I’m (27F) not sure of the future of my relationship with my SO (30M)

[yume]

Apologies for the length. And so happy to see the forum back online!

 

I’d like to start off by saying that this is probably the best relationship I’ve ever been in. We’ve been dating for a year and four months, after knowing each other for about five years prior in a professional capacity. I asked him out. It had been bliss up until about the year mark.

 

A few weeks after celebrating our first anniversary, I started a new school program that I’m very excited about. Without getting into the long story of my journey of self-discovery to find my calling career-wise, I essentially finally found the perfect program for me that will lead me into a very fruitful career in the future. I am super excited about it and this is basically the first time in my life that I look forward to going to school every day (big change for me as I’ve always hated school). As a result, I feel like I’m changing / growing and moving forward. But I’m also beginning to feel like I’m leaving my SO behind.

 

I love him, he is a wonderful person, excellent with people, is extremely kind, nurturing, affectionate, always calls, cheers me up when I am down, is respectful of my space… essentially he is an excellent balance to me as I have a tendency to be too serious and moody. He puts up with a lot of my shortcomings involving intimacy. However, as time has gone on, and the rose coloured glasses have come off, I think I am beginning to see that he is not a perfect person - he does have some faults.

 

The major fault I’m finding with him is his very apparent apathy or lack of motivation with regards to his career. My SO has been at the same job for over 10 years. He is adamant about not being promoted from his position, and has refused to do so multiple times, even though senior management has asked him to, and thinks he would be wonderful in the next position above him. He also has zero ideas about what he would like to do instead. He consistently has a ****ty schedule as it’s shift work, and this frequently prevents us from having quality time together. My schedule is fixed M-F and he is always working weekends. If he wants a weekend off, it becomes a big production – he must ask for it way in advance, it has to be approved, and even if he gets it he still gets **** on by senior management for being away. I do my best to accommodate his schedule and spend weeknights with him whenever possible. But I miss having normal time together, waking up on a weekend where neither of us have to be anywhere all day, that sort of thing. That rarely happens in our relationship.

 

Just recently, there was an incident where it looked like they weren’t going to allow him to take the summer holidays he had booked back in January. He was really upset by this, and told me he is finished, wants a new job, is going to start looking, etc. And then the issue got resolved and he got to keep his holidays. So now it’s back to “everything’s fine!”. This has happened several times over the course of our relationship – something happens, he gets frustrated at work, tells me that he’s gonna get out, then a few days go by and it’s all fine again. This job, I should also mention, is pretty average, if not a bit below average – it requires no post secondary education, the pay is mediocre, and the hours suck. And my SO is (I think, anyways) reasonably intelligent, has EXCELLENT people skills, and could do SO MUCH better job-wise. He just won’t go out there to see what he could actually do with his career.

 

In extension to this, my SO also seems to have a rather carefree, goal-less existence in a broader sense. He has no financial savings that I am aware of, no goals of home ownership, or anything of that nature. In terms of future planning, and what he’s told me in conversations we’ve had about the future, is that he wants 2 kids, a boy and a girl. But he can’t tell me when he wants this OR how he would manage (financially) with a family of that size. He has also never initiated any serious conversations with me regarding the future or what we want out of life.

 

I already am leaning heavily towards being child-free, and he knows this. I do however think I could have 1 kid provided certain conditions were met prior (stable finances, possible home ownership, completion of other things I want to do in life first like travel) – yet I don’t think he has a chance of even convincing me to start a family with him due to his inability or unwillingness to plan a future. I myself see a life in a wonderful partnership, with home ownership, cats and dogs, maybe one child or more likely childless, lots of travel and generally wonderful experiences.

 

As a result, I’m beginning to feel like our time together is finite. I don’t necessarily feel at this moment that I want to end it, as we have such great times together, and in spite of the above generally all other aspects of the relationship are fine, but these issues are constantly at the back of my mind. I am beginning to feel more often lately that our relationship is a bit strained due to his difficult schedule, and my own growth is fuelling my inner frustrations with his lack of growth.

 

I guess I want to feel like I can be with someone that I can plan a future with. And maybe I’m now realising I may not have a future with this particular person. I’m just having a terrible time rationalizing ending a great relationship over something like this. I think about how there are so many worse things worth ending a relationship over, and how maybe this is what being an adult in a relationship means – realising someone’s faults and either learning to accept them as is or… not. I know everyone has their own timelines, but in some ways (and I feel horrible saying this) I feel like a 30-year-old man should have more of his **** together by now? And god knows I wasn’t put on earth to babysit, kids OR grown men.

 

So...I'm looking for some outsider perspective as to whether I’m making a big deal out of a minor issue in an otherwise great relationship. What should I do next? I’ve had a lot of conflicting advice from friends about how to proceed, from just letting our relationship be what it is until it…isn’t, or giving him an ultimatum (I don’t like ultimatums personally). We have already had one tense conversation in the last month about some of my thoughts related to the above, nothing was really resolved or cleared up in that convo except that we both established we didn’t want to end things then and there. He did say that if I am 100% a no on kids, then it wouldn't work out. But I'm not 100% a no, so...

 

Anyway since then things have been ok – I’m just trapped in my own mindsuck, which is why I’m now posting here.

 

TLDR my SO is very unmotivated, has a ****ty schedule due to work but won’t do anything to change his situation for the better; things going on in my own life are causing me to experience lots of growth and I fear I may be “leaving him behind” instead of us growing together. Also have some differing expectations for the future regarding kids and not sure how to proceed.

[S_A]

How do you feel while at school? You started already? Do you feel like you connect well with other people there and that they have given like this new-found-energy or something? Need to know the answer to these questions before I answer yours.

[yume]

How do you feel while at school? You started already? Do you feel like you connect well with other people there and that they have given like this new-found-energy or something? Need to know the answer to these questions before I answer yours.

 

Yes, I started 4 months ago. I feel good when I am at school, I feel productive and generally just like "Yes! I am working towards something I am finally excited about!" Sometimes I sit there and pinch myself that I am actually there, compared to where I was a year ago. I am really enjoying school in terms of the curriculum and what I am studying / learning how to do. I don't know where the hours go, which is a phenomenon hasn't happened to me for a long time. I wouldn't say my classmates are the source of my new energy - they are all very nice people (all international, I am the only local in our class) but I wouldn't say I've made any deep, significant connection with any of them (yet). 85% of my class is also female, so it is not a question of any new male proximity that's affecting me. Ultimately I think my new found energy is fueled by my excitement for moving forward after a LOT of ups and downs and hard, introspective work with life coaches and counsellors over the last year.

[MaleIntuition]

This is quite an interesting topic. On the one hand you are describing a good relationship with someone whom have personality traits that you admire: good people skills, warm, caring etc. But on the other hand you wish that he would be more future oriented.

 

Based on your description it sounds like your bf might be an ESFJ according to MBTI: Portrait of an ESFJ ?

 

I really don’t think you can change him that much. Career goals, savings, house ownership; the things you listed as faults aren’t objectively better, they are just different priorities. Doing a career is stressful- it will introduce more conflict and less harmony. Saving money means less now but more later.

 

Personally I like the idea of finding a partner whom can compliment some of my weaknesses. And I also think it’s fairly common with such relationships, however, traditionally it’s the man who’s doing the career and the women who’s more family oriented.

 

At the end of the day, you’ll just have to figure out what’s most important for you, finding someone with a more similar personality or doing most of the future planning yourself.

[Els]

So...I'm looking for some outsider perspective as to whether I’m making a big deal out of a minor issue in an otherwise great relationship. What should I do next? I’ve had a lot of conflicting advice from friends about how to proceed, from just letting our relationship be what it is until it…isn’t, or giving him an ultimatum (I don’t like ultimatums personally).

 

Stark differences in life goals and incompatible careers is as far from "minor" as... well, I dunno, the only comparable incompatibility I can think of is one partner wanting a monogamous R and the other wanting a polygamous R, lol. It's HUGE. This isn't like one of you preferring the thermostat on high while the other prefers it on low.

 

He's not "wrong" for wanting what he wants (to remain stagnant in his career assuming he's able to support himself), but neither are you "wrong" for wanting a different sort of partner. And realistically, the life goals that you have - travel, home ownership, etc, are incompatible with his choices.

 

I do have to mention that there is always a tradeoff. The odds of a couple both having amazing careers while having completely compatible work schedules, being able to travel together, own a home AND a few dogs and cats... that is fairly low. Chances are you will have to give up one or two of the above. For instance, in me and the SO's case, he has a great career, we have traveled together lots (especially considering our age), we could own a home now if we wanted. But he works weekends sometimes, and will for the next 5 years or so until he gets to the top (and even then there will be a few weekends, albeit rarer). It's just a tradeoff that we have to live with - life is rarely perfect.

 

But in your case it seems like less of a "tradeoff" than complete incompatibility, which is why I'm leaning towards advising you to leave.

[Noproblem]

Here is the thing.. I don't think you really love him otherwise you wouldn't think your time together is finite.

 

So since this is the case, you are still very young 27

 

Get out of this relationship, focus on your school, and the right person will come or maybe not.

 

But the heartache of breaking up with him will be less severe and the time investment will be much less compared to if you decided to break up with him at age 31.

 

Don't be stuck in something you don't feel comfortable at.

 

At the same time, if it's not broken why fix it?

 

He is not perfect and he is not supposed to be perfect. You either love him with his faults or just leave before you two get attached to the point with no return.

[yume]

At the end of the day, you’ll just have to figure out what’s most important for you, finding someone with a more similar personality or doing most of the future planning yourself.

 

I think, if I am to be in a partnership for life, I'd want it to be with someone who is interested in making plans together, as opposed to one person just steering the ship.

 

Stark differences in life goals and incompatible careers is as far from "minor" as... well, I dunno, the only comparable incompatibility I can think of is one partner wanting a monogamous R and the other wanting a polygamous R, lol. It's HUGE. This isn't like one of you preferring the thermostat on high while the other prefers it on low.

 

He's not "wrong" for wanting what he wants (to remain stagnant in his career assuming he's able to support himself), but neither are you "wrong" for wanting a different sort of partner. And realistically, the life goals that you have - travel, home ownership, etc, are incompatible with his choices.

 

I do have to mention that there is always a tradeoff. The odds of a couple both having amazing careers while having completely compatible work schedules, being able to travel together, own a home AND a few dogs and cats... that is fairly low. Chances are you will have to give up one or two of the above. For instance, in me and the SO's case, he has a great career, we have traveled together lots (especially considering our age), we could own a home now if we wanted. But he works weekends sometimes, and will for the next 5 years or so until he gets to the top (and even then there will be a few weekends, albeit rarer). It's just a tradeoff that we have to live with - life is rarely perfect.

 

But in your case it seems like less of a "tradeoff" than complete incompatibility, which is why I'm leaning towards advising you to leave.

 

I know there will always be some sort of tradeoff, which is why this feels so confusing. As I said in my original post, I constantly think about how there are much worse reasons to have for considering ending a relationship - and is this really that bad? I know no one I meet will be perfect, and no relationship will ever be perfect. I am willing to make concessions (and have been), but like in your situation, you know it's temporary that your SO is working weekends until he moves up, whereas I have every reason to believe that this is just the way our relationship will be until the end of time because he's not working towards anything else.

 

Here is the thing.. I don't think you really love him otherwise you wouldn't think your time together is finite.

 

I think that's rather harsh. Can I not love someone as much as I am able regardless of whether or not we are suited to spend our lives together?

[Els]

I know there will always be some sort of tradeoff, which is why this feels so confusing. As I said in my original post, I constantly think about how there are much worse reasons to have for considering ending a relationship - and is this really that bad? I know no one I meet will be perfect, and no relationship will ever be perfect. I am willing to make concessions (and have been), but like in your situation, you know it's temporary that your SO is working weekends until he moves up, whereas I have every reason to believe that this is just the way our relationship will be until the end of time because he's not working towards anything else.

 

 

Yes, exactly. As I said, that's why I'm leaning towards encouraging you to leave. There will always be "much worse reasons" for considering ending a relationship. But if you are this unhappy with his choices and he is this set in his ways, I apologize but I really don't see a happy ending here. You are already this resentful of him 1 year in. Imagine how you will feel when you're 10 years in, supporting the family financially while juggling a kid or two (whom you will be solely in charge of during weekends), having traveled nowhere, still renting, unable to afford the lifestyle you desire?

 

 

I wouldn't give him an ultimatum, and I don't believe those lead to anything good ever. But you should really have a serious talk addressing these incompatibilities.

[yume]

Yes, exactly. As I said, that's why I'm leaning towards encouraging you to leave. There will always be "much worse reasons" for considering ending a relationship. But if you are this unhappy with his choices and he is this set in his ways, I apologize but I really don't see a happy ending here. You are already this resentful of him 1 year in. Imagine how you will feel when you're 10 years in, supporting the family financially while juggling a kid or two (whom you will be solely in charge of during weekends), having traveled nowhere, still renting, unable to afford the lifestyle you desire?

 

That is my nightmare, lol

 

I wouldn't give him an ultimatum, and I don't believe those lead to anything good ever. But you should really have a serious talk addressing these incompatibilities.

 

Yes, you are right that I need to talk with him again. Last time we had a conversation around this, I really struggled with expressing myself to him in avoidance of coming over too harsh, so I feel like I'll need to properly prep what I want to say so it can actually be a constructive conversation this time around.

 

As an aside, I'm a little surprised that none of the replies have focused much on the fact that he wants kids / I do not really want kids. A lot of opinion I've received so far from close friends has mostly been "you both aren't on the same page with kids so it needs to end" - but I really appreciate your perspective, Elswyth, about the broader incompatibilities we seem to have, not just about kids, but overall lifestyle expectations.

[Els]

That is my nightmare, lol

 

Yes, you are right that I need to talk with him again. Last time we had a conversation around this, I really struggled with expressing myself to him in avoidance of coming over too harsh, so I feel like I'll need to properly prep what I want to say so it can actually be a constructive conversation this time around.

 

Sounds like a good plan. Fingers crossed for you that the two of you manage to find a reasonable middle ground, if you decide to stay.

 

 

As an aside, I'm a little surprised that none of the replies have focused much on the fact that he wants kids / I do not really want kids. A lot of opinion I've received so far from close friends has mostly been "you both aren't on the same page with kids so it needs to end" - but I really appreciate your perspective, Elswyth, about the broader incompatibilities we seem to have, not just about kids, but overall lifestyle expectations.

No problems at all.

 

At the risk of sounding sexist, I don't think it's wrong for a woman who's unsure of whether or not she wants kids, to stay with a 30 yo man who does... as long as she's completely honest with him about her uncertainty so that he can make an informed decision in that regard. Men have relatively long fertility windows, so even if at 35, you finally decide you don't want kids and he decides he's 100% sure he does and neither of you want to remain together, he still has a good 10-15 years to have the kids he wants (and that's not even a hard limit, just a recommended one). On the other hand, if your sexes were reversed, I would urge you to think long and hard about what you're doing, since women have relatively short fertility windows and at 35 a woman would have only 2-5 years of fertility left.

 

Going on a bit of a tangent, I was much like you at 27 - I figured I most likely didn't want kids, but that I REALLY wanted to travel and see the world. Now, a few years down the line, I'm slowly moving towards the fence in the kids department. The biggest thing holding me back, is that it feels like there's so few years left for me to live life and do what I want to do, before I have to make a final decision. I've traveled to 10+ countries so far and had the most amazing time over the past few years as the SO's and my career took off (each of us gets a few sponsored trips by employers, so it halves the cost of all our travel together)... but it's not enough, there are so many places I still want to see, so many experiences I still want to have, so many things I still want to do. I really wish I had started traveling and gotten my career on track earlier, because if only we'd had more of the golden years before the time comes to make a decision, it would be an easier one.

 

I really think that to be able to make the best decision for yourself re: kids, you want to really put yourself out there and live life to the fullest right now, so that at 31, you won't be facing the same difficult choice. And I fear that your relationship might be holding you back in that regard.

Edited July 1, 2018 by Elswyth

[S_A]

Yes, I started 4 months ago. I feel good when I am at school, I feel productive and generally just like "Yes! I am working towards something I am finally excited about!" Sometimes I sit there and pinch myself that I am actually there, compared to where I was a year ago. I am really enjoying school in terms of the curriculum and what I am studying / learning how to do. I don't know where the hours go, which is a phenomenon hasn't happened to me for a long time. I wouldn't say my classmates are the source of my new energy - they are all very nice people (all international, I am the only local in our class) but I wouldn't say I've made any deep, significant connection with any of them (yet). 85% of my class is also female, so it is not a question of any new male proximity that's affecting me. Ultimately I think my new found energy is fueled by my excitement for moving forward after a LOT of ups and downs and hard, introspective work with life coaches and counsellors over the last year.

 

Well, when I asked about other people in class, I did not mean romantically. The reason I asked the question I did in my prior post is to further investigate my "hunch" about your situation. I am going to give you the same advice I gave to someone else IRL, and you may not like what you're about to hear.

 

I know this girl who left her S.O. because she too felt like she was leaving him behind. She landed a great-paying job and loved where she worked and all that. I told her I thought leaving her S.O. was a mistake. Women tend to marry "up," not "down." So it makes sense for a woman to lose interest and attraction to a partner that she passes when it comes to status and the ability to provide (I am not judging you or any other woman for that).

 

I told this girl that it seemed like she was being overpaid with this new company. I also told her that such a thing can happen when a company grows too much too quickly; company's will over-reach for talent because they need to keep up with the growth. I told her that I would not be surprised if she got laid off in the short term because I though the company's growth was not sustainable. I actually thought there would be a decline. I was right. She lost her job after about one year. She also said I was right about her leaving her S.O. The ex actually got a promotion within a few months after the relationship ended.

 

In your case, I would say that it is great you have a lot of excitement about school and everything. Education is important. But I think you MIGHT be repeating the same mistake as the girl I talked about above. You're going-back-to-school is nothing more than potential. You have not actually achieved anything yet (though you are trying). And while education is CRUCIAL, do not assume that everything comes easy once you have a degree. You are very excited (like the girl from the story above) about this new potential because it might open doors for you. But I guess what I am trying to say is, remain grounded and don't be blinded by this excitement. Also, if this school and the degree that you are pursuing is even worth-a-damn, it will NOT be easy.

 

Hope all this made sense. I feel like I may not have explained myself properly.

[yume]

Sounds like a good plan. Fingers crossed for you that the two of you manage to find a reasonable middle ground, if you decide to stay.

 

No problems at all.

 

At the risk of sounding sexist, I don't think it's wrong for a woman who's unsure of whether or not she wants kids, to stay with a 30 yo man who does... as long as she's completely honest with him about her uncertainty so that he can make an informed decision in that regard. Men have relatively long fertility windows, so even if at 35, you finally decide you don't want kids and he decides he's 100% sure he does and neither of you want to remain together, he still has a good 10-15 years to have the kids he wants (and that's not even a hard limit, just a recommended one). On the other hand, if your sexes were reversed, I would urge you to think long and hard about what you're doing, since women have relatively short fertility windows and at 35 a woman would have only 2-5 years of fertility left.

 

Going on a bit of a tangent, I was much like you at 27 - I figured I most likely didn't want kids, but that I REALLY wanted to travel and see the world. Now, a few years down the line, I'm slowly moving towards the fence in the kids department. The biggest thing holding me back, is that it feels like there's so few years left for me to live life and do what I want to do, before I have to make a final decision. I've traveled to 10+ countries so far and had the most amazing time over the past few years as the SO's and my career took off (each of us gets a few sponsored trips by employers, so it halves the cost of all our travel together)... but it's not enough, there are so many places I still want to see, so many experiences I still want to have, so many things I still want to do. I really wish I had started traveling and gotten my career on track earlier, because if only we'd had more of the golden years before the time comes to make a decision, it would be an easier one.

 

I really think that to be able to make the best decision for yourself re: kids, you want to really put yourself out there and live life to the fullest right now, so that at 31, you won't be facing the same difficult choice. And I fear that your relationship might be holding you back in that regard.

 

You know, when you started talking about those fertility windows, I didn't even feel a twinge. Hmm.

 

That's great that you and your SO have been able to achieve most of your travel goals. I would have a tough time letting go of that, too. But I guess there's always retirement

 

Well, when I asked about other people in class, I did not mean romantically. The reason I asked the question I did in my prior post is to further investigate my "hunch" about your situation. I am going to give you the same advice I gave to someone else IRL, and you may not like what you're about to hear.

 

I know this girl who left her S.O. because she too felt like she was leaving him behind. She landed a great-paying job and loved where she worked and all that. I told her I thought leaving her S.O. was a mistake. Women tend to marry "up," not "down." So it makes sense for a woman to lose interest and attraction to a partner that she passes when it comes to status and the ability to provide (I am not judging you or any other woman for that).

 

I told this girl that it seemed like she was being overpaid with this new company. I also told her that such a thing can happen when a company grows too much too quickly; company's will over-reach for talent because they need to keep up with the growth. I told her that I would not be surprised if she got laid off in the short term because I though the company's growth was not sustainable. I actually thought there would be a decline. I was right. She lost her job after about one year. She also said I was right about her leaving her S.O. The ex actually got a promotion within a few months after the relationship ended.

 

In your case, I would say that it is great you have a lot of excitement about school and everything. Education is important. But I think you MIGHT be repeating the same mistake as the girl I talked about above. You're going-back-to-school is nothing more than potential. You have not actually achieved anything yet (though you are trying). And while education is CRUCIAL, do not assume that everything comes easy once you have a degree. You are very excited (like the girl from the story above) about this new potential because it might open doors for you. But I guess what I am trying to say is, remain grounded and don't be blinded by this excitement. Also, if this school and the degree that you are pursuing is even worth-a-damn, it will NOT be easy.

 

Hope all this made sense. I feel like I may not have explained myself properly.

 

No, I see what you are saying. And you're right, I haven't achieved anything yet. But at least I am working on it.

 

I completely understand your point about women tending to "marry up". But you see, while yes, I won't deny that I'm feeling that if I stay with him and he doesn't change, that I would be "marrying down" - what I would wish for instead is to at least "marry equal".

 

Maybe he isn't driven in his career, but he also isn't driven in anything else. I could maybe forgive the lack of an astounding career if he had big goals in, say, his hobbies, or he was working towards some significant savings, or a down payment on a home for the future family he plans to have, but he doesn't have any of this. And that's whats hard to swallow about this situation. I want to be able to feel that I can plan a future with the person I'm in a relationship with.

 

Hopefully once we have another big conversation I'll have a clearer understanding going forward.

[Els]

You know, when you started talking about those fertility windows, I didn't even feel a twinge. Hmm.

 

That's great that you and your SO have been able to achieve most of your travel goals. I would have a tough time letting go of that, too. But I guess there's always retirement

 

 

 

No, I see what you are saying. And you're right, I haven't achieved anything yet. But at least I am working on it.

 

I completely understand your point about women tending to "marry up". But you see, while yes, I won't deny that I'm feeling that if I stay with him and he doesn't change, that I would be "marrying down" - what I would wish for instead is to at least "marry equal".

 

Maybe he isn't driven in his career, but he also isn't driven in anything else. I could maybe forgive the lack of an astounding career if he had big goals in, say, his hobbies, or he was working towards some significant savings, or a down payment on a home for the future family he plans to have, but he doesn't have any of this. And that's whats hard to swallow about this situation. I want to be able to feel that I can plan a future with the person I'm in a relationship with.

 

Hopefully once we have another big conversation I'll have a clearer understanding going forward.

 

 

Right. FTR, the reason I suggested that you two might not be a good fit for each other is not his dismal career, but rather his life goals which are so diametrically opposed to yours. It is true that careers can rise and fall, but someone is unlikely to change much in terms of personality and life goals/ values at 30.

 

 

Have you managed to talk to him about this yet?

[yume]

Right. FTR, the reason I suggested that you two might not be a good fit for each other is not his dismal career, but rather his life goals which are so diametrically opposed to yours. It is true that careers can rise and fall, but someone is unlikely to change much in terms of personality and life goals/ values at 30.

 

 

Have you managed to talk to him about this yet?

 

Not yet. It's his birthday tomorrow so I'm going to hold off for a few days.

 

If you are interested, I'm happy to send you a PM when I have an update

[bachdude]

My concern OP is, if you stay in the relationship, the issues you describe will slowly eat at you and get bigger and bigger.

 

Look, you mention you feel that, if you ever married him, you'd be marrying down. Every guy deserves to be with someone who respects him.

 

By saying that, I think you answered your own question.

[coolheadal]

OP, you are not ready to be with such a man yet. Your career stands out more than what your really staying here to us. You want so much more but you can't understand the mind of 30 year old guy. He at his job for 10 years schedule sucks to you but not to him. Yet things goes crazy at his job and his shift work. But listen wake up call too you HE'S WORKING AND GOT A JOB! He knows how to do that job as you know he's still there for 10 years. This got to count for something in your mind as well. You said he's smart an etc. Well you said it all there you know how you feel. Your only 3 years different in age. You do what you have to do to make this relationship work otherwise you drop and leave him for another man, and is that what you really want to do? Doesn't sound to me you do. Schedules can't be the same and you know it if you so worried about schedule then why don't you have him quit his job and you bare the responsibility of both incomes for him into your single income. I am sure you don't want to do that do you. He's happy what he does. No matter what happens he happy. You just have to be there for him instead of being a bit selfish wanting things to go your way. Do not push him away with your crazy talk to him. He will never understand why you trying to change his job schedule which he can't anyway. This is it work with him or don't but stop with this crazy idea you can make him do better. It's up to him too do better if he wants. 10 years at the same place should count for something to you. Having kids no or never is your choice. Maybe if you both had kids now you wouldn't be thinking so much about his schedule.

 

Do you love this guy so much you can't live without him? If so then you follow your heart, mind and soul and be the woman for him as he is the man for you! Pity talk is what you came here with not right you know you have a good life with him. I do not see anything else wrong with this relationship you have with him. Do not wreck what you have already with him okay!

[yume]

He's happy what he does. No matter what happens he happy.

 

Well, no, he isn't 'happy'. As I stated in my post, he frequently gets shafted with his schedule and is often really upset by it. So no, he is definitely not "happy" "no matter what happens".

 

Do not push him away with your crazy talk to him.

 

I actually think my feelings are perfectly valid with regards to assessing our future together. But thank you for deeming it "crazy talk".

 

He will never understand why you trying to change his job schedule which he can't anyway. This is it work with him or don't but stop with this crazy idea you can make him do better. It's up to him too do better if he wants.

 

I'm not outright doing things or trying to do things to make him change - I'm well aware that that's impossible, and that my options are either accept him as is or not. If I am guilty of doing anything, it may be that I'm trying to help motivate him to be the best that he can be, but ultimately it's not up to me.

 

Maybe if you both had kids now you wouldn't be thinking so much about his schedule.

 

HAH. Even if I wanted kids things would be a nightmare, and I absolutely guarantee his schedule plus kids would be driving me more bonkers than it is now.

 

Pity talk is what you came here with not right you know you have a good life with him.

 

I actually came here for some outside perspective, which you yourself have so lovingly provided. Yes we have a good relationship, but just because it's overall good doesn't mean I'm not allowed to think about our future together and how it will play out.

[coolheadal]

Well, no, he isn't 'happy'. As I stated in my post, he frequently gets shafted with his schedule and is often really upset by it. So no, he is definitely not "happy" "no matter what happens".

 

 

 

I actually think my feelings are perfectly valid with regards to assessing our future together. But thank you for deeming it "crazy talk".

 

 

 

I'm not outright doing things or trying to do things to make him change - I'm well aware that that's impossible, and that my options are either accept him as is or not. If I am guilty of doing anything, it may be that I'm trying to help motivate him to be the best that he can be, but ultimately it's not up to me.

 

 

 

HAH. Even if I wanted kids things would be a nightmare, and I absolutely guarantee his schedule plus kids would be driving me more bonkers than it is now.

 

 

 

I actually came here for some outside perspective, which you yourself have so lovingly provided. Yes we have a good relationship, but just because it's overall good doesn't mean I'm not allowed to think about our future together and how it will play out.

 

You two live some complicated lives but yet you both are together. Then you need to give in a bit and let it be. As for his schedule he's can't change it if the company didn't want make adjustments or can't? Unless he quits his job then what? Will you be happy with him around you 24/7. You too need to works things out. You would go bonkers if you had kids right now really. Sad to hear that statement. Sounds like you both are not ready to have kids. Of course you would have your hand cut out to deal with the babies while he was on his crazy work schedule. You two have to work on your relationship we here can only advise you what's the best course of action. If you leave out details like you seem you have then going to be uneven advise.

[Els]

You two live some complicated lives but yet you both are together. Then you need to give in a bit and let it be. As for his schedule he's can't change it if the company didn't want make adjustments or can't? Unless he quits his job then what? Will you be happy with him around you 24/7. You too need to works things out. You would go bonkers if you had kids right now really. Sad to hear that statement. Sounds like you both are not ready to have kids. Of course you would have your hand cut out to deal with the babies while he was on his crazy work schedule. You two have to work on your relationship we here can only advise you what's the best course of action. If you leave out details like you seem you have then going to be uneven advise.

 

 

You don't HAVE to choose between just staying in your current job, or quitting without a backup plan, you know. There's a third option that most people use if they're unhappy with a dead-end job - stay in your current job, but keep looking for a better job while you're there.

[psiblast]

Yume -

 

I feel I can offer you a different PoV. You see, I'm in the opposite situation as you. I am the guy who makes less money, and is less ambitious than my girlfriend of 3 years.

 

We've been living together for the past 8 months. We both do pretty well. We both make 6-figure salaries, but she still makes about $50K/year more than me.

 

She has told me on several occasions that she thinks I am so smart and that I could be doing more with my life/career. I don't disagree with her. But I don't have the career drive that she does. She's a manager, and I'm an engineer. I'm very content because I love the hands-on, problem-solving aspect of my career.

 

While I *seem* to be a little better off than your boyfriend, the parallels are there. Like your boyfriend, I too am very loving, kind, considerate, and really know how to treat my lady. She says that's not the problem at all.

 

The other issue she has with me is that I often over-promise and under-deliver. For example, when I say I'm going to renovate our bathroom, and then procrastinate. She hates that. She wants me, as a man, to take more ownership of things around the house and deliver on expectations. I haven't been doing a good job of that.

 

My advice to you is to at least threaten to leave the relationship, if not leave altogether.

 

Sometimes a man has to hit the bottom to realize that he's been falling. As hard as it may be, you have to let him hit that bottom. If he loves you that much, let him have the opportunity to show you that he can change.

 

He's only 30. It's not "too late" for him to get his stuff together. I'm much older than your boyfriend, and it took a painful divorce in my early 40s to get my life turned around.

 

Don't lose sight of his good traits. It's hard to find a man who will be loyal and faithful. Trust is the #1 backbone of any relationship. If you have that, then other things can be built on top of it, as long as you BOTH are willing to work at it. But it sounds like he needs a jolt of reality. Make him hit that bottom. Whether or not you guys end up staying together, you'll be doing him a favor and he'll come out a better man in the end.

[yume]

Wow, thank you so much for your reply. I'm sorry I didn't see it sooner.

 

I don't want to let these negative factors overwhelm his good traits, as you said. I think our relationship has overall been truly amazing, and therefore extremely hard to let go of.

 

To update the situation, we had a very hard conversation on Saturday for two and a half hours.

 

The majority of our conversation centred around his desire to have children versus mine to not. I told him that I thought we had been together long enough now that we should both know whether or not we have a future together, and that some of our incompatibilities with life goals was making me question what we were doing. I had to flat out ask him if he saw a future with me (as he was not volunteering that info himself) and he said "It's hard to say... I see us being together, traveling together...but I feel that the chances of us having a family together are getting very slim." We talked about the things that I wanted out of life, which were good career, financial stability, home ownership, travel, lots of pets...but I emphasized that I feel I could live my life happily without children. He was very firm about his desire for kids and said there would be no compromising on his part about that. Which I already know and understand completely. I told him I'd never ask him to give that up for me.

 

We were a hair away from breaking up - but I got panicky and asked him to give me some time to think things over, which he very generously agreed to... So we are not speaking for two weeks and we will come back together for one more (final or not) conversation on this matter.

 

The last few days for me have been horrific - I'm really really upset that we are so close to ending it and that I may be losing him. Because it's not that I don't love him.... I'm having a very hard time rationalizing letting go of someone I love so much

 

So far, I've been trying to plan a little about what I would like to say to him next time we speak - and I think I should tie in his career issues a little bit more as I think we focused too much on the kid thing. The career ties into the kids thing as I have a hard time understanding how he thinks he will manage having all these kids with his current job situation, as he is not making any moves to improve on that at all...

 

I think I can forgive most of these shortcomings if he just... got a little more realistic about his life. But then again, maybe we are just not meant to be together

Edited August 22, 2018 by a LoveShack.org Moderator
QUote of preceding post removed

[TheFinalWord]

Right now you are in the midst of a career change and you are motivated and excited by it. He, however, does not feel the same way about his career. A career is a means to an end, not an end unto itself.

 

Let me tell you that in 15 years when you have finished your program and have settled into your job, you will likely hit a stage in which you realize a career is not really that important in the grand scheme of things. It's a necessity, but it's not life. Often it feels that way when you are excited and driven by something new. But that novelty wears off. I say this as someone that dedicated my entire life in that regard and now wish I had taken more time to smell the roses.

 

You may find that having a stable partner that supported you, but may have been more interested in raising children, is not such a bad thing...

 

Also, having kids is not something you plan for down the last cent. It's more about having them with someone you love, than worrying about all the details.

Edited August 22, 2018 by TheFinalWord

[Miss Clavel]

We talked about the things that I wanted out of life, which were good career, financial stability, home ownership, travel, lots of pets...but I emphasized that I feel I could live my life happily without children. He was very firm about his desire for kids and said there would be no compromising on his part about that. Which I already know and understand completely. I told him I'd never ask him to give that up for me.

 

 

 

 

 

So far, I've been trying to plan a little about what I would like to say to him next time we speak - and I think I should tie in his career issues a little bit more as I think we focused too much on the kid thing. The career ties into the kids thing as I have a hard time understanding how he thinks he will manage having all these kids with his current job situation, as he is not making any moves to improve on that at all...

 

I think I can forgive most of these shortcomings if he just... got a little more realistic about his life. But then again, maybe we are just not meant to be together

 

okay, there's your sticking point. and ask him just that.

 

because whether he has a single child with you (and you did say you would consider one child with him if he improved his income/edu) or someone else, he's gonna be working weekends and leaving child rearing to his partner.

 

and i do agree with coolheadal. your bf is a great guy. and 10 plus years, ten years at the same job is nothing to sneeze at, esp when it comes time to apply for a mortgage loan.

 

let the negotiations begin.

 

if he wants to stay at his job, he gets a more family oriented schedule and you give him a baby once schools is almost over and he helps you with the mortgage loan applications.

 

steady on.

[Els]

Wow, thank you so much for your reply. I'm sorry I didn't see it sooner.

 

I don't want to let these negative factors overwhelm his good traits, as you said. I think our relationship has overall been truly amazing, and therefore extremely hard to let go of.

 

To update the situation, we had a very hard conversation on Saturday for two and a half hours.

 

The majority of our conversation centred around his desire to have children versus mine to not. I told him that I thought we had been together long enough now that we should both know whether or not we have a future together, and that some of our incompatibilities with life goals was making me question what we were doing. I had to flat out ask him if he saw a future with me (as he was not volunteering that info himself) and he said "It's hard to say... I see us being together, traveling together...but I feel that the chances of us having a family together are getting very slim." We talked about the things that I wanted out of life, which were good career, financial stability, home ownership, travel, lots of pets...but I emphasized that I feel I could live my life happily without children. He was very firm about his desire for kids and said there would be no compromising on his part about that. Which I already know and understand completely. I told him I'd never ask him to give that up for me.

 

We were a hair away from breaking up - but I got panicky and asked him to give me some time to think things over, which he very generously agreed to... So we are not speaking for two weeks and we will come back together for one more (final or not) conversation on this matter.

 

The last few days for me have been horrific - I'm really really upset that we are so close to ending it and that I may be losing him. Because it's not that I don't love him.... I'm having a very hard time rationalizing letting go of someone I love so much

 

So far, I've been trying to plan a little about what I would like to say to him next time we speak - and I think I should tie in his career issues a little bit more as I think we focused too much on the kid thing. The career ties into the kids thing as I have a hard time understanding how he thinks he will manage having all these kids with his current job situation, as he is not making any moves to improve on that at all...

 

I think I can forgive most of these shortcomings if he just... got a little more realistic about his life. But then again, maybe we are just not meant to be together

 

 

I think you should definitely tie in his career situation into the conversation. There isn't much point in carrying on talking about the kids thing when it appears that for you, kids are contingent on financial stability and having achieved your goals in life first. Perhaps if he is aware of that, he may offer a compromise on his side - he picks up the slack career-wise, you both get your dream of travel and home ownership sorted first, and then kids after?

 

That being said, personally, my thoughts are that the odds of this happening are fairly slim.

 

Right now you are in the midst of a career change and you are motivated and excited by it. He, however, does not feel the same way about his career. A career is a means to an end, not an end unto itself.

 

Let me tell you that in 15 years when you have finished your program and have settled into your job, you will likely hit a stage in which you realize a career is not really that important in the grand scheme of things. It's a necessity, but it's not life. Often it feels that way when you are excited and driven by something new. But that novelty wears off. I say this as someone that dedicated my entire life in that regard and now wish I had taken more time to smell the roses.

 

You may find that having a stable partner that supported you, but may have been more interested in raising children, is not such a bad thing...

 

Also, having kids is not something you plan for down the last cent. It's more about having them with someone you love, than worrying about all the details.

 

okay, there's your sticking point. and ask him just that.

 

because whether he has a single child with you (and you did say you would consider one child with him if he improved his income/edu) or someone else, he's gonna be working weekends and leaving child rearing to his partner.

 

and i do agree with coolheadal. your bf is a great guy. and 10 plus years, ten years at the same job is nothing to sneeze at, esp when it comes time to apply for a mortgage loan.

 

let the negotiations begin.

 

if he wants to stay at his job, he gets a more family oriented schedule and you give him a baby once schools is almost over and he helps you with the mortgage loan applications.

 

steady on.

 

I think both of you are imposing your own life goals on the OP, which is a horrible idea. People should NOT have kids while they are unsure about wanting kids! It's not fair to her, and most certainly not fair to the kid.

 

The OP has said that she values a career, financial stability, pets and travel, and she isn't sure she wants children. Those are HER priorities in life, and she is entitled to make that choice for herself. I don't understand what the purpose of giving advice is if you're just going to assume that everyone should have similar priorities to you.

[yume]

Often it feels that way when you are excited and driven by something new. But that novelty wears off.

 

I wonder if this also applies to having children...

 

 

let the negotiations begin.

 

if he wants to stay at his job, he gets a more family oriented schedule and you give him a baby once schools is almost over and he helps you with the mortgage loan applications.

 

See though, I don't want to "give" anyone a baby. Not right now, and definitely not in a years time when I'm finished school and starting work again. Maybe not even at all!

 

He even said to me that his biggest fear is if we stay together, and we have kids, that I would end up miserable. So clearly a part of him knows how serious this is for me.

 

I think you should definitely tie in his career situation into the conversation. There isn't much point in carrying on talking about the kids thing when it appears that for you, kids are contingent on financial stability and having achieved your goals in life first. Perhaps if he is aware of that, he may offer a compromise on his side - he picks up the slack career-wise, you both get your dream of travel and home ownership sorted first, and then kids after?

 

That being said, personally, my thoughts are that the odds of this happening are fairly slim.

 

It's worth having a conversation over. But when I think about having that life together I just see myself bogged down with children that I had for him... not because I truly wanted them myself. Who's to say I won't change my mind in a few years, but right now... I'm so focused on other things.

 

I had a realization last night about how I'm really excited about my future career and I'm driven to studying hard, making sure it turns out well for me...and that maybe those feelings I have about what I'm doing now are the feelings he has about having kids. So... I think I am inching closer to ending it with him.

 

I think both of you are imposing your own life goals on the OP, which is a horrible idea. People should NOT have kids while they are unsure about wanting kids! It's not fair to her, and most certainly not fair to the kid.

 

The OP has said that she values a career, financial stability, pets and travel, and she isn't sure she wants children. Those are HER priorities in life, and she is entitled to make that choice for herself. I don't understand what the purpose of giving advice is if you're just going to assume that everyone should have similar priorities to you.

 

Thank you.

Edited August 23, 2018 by yume