noname Posted August 29, 2005 Posted August 29, 2005 If a woman is worth it I will give this and more to her. I think I have a woman that is worth it right now. good for you Woggle... i know you have been going through some trying times. emotional recovery is a slow process but it can really help if you have something or someone to focus your energy on. it seems to already be working since you actually think that there are at least some woman out there that are good;) good luck with this one. it it the older woman?
Woggle Posted August 29, 2005 Posted August 29, 2005 good for you Woggle... i know you have been going through some trying times. emotional recovery is a slow process but it can really help if you have something or someone to focus your energy on. it seems to already be working since you actually think that there are at least some woman out there that are good;) good luck with this one. it it the older woman? Yep it is the older woman and she has shown me that some good women do still exist.
DeaconFrost Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 My BF's grandfather used to say: "Women marry men hoping that they (men) will change and men marry women hoping that they (women) will never change." :laugh: What an awesome quote...LOL Your post had many red flags waving wildly Dude, I really don't see how her post sounds bitter. There might be twinges, but I think she's just trying to give some decent advice. I somewhat disagree with a few of the things she said, but I wouldn't call her bitter. Maybe your the one who is bitter from encountering a bitter girl. -------- I do have to say that NewLee has summed this all quite well -------- Amino, I understand what your saying, but you kind of made a roundabout argument to get there. You got unnecessarily harsh there. I will definatly agree with you that men exposing tenderness is not exactly a pre-requisite in the early stages. On many levels primal attraction is all that matters for the first few hours even weeks. I will agree that many women do not expect us to show these kinds of initial qualities. They want the mystery, confidence, and raw attitude that fits "desireable" male profile. What a surprise when you find out that alot of guys are exactly the way you find them! In some ways you have to admitt that the "I told you so" reply is not unjustified. Ladies, in a lot of ways, you've done it to yourselves. I think the really quality message behind the OP's ideas is that love does not and can not exist out of fabrication. We can't create our ideal partners and nor should we settle for mediocrity when we really desire greatness. If you desire a profound and amazing relationship then stop wasting your time with "maybes" and never give up searching "definately yes!" What you see is what you get with most guys. Either fall in love with it, accept it as is, and stay with it or get the hell out of dodge.
DeaconFrost Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 And Kat, I hear where you are coming from. There are a lot of dudes and women who aren't like that. If it makes you feel any better, I'm HELLA affectionate, definately like playing with kids, almost never cancel plans, and sure as sh*t up for sex 6 times a week (and if I remember correctly, I'm your age). As for the other stuff, I've got no problem doing all that as long as I feel you aren't pissing me off or deserving of it. 4-5 days can be a pain in the ass though. I LOVE to be around, but I sure need my space too to keep things interesting. I hate it when things get routine and the fun gets replaced by the familar and predictable. You gotta have some space to keep the fire alive and well. BTW, I think we all hide things. Not sure what else to say to that. This guy is never going to change. No one does - not when it comes to intrinsic personality traits. If it's one thing I know for sure, it's that a non-affectionate person will NEVER become an affectionate one. There's not a chance in hell that marriage or an engagement will alter that. If anything it'll get worse. Do yourself a favor and size your BF up to what you really need, as is. If he ain't making the grade, then you've got to run. I've been where you are and it's just not worth the heartache. Besides, why go a day without alot of cuddling, a lot of kissin', and a lot of love making? Seems like a waste of time otherwise...but that's just me
GirlInTheRedMustang Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 Thank you AmberAriesMom.. :-) like Kat, I really need to hear this today. This is quite a reinforcement.. I had two choices to make today, compromise or just leave it alone. I chose the latter one. But before that, I had to admit that I felt like crap -- seriously -- like don't have any energy to move, and my stomuch got REALLY sick.., just like you described eariler... Anyway -- just in time that I really need this, your post came. Thank you so much, from my heart. - GirlInTheRedMustang
JanieQP Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 AmberAriesMom, thanks for posting this! In the past few days I've been letting go of what I thought I wanted (but wasn't getting anyway) and opening up to what is here and now and ... pretty wonderful. Kat, "absolutely wonderful one day" isn't doing you a bit of good right here, right now where you are. I left a man who is getting closer and closer to "absolutely wonderful". He will be, someday, for someone, but not for me.
RecordProducer Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 You don't need to tell them to leave the bad relationship, so they can just go on to the next bad one... You need to change their perception so they can start making thoughtfull and educated choices. I am not a social worker, I don't help people make thoughtfull and educated choices for a living. I want an equal partner who will treat me like I treat him! The kind of people who tend to get 'stuck' in these kind of relationships usually swing one of two ways, they end up in another bad one after they break up the first one OR they end up with some unrealistic expectations, commitment phobia or some other undesirable mental problem. We are talking about abandoning a bad relationship here. What happens next is a completely different question. After all, being alone or jumping from one short relationship to another because of bad choices is still healthier than staying in one frustrating relationship for a long time. Like i said, obviously these people didn't choose their partners with their heads at all, they love whoever seduces them next. Quite the contrary! They become wary of how people's faults (incuding their own) can ruin the relationship so they open their eyes widely for the next partner. It's not really 'this' specific partner that they need to dump, it's their whole attitiude that needs changing. People have different perceptions of what makes them happy. The most common love problem is making a bad choice and usually replacing the partner is easier than changing him or changing yourself - which you precisely recommend when you say that we need to change our attitude. Why would we? Why does a woman need to accept that it's okay if her partner lies, cheats, beats her, calls her names...? Isn't it easier to find a better man? If you want affectionate guys, then make it a priority in your choice of partner, that's all i'm saying basically. Duh! That what we're talking about. Leaving the bad guy and find a good one. But it's not that easy, you know. People often pretend and try hard at the beginning and show their true colors much later. Don't call the victims idiots for choosing lousy partners, it might happen to you as well. Staying with a bad partner is a mistake, not choosing him when he was all sweet.
animo Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 Unlike you may seem to think... I'm not disagreeing with you, but that's a detail right? So you are telling me then that you (i guiss we are talking about you since you use the term 'we') have a soft spot for talented deceivers then? Because frankly...if you cannot see through the 'all sweet' phase then that guy must be really good at hiding his true nature... Most of the women i talk to, have my number down pretty fast (granted superficially and very basic, but still they have my number down in those departments that are of intrest to them) and i'm not exactly an open book that you can just open up to any chapter that is of intrest to you and read all about... So yeah.. not sure what's going on over there, you say that you go on to the next relationship with eyes wide open, but still claim that it's very hard to spot acters and liers when they get on the stage... I'm not trying to portrai anyone here as an idiot. Ignorance is a widely spread and basic human characteristic, it doesn't make you an idiot, just soemone who doesn't know everything (everyone), so don't take it personal. I'm just saying that from where i am standing it's pretty easy to dissect peoples characters after you known them for only a short while. Things like wether or not they are clingy, bad tempered, insecure (anything relating to jealousy etc), dishonoust and/or gameplayers. Maybe i got it by the wrong end here, but i always assumed (and that has been my experience aswell) that women are generally much better at 'sencing' these things then men are so i conclude that they must simply be looking for the 'wrong' things. That being said... i have met women who got my completely wrong aswell and who misinterpreted even the simplest things i said or did for something totally different. I simply concluded we were uncompatible, but maybe i was wrong and they are simply not attuned to their sences, maybe that's the problem all along. And that's what i'm trying to say really... Most of the time... it's almost impossible to figure anything out about someone going on what they say... Don't believe what they say, believe what they do and how you experience it...
Author AmberAriesMom Posted August 30, 2005 Author Posted August 30, 2005 Wow! Thanks to everyone for discussing this topic! And thanks to all for elaborating on what I was getting at! Maybe you can help me some more if this post needs explaining. And to those who are thinking about moving on from the guy they are 'working with/on' (lol)at the present time I'd like to add a word of encouragement. I know it's not easy to let go of someone whom you might have fun with in lots of ways no matter how many times you might feel dissatisfied. Balancing is hard. I know it's hard too, to think about when you might meet the next guy and feelings of being alone are telling you to hold on to what you have. The future is scarey! It's much easier to tell ourselves that we can fix what is wrong with our present guy...what makes us unhappy about our guy emotionally.... and it's easier to give up what we need and settle for less than that as if his needs and rights to be who he is matter more than ours (that darned maternal instinct misplaced). I have found that the base line is in character. Barring experience in testing who we are, we are all pretty much who we are as far as character goes by about 16 years old. (please note that my use of the word 'character' is not to throw stones at a person's character as in 'nice or some evil troll'...it's about how a person has learned to survive in this world and the tools they have learned to use for that, be it mind games, avoidance of becoming too close to others, lying, over appeasing or whatnot) and if his way of surviving conflicts with yours and causes you frustration then it's just not a good match. In the name of being as human as the next guy we need to evolve to where the men we pair off with are not making us feel less than who we want to be as women feeling good about ourselves...we are strong women with something positive and meaningful to ADD to a relationship with a man who has something of the same to ADD to the relationship to the end where both together make the relationship strong, lasting, productive and fun more times than not. Every person on this earth is different and knows what they are happy putting up with....not just with men, but with friends and just about everything in life. In other words, some things make up take a stand and some don't matter so much that we bother. I have seen some very strong women take on the world with a much stronger sense of self and rights to be considered important than they do with the man they have found to date more than a few times. They make different rules for themselves when it comes to holding onto a man. Yet, this man is going to become the most often dealt with person in their lives, so the reverse should be true! For the men here, I'm not unsympathtic to the feelings of nice guys who get taken for a ride by women wanting nothing but a great time. There are some horrible selfish and yes, even slutty women out there who give the rest of us a bad name. The same things being discussed here about women finding Mr. Right holds true for men finding Mrs. Right. It's all about finding like kind, and character! I believe that What You See Is What You Get. We all generally put our best face on in the beginning. So what you see in the beginning is most likely the best you're going to get later on down the road. And I'm certainly not saying that just because a guy is not what we're looking for there's something wrong with him. He might be fine for someone else, as someone said here. Just not for you. He might be a perfectly great guy, but not great in the ways you need him to be great. Hope this made some sense! I just want to see a world where marriage and relationships are not so much based on some primal fear of being alone or in some social pressure to have a steady boyfriend or in some need to martyr oneself in hopes of finding someone to care about you so you feel loved by someone other than your family, etc. I often see young people wanting to do whatever they can to have a relationship to where neither party is truely happy....unless one is happy manipulating and/or using/bossing the other one around. In 'humor'....select your mate as you would the perfect pair of shoes! How many times has that pair that looked so perfect on the shelf turned out to hurt your feet after a few hours, or just didn't allow you to walk in them comfortably...made you have to adjust your normal stride?
RecordProducer Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 Animo, we came to the point where you reveal the reasons for your attitudes - you're a MAN. You would agree with everything I said had I put it like this: HE should leave a bad WOMAN. It doesn't matter whether you ditch the person before you slept with her or after the 17th date or after 17 weeks or months or years. What matters is that when you see that the relationship is wrong you quit it instead of trying to significantly change yourself or the other party. Sometimes things can be worked on and resolved. Sometimes they can't. I thought I should have worked on my marriage because I loved him and we had two children. he thought we should split. And we split. And that was the best choice anybody ever made for me. I am so much better without my ex-husband and he is better off without me. It hurt a lot at the beginning, but from this perspective I can't possibly imagine myself being with him for the rest of my life. I am not taking your words personally and when I say 'we' I mean you and me and everybody else. You're talking as if you've either never had any meaningful relationship or you are in a fantastic relationship right now. Just know that not all people have the luck to meet the right person. Sometimes you can't meet them at all and sometimes you meet them but they don't want you or at least not in the same way. So we settle for less. I guess you're right, I do have a soft spot for people who tell sweet words, but do little to stand behind them.
Jtizzle Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 I didnt see the post as bitter, but more like a woman experiencing things in her life and trying to pass on what she know and have learned from them to other women to help them achieve or have what she has now, which is a wonderful loving husband of 25yrs... You go girl im happy for you:D As Kat and sumone else has said this post has come at the right time for me as well..Funny how God talks to you through lil things.. Last night i was about to make the biggest mistake ever..I have a bestfriend who i am head over heels for, he knows this i know this, and my bf knows this as well.. Me and him talked last night for a good while and i was gonna tell him my feelings again, and "beg" of him to give me a chance...Just as Amber originally posted and was saying, you shouldnt be in a relationship thinkin oh if im good to him, he will hopefully oneday love me like i love him.. thats just like sumbodys signature (sorry forgot who's i just woke up) ..the quote goes: "one day he will wake up and realize that he love her, whereas she'll be waking up to the next guy who already knew." <<whoever that belongs to, i love you:love: lol..thats so true.. oh goodness thank you amber for posting this, its exactly what i needed. infact it was the first NEW post on the page, so this was meant for me to see.. but like i was sayin, this dude that i was in love with, oh my goodness i mean i would honestly do anything for him, he's in the army. and he just came back from korea. i mean i was so in love with him an dyin for him to love me as well that if he told me to be in korea in five minutes, oh trust me, i would find a damn way to be there in 4 minutes and 17 seconds and still have time to cook him a nice candlelit meal..but this post showed me why waste time on loving him tryna get him to love me when i can put myself out there for sumone who will love me just as much as i love them.. because when i love sumone i love hard, and sincerely, and i want sumone that will do so just for me. like "LEE" stated, folks who want to keep you around will through you a few scraps to keep you goin, but i dont want scraps, hell i want you to bake me a turkey dinner..i hate always giving and giving and the person just takes and takes and dont even say please or thank you, folks those two phrases go a long way. but yea amber u have most def saved me from makin a ass of myself with this guy, cuz i was gettin ready to make a complete fool of myself
animo Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 RP, yes i am a man... i thought you would have figured that one out faster because i am a very typical guy guy with very little tolerance to stomach any new age horsesh*t... I'm not sure why you think i've never had a meaningfull relationship. I did have a meaningfull relationship before and i can't say it was one of those damaging or hurtfull ones either. She just needed alot of maintenence, got ticked off at everything and took everything i said or did personal and i took her for granted and didn't give in to ANY of her demands (the realistic ones aswell as the silly ones). I guess it could have been better, if i and she had changed just a little...but we didn't. I understand your point on not changing yourself but...i have to say that now i AM changed nonetheless. I think that in my case it's not somuch a question of changing yourself but simply growing more into yourself and pushing yourself into the general direction of where you want to go. I've not had any meaningfull relationships since but i'm confident that when i do meet the right person i will be a better partner allround than i was in my last relationship. So i guess my point of view is that it's fine to iron out your own rough edges to make a relationship work, but it has to be a give and take situation i think. That doesn't mean that i think you should give up on what you want out of a relationship if you aren't getting it though...
RecordProducer Posted September 2, 2005 Posted September 2, 2005 Animo, I see that we completely agree on this. I never said that people shouldn't work on the relationship, but dump the other one right away. It's just that often it doesn't help no matter how hard you try. So it's better to leave than fight, suffer, demand, beg,...
Nyasa Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 Thank God for this post, I needed it! Amber - You're advice really struck a chord with me and a lot of others obviously. I have been seeing a guy for only a few months now and while it started out strong, he no longer puts in any effort. I have none him for nearly 10 years now and we have remained friends and lovers on and off and I realize now that he has always been the same! I told myself if we get into a REAL realtionship he will change. I wait patiently for him to fufill all his promises and he does not. I make up a million and one excuses for his behavior and again and again I wait it out thinking it will get better. He lacks affection, but he also lacks the so-called "normal" things like calling back and getting involved in the important things in my life. I "beg" him to love me by running to be by his side everytime he asks and forgiving him everytime he fails to spend time with me or cancels important plans at the last minute or pulls away from me HARSHLY when I touch him. I feel I am a convienace factor for him, that this is HIS realtionship and I tried to tell myself that was ok b/c he has such a busy life, but please a phone call does not take long and funny how he ALWAYS has time for friends and co-workers and not me. I wanted this to work so badly b/c we had talked about it FOREVER and finally we were at a point where we lived near one another and were single, so we gave it a try and I am HUGHLY disappointed now that it has not worked out! His friends and family try to tell me to wait it out and bear with him as he grows up and gets past his issues, but he is 23 and shouldn't he at least know common courtesy. If you feel like he is the one, but you know it will be a lot of work and probably all on your part, should you give it a try? And Amber you said you can tell a lot about how a man was raised by his mother. Well his mother died when he was 5 and he never really had a female influence in his life. He and others blame a lot of his issues on this factor, should I be patient and help him work through it? Will that really teach him ever to be considerate, affectionate and caring? He says all the right things, but NEVER shows me, is it b/c he doesn't care or b/c he just doesn't know how? Also, well the other day I had an important company picnic he promised to go to. He never called me that day like promised adn so I finally called an hour left of the event and he was sleeping! Blamed it on that! i told him he still had time to come and he said "it wasn't worth it, b/c by the time he got there it would be over." I said fine and hung up. Later I called and left a message. I told him it pissed me off and more importantly hurt my feelings b/c he seemed to cancel things at the last minute with lame excuses and was always when it was important to me. I told him I was sick of making excuses for him and being embarrased in front of my friends adn family and I was done with being hurt by men at this point (my ex-fiance ended things a few months back and insisted on not leaving me alone when I was trying to move on, I was sick of being manipulated and played). I told him if he cared he can call, but if he didn't I could no longer put any more effort into someone who did not give back. It's been almost two days and he hasn't called back. No big surprise that is how he works, he is probably expecting me to call again adn apologize for getting mad at him and we will be back to square one. I refuse to call him back, I think I was in the right for being angry and standing up for myself, telling him how I feel. Was I in the right and should I just let it go if he does not call me back or should I call and try to talk it out? I mean how can he just NOT talk to me, it's not like we have not been friends for years!!! Any advice would be helpful.
bluefin Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 i agree with you everyone has self respect no one should lose it even if the man is mr. world
lindya Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 I often see young people wanting to do whatever they can to have a relationship to where neither party is truely happy....unless one is happy manipulating and/or using/bossing the other one around. You do see quite a few pretty happy couples where there's maybe some degree of affectionate "bossing about" going on. Some people who are lazy but good-natured attract and are attracted to more pro-active individuals who will "organise" them. Provided it's not abusive or overly controlling a relationship like that can often function pretty well for both parties. It's easy to get wound up when reading posts from people who are clearly investing far too much energy and emotion in the wrong person - ie someone who's either playing games with them, or just wants to selfishly grab the goodies from the relationship whilst returning the minimum time and effort they can get away with. Hard to read a post in thread A from a deeply distressed individual who's using anti-depressants after being subjected to precisely the sort of dehumanising "game plan" that you know is being advocated on thread B. C'est la vie. This board really can be a surreal and frustrating experience in that sense, and it's very easy to start feeling angry and caught up in it all. Doesn't mean you're bitter though... just means that you're capable of being moved to anger by the less savoury aspects of humanity. Good for you, I say.
Iluvsiamese Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 Nyasa, just to give you some feedback. I can see where you are coming from but I can also tell you that this guy is highly unlikely to ever change. At the very least, not for a long, long time. He could use some change in attitude but it may never be forthcoming. The romantic notion that loving someone enough will look after all of their problems is a myth. You will not be able to fix this guy by talking to him and allowing him to continue to behave with complete disregard for your feelings. Been there, done that. All you can do is contribute to his learning experience by putting a stop to it. You can feel sorry for him, understand where the problem originates, but you can't fix it. Why? Because he doesn't believe that his behaviour is wrong. For 14 years I tried to make my marriage work. My ex came from a broken home with some bizarre events that left scars. There was no role model to teach him how to love and how to treat others. Nothing, and I mean nothing, worked. He simply did not care and refuses to put forth any effort. He is convinced that he is an exemplary husband, father and pillar of the community. He has alienated his mother, his former wife, his former in-laws, other members of his family, his children and many of his friends. However, there are always more people to meet and to call friend until they get burnt one too many times. When this happens, it is always their fault because "they aren't nice people," never his fault. You would be appalled at some of the stories I could tell you. He always justifies his behaviour in some way and there are times when it makes no sense whatsoever. His most recent stunt was to drop his children off 3 hours early and since I wasn't home at the time, he left them with one of our neighbours whom he didn't know! This person is 46 and still doesn't get it. He never will.
Guest Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 I think AmberAriesMom's original post was right on, and in no way bitter. She was saying straight out, "Women, don't take s*** from men, you don't have to. If a man gives you s*** (above and beyond problems that occur in any relationship -- I think she was referring ONLY to men who have no respect for the women they are involved with), walk away and find someone else." Pure and simple. I don't see how anyone could read that and think there was bitterness or man-hating in there, unless they have some issues in their own minds tha make them overly-defensive.
clandestinidad Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 nyasa, do not call him. do not be weak. keep standing up for yourself.....it feels good doesnt it you know what you want in life, and that guy isnt capable of doing it. it helps me to remember that there are people out there more suited for me. seeing how a lot of guys are on this website has opened my eyes, and shown me that there ARE compassionate caring affectionate loving people. do NOT call him....control yourself, dont let him control you. someone who truly loves you would not always crap on plans like that, and certainly would have called you by now!!! arent you tired of feeling bad so often?? a relationship isnt supposed to feel like that. there are other men better suited for you
Nyasa Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 I'm thankful for your input Iluvsiamese and I am sorry that you have to be in the situation you are to give me your insight. Well he just called me at work. He says he has been trying to get me for days, but his calls went straight to my v-mail, he thought I was trying to be a qoute "tough bitch", well it must have worked b/c he said it was driving him crazy, so he called me at work. I would not have believed had I not heard from several people that the same thing has been happening to them, of course they left messages. I told him he could have left a message and he said he wasn't sure if I wanted to hear from him and he said he wanted to TALK, not leave a message. He asked me if I was still "mad" at him and I said "Yes, I am. But, I know you care about me, but please just do the courtesy of taking me seriously and going to things that are important to me, especially when you PROMISE! And if you can not go just CALL me for gosh sake." He said he was very sorry and please understand that this is new to him and he IS TRYING. For now I guess I can deal with that, BUT if I do not see an honest change, if it continues to be a repeat behavior, then we have something to talk about. I really do adore him and I do know him well and I know these are issues he has dealt with his whole life, but I think it's the first time he has been with a women he can be open and trust and who WANTS her to point out the things that DO NOT WORK for a realtionship. People can change, I most certainly have in the last few years, I mean I think as people if we do not allow ourselves to constantly change and evolve then we are wasting life, we are truly living when we refuse to keep changing. So for NOW, I can give him the benefit of the doubt, BUT I also made it apparant to him that I do want the option to have a more open realtionship, i need to explore more of me, dating adn find out what I want and who I am and who is better suited for me. I am not saying I will not put the effort and hope towards my man, but right now he can not really give me the time and focus I want and so I will need to adjust things in my life so that I am fufilled and happy regardless.
Iluvsiamese Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 Ok Nyasa. It sounds good but just make sure that he keeps on trying. Not just for a few days until the dust settles and then goes back to not bothering. My ex did this routinely. He would pretend to take all of the blame and admit that he needed to change. This would last until he was sure the heat was off and then it was back to the usual. As soon as this cycle starts, it should be game over.
Kengne Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 I'm thankful for your input Iluvsiamese and I am sorry that you have to be in the situation you are to give me your insight. Well he just called me at work. He says he has been trying to get me for days, but his calls went straight to my v-mail, he thought I was trying to be a qoute "tough bitch", well it must have worked b/c he said it was driving him crazy, so he called me at work. I would not have believed had I not heard from several people that the same thing has been happening to them, of course they left messages. I told him he could have left a message and he said he wasn't sure if I wanted to hear from him and he said he wanted to TALK, not leave a message. He asked me if I was still "mad" at him and I said "Yes, I am. But, I know you care about me, but please just do the courtesy of taking me seriously and going to things that are important to me, especially when you PROMISE! And if you can not go just CALL me for gosh sake." He said he was very sorry and please understand that this is new to him and he IS TRYING. For now I guess I can deal with that, BUT if I do not see an honest change, if it continues to be a repeat behavior, then we have something to talk about. I really do adore him and I do know him well and I know these are issues he has dealt with his whole life, but I think it's the first time he has been with a women he can be open and trust and who WANTS her to point out the things that DO NOT WORK for a realtionship. People can change, I most certainly have in the last few years, I mean I think as people if we do not allow ourselves to constantly change and evolve then we are wasting life, we are truly living when we refuse to keep changing. So for NOW, I can give him the benefit of the doubt, BUT I also made it apparant to him that I do want the option to have a more open realtionship, i need to explore more of me, dating adn find out what I want and who I am and who is better suited for me. I am not saying I will not put the effort and hope towards my man, but right now he can not really give me the time and focus I want and so I will need to adjust things in my life so that I am fufilled and happy regardless. Good for you Nyasa! Didn't I tell you he was gonna call u back? Well I hope you start giving less to him, and more to yourself. But like Iluvsiamese said.. don't let this be a one time thing. You have to continue to SHOW him you mean business. Don't fall back into the trap of pursuing him, calling him etc.... he will just get lazy, AGAIN and go back to his old ways. Anywho... good luck, and be good to YOU! K.
Nyasa Posted September 13, 2005 Posted September 13, 2005 Thanks Kengne, your replys helped me more than you know!! I was VERY confident in sticking to my guns and not calling him last night. Then this morning I starting panicing about it again and I sought more advice, that's when I finally said ENOUGH IS ENOUGH! I actually printed out some of your advice on NOT CALLING and tried to believe that he would and I focused on that, made a little prayer to God, pretty much leaving it in his/her/fate's hands and went about my day focusing on the positive. Low and behold within no time he called!!!! You were sooooo right and I am so glad I stayed strong, no matter how hard it was! I realized I do deserve the best and I put out there what I needed and wanted from him and if wasn't going to TRY to work on that with me, then I would move on and hope for the best. REALLY I don't ever want to be that girl that gives in and settles for less, b/c it's better than losing them all together or being alone, BS, if I learn to love myself and find a fufilling life, then a good man will be an extra added bonus, NOT a necessity (and I will not tolerate anything less than a GOOD man if I find self-love and respect!). Thanks again for your advice, all your advice and yes I intend to stay true to me, take some time to build a healthy REALATIONSHIP with myself and give him the benefit of the doubt without giving him the oppurtunity to **** on me! I found that the more I gave the impression that I was strong and could be ok with or without him, the more him seems to pay me respect, I am aware that he could go in circles again, but hopefully if that should happen again, I'll stop him midway through and put him check and if he doesn't like it, ciao! I have to remember in all this as hard as it may be to lose the one you think you love, it's far worse to lose love for yourself! That feel much worse that heartbreak every did!
megabit15 Posted September 14, 2005 Posted September 14, 2005 I wait patiently for him to fufill all his promises and he does not. I make up a million and one excuses for his behavior and again and again I wait it out thinking it will get better. He lacks affection, but he also lacks the so-called "normal" things like calling back and getting involved in the important things in my life. I "beg" him to love me by running to be by his side everytime he asks and forgiving him everytime he fails to spend time with me or cancels important plans at the last minute or pulls away from me HARSHLY when I touch him. I feel I am a convienace factor for him, that this is HIS realtionship and I tried to tell myself that was ok b/c he has such a busy life, but please a phone call does not take long and funny how he ALWAYS has time for friends and co-workers and not me. Will that really teach him ever to be considerate, affectionate and caring? He says all the right things, but NEVER shows me, is it b/c he doesn't care or b/c he just doesn't know how? Later I called and left a message. I told him it pissed me off and more importantly hurt my feelings b/c he seemed to cancel things at the last minute with lame excuses and was always when it was important to me. I told him I was sick of making excuses for him and being embarrased in front of my friends adn family and I was done with being hurt by men at this point. I told him if he cared he can call, but if he didn't I could no longer put any more effort into someone who did not give back. It's been almost two days and he hasn't called back. I refuse to call him back, I think I was in the right for being angry and standing up for myself, telling him how I feel. Was I in the right and should I just let it go if he does not call me back or should I call and try to talk it out? I mean how can he just NOT talk to me, it's not like we have not been friends for years!!! Hallelujiah!! Congratulations for saying 'enough is enough'. This is what the original post referred to. People treat us as we let them. It took me a long time to realize that. Don't call him - at least until you are not as angry. Write him a letter if you really want - giving specific examples of when he did things and how it makes you feel: a: is untrustworthy (not doing what he says he will) b: made you feel like a convenience and that he does not care about you. Some examples that I've experienced: Does he change the subject when the topic is something important to you, but not necessarily to him, does he remember events in your life and ask about them, etc. The 'trick' is to be happy with yourself, and not be angry with him because he is being who he is. And we (I used to do this too) get so angry when people do what is in their nature. I have found it works better when I was able to say (paraphrased) "hey, this is not working for me like this. When you dont' call it makes me feel unimportant. My belief is that if two people who are dating do not want to talk with each other on a regular basis, there is something wrong in the relationship." etc. The point is, you are taking responsibility for your own happiness and not judging the other person or their behavior. It's YOU who is unhappy, not them. Laying on judgement, guilt trips, anger on a person - this shifts blame for your unhappiness to them. (I'm not talking about serious issues like infidelity, just general relationship malaise). If you decide you are unhappy in a relationship, you can communicate why to your partner, but you decide for yourself. When evaluating things, I believe a person's actions speak louder than words. They can tell you "I'm gonna call" - but if they don't, move on without resenting the other person. They are just not right for you, but it doesn't make them a bad person. A person can make me feel a certain way, but it is up to me whether to stay there and let it continually happen. If I keep doing the same thing with the same person, and expect to feel differently or get angry with them or depressed because things aren't different, who's fault is that?
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