Flat out rejection haha

[jamesukuk]

Hey,

 

I feel embarrassed asking this question And apologies for the length, I've tried to crack a few amusing antidotes here and there.

 

I always consider myself average to slightly above average looking.

 

I had a breakup two years ago. I dated this girl, I met on POF who then joined my workplace (awkward I know), we dated a year but she had intimacy issues and made out it was because her dad abused her as a child. She dumped me for my best friend and work college who she’d been having sex with for at least 6 months prior. She was the first and only person I’ve dated, if you can call it that.

 

So yeah, I found myself looking like Tom from (500) Days of Summer after his breakup, scowling and sulking at the world for three months. Obviously it wasn’t great working with them both and seeing them have something we never had – intimacy.

 

So I went speed dating.

 

I had a great time, oddly enough the person I was most physically attracted to became the person I was the least attractive as she had a very dark personality (she told me, she liked watching snuff films on the dark web – I’d actually worked with her parents, both of whom had issues and had been fired).

 

Anyhow, from that night, one girl arranged a date with me and another I clicked with.

 

I was enthusiastic, looking forward to my date to a water park.

 

Then came the results out of 20 – 0 matches, 0 friends, 0 likes. 0 full stop. I was expecting 2 – 3 matches, 2 friends.

 

I was on a train, it was a surreal journey home whilst I figured out what I’d done wrong. 3 of my expected matches matched with my friend. The one I arranged a date with sent Ryan a message saying, “You were the only guy I ticked, none of the others were even worth ticking friend to”.

 

By the end of the journey, I saw it as an opportunity to get better, to learn how to attract women.

 

Step 1 – Change my haircut. I’ve always had a high hairline since my teenage years, it’s actually not changed. Even when I was a kid the hairdresser remarked at my high hairline. With the help of a hair advice lady, I decided to make my hair shorter on the sides and spike my hair a little.

 

Step 2 – Improve my style.

 

Step 3 – I was going to make the conversations more fun and learn how to interact.

 

Step 4 – I was going to become more sociable in general.

 

Step 5 – I was going to pursue my career dreams.

 

I did steps 1-3 and I am still working hard to pursue step 5. I improve my hair, maximised my appearance (yes, all superficial) and started joining groups. I found myself in various social groups and at one point, I went out 12 consecutive nights and I had fun.

 

I decided if I went with an outcome in mind, I’d fail. I wanted to connect, make friends and meet people but most importantly have fun, enjoy myself. In fairness, I did.

 

So I went to the next speed dating. Same result: 0 matches, 0 likes.

 

And again 0 matches, 0 likes.

 

My friends meanwhile were getting anywhere between 1-5 likes a night.

 

Then one night, I had probably one of the best nights ever. I had such a fun, great time, really had some good conversations, really hit it off with people.

 

Same result: 0 matches, 0 friends, 0 likes.

 

My friends were using it as a precursor of a night out. We’d go speed dating then have a night out.

 

Despite my lack of success, I was still enthusiastic, I felt I was getting better at interacting and I was having fun. I felt if I’d have a negative attitude, it wouldn’t help me.

 

During these nights out, I started bumping into girls from the previous events. They all told me how much they enjoyed speaking to me, two girls event said I was the crack there (that’s slang term in my area for banter, fun conversation, personality – not drugs or insane!) and when I asked if they enjoyed speaking to me so much, they liked my personality and although there was nothing wrong with my physically they just weren’t physically attracted to me.

 

Continued the speed dating – 0 likes, 0 matches etc. My friends continued with their varying degrees, 3 of the 5 got bored so stopped going so it was usually just 1 or 2 of us. I started getting bored but they persuaded me to come along.

 

Eventually, things started taking a sinister turn. Some girls called me ugly, too short, didn’t like the sound of my voice, not muscular enough, too fat, too scrawny (yes a contradiction, I’m probably on the lean side).

 

Several girls started pulling off a “wait for me while I got to the toilet” trick then went for the exit trick, which was just next to the toilet, leaving me waiting for them.

 

Then came the night from hell. First half I thought it going okay, a girl I knew from a social group was there, really liked her. She told me to speak to her during the interval. Also hit off with two girls.

 

The guy in front of me had a row with his housemate. He had been telling the guys she had pissed the couch the previous night. She was furious and they had a row where she accused him of having sex with her without a condom despite knowing he had an STD. This was in front of everyone. We’ll call him Phil.

 

The whistle went for the interval. They left and left their sheets on the table. I read their sheets; both had ticked yes to a few of the guys, including the guy who had the row. But what hit me was when in cold writing, on the sheet, she wrote “ugly”. The other wrote “NO!!!” but both had written things such as “red shirt” or “nice guy, not for me” for the other guys. I was the only one with negative comments. I was shocked.

 

During the interval, spoke to the girl I knew, she blanked me. She walked past, blanked me again.

 

Then after the interval. First girl didn’t return from the bar as she didn’t fancy me, second girl went to the bar with Phil rather than speak to me, leaving the third girl on her own until the last minute. Third girl ticked Phil despite his rudeness and immediately ticked no. I asked why, she said “too short”.

 

This was turning into the night from hell.

 

Then I finished with two girls who were really sweet and told me they liked me. They said they wanted to go to a bar with me, they took selfies with me for their social media accounts and stole my sheet and wrote down my phone number.

 

They told me to wait for them while they went to the toilet, and yes, they went for the exit instead. I followed them and asked if we were still heading to a bar, they told me to **** off. I went home, they started prank calling me, mocking me.

 

The selfies they took had been uploaded to social media and were mocking me.

 

I felt deflated.

 

Side Note: I bumped into Phil's housemate, she said he had a threesome from the speed dating!!! Literally, every girl liked him and believe her haha. I thought there was something really off about him, it's not that he got the girls, I thought he was really sinister and underneath but in fairness physically muscular and obviously attractive to the girls.

 

So speed dating: 20 events, 25 – 30 ladies a night, 500 + women, 0 matches, 0 friends and 0 likes. Zero liked me. The speed dating lists all the girls who liked you even if you didn’t tick them. I wish it didn’t because:

 

1) It gives an ego boost to girls who have rejected you

2) It feels absolute **** to constantly get told 0 out of 25+ liked you. I’d rather pretend that some of the girls I didn’t connect with or fancy probably liked me but in that case I can’t because nobody did regardless of whether I liked me.

 

 

A few side notes from the social event:

 

Met a girl (Stacey), I really connected with me. Agreed to go to a different social event with her as she said she wanted to go with me, went there, she didn’t turn up. Met another girl (Scarlet), hit it off wit her.

 

After a few months of seeing Scarlet on social events – she told me she liked me. Things developed, we were very physical without kissing, club about to close. I went to the toilet, came back and she was full on snogging another guy (Alan).

 

She text me an hour later at 4am to apologise, she said she thought I’d gone home and didn’t realise I was still there and she implied she was snogging him as she felt upset by me going home.

 

Then a few months later, things developed between us again. Alan was there and Brian my friend was there. Brian asked what the deal was, I told him the story. She ignoring Alan so he went home, she took me to one side, told me she liked me and wanted to hang out. She had to go to the toilet (I will now call toilets, signs of doom!). She came back and immediately started snogging Brian.

 

I decided to go home, I said my goodbyes and she had a face of pure shame.

 

Meanwhile, meant to go to a 2nd event with Stacy but she said she wasn’t up for it. She said it wasn’t her thing, even though she suggested it.

 

She disappeared for a while, then messaged me about seeing me but that fell through.

 

Both Stacey and Scarlet are now in long term relationships. I connected the most with Stacey out of all the girls I’ve met the last years, on nights out, speed dating, singles parties, social events but she’s getting married.

 

Dating websites, Tinder have resulted in nothing. No messages on dating websites (yes, I had sent messages haha) and Tinder, I either match and get no response or get catfished.

 

Anyway – in short. I feel pathetic and I feel cynical.

 

I feel this time last year despite the rejections I was enthusiastic, I’ve become the best person I can be and I’m working on improving every aspect of my life but I feel deep inside, I will never attract females, I feel physically ugly and nobody can say I haven’t tried.

 

Even when I was enthusiastic, felt confident in my appearance and personality, I had no success.

 

There’s a cynicism that’s crept in and I hate been cynical but I don’t know how to get rid of it. My main fight is to stop the cynicism creeping into other areas of my life. I feel enthusiasm is important in all aspects of life but I can feel cynicism creeping in. There’s been periods the last few months where I’ve felt depressed.

 

I have to remind myself: I don’t need a relationship, I can live without one.

 

If anyone has any advice, tips or want to tell me to stop being a pussy haha, it would be appreciated :

[smackie9]

So far you have done everything right, but if speed dating is getting you these kinds of result/comments, then stop wasting your time.

 

I feel you are looking in all the wrong places. Obviously these girls are high maintenance, have high expectations, loose or young and immature.

 

I don't think anyone can be THAT ugly to not get some interest.

 

I know this is personal but are you black by any chance? What nationality are you? and is the norm in your community. Sometimes culture plays a huge role and can be a disadvantage.

[jamesukuk]

So far you have done everything right, but if speed dating is getting you these kinds of result/comments, then stop wasting your time.

 

I feel you are looking in all the wrong places. Obviously these girls are high maintenance, have high expectations, loose or young and immature.

 

I don't think anyone can be THAT ugly to not get some interest.

 

I know this is personal but are you black by any chance? What nationality are you? and is the norm in your community. Sometimes culture plays a huge role and can be a disadvantage.

 

Thanks for your post.

 

No I'm actually white, English, living in England.

 

In terms of black guys, I kind of feel its the opposite. One of my friends became paranoid that the girls were only going for black guys and he would freak out if there were any guys who were either:

 

1. Black

2. Over 6'3"

3. Had beards.

4. Muscular

 

In theory, a 6'3" bearded black guy would be his worst nightmare. Fortunately for him, I saw many muscular black guys over 6'3" and muscular many 6'3" bearded guys but never a muscular 6'3" bearded black guy.

 

I told him to concentrate on himself and not to worry. My friend grew a beard in response. I never saw the other guys as competition, I just did my own thing.

 

In hindsight, he kind of had a point, definitely regarding beards, weight and height. Maybe my city is really liberal but being black is no disadvantage and probably an advantage in desirability. I'd say being Asian is more of a disadvantage in attracting ladies.

 

Anyway, I'm white, 5'11".

[smackie9]

The reason why I asked is, if your were black, not being dressed or look like a gangster is a disadvantage. I have been told this many times from black guys that prefer to dress metrosexual.

 

So 5' 11'' is not short, and being in England, white is not a disadvantage. So by your observations, women like tall bearded buffy guys. Or what we call here in North America "Lumbersexual". Work on getting the look and see what happens...get that ugly beard growin, hit the gym, buy some tattered jeans, get them all dirty looking, some work boots (they have at least a 1" + heel on them) and a plaid shirt. Oh and grow out your hair and leave it unkempt. You might see some pretty good results. Oh and having a "I don't care" attitude, being aloof and distance works wonders......you are too much in their space, looks too eager IMO that's why they run.

Edited August 6, 2017 by smackie9

[Miss Spider]

That sounds like a hobo , smackie lol

[smackie9]

That sounds like a hobo , smackie lol

LOL I know eh? It's just the rugged look....if you google lumber hipster or lumbersexual men, they don't look like any hobo I have seen.

 

Some do wear a clean dress shirt with suspenders and a bow tie and smoke a pipe to finish off the look as well. The final touch is being sleeved (tattooed)

[hptalbot]

Man the UK sounds like a terrible place, or maybe its just the places\people you are going\meeting? I don't know.

 

Sounds like your friends are a bunch of asshats, who are willing to sabotage you to get laid.

What kind of best friend steals a man's girlfriend? The kind you don't need in your life.

What kind of friend goes up and starts making out with your date the minute you go to the restroom? The kind you don't need in your life.

 

I don't want to put thoughts in your head but I would not put it past these guys to lie about you to women to up their own chances.

 

0 out of 0 after 500? Something is up here.

 

Try going to an event alone without your friends. Or come to the states, we have our own share of *******s but it seems they are the standard model over there across the pond.

[smackie9]

Some will metrosexual hipster d(*&%^ their look by adding skinny jeans, van runners and a scarf (barf).

 

I'm old, so I think they look like dbags lol.

[elaine567]

https://onmogul.com/stories/spotting-a-lumbersexual - its not a bad look.

 

But whether it will suit James or not is open to question.

Btw these girls sound absolutely horrible and a bit trashy to boot.

No class, no manners and just rude.

[smackie9]

https://onmogul.com/stories/spotting-a-lumbersexual - its not a bad look.

 

I think the shirtless ones are hot lol. I just hate beards and always have....so I'm out.

[Robratory]

I have to remind myself: I don’t need a relationship, I can live without one.

 

Of course you need a relationship. We all do. What you don't need is all this BS drama.

 

Speed dating? Jesus, stop doing that to yourself.

 

And stop going out in groups. Hunting in groups makes sense when all you got is wooden spears against Siberian mammoths, but if you're looking for a sweetie, you'll do better hunting alone.

 

It's good to try to be more sociable, and working on yourself is always good. If you think there's a hairstyle or clothing style that better presents the picture you want to present, by all means adopt it. But don't frame it in your mind as "to learn how to attract women."

 

You can't attract "women." Nobody can. The best we can do is attract some women. Think of all the women you encounter every day and towards whom you feel zero attraction and possibly even the opposite. Note that a substantial number of those women you don't find attractive have men who do find them attractive. Well, it's the same on the other side of the fence.

 

For some reason, events created specifically for the purpose of bringing people together don't work out as well as one would suppose. Back in the 80s, before the internet, there was a local organization called, if I remember right, "Bay Area Singles." It organized "singles mingles," renting dance halls and charging $5 entrance. Once inside, you got a plastic glass with some cheap white wine, a plate with some supermarket cheese, and walked over to where everyone of your sex was standing together, proceeding then to stare at the opposite sex group standing on the other end of the dance hall.

 

Just when you thought things couldn't get any more awkward, the event organizer, a short balding man you knew must have been bullied in high school, would come out and try to liven things up by clapping his hands and chanting, "Singles! Mingle!"

 

I went twice and decided it wasn't for me.

 

As for Stacy and Scarlet, a couple of things. One, it doesn't sound like you developed actual relationships with them, and two, it sounds like they were the type of women who love hanging out in groups because they get to tease one boy after the other, first "snogging" him and then ignoring him.

 

Don't envy Brian and Alan. Those boys are getting teased, not laid.

 

I advise you to work all the sources a little (POF, OKC, even speed-dating) but not to rely on any one. And instead of going to social events where you see the same people over and over, look for all the opportunities that present themselves during the course of every ordinary day.

 

Every day, you must come across dozens or even hundreds of women who are age-appropriate and available. And if you're an average looking guy, at least some of them will find you perfectly acceptable. And it turns out that, if the girl isn't in a hurry and you don't trigger her creep alarm, she will usually respond at least politely to a friendly comment.

 

Chat for a minute, introduce yourself, and now that you know her name, ask her out. Set a time and date or at least get her phone number. If she declines, say thanks, have a nice day, and excuse yourself. No big deal. She's just one girl in the big city. You're not going to see her again and again, snogging with your buddies.

[jamesukuk]

There's no doubt that my friends were putting me down speed dating cause:

 

1) The host warned me. He said I was being cock blocked to use his exact words.

2) I overheard one of them saying to the girls how scrawny I was. Some random guys joined in and said "He'll never get a match, he'll be pressing refresh a long time" (you get the results via email anyway so it was a redundant comment). He didn't see me stood behind him.

 

My friend got his comeuppance, the girl told him to wait for her at the bar. He waited until he found out she'd left with the other guys who joined in. I never went with him again after that.

 

My philosophy was, if they make their decisions based on my friends, they aren't worth it. The girls will see through their insecurities, I never worried about any of the guys, whether friend or not.

 

But it can't be down to my friends, I did the last 4 events solo and got the same results.

Edited August 6, 2017 by jamesukuk

[kazen]

So by your observations, women like tall bearded buffy guys. Or what we call here in North America "Lumbersexual". Work on getting the look and see what happens...get that ugly beard growin, hit the gym, buy some tattered jeans, get them all dirty looking, some work boots (they have at least a 1" + heel on them) and a plaid shirt. Oh and grow out your hair and leave it unkempt. You might see some pretty good results. Oh and having a "I don't care" attitude, being aloof and distance works wonders......you are too much in their space, looks too eager IMO that's why they run.

 

You just describe me. But please don't use the term Lumbersexual, I'm offended by that term. We prefer Lumberjacks or my personal preference "woodsman".

 

You are right, women do respond to it. Although when I tell them about my axe, they get scared. LOL

[preraph]

I have to say you show an exceptional amount of bravery and tenacity given the brutal array of speed dating rejections you've experienced. I would just now say that speed dating is not for you and probably neither is online dating. I think your time is better spent pursuing your active outside hobbies and interests in hopes you make new friends with something in common to expand your network of possibilities.

 

You've taken steps to improve yourself and make yourself more appealing. Since so many of these women didn't want to directly reject you, I have to think that means you were nice enough and not rude or crude or something personality-wise that put them off such that they didn't want to be mean but instead ghosted on you, which is admittedly also not fun, but better than a direct rejection of "you're too this or that."

 

Be sure you have gone to a good barber and asked them what they think would look best on your hairline. Maybe it's not spikes but needs a side part with a swoop of hair covering part of the forehead. Maybe it needs to just go bald entirely if your head shape is okay.

 

In online and speed dating, try to remember that most people still shoot for the moon, hoping to get a date with the best looking or most vivacious person there, and so it ends up everyone after the same people. So unless you are that person, and you are not, then that's not your forum.

 

Find groups that are just about activities and interests and expand your social circle by getting to know more male friends who think highly of you. If your buddy is always the one who gets the girls when you go out, dang if I'd go out with him. I mean, I get he draws them to your vicinity, but that's not working out if they are all over him.

[rushed]

I started reading your post ready to tell you all the things that you were doing wrong. But wow, it turns out that you did nothing wrong. You did everything right. And you sound like a pretty cool guy with a great sense of humor with an engaging writing style.

 

Stop doing speed dating. And stop hanging out with those so-called friends of yours. It looks like when there is any kind of competition around you wind up getting the short end of the stick and your friends are either contributing to it or they just don't care. Either way they're not very good friends. Like preraph said find better friends.

 

Maybe search out local forums for whatever hobbies you like and try to befriend a girl on there. Like I said before, you're great with writing and women love a guy with a sense of humor, which comes through in your writing. I think getting to know a girl that way would be a good option for you.

[preraph]

Also, have you ever wondered if your popular buddy could be saying something to put these women off you? I had a roommate once who would whisper things to guys and I was never sure what, but I think it was to shift the focus to herself by doing them a favor or something.

[Bastile]

500 opens in speed dating, and nothing?

 

No replies at all on Tinder?

 

And your mates are taking your womenz?

 

There's something not quite right about it. Even if we suggest that your mates are c*ckblocking you, still at least one woman's interest should have been sufficient.

 

It sounds as though you have dealt with the worst men and women that the world has to offer for a very projected period, and not even got a lay from fool's mate.

 

Bizarre.

 

Time for changes to be made. If every guy is taking your woman, or sees you set as something to easily invade, then you are giving off a vibe of being a wuss.

 

Don't get me wrong, dealing with white-knight c*ckblocks, muscle bound "tough guys", and her unhappy fat friends is part of life. But this should not be happening on the regular. There is something about your vibe giving off the impression that you can be messed with.

 

Still doesn't account for 500 sets and nothing, but it's a start. You need to sharpen your teeth. Learn how to deal with people a bit more ruthlessly.

 

If your mates are going to neg you (attempt to lower your value) in front of women, you need to learn how to navigate that smoother, and come out looking better. Those guys are poncing off your energy, and are ultimately crappy wings anyway. But you seem like an easy target, and there's one in every group tbh.

 

That's the male front. For the female side of things, it sounds like you are dealing with legit slags lol

 

But again, 500 of them?

 

Anyway, that can be usual for club game. You aren't going to get anywhere with those sorts of girls unless you are more assertive.

 

Either that, or you need to look shiny enough for them to come onto you, and then be a good tease.

[Chilli]

https://onmogul.com/stories/spotting-a-lumbersexual - its not a bad look.

 

But whether it will suit James or not is open to question.

Btw these girls sound absolutely horrible and a bit trashy to boot.

No class, no manners and just rude.

 

 

Ahh yeah , exactly what l was thinking. Why would a guy turn himself upside down for women like that.

pretty sad.

[Bastile]

Ahh yeah , exactly what l was thinking. Why would a guy turn himself upside down for women like that.

pretty sad.

 

Learning how to stop getting trampled on is not "turning yourself upside down". It's developing a backbone.

 

The alternative is to be avoidant and try and hide from those "mean nasty woman and men".

 

Hundreds and hundreds of them.....

Edited August 7, 2017 by Bastile

[gaius]

No offense but you just come off like a passive, bland guy who displays almost no genuine emotion. That's how I act when I'm around women I don't want to be involved with and it works like a charm. To the point that some of the girls in this thread have started openly having a side conversation because they don't find what you've presented to be worthy of much real attention.

 

Next time you find a "friend" of yours making out with the girl your were after why don't you try hitting him with a barstool. Or something. Show a little competitive spirit and emotion. That's incredibly humiliating, you should be enraged. And learn how to communicate in a way the opposite sex finds interesting. Apologizing right off the bat and saying you're going to make amusing antidotes won't get you far. Stop talking about it and just be amusing instead.

[healing light]

Your height is perfect and you sound like a gentleman through and through. I think you need to come to the United States where the women will dote over your hot accent. We'll take you!

[rushed]

Your height is perfect and you sound like a gentleman through and through. I think you need to come to the United States where the women will dote over your hot accent. We'll take you!

 

This is exactly what I was thinking! Even if you're just average looking, your accent would definitely get you some interest here.

[Miss Spider]

I agree.. OP sounds lovely. I'm with smackie, though, that it might just be a matter of getting your own style, because the girl mentioned physical attraction. Obviously there are limitations to how much we can change our looks, but you'd be surprised at how much the way we style/dress ourselves can improve attractiveness and exude personality. People do draw conclusions about appearance especially in speed! dating. Maybe not the feral look unless you can pull it off but find what works best for you and wear it with confidence. Like Reddit has a male fashion subreddit and there's all kinds of resources

 

Also, again on what smackie said, the "I don't care" attitude can be effective, you may be unintentionally a little...for lack of better term... "try hard"(I don't know) in your encounters with women because you understandably want success, but that can backfire. Better yet if you can genuinely have that confidence

Edited August 7, 2017 by Cookiesandough

[Sara1989]

I am from the UK and average looking men/women have no problem finding dates here.

 

Surely the problem are

1. The speed dating-give it up and use other means of finding women. Also if your there every week they may think there is something wrong with you.

 

2. Your friends...not really friends are they?

 

3. Your look...maybe show us a picture on here? or an female friend give you an honest talk on your looks.

[CptInsano]

I am from the UK and average looking men/women have no problem finding dates here.

 

Surely the problem are

1. The speed dating-give it up and use other means of finding women. Also if your there every week they may think there is something wrong with you.

 

2. Your friends...not really friends are they?

 

3. Your look...maybe show us a picture on here? or an female friend give you an honest talk on your looks.

 

All good advice. I would add a good look at the type of woman the OP is interested in. If he doesn't seem interested in women who would consider him, the end results may be just the same.