I agreed, with the condition that I can see other people. (Note, we do not have any type of sex life!) About 3 years ago I started seeing a new Dr because of depression caused by my very difficult relationship. I had almost no self-esteem and was thinking about taking my own life (That is how useless my then fiance had made me feel). <snip> 1. What you are wanting and what he is offering to you right now are not aligned. It sounds like you're operating on the hope that one day it will be aligned, based on what he says could happen one day. That's why you're worried, and that's reasonable to worry about. 2. Sometimes age matters, but not always. At a certain point, I think it matters less. You said he is more fit than you and that sounded like what the concern was more than age. Are a you a heavy woman? 3. He says he has never fallen for a patient before. Okay, this is where things get more serious in my eyes. It is unethical in the medical profession (psychology, psychiatry, general medicine, etc...) for a doctor to establish a personal relationship of any sort with a patient. In some areas, it is illegal. Did you know this? It is also considered unethical for a medical professional to see you pro bono (i.e. for free), unless there is a highly unusual situation where payment of any kind, even $10, would be impossible. Your "boyfriend" can lose his license to practice if he was reported for this, and could even face jail time. I myself am in the psychology field and am alarmed by what is occurring here. My understanding is that personalities such as his have underlying narcissism at best, and psychopathy at worst. I am highly concerned about what he is doing with you. If he is willing to act unethically in his profession, then I wouldn't believe him that he has never fallen for a patient before, let alone how he seems to be stringing you along. Finally, I want to say I feel very concerned for you. I don't know you at all, but from what you've written here, it sounds like you have a history of getting involved with men who 1) have positions of authority; and 2) are behaving unethically by establishing a personal relationship with you. I would encourage you to find a female professional psychologist whom you can talk with about your situation. I think you're in need of support from someone who you can trust and will have your best interest in mind without taking advantage of you. Edited August 30, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator Truncate quote
TheBathWater Posted August 29, 2018 Posted August 29, 2018 We did not start dating while I was his patient. I asked him to make a note on his system that I was changing doctors. I am a lawyer, so I was very scared to cause any trouble for him in the future. He is not a psychiatrist, he is a GP. I was only his patient officially for 1 consultation, however he did continue to write repeat prescriptions for me. You're a lawyer. I think you're smart and know you are blurring the lines here to rationalize what is happening. Once a professional meeting occurs between a doctor and patient, that's it. It is unethical and sometimes even illegal to establish a personal relationship for several years (typically 2-5 years) after the last contact. And if he was prescribing for you, he was your doctor. 1
Author catchmeifyoucan Posted August 29, 2018 Author Posted August 29, 2018 1. What you are wanting and what he is offering to you right now are not aligned. It sounds like you're operating on the hope that one day it will be aligned, based on what he says could happen one day. That's why you're worried, and that's reasonable to worry about. 2. Sometimes age matters, but not always. At a certain point, I think it matters less. You said he is more fit than you and that sounded like what the concern was more than age. Are a you a heavy woman? 3. He says he has never fallen for a patient before. Okay, this is where things get more serious in my eyes. It is unethical in the medical profession (psychology, psychiatry, general medicine, etc...) for a doctor to establish a personal relationship of any sort with a patient. In some areas, it is illegal. Did you know this? It is also considered unethical for a medical professional to see you pro bono (i.e. for free), unless there is a highly unusual situation where payment of any kind, even $10, would be impossible. Your "boyfriend" can lose his license to practice if he was reported for this, and could even face jail time. I am highly concerned about what he is doing with you. If he is willing to act unethically in his profession, then I wouldn't believe him that he has never fallen for a patient before, let alone how he seems to be stringing you along. Finally, I want to say I feel very concerned for you. I don't know you at all, but from what you've written here, it sounds like you have a history of getting involved with men who 1) have positions of authority; and 2) are behaving unethically by establishing a personal relationship with you. I would encourage you to find a female professional psychologist whom you can talk with about your situation. I think you're in need of support from someone who you can trust and will have your best interest in mind without taking advantage of you. ** Thank you for your response... yes, I am wanting a long term relationship with him and he does know this. We were having a serious conversation the other day and he told me that he is not going anywhere (i.e. he does not plan to leave me). I then asked him please not to hurt me. His reply was: "I promise you I will never, for a few reasons: 1. I really love you 2. You are only ever good to me 3.I truly have never felt like this before" If he feels this way, I just wonder why he does not want a relationship right now. I have never been through a divorce before. So I dont know if it is normal to take things very slow after a divorce, or if he is just making excuses. ** I am not a heavy person. I weigh 55 kg (around 121 pounds). Fitness is important to me, so I see it as a good thing that at his age he is fitter than me. ** Thank you for your concern. I know you are right. I have some anxiety about seeing a psychologist as I have never done so in the past. But I am seriously going to consider it.
Author catchmeifyoucan Posted August 29, 2018 Author Posted August 29, 2018 You're a lawyer. I think you're smart and know you are blurring the lines here to rationalize what is happening. Once a professional meeting occurs between a doctor and patient, that's it. It is unethical and sometimes even illegal to establish a personal relationship for several years (typically 2-5 years) after the last contact. And if he was prescribing for you, he was your doctor. In my country (3rd world country), the laws and ethical codes are not clearly defined when it comes to past patients. He was prescribing for me, but has not since things have become physical. (I still have enough repeats, so we have not come to that point yet) I do know that what is happening is not professional of him and wrong of me. I do feel as though I am in love with him. I am supposed to see him this evening.
kendahke Posted August 29, 2018 Posted August 29, 2018 It feels like he is the thing that has been missing my entire life. I guess I am just a sucker for punishment. The way you know this for sure is by the actions they put behind how they say they feel. He says all of this, but what are his actions? Has he filed for the divorce? He is also not really hiding me. He has introduced me to a few of his friends and he talks about our future often by saying that he can see us being a couple in the future. Ok, so the future can be the end of the year or 2045--which is it for him? Does his immediate familial circle know you exist? He is also always availble, I dont get the feeling he is seeing anyone else. I suppose I am just seeing what I want to see. How much of your youth are you willing to apply to this relationship? If he never changes his approach, are you good with what you do have and can be content with that and not complain? It's the being able to not complain about what you have with him that is the test of what you're talking yourself into.
Author catchmeifyoucan Posted August 29, 2018 Author Posted August 29, 2018 (edited) The way you know this for sure is by the actions they put behind how they say they feel. He says all of this, but what are his actions? Has he filed for the divorce? Ok, so the future can be the end of the year or 2045--which is it for him? Does his immediate familial circle know you exist? How much of your youth are you willing to apply to this relationship? If he never changes his approach, are you good with what you do have and can be content with that and not complain? It's the being able to not complain about what you have with him that is the test of what you're talking yourself into. He is divorced already for 6 months. His divorce had nothing to do with me. He has done nothing for me not to believe what he says. All his actions have backed up what he is saying. He calls me once per day before work, we text every day a few times and we see each other around 3 times per week. He has never cancelled on me, and all the times I have asked to see him, he has acted very excited. I guess that is the problem - I dont know when the future is for him. None of his family know about me. But in his defense, we have only been "dating" (if you can call it that) for 3 months. And intimate for 1 month of those months. I am not willing to wait forever for him. I feel I have already wasted 6 years of my life with the previous guy. But I want to be understanding, because I can imagine going through a divorce is difficult. All ethical views aside... should I maybe give him another month, and if things are not closer to becoming official, then I distance myself from him? How long is too long to wait for someone? (especially if they have recently gone through a divorce) Edited August 29, 2018 by catchmeifyoucan
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