How soon is now....

[some_username1]

So….I’m looking to get a consensus on Loveshack as to how long it takes the average girl to want to get intimate vs it more being a case that she is just stringing someone along?

 

To give the full background I met a girl in my state off Tinder (I know right…) a month ago and when we are with each other we seem really into each other. She said she wants to take it slow and her previous boyfriends (apart from one where she tried FWB) started out as friends. I like that myself, my feeling is that the girl who is right for me doesn’t put out on the first date. That being said it has been about a month and 6 dates now (we have taken each other out and spent a fair few dollars on each other in that time) and the closest we have been to some alone time is a brief bit of intimacy in my car parked up on a quiet bit of road. Not ideal and really frustrating for me and frustrating for her, at least on the surface….I’ve made it clear that I want her and that that I want her for her mind as well as her body….

 

Yet I can tell by a cursory check of her Tinder profile that the distance keeps updating and she has moved the order of her profile pics around so she is obviously at least toying with Tinder if not doing more so, so I am starting to get suspicious.

 

Given the Tinder activity and her coyness I am starting to wonder if it is less a case of her wanting to take it slow and more that she is avoiding sleeping with me to keep her options open. So she can justify to herself that she isn’t sleeping around. No problem with that in principle, we aren’t exclusive. In response to finding her Tinder account being active I put my Tinder account back into circulation and have been dating someone else. Problem is I really would rather date the subject of my OP exclusively but I am not going to ask her to be my girlfriend without us being intimate first! So the lack of a sexual encounter so far along with the knowledge she is at least window shopping makes me think I am better off just cutting her loose and sticking with this other girl. She also hasn’t really dressed up for any of our dates and that irritates me as I have put effort in and she shows me pics of nights out with her friends where she in a dress and has made an effort to wear something other than leggings and trainers etc. All that being said I am really reluctant to move on as I like her so much.

 

I guess that people are going to say that I should speak to her directly but in my experience turkeys certainly don’t vote for Christmas! She has already told me in passing that she isn’t dating anyone else off Tinder, she doesn’t believe in multi-dating (so she is either lying or she is using Tinder for a laugh with her friends or whatever). So I would like to know the opinion of this board as to whether this ‘demureness’ seems like a normal situation or whether it feels like she is just keeping me on ice until something better comes along on Tinder.

[bluefeather]

If it's been 6 dates and no action, and with the way you have described her, I'd say she is probably leading you on/stringing you along until someone else comes around. But I think if you make the next date with her at a private locale, whichever way she responds will give you a more precise answer.

[d0nnivain]

What the "average" girl does or doesn't do is not the proper yardstick for the right time to begin a sexual relationship.

 

Every person is different & every relationship is unique. For some people the right time is the first date for others, it's the wedding night. Both are correct answers & so is every date in between.

 

 

Since she told you that she wants to take it slow & you know she's still on Tinder, you have to assume she's multi dating. I don't know that she's "stringing you along" but I agree that she's "keeping her options open" without sleeping around.

 

 

You are also at the classic impasse. You want sex before you can evaluate if she's GF material. She may want exclusivity before sex.

 

 

The only want to deal with this is to talk to her about her intentions & your desires.

[fred123]

She wears leggings and trainers for dates?

Haha thats bad. Sounds like my ex.

 

Book a fancy restaurant then she will b3 forced to wear something else

[Gaeta]

* wanna be friends first

* wants to take it slow

* doesn't make an effort to dress up for you

* still active online

 

= she is not interested, she is just kiling time with you.

[Gaeta]

She wears leggings and trainers for dates?

Haha thats bad. Sounds like my ex.

 

Book a fancy restaurant then she will b3 forced to wear something else

 

It's important to filter early the bad ones from the good ones. If a woman does not make an effort to look nice for you and she shows signs of being not-so-interested you do not take her to a nice restaurant. Why reward her for her bad behavior? You dump and move on.

[olivetree]

Don't write this one off yet.

If she keeps going out with you, then she is interested.

She might just be slow to warm up.

 

If you haven't had the exclusivity talk, then why would she delete her Tinder?

 

She might not sleep with someone unless they are exclusive

Also, don't count dates until sex.

Everyone is different as to when they are ready.

 

As for the clothes, are you taking her out on nice dates that she should dress up for?

[some_username1]

Thanks guys, nice to know other people’s intuition of the situation matches my own gut feeling on this and I am not being unduly irrational.

 

I’m going to de-escalate (if that is even a word) and gradually phase her out unless her investment picks up. Such a shame but this is what it seems you get as a guy when using Tinder as a source of dates.

 

So frustrating how they tell you all about how excited they are that you have some reasonably unique things in common and they are telling all their friends and family about how gooey they feel about you yadda yadda yadda….meanwhile they just can’t stay off Tinder!

[some_username1]

Don't write this one off yet.

If she keeps going out with you, then she is interested.

She might just be slow to warm up.

 

If you haven't had the exclusivity talk, then why would she delete her Tinder?

 

She might not sleep with someone unless they are exclusive

Also, don't count dates until sex.

Everyone is different as to when they are ready.

 

As for the clothes, are you taking her out on nice dates that she should dress up for?

 

We have been to low key restaurants and outdoors stuff like picnics so nothing justifying a ball gown or anything like that, but a summer dress or something would have been nice as she has a great figure for it. The lack of typically feminine attire just makes it feel like she is not really bothered about displaying that side of her to me. As i say, she shows me pics of nights out (and not particularly special occasions, works night out sort of stuff) where she dresses up so she is far from a tomboy although that is the side of her that I get.

 

I have no problem with her being on Tinder it is more that she told me that she doesn’t multi-date when we first started dating. Mind you we live in era where as soon as a girl says she doesn’t multi-date it is almost a tacit admission that she actually does. They are all at it, in my experience and the sheer weight of numbers that girls have access to doesn’t lend itself to much sense of security for a guy.

 

I guess my issue (like with most guys who meet a girl online that they see as a long term prospect and who is being careful not to rush into sex) is that I worry that some other guy is getting the best of her- he is the one she is dressing up for, perhaps even having sex with and I am effectively holding his coat for him while he does it. I can’t know this and there is no easy or tactful way to ask without making a big drama of it and only a month or so in is probably too soon to bring up such a heavy and potentially explosive topic especially as our dating hasn’t really got past the holding hands and kissing in public stage. It is just the standard uncertainty that sets in when you know categorically that she is still online in some capacity.

 

Yes she is still going on dates, but the flip side is that her lack of investment (dress, sex etc) means it could be argued that it isn’t really costing her a lot of effort to do so. It isn’t out of the question that she is ‘bookmarking’ me or just enjoying a bit of attention while waiting for another suitor to show up who she will have sex with at the drop of a hat. Neither of those scenarios is particularly appealing to any man with a shred of self respect.

[preraph]

I'd stop dating her just for wearing nothing but leggings and trainers. That's inappropriate. Those are for around the house or yard and to work out in, but I do not see it as her not dressing up "for you." I see it as her just being lazy and inappropriate in general, as well as disrespectful, but mostly just lazy, lazy, lazy.

[fred123]

I remember once my ex i had planned a third date to a nice restaurant. She had a fb profile.pic of a nice dress and mentioned she looked good in a dress. She then said do you want me to wear that for dinner. I said yes you look really nice in dresses. She then said " haha well.im not going to. I replied why did u ask me then. She replied becausw i just wanted to see what you would say. I dont do what people tell me to and im very stubborn.

 

We went out for that date she wore heels and dressed up a bit. But in the next 6 months i never saw her wear a dress for me. She wore dresses for her nights out with her work colleagues and for xmas parties etc. But never with me

[rushed]

Don't write this one off yet.

If she keeps going out with you, then she is interested.

She might just be slow to warm up.

 

If you haven't had the exclusivity talk, then why would she delete her Tinder?

 

She might not sleep with someone unless they are exclusive

Also, don't count dates until sex.

Everyone is different as to when they are ready.

 

As for the clothes, are you taking her out on nice dates that she should dress up for?

 

I second all of this.

 

Also, if I knew I was going on a picnic, no way would I wear a dress. It can get windy, and do you know how awkward it is trying to sit on the ground or climb over to sit on a picnic bench in a dress? If you want to see her dressed up, ask her out to a place that warrants it. Now, keep in mind if she's usually wearing leggings and sneakers, then this is what she is going to look like 90% of the time. If you don't like it, it's probably best to part ways now.

 

As for the sex part, have you invited her over to your place for dinner yet?

[5x5]

So….I’m looking to get a consensus on Loveshack as to how long it takes the average girl to want to get intimate vs it more being a case that she is just stringing someone along?

 

In the distant past when I was dating various women the norm was for sex on the first or second date usually at their place, with their invitation and sometimes their initiation. Sometimes it happened on the third date and on the rarest occasion by the fourth date. I never experienced going on more than four dates with any woman I didn't have sex with.

 

What has been the norm for me and the women I have been with, makes no difference to you or the women you date. What you and your date wants to do is all that matters.

 

All of that said have you taken this woman to your place, has she invited you to hers?

 

Have you been very direct in telling this woman you want to have sex with her in whatever moment?

 

Are you passive and reticent when it comes to sex or are you assertive and bold?

 

In my experience sex comes very easily when one is very direct and confident with someone who finds you attractive and is keen on you. On the other hand, If she isn't interested she'll let you know so you can then move on.

[Andy_K]

Most girls, 1-3 dates. The most cautious ones, 5-6 dates. Only time it's been longer than 6 dates is girls with psychological issues relating to sex in some way.

 

Or she could be just not interested. Can't share any experiences of that though, as I only date girls who actually like me.

[Arieswoman]

s-u1,

How do you define "an average girl" ?

 

IMO there is no such thing !

[some_username1]

I second all of this.

 

Also, if I knew I was going on a picnic, no way would I wear a dress. It can get windy, and do you know how awkward it is trying to sit on the ground or climb over to sit on a picnic bench in a dress? If you want to see her dressed up, ask her out to a place that warrants it. Now, keep in mind if she's usually wearing leggings and sneakers, then this is what she is going to look like 90% of the time. If you don't like it, it's probably best to part ways now.

 

As for the sex part, have you invited her over to your place for dinner yet?

 

After a steamy make out session in my car on a saturday afternoon we agreed that it wasn't the vibe to go from there straight to bed seeing as neither of us have our own place. I said her that we should aim for the following saturday night so I attempted to put down a marker of when I thought it would be appropriate. I haven't rushed her into bed up til now and the make out sessions have been escalating so it seemed natural that the next date should end in sex.

 

We both are quite busy though and when trying to firm up plans she couldnt do saturday so offered Friday, I couldn't do Friday so she offered Sunday. So she is at least trying to make dates happen...so we went out that night and I took her out for a low key dinner (I don't have much money at the moment so I can't make extravagant dinner gestures, much as I would like to and have done in the past when my circumstances were better). She wasn't feeling well though and wanted to be dropped off at her house, she is currently living with her parents while she saves for a deposit on a house so when she said she wanted to be dropped home I knew it wasn't going to happen that night.

 

So I have tried to push things along. She could be legit in wanting more dates, I have picked up from general conversation that she does seem to place emphasis on reputation so it doesn't seem incongruent that she is holding out.....but by the same token she could be trying to avoid sex (or avoid sex with me) because she has other guys she is interested in and wants to save herself for.

 

Who knows, all I can say is that night was a big kick in the teeth for me as I had tee'ed it up and it seemed* the natural point at which to take things further. I am now losing interest. I will not be an orbiter and am going to see if she steps up from here. I haven't checked her tinder activity recently (the last time I checked was a couple of dates ago) as that is a sure road to madness. It is enough that I know that she *was* using it and that we still have not had sex so I have to assume that she is multi-dating (despite what she told me) and that I need to follow suit (which I am doing, I have a date lined up on Sunday myself).

 

My prediction is that she will fade herself out or tell me she has met someone else, unless I give her that message first which is unlikely because the other girls I have dated in recent times just don't compare. I want her. But, what I always try to remember when dating, is that when you meet the right one it should be effortless and you should certainly not be in a position where you are writing posts on a forum trying to figure things out.

 

Always the way that when I feel like I have met the right one she is a serial Tinderer!

[some_username1]

s-u1,

How do you define "an average girl" ?

 

IMO there is no such thing !

 

Yeah I totally phrased it wrong. I guess I was trying to get an idea as to whether 7 or even 8 dates is 'normal' or getting to the point of being an outlier.

 

I actually like meeting a girl who doesn't do it on the first date as thst has never been a good sign based on how things turn out in my exprrience. When you desire someone it is quite hot to build up to it. The thing is when that has happened to me in the past it has been at most about 5 dates. Desire is a two way street and the other person can crack before I do! For it to build up and the other person is still able to hold off tells me that she might not be as into it as I am....or have important reasons why she can't (body image, other suitors she is saving herself for...)

 

I consider myself a gentleman, but gentlemen can be taken advantage of and I am definitely nobodies orbiter. Been there, done that, never again. Gonna let her make the running from here while I reluctantly meet others.

[fred123]

think its really hard when both of you live with your parents. id give it 2 months tops and then ask her about it. if you haven't slept by 8 dates then id be worrying but its harder given your logistics

[some_username1]

think its really hard when both of you live with your parents. id give it 2 months tops and then ask her about it. if you haven't slept by 8 dates then id be worrying but its harder given your logistics

 

Oh, she lives at home, I live with a couple of room-mates

[act00]

It seems you are putting too much emphasis on her attire as a gauge to her attraction to you. You don't take her any place that warrants dressing up, and this seems to be her preferred style of dress and comfort. If you want a girl who wears dresses more often than not, then you need to find another girl. I find it hard to believe she has made no effort to look nice when you go out, even if her style is more casual. Your dates have been casual.

 

Life with roommates. Did it for years. Boyfriends and girlfriends spent the night and dates came over. Outside of strict roommate rule situations (no house guests), I don't see why you can't invite her over for a nice meal, a movie, and unless you share a room with someone, a sleepover. It's not ideal, but your place is the best of two choices. You're not in the best financial spot, so a hotel is probably not something you can do, but if you can make arrangements to have the living room free for an evening, and/or if she's comfortable with it, retire for a movie in your room, you can have some more privacy and save some money, and hopefully get some sex.

 

Your idea is "try before you buy," and that's simply not going to fly with a lot of women. If she wants exclusivity before she jumps into bed with someone, it's because she's avoiding this dump and run, which could happen anyway, but at least there was an attempt at real commitment. You're simply letting yourself off the hook if that first time turns out to be less ideal than you built up in your head, and you can simply walk away with the thought of, "We weren't a couple anyway, so it's okay." It's not okay. Either you want her as your one and only or not. She seems to want monogamy, as do you, so make a choice. There are no guarantees, and if it turns out you're not sexually compatible, you'll end up breaking up anyway, but if you really like this girl, make it happen. Have a discussion on where you are as far as sex and monogamy. If your goal is to take her for a test run while you date other women (test run them too?), you'll probably never get in her pants.

[some_username1]

It seems you are putting too much emphasis on her attire as a gauge to her attraction to you. You don't take her any place that warrants dressing up, and this seems to be her preferred style of dress and comfort. If you want a girl who wears dresses more often than not, then you need to find another girl. I find it hard to believe she has made no effort to look nice when you go out, even if her style is more casual. Your dates have been casual.

 

Life with roommates. Did it for years. Boyfriends and girlfriends spent the night and dates came over. Outside of strict roommate rule situations (no house guests), I don't see why you can't invite her over for a nice meal, a movie, and unless you share a room with someone, a sleepover. It's not ideal, but your place is the best of two choices. You're not in the best financial spot, so a hotel is probably not something you can do, but if you can make arrangements to have the living room free for an evening, and/or if she's comfortable with it, retire for a movie in your room, you can have some more privacy and save some money, and hopefully get some sex.

 

Your idea is "try before you buy," and that's simply not going to fly with a lot of women. If she wants exclusivity before she jumps into bed with someone, it's because she's avoiding this dump and run, which could happen anyway, but at least there was an attempt at real commitment. You're simply letting yourself off the hook if that first time turns out to be less ideal than you built up in your head, and you can simply walk away with the thought of, "We weren't a couple anyway, so it's okay." It's not okay. Either you want her as your one and only or not. She seems to want monogamy, as do you, so make a choice. There are no guarantees, and if it turns out you're not sexually compatible, you'll end up breaking up anyway, but if you really like this girl, make it happen. Have a discussion on where you are as far as sex and monogamy. If your goal is to take her for a test run while you date other women (test run them too?), you'll probably never get in her pants.

 

No disrespect to you as I know you mean well by the overall message of your post, but the whole idea of a girl who is known to be active on Tinder being in a position to demand monogamy before sex is hilarious. Come on guys, form an orderly queue to gf up this chaste and pure multi-dater! For all we know she could be having sex right now while I play the role of the gentleman and wait for crumbs off the table.

 

To be honest, I have gone right off her now. I went on the date with the other girl (date 3) and she pulled out all the stops to make a great date and show how interested she is in me. It did end in sex and I feel much more attached to her as a result. Dating is so effortless with this girl, she tells me she isn't on Tinder and it looks like she isn't, it is such a contrast with the uncertainty that I feel with the girl in the OP. It is just a shame that I had instant 'spark' and 'chemistry' with the girl in the OP which I have pretty much never had before and her words made me feel like she felt the same way. But why would a girl who says those things still be on Tinder? I don't need girls who fake propriety and the girl I just recently dated deserves more respect than to be kept on the sidelines in favour of a girl who makes things so complicated.

 

As a sad addendum to this tale the girl in the OP mentioned me helping her out with moving some stuff out of her old house share. I had to laugh at that, how many times have we seen this on loveshack? She should be asking her boyfriend to help- until we have sex I am certainly not her boyfriend and won't be getting involved. She can maybe get on Tinder and find someone to do that for her.

[phineas]

Anywhere from 30 mins. after they pulled into my driveway for the first date and first time meeting them to 3 dates.

After 3 dates it never happened.

they either dangled that sex carrot or ghosted.

[sadpanda3]

No disrespect to you as I know you mean well by the overall message of your post, but the whole idea of a girl who is known to be active on Tinder being in a position to demand monogamy before sex is hilarious. Come on guys, form an orderly queue to gf up this chaste and pure multi-dater! For all we know she could be having sex right now while I play the role of the gentleman and wait for crumbs off the table.

 

To be honest, I have gone right off her now. I went on the date with the other girl (date 3) and she pulled out all the stops to make a great date and show how interested she is in me. It did end in sex and I feel much more attached to her as a result.

 

Good for you it worked out for you with the other girl. If you value easy sex a lot you probably took the right decision.

 

I do think however you are being a bit unfair towards the first girl. I am a multidater and I do expect monogamy before I sleep with someone. That you find this idea hilarious makes me a bit sad. Just because she's still using Tinder doesn't mean she's sleeping with other guys or has any less right to demand exclusivity before sleeping with you...

 

You obviously feel entitled to have sex without committment....which TBH isn't very gentlemanly.

[phineas]

No disrespect to you as I know you mean well by the overall message of your post, but the whole idea of a girl who is known to be active on Tinder being in a position to demand monogamy before sex is hilarious. Come on guys, form an orderly queue to gf up this chaste and pure multi-dater! For all we know she could be having sex right now while I play the role of the gentleman and wait for crumbs off the table.

 

To be honest, I have gone right off her now. I went on the date with the other girl (date 3) and she pulled out all the stops to make a great date and show how interested she is in me. It did end in sex and I feel much more attached to her as a result. Dating is so effortless with this girl, she tells me she isn't on Tinder and it looks like she isn't, it is such a contrast with the uncertainty that I feel with the girl in the OP. It is just a shame that I had instant 'spark' and 'chemistry' with the girl in the OP which I have pretty much never had before and her words made me feel like she felt the same way. But why would a girl who says those things still be on Tinder? I don't need girls who fake propriety and the girl I just recently dated deserves more respect than to be kept on the sidelines in favour of a girl who makes things so complicated.

 

As a sad addendum to this tale the girl in the OP mentioned me helping her out with moving some stuff out of her old house share. I had to laugh at that, how many times have we seen this on loveshack? She should be asking her boyfriend to help- until we have sex I am certainly not her boyfriend and won't be getting involved. She can maybe get on Tinder and find someone to do that for her.

 

Good for you.

If a woman is not wanting to sleep with you by the 3rd date then it's time to cut them lose and find a woman who likes you and is attracted to you.

If after 3 dates she is STILL on tinder (after saying she wasn't) then you are mr right now while she continues to search for mr right.

 

What man wants to be that guy?

I sure don't.

Edited July 16, 2017 by phineas

[healing light]

I used to be a part of another Mars Venus dating board where the principles were based off of John Gray, the famous author and marital therapist of 30+ years. His guidelines were established based on his personal experience of what he saw made couples value each other and more successful long-term.

 

Most of the women on those boards were encouraged to multi-date without sleeping together so they could be objective about what a man was bringing to the table (as the oxytocin released can bond a woman quickly to someone who may not be healthy for her), and to wait for sex until after exclusivity is established by the man.

 

I know many other women who feel the same without having read those books, and personally I think they're sound guidelines for a solid foundation. So realize it's entirely possible that this woman is not stringing you along and may be waiting for a clear indication from you that you would like to be exclusive precisely because she does want a potential long-term relationship with you. Not everyone hops into bed right away despite popular cultural narratives to the contrary.

Edited July 16, 2017 by healing light