pandnh4 Posted August 25, 2005 Posted August 25, 2005 hi everyone... i thought things were going great with a current relationship but sadly i'm starting to realize things are not as bright as they seem... my concern is this lovely young lady that i'm dating is not great about calling and doesn't really seem to make time to spend with me... now i'm not the needy type and i do love my space and independence but we only really see each other on weekends so it makes things a little difficult, especially in recent times... i'm starting to feel like i put in all the effort to see each other and spend time together... quick background info... i'm 25, male, young professional, she's 23 and a full-time student... we live in different cities but they are very close so commuting is not an issue... we've been going out on dates for about 10 weeks and have become intimate but have not yet slept together... 1st kiss about 6 weeks into the relationship, made things *official* per her request just about 3 weeks ago... things have indeed moved slowly and i get the sense that she tends to be a little more on the traditional side when it comes to relationships which is fine with me... the problem is that she hardly ever calls to say hi or talk and she doesn't seem to want to make specific plans to see each other... last time we saw each other was almost 2 weeks ago after spending a lovely night together, then i didn't hear from the whole week after... i decided to give her space and time cause she had midterms and projects but figured she'd call me when things eased up a bit with her schedule... so on friday i make plans with friends and then on saturday call her and find out she did the same with her friends... when i ask her if she wants to get together that night she says she's staying in cause of parents visiting the next day and homework but then i learn on tuesday when we talk over the phone that she ended up going to her friend's place on sunday night and spending the night there... i mentioned that i was going to take wednesday (yesterday) off from work and be in her city for a meeting and i'd like to take her out for lunch or dinner or even just drinks but she says she's probably busy with work... then later in the evening she texts me that this same friend of hers is *kidnapping* her and taking her out to a party but that i should meet up with them... so at this point i'm pissed but tell her i already made plans and that she should call me when she feels like making plans with me... when i asked her over the phone the previous night what about thursday or friday all she did was remain vague... she said there was a party that we could go to but that we should just see and play it by ear... then i find out this morning from another friend that she decided to commit to going... so it's like sometimes she has such a *busy* schedule that she can't find time to see me or call, other times she finds room in her schedule *last second* and doesn't bother thinking of me, or she doesn't feel like making plans with me... what gives? i really like this girl and i know we can't see each other all the time but it's been almost 2 weeks now since we last saw each other and she manages to find time for friends... besides, she's the one who wanted to make things *official* between us too... some people have pointed out that there are 168 hours to a week and how we choose to spend them is indicative of our priorities and interests, also that if she were truly interested and cared she would find time and actually want to call or see me... i've put in alot of effort so far and make myself available but no reciprocation here and it's starting to affect me... i want to talk to her about it but am worried it might come off as needy or drive her away even more... can anyone please offer some advice, insight, other perspectives? all opinions graciously welcome, both sides... thanx for your time, help, and interest...
kitkat826 Posted August 25, 2005 Posted August 25, 2005 I don't know, this seems fishy to me. It's true, no matter how busy people are, they make time for things that are important to them. I'm sorry, but if I had a boyfriend that I really cared about that lived in another city who I didn't get to see very often, my friends who I'm around all the time would have to take the back burner on the rare occasion when we can make plans. It sounds like shes really into the free-for-all student lifestyle and not wanting you to cramp her style, regardless of her being the one to push it as "official". Some people just like the security of knowing that, but it doesn't mean they are willing or able to put the energy into it that it deserves.
Author pandnh4 Posted August 25, 2005 Author Posted August 25, 2005 hi kitkat826, thanx for your quick and sincere insight... i completely agree that people should make the time if ther interest is there... i originally decided to give the benefit of the doubt because i know from past and personal experience that people can sometimes be a little rusty after being single for quite a while, which is indeed the current case for both of us... i also thought well maybe her schedule is hectic since she's in design school (though she lives off-campus; there actually isn't really a campus per se since the school is in a relatively large city) but i see her always getting dragged out by friends last second and then she actually makes plans with others... i thought maybe she's trying to play it cool with me for a bit and not be too attached, and then i thought well maybe she just has old-fashioned approaches to relationships... little by little though every one of these ideas gets disproved and i realize i've giving too much benefit of the doubt... someone else pointed out to me that maybe making things *official* was a way of wrapping me around her finger and securing a boyfriend, or maybe she did indeed think she wanted a relationship but didn't know herself well enough to become properly involved... anyway, do you have any advice? anyone else?
kitkat826 Posted August 25, 2005 Posted August 25, 2005 Originally posted by pandnh4 .. someone else pointed out to me that maybe making things *official* was a way of wrapping me around her finger and securing a boyfriend, or maybe she did indeed think she wanted a relationship but didn't know herself well enough to become properly involved... Either of these are valid options, and either mean you are getting screwed. And because I really don't see any other option, I would say make a move to distance yourself from her. If she likes you having her wrapped around her finger, then she'll learn she can't play that game. If she really does like you but is rusty or doesn't know herself well enough, then she'll learn what being in a relationship realy means and hopefully will come to her senses by either stepping up to the plate or admitting that shes not ready.
Author pandnh4 Posted August 25, 2005 Author Posted August 25, 2005 so i feel like my options are: 1 - break up with her and explain why - in which case that's it, all done 2 - distance myself without saying anything - which could make her want me more and shape up but also runs the risk of sending a wrong signal to her, i.e. that i might not be that interested in her 3 - explain how i feel and see her reaction - if she gets defensive then i know she's not ready but doesn't want to admit to it, or she either admits to not being ready and bails or she steps up to the plate seems to me like 3 is the most sincere and worthwhile option... any other takes or opinions? thanx so much...
Author pandnh4 Posted August 25, 2005 Author Posted August 25, 2005 i guess there is also option 4 which would be to talk to her friend (who is also a friend of mine too) and see what she knows or can find out... maybe she can point out these things to her and make her realize that a little more effort is required... not sure about this one though...
kitkat826 Posted August 26, 2005 Posted August 26, 2005 I say go for 3, but be strong about it so she knows that the behavior is not acceptable to make the relationship work.
Linus Posted August 26, 2005 Posted August 26, 2005 Listen to yourself. I got the sense from your first post that you really don't like the way she's been treating you... You like her and want to be there for her, and this is totally admirable and that's how I want to treat someone I like. However, having been in a very lopsided relationship where I bowed down to my girl and she walked all over me, my advice is to be very careful with how much more of yourself you're going to give to this girl. You may have to make an extremely painful decision--for you, anyway, and based on what you wrote I'm not sure if it would affect her, and understanding this will help you make that decision more promptly. This is one of those sucky things that bites all of us, and unfortunately it has become your situation. She will continue to drive you crazy, and she won't understand that she needs to be there for you, too (one side note: make sure you have directly communicated to her your needs in this area). If the relationship is lopsided, and she won't hold up her end of things, or you both can't reach a fair compromise, then unfortunately you have to call it quits. It takes a lot of courage, but that's the deal... unless you want to suffer and fall in love with hopes or expectations which aren't reality... very unhealthy. You deserve to be treated well, so form your decision understanding this. Good luck.
hoppy28 Posted August 26, 2005 Posted August 26, 2005 well said!!!!! a very simple plan i wish i inherited along time ago is the DO NOTHING plan. Dont pick up the phone, dont beg her back, dont send her gifts, dont ask whats up. begging and pleeding will only push them away. if she calls keep it simple, keep it quick. dont be a dick either. especially if you intend on getting her back. this is ALL about YOU...........not her. actions speak louder then words my friend. she would walk through a house on fire if she trully wanted to be with you. bottom line is...............try your best to not let this scrammble your brain. backoff ALOT.........and NO your are not doing this for her its for YOU.
Author pandnh4 Posted August 29, 2005 Author Posted August 29, 2005 well, we finally ended up seeing each on friday evening and spent the night together... i took her out to dinner at a pretty nice place and then we went to a club after for drinks... we ended up having a really nice time together, i think, and i decided to see how things played out before bringing up the issues that i mentioned above... the impression i get from her is that she can be a little passive and indecisive about things sometimes; her spunky and eclectic nature seems to make her a little more spontaneous about things too... when i picked her up she invited me in while she finished getting ready but i waited in the living room; she said something about her room being messy and embarassing... when we left the club and drove back to her place and i double parked outside because i didn't want to assume that i would be staying with her... we sat in the car and talked for like 5 minutes and then she said if parking weren't so bad she'd invite me in... then i asked her if she wanted to me to come in and if we should find parking... she ended up extending the offer but i couldn't seem to get a direct answer from her... i almost felt as if i was invited but that she was indifferent towards me staying - but maybe i'm reading too much into it... we talked some more in her room, she got a little cuddly with me and didn't act all that shy or anything... at one point though she said something along the lines of "you don't look too tired if you wanted to drive back"... a little confusing to me... nonetheless, i stayed and the next morning we went out for brunch and she kept saying all these things about how happy she was being with me, etc... we also opened up about a bunch of things and i feel like we got a bit closer... later that afternoon, without being direct i tried to hint at the fact that she was difficult to read sometimes and that i couldn't always tell how she felt about things... i mentioned that i couldn't sense whether she had wanted me to spend the night to which she responded that i was always welcome to stay over, especially when it's so late... my problem, i guess, is that response is a little void of emotion and doesn't really convey what she wants... there are times where she still seems a little distant and she can be a little slow and passive about initiating intimacy too... in regards to sleeping together, i can't read her or her interest whatsoever... does anyone see any specific type of patterns here or read anything about her words an behavior? i really like her and am willing to work with things here but i'd like further advice on what might be going on or what to look for... thanks everyone for your interest, insight, and support...
sanne Posted August 29, 2005 Posted August 29, 2005 i was in an eerily similar situation in my previous relationship. in the beginning we couldn't get enough of each other and were seeing each other almost everyday of the week. that gradually died down a little bit as I expected, but things soon got much worse. we lived 2 minutes away from each other but only ended up seeing each other once or twice during a given week. our communication wore down so much to the point where I was questioning if the relationship was even worth it. of course whenever i brought it up she would try harder and make me think that it was all just in my head. i found out that she was still seeing her ex at the time and was playing us both, which is why she had so little time for me. the moral of my story is this, if a woman cannot make time for you and make herself available then she is not worth it. relationships are a two-way street. on a brighter note, i'm now seeing a really wonderful girl i met at my work. she lives 15-20 minutes away from me and makes more of an effort to see me and get together than my ex ever did. i seriously wonder why i ever put up with the crap my ex made me go through, i guess i had never really known what a good relationship was all about until i met this new girl.
Shandy Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 maybe she read that book, "why men love bitches", and is applying it on you.
Author pandnh4 Posted August 30, 2005 Author Posted August 30, 2005 i don't think that she's being a *bitch* with me... it's just that she seems indecisive, passive, and sometimes indifferent about us speaking or seeing each other... i can't tell if it's something about her personality, whether she has her head up in the clouds, or if there's something else going on that she's keeping from me or that i'm blind to... when we do see each other, however, she's very sweet and delightful... she often expresses how happy she is that we're together, how she tells her friends about us, that they're happy for us, and that i'm such a great person... she's also said that i'm the only one for her and she's very appreciative of me taking her out, being such a gentleman, and overall just treating her like a princess... so all this makes me lean towards giving her the benefit of the doubt, especially because she is so charming and lady-like... there is a certain touch of innocence to her but on the other hand she does like to party, go out, and sometimes act/dress scandalously... which is all fine so long as i know that she is still committed and exclusive to me... as i've mentioned before, she's a little reserved as far as showing emotion and initiating any affection... she will take my arms and hands on occasion and every now and then she'll plant a sweet little kiss, out of nowhere... finally, she's told me that she's not one to rush into things and that it was refreshing that i'm not the pushy type... i'm sure this was in reference to sex, but even there i can't read her... i know she might be waiting it out a bit but i wish i could get better signals regarding her overall desires and interest in me... hmmmmmm...
Mary3 Posted August 30, 2005 Posted August 30, 2005 She is either waiting for A) Someone better to come along B) Using you for dinner , club drinks and see A above . C) Is not over someone else All add up to : She is playing you and is not VERY interested but slighly enough for you to waste money time and emotions on her...
Shandy Posted August 31, 2005 Posted August 31, 2005 I personally think it's fine. Sometimes girls don't want to seem overly eager and like to be pursued. She said it herself that she wants to take things slow. In the beginning stages of a relationship, there are questions that go through a girl's mind, especially if she's young. Like, is he only after me for sex? Or, will I get hurt later if I really fall for him? It really depends on the girl.
flowergirl Posted September 1, 2005 Posted September 1, 2005 Shandy, I strongly disagree. Although girls do think a lot at the beginning of a relationship, and are cautious from fear of getting hurt, I think any girl, or guy for that matter, who acts like his girl, is incapable of love for whatever reason, and is just playing games with innocent peoples' hearts. My best advice to this guy is to cut her out, as painful as it may be, because no one deserves that. Good luck in your future, man.
Author pandnh4 Posted September 2, 2005 Author Posted September 2, 2005 hmmmmmmm... it seems like the general consensus, no matter where i go or with whom i speak, is that these are not great signs from her... i think shandy's response, which i appreciate as well, is the only one that conveys some understanding towards the responses that i get from this young lady that i have been seeing... it seems as if over time she is becoming a little closer and more open with me but at the same time she just still doesn't put in all that much effort to see me or spend time together... to give a little more background info, i've actually known this young lady for quite some time, maybe over a year... she used to date an aquaintance of mine (not a particularly close friend) and was actually friends with my former... we started talking more after my ex and i broke up, back in december... at one point in january though i think she got the impression that i might have had some interest in her and said something along the lines of not dating through the circle of friends... at this time she and my former were particularly close and she really said this out of nowhere but i took it as a hint and backed off entirely... over the next several months though we exchanged emails and got to know each other a little better... then one day back in may she mentioned that she was no longer friends with my former, that she had been betrayed and hurt by her... several days later she pretty much invited me to ask her out, hinting that she would say yes... she later told me, like about a month ago, that she had changed her mind about not dating in the circle of friends because it just didn't make sense anymore, what with everyone knowing everyone, and she really wanted to get to know me... so there, a week later in the beginning of june i took her out for the first time and things have just kind of been moving slowly since then... this is all pretty new to me since i've never really been through the whole *dating* phase... it's always pretty much been getting to know someone one or two nights, hitting it off really well, and then boom, we're a couple and spending lots of time together... so i guess it's just a little unsettling now not really knowing what's going on or what she is thinking... the signs, some of which are good, just aren't as clear-cut as i'm used to...
sanne Posted September 2, 2005 Posted September 2, 2005 stop over analyzing and making things complicated for yourself. sit her down, tell her you are really tired of making all the effort in the relationship and say you want things to be a 2-way street. then let it be, if she changes then great but if she still stays the same break up with her. at least you can say that you tried all you could. honestly, women make things so damn complicated sometimes you just gotta cut through their bs and make the options very clear. but please, be gentle with her and don't make it sound like an ultimatum.
Author pandnh4 Posted September 2, 2005 Author Posted September 2, 2005 sanne - any advice on how to do this? how would you recommend telling her that i'm tired of putting in all the effort and want her to step up, without making it sound like an ultimatum? any particular place or environment to do this? thanx much...
Shandy Posted September 3, 2005 Posted September 3, 2005 I gave my response because I was like that girl once. In the beginning of my relationship I was very hesitant. I didn't feel strongly about my boyfriend in the beginning and yes, like you, he was frustrated. At the time, I thought we get along great so why not stay in the relationship? Maybe my feelings will grow deeper as we spend more time together (it did). Guys usually fall faster than girls do and some girls just need more time. Although, that's only looking at the bright side of it. She could also be playing games like the others have said. Now in your recent post you said she's been betrayed by your ex. Could she be using you to get back at your ex, her former friend?
Author pandnh4 Posted September 3, 2005 Author Posted September 3, 2005 well, anything's possible... she could indeed be using me to get back at my former but i doubt it because my ex is actually the one who broke up with me and she has been involved with someone for a while now since february... so to be perfectly honest i doubt that she even cares... i also doubt that this young lady and my former even talk any more... although they seemed rather close back in the spring, my ex has had a habit of latching onto female friends, one at a time, and then drifting apart on shady terms, very much in the nature of *flavor of the month*... that's interesting to know that you once went through something like the one i described... i'm curious though, did you let the guy know that you were interested? the reason i ask is because this young lady has been very direct about that, how i am so wonderful and never cease to amaze her, yet she still remains a little hesitant about getting close or spending time together... i would imagine that someone so willing to express their feelings might actually follow through with pursuing a little, though she once mentioned to me that it was really nice for her to feel *courted* for once...
upsetnhurt Posted September 3, 2005 Posted September 3, 2005 Pand....did you ever step back and think she might have another dude on the side or at least have feelings for one still other than you (maybe an ex?). Reason I say it is I heard the same things as you do yet received the same actions.......found out a bit later the gal was playing two sides...mine and her ex.
Author pandnh4 Posted September 3, 2005 Author Posted September 3, 2005 well, that's possible too.. i mean, this young lady is extraordinarily attractive and i'm sure guys hit on her left and right... i've even witnessed it a couple of times when we were out together and i got drinks or disappeared to the restroom... on one occasion, when i got back, the other guy said to me *wow, she's really into you* but another time some dude was parked right there dancing next to her and only took off when i came over, like she didn't tell him she was there with someone or he didn't understand... i'm not the jealous type though and every so often get hit on myself so these things don't bother me, only when i don't see any effort to mention that the person is spoken for... anyway, she has mentioned us to people and just recently posted a pic of us together on her myspace profile... perhaps it's just to humor me though, who knows? it's friday evening though and no call or word from her, wondering if she has any intention or desire to get together this weekend... i certainly do but hate feeling like a sap and always asking if she's busy... after all, i'm used to people asking me to go out and do things... lol
sanne Posted September 4, 2005 Posted September 4, 2005 man it really kills me to see you in this situation. i really hope that my instincts turn out not to be correct, but everything i read about your situation tells me that something is not quite right. it's time for you to put your foot down man. you've got to have the talk with her, as long as you are honest and open about your feelings nothing bad can come of it. in fact, there is no right way to approach this situation other than being completely honest. how she responds is how you can make your decision about whether or not to leave this relationship. on a side note, not all women are like this. my new gf is absolutely the exact opposite of how my ex and your gf are. she lives 20 minutes away and has never once complained about driving over to my place, she calls to confirm any plans we make, and most importantly she calls to MAKE plans to do things. what i'm trying to say is that you can really tell when a girl is into you because they make the effort. honestly, go find a woman that will make the effort because i'm sure you deserve it.
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