relli Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Greetings everyone, first time poster here. So I was in the best relationship of my life for the past nearly 8 months. I have been in relationships that lasted 3-4 years and I never felt ANYTHING like I did for this woman. We met on an online dating site and our first date was incredible - never have I been so immediately drawn to someone. We were the same exact person, but trapped in the other gender's body. We loved the same things, enjoyed traveling together, and were generally inseparable. To put things in perspective, I am a 31 year old college professor in biology and she is a 30 year old director of nursing with two boys who will be 2 and 5 in September. Things were going absolutely flawlessly. We never fought once, always seemed to be thinking the same exact things (on her first visit to my house I had her pick a movie from my collection of over 200 DVDs to watch and jokingly said 'I bet I can pick which DVD you chose -- and I did) and genuinely loved eachother. I knew she was the one. So much so that 2 weeks after we started dating I went to the bank and opened up a separate savings account to start funneling $900 a month from my paychecks into to save up for a trip to Bora Bora. I found out during our first week of dating that it was her dream destination and I told myself that if these feelings were still there a year later then I would take her there and propose. Anyways, 2 days after Valentine's day I noticed that her texts had slowed down and I received a text in which she indicated that she was unsure of her feelings and was not sure she could be in a relationship. She kept alluding to the fact that it wasn't fair to me to be with someone who was not sure of her feelings. I was distraught and I didn't contact her for a week but then decided as one last ditch effort, I would write her a handwritten letter. Well, that letter ended up being 15 pages long and it outlined all of the great things about us, the memories we shared and what I had hoped for the future - including things like moving in, getting married, having kids, revealing the whole Bora Bora trip etc. She texted back later that it was the most romantic thing she's ever read and she really appreciated it. I thought 'well, that's that' and I was ready to throw in the towel. A few hours later she showed up at my door with a stack of letters for me to open at different times. The first letter stated her reasoning for distancing herself. She said she was scared because she has never had someone show so much love for her and it was almost overwhleming at times so instead of returning that love, she pushed it away because she was afraid she couldn't give me what I deserve. She said she no longer had that doubt and that she would be crazy to throw this all all away and that she wanted me forever. We immediately reconciled and I was probably the happiest I had ever been in my life. This was at the end of February. Shortly thereafter, she gave me a key to her apartment (I spent way more time at her place than mine) and things were back to normal. We had this amazing little nuclear family thing going on (I love her two boys to death) and all was well with the world. We had talked about moving in and I assured her that once the semester ended and I had figured out my teaching assignment for the Fall that we could discuss it. I worried, however, that the same situation might happen again sometime so I was hesitant to move forward. The whole time we talked about having kids, what kind of house we'd want to build etc. Then in mid-May I went to a friend's place on a Saturday night to do a beer share and she decided to go out with a group of friends to celebrate someone's birthday. Earlier that day, she and I had just booked a summer vacation to VA beach with her kids and I paid for it as a Mother's Day gift to her. Her last text to me was "I am going to turn off my phone. I love you and I will talk to you tomorrow". Tomorrow came and I didn't get a response until much later in the day. She admitted to drinking to much and kissing another guy. I was heartbroken but then she broke it off again. Stating that she had rebuilt those emotional walls back up. It has been over a month now. At first I texted her long, flowery texts about how much I loved her and how perfect things were when we were together but I was getting simple, non-emotional texts back. I slowed down my contact with her and two nights ago asked to meet to talk so I could get some answers that have been plaguing me this entire time. She cried when admitting that she still thinks about me every day and she does at times regret her decision. She told me that her kids always ask if I am coming over and she never told them about the breakup - just that I was 'busy with work' or 'studying'. She also said that she is just as unsure as she was a month ago when she ended things. She said when the boys aren't here the house is quiet and she hates it and she misses having someone to wake up next to. We had a really long, emotional and good talk and it seemed to leave the door open. At this time there is nothing else in the world that I want then to be with her and her two kids forever. I am just so lost and I do not know what to do. Everyone keeps telling me I need to move on but I don't think I can. Am I stupid to be optimistic here? My apologies for the long post but I can assure you that this is the much abbreviated version of our story Thank you for any help or advice that you'd be willing to give!
Zahara Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Yes, you should move on. Someone that is indecisive this way, and turns to destructive behavior (kissing another guy) has attachment issues. She's likely avoidant and can't attach/love in a healthy manner. Chances are even if you got back together with her, there will be repeated behavior. Also, when someone is telling you that they aren't sure about you, ends with you twice, gets physical with another guy while in the relationship with you, don't reward that behavior with declarations of love. Walk away. 2
SevenCity Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Yes, you should move on. Someone that is indecisive this way, and turns to destructive behavior (kissing another guy) has attachment issues. She's likely avoidant and can't attach/love in a healthy manner. Chances are even if you got back together with her, there will be repeated behavior. Also, when someone is telling you that they aren't sure about you, ends with you twice, gets physical with another guy while in the relationship with you, don't reward that behavior with declarations of love. Walk away. Agreed 100%. It's tough because you never connected like this with someone. And you may never again. But, this will be a continued source of pain that will not cease until you let it go. 2
vickyp Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 but she disrespected you. What is there to think about? To say you may never have this connection with anyone else is just your emotions speaking. There are so many women out in there world, why settle for second best. Don't you deserve the best?
GOB Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 (edited) I know EXACTLY how you feel, literally the same scenario, dated a girl for about 4 months and all was great, no arguments, she's always admitted to struggling to show emotions and isn't a lovey dovey person but neither am I, apart from the occasional bit of it in bed. She ended it after a weekend away saying she wasn't happy, I agreed, let her go and left her to it. Two weeks after that she sent me a long message saying she had made a mistake and that she did want to be with me, just freaked out that she suddenly found herself in another relationship and didn't want it to become like her last one, frank discussions and me making sure she was making the right decision we almost instantly got over it and carried on as normal. Fast forward 5 months, she had a distant weekend and after I checked she was okay, she said she was stressing over an op she has coming up and wants to deal with it alone and I said that's okay, I'm here if you need me. Two days later she ended it again, saying we are too different. Without thread hijacking, what can we do? Absolutely nothing, maybe we aren't the right people for them. Maybe we met them at the wrong time and they have issues they need to deal with. Our only option is to move on, even if they come back once again, are they going to leave at any sign of doubt or trouble in there life? I love her but not worth the hassle. Edited June 22, 2017 by GOB
Been Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Ask yourself how many times do you want her to dump you. Then ask yourself even if you did get back together a THIRD time how's that gonna work out?You would be waiting for her to dump you AGAIN so this would cause you to be walking on egg shells the whole time and WORSE your telling her your OK with being option B. 2
Spartakooty Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Totally relate to this. Full on then stop, full on then stop. You might want to check yourself as to why you give so much effort and energy, you sound a bit hopelessly optimistic and smothering (believe me, I can relate to that too). I just went through a year with someone who was avoidant and a commitaphobe...at least it appears that way. Questioning so much, hot n cold lots of unfulfilled promises etc. No making out with another guy or anything, I hope. That is a big red flag. We broke up twice...last one seems final. I think some people simply don't feel they deserve the kind of attention we like to give. Or they LOVE the up and down drama of breaking up and getting back together; has an addictive quality. Move on. It ain't gonna get better....at least not now. 1
preraph Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 I honestly just think she maybe had her fill of domestic bliss with her kids' father and just isn't sure she wants to go "all in" again. Also, and this is just one possibility but by no means am I sure of it -- Sometimes familiarity kills romance. She may be so much like you and so comfortable with you that it has begun to feel more familial than romantic, like you know the person too well to be excited about it or they start to seem like a brother or whatever. That is some sort of intimacy issue -- and I bring it up because I am a bit that way myself. If it's so comfortable and effortless that there is no sexual tension or personality tension too, to me, that is more a friend vibe. It's just something that's possible, but I am projecting into it and it may not be anything like that. Thing is, she's not ready for commitment. In a practical sense , she is probably making a mistake, but if she really needs her freedom right now more than she needs a mate, then that's just how it is. If I were you, I'd go date other people and maybe only keep up with her loosely, not let her lean on your emotionally at all, not let her tell you about her new men, not let her hardly in but just keep her at arm's length, you know, maybe 3 times a year, a text to see how she's doing. Then let her explore or settle into whatever she's seeking and maybe take her temperature in two or so years to see if she's leaning in another direction and ready for commitment or not. But if you stay right up under her, you will only solidify a "friends only" relationship, so don't give her that. 1
Author relli Posted June 22, 2017 Author Posted June 22, 2017 Thanks all for the replies. I am slowly working to convince myself that my best option is to move on. The one hold up I have is that it seems like a lot of her issues are due to the fact that she was with a toxic guy who she had two kids with. Their relationship started off all well and good but she got pregnant and he wanted to have an abortion while she didn't. They worked through things and stayed together for the child and when he was born things got better for awhile before going downhill. He made significantly more money than her and she felt like they argued about money all the time. She said that he made her and her kids constantly feel like a drain on his money. They separated for awhile, got back together and she got pregnant again and the problems repeated. She ended things with him in April of 2016 and met me in September of 2016. I made it a point in our relationship to show her that I was nothing like him and whenever I could I made sure to take care of groceries, bar tabs, dinner bills, etc. I guess my question is can most of her issues be chalked up to feelings of worthlessness brought about by her ****ty ex and that unfortunately carried over into our relationship? If that is the case, wouldn't walking away in this situation be the wrong thing to do (i.e. another man giving up on her)? I really do appreciate all of the helpful advice!
Author relli Posted June 22, 2017 Author Posted June 22, 2017 (edited) Totally relate to this. Full on then stop, full on then stop. You might want to check yourself as to why you give so much effort and energy, you sound a bit hopelessly optimistic and smothering (believe me, I can relate to that too). I just went through a year with someone who was avoidant and a commitaphobe...at least it appears that way. Questioning so much, hot n cold lots of unfulfilled promises etc. No making out with another guy or anything, I hope. That is a big red flag. We broke up twice...last one seems final. I think some people simply don't feel they deserve the kind of attention we like to give. Or they LOVE the up and down drama of breaking up and getting back together; has an addictive quality. Move on. It ain't gonna get better....at least not now. I am most certainly a hopeless romantic and an overly optimistic person in general. I am beginning to hate the fact that I went to her house and had this great discussion that seemed to open up the door Edited June 22, 2017 by relli Grammar
ExpatInItaly Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 You would be wise to stay far, far away from her. She runs when intimacy increases. She cheats. She runs again. There won't be a happy ending here. For what it's worth, I think you two moved very fast, especially considering she has kids. It's not wise to go making grand future plans when you still are learning about the person. You need to give them time and space to let them show you who they really are and how they function (or don't function) in a relationship. Talking vacations and homes and blending families and marriage all in under 8 months provides a false sense of security, because you're not basing it on a truly solid foundation. 1
GOB Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Do you feel like she would shut you out whenever she had some stress in her life? Did you argue? Did she do everything but show signs of her considering breaking up with you? Two weeks before I was dumped I was with my ex and her friend and she was saying how they had been discussing why we were so good together.... two weeks later, no arguments, just stress and me wanting to be there for her, she was gone. Like you I'm really trying to see why a seemingly great relationship went wrong. Maybe they just weren't feeling it and were confused. Even her friends and mom can't give me answers. I find it difficult but I think we need to just ignore it, try not over analyse and move on.
Zahara Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 I guess my question is can most of her issues be chalked up to feelings of worthlessness brought about by her ****ty ex and that unfortunately carried over into our relationship? If that is the case, wouldn't walking away in this situation be the wrong thing to do (i.e. another man giving up on her)? Her dysfunction is not your responsibility. You can't "love" someone out of their issues. Being a knight in shining armor is not what she needs. She has to have enough self-awareness and reflection that she has problems and embrace that by seeking help to undo her past abuse. Aside from that, you aren't walking away. She has told you that she can't and does not want to invest in you. You also have to ask yourself why you think you are tolerant of someone cheating on you. What does that say about you? "Issues" -- not an excuse to cheat. 3
preraph Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 A mature experienced woman like this one had little idealism left in her, so telling her you're not like that doesn't really work, because what happens is she was in that marriage, probably felt trapped for at least part of that time and was miserable and oppressed. And then she got out and I'm telling you, it can be like you just learned to breathe again -- and some women (men too) will choose not to reenter a relationship where you have to account for you time, keep tabs, compromise, etc. Sometimes it's easier being single. But in time she may feel up to giving it a go again, but you never know. 1
komorebin Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 None of us in here know the exact situation and we could be wrong and misinterpret the story, but as a woman, my first impression from reading this is that she is insecure within herself and her ability to love you as deeply as you seem to love her. It seems like you both have an amazing connection and you're coming on extremely strong. As she mentioned, she's not used to being given this kind of love in such quantity, especially in the short amount of time that you've known each other. "We accept the love we think we deserve". Maybe she subconsciously doesn't believe that she deserves your love and is self-sabotaging without even realizing it. As a woman, I can definitely relate to her reasoning for breaking up with you. Do I think she should have? No. Do I think she wants to? No. Would I have done differently? We'd all like to say yes, but probably not. I think she does love you. That all being said, it was wrong for her to go out and kiss a guy. Being drunk is no excuse. Hypothetically, if it were me, I'd want the guy to fight for me and show me that this is what I deserve. On the other hand, sometimes it's better to work on yourself(her) before getting into a relationship to avoid these messy events. It's definitely not fair to put you in this position. Ultimately, the decision is up to you. Are you willing to forgive her? Are you willing to work through her insecurities and the relationship? PROS of letting her go: -You don't have to deal with possibility of her breaking up with you and kissing other guys again CONS of letting her go: -She could be "the one" -You may never find a connection like this again
Spartakooty Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Thanks all for the replies. I am slowly working to convince myself that my best option is to move on. The one hold up I have is that it seems like a lot of her issues are due to the fact that she was with a toxic guy who she had two kids with. Their relationship started off all well and good but she got pregnant and he wanted to have an abortion while she didn't. They worked through things and stayed together for the child and when he was born things got better for awhile before going downhill. He made significantly more money than her and she felt like they argued about money all the time. She said that he made her and her kids constantly feel like a drain on his money. They separated for awhile, got back together and she got pregnant again and the problems repeated. She ended things with him in April of 2016 and met me in September of 2016. I made it a point in our relationship to show her that I was nothing like him and whenever I could I made sure to take care of groceries, bar tabs, dinner bills, etc. I guess my question is can most of her issues be chalked up to feelings of worthlessness brought about by her ****ty ex and that unfortunately carried over into our relationship? If that is the case, wouldn't walking away in this situation be the wrong thing to do (i.e. another man giving up on her)? I really do appreciate all of the helpful advice! At the end of the day, if we have to instill in another that we are nothing like that other person then she has more work to do on herself. If she naturally compares you to him that is. We should not even have to worry about it ideally. Her sense of self-worth would likely have started before him and just exacerbated by him. Plus the time between him and you wasn't that long at all. Can't see this working out.
komorebin Posted June 22, 2017 Posted June 22, 2017 Her sense of self-worth would likely have started before him and just exacerbated by him. Plus the time between him and you wasn't that long at all. Can't see this working out. While some of what you say is true, I disagree about it not working out. There's definitely a possibility that it could. She's insecure and does need some working on but it's up to him to decide if he wants to work together with her on that as a couple or let her do it on her own. 1
Author relli Posted June 22, 2017 Author Posted June 22, 2017 None of us in here know the exact situation and we could be wrong and misinterpret the story, but as a woman, my first impression from reading this is that she is insecure within herself and her ability to love you as deeply as you seem to love her. It seems like you both have an amazing connection and you're coming on extremely strong. As she mentioned, she's not used to being given this kind of love in such quantity, especially in the short amount of time that you've known each other. "We accept the love we think we deserve". Maybe she subconsciously doesn't believe that she deserves your love and is self-sabotaging without even realizing it. As a woman, I can definitely relate to her reasoning for breaking up with you. Do I think she should have? No. Do I think she wants to? No. Would I have done differently? We'd all like to say yes, but probably not. I think she does love you. That all being said, it was wrong for her to go out and kiss a guy. Being drunk is no excuse. Hypothetically, if it were me, I'd want the guy to fight for me and show me that this is what I deserve. On the other hand, sometimes it's better to work on yourself(her) before getting into a relationship to avoid these messy events. It's definitely not fair to put you in this position. Ultimately, the decision is up to you. Are you willing to forgive her? Are you willing to work through her insecurities and the relationship? PROS of letting her go: -You don't have to deal with possibility of her breaking up with you and kissing other guys again CONS of letting her go: -She could be "the one" -You may never find a connection like this again So because my story is definitely abbreviated I think some people do harbor a few misconceptions here, but the advice is all valid. I do admit that perhaps things were moving a little quickly here, but she was the one who was suggesting we move in, gave me a key to her apt, etc. I simply read the signs I was given and expanded upon. I am well aware at my age that that coming on too strong can freak someone out haha. From what she wrote in her first round of letters to me, I think your first three paragraphs summarized them perfectly and she has admitted to me that the first time she broke things off it was all about her self-sabotaging the situation. She said she got scared that something would go wrong down the line or that she wouldn't be capable of putting out the same amount of love that I could and therefore decided to nip in in the bud to prevent possible future heartache. She has this idea that love always have to be equal. One partner has to love the other partner just as much all of the time in order for the relationship to work. If there is any inequality, then the relationship is not going to work in her mind. I wonder what you guys may think about this? I am very much stuck because I do have that "shining knight" mentality who wants to show her that, no matter what, I am here for her and her kids, always. But then again, that might just push her further away. So I have stopped contact and decided to let the cards fall where they may. She knows my intentions and feelings there is not much more I can say or do. p.s. trust me, I hate the fact that she kissed another guy. It is not right and I didn't deserve that. But, my relationship with her is more important than a mistake that she immediately owned up to without having asked her anything about it first.
Author relli Posted June 22, 2017 Author Posted June 22, 2017 Do you feel like she would shut you out whenever she had some stress in her life? Did you argue? Did she do everything but show signs of her considering breaking up with you? Two weeks before I was dumped I was with my ex and her friend and she was saying how they had been discussing why we were so good together.... two weeks later, no arguments, just stress and me wanting to be there for her, she was gone. Like you I'm really trying to see why a seemingly great relationship went wrong. Maybe they just weren't feeling it and were confused. Even her friends and mom can't give me answers. I find it difficult but I think we need to just ignore it, try not over analyse and move on. There was never any signs of stress about our relationship. Her work, sure. Issues with her kid's dad, sure. Never with us, we never fought or argued once in 8 months. The day before she ended things we were talking about whether or not she'd want a 3rd boy or a girl and we planned a trip to VA beach. This is probably one of the hardest things for me to comprehend. Why would you make vacations plans with me and then end things abruptly the next day? Wouldn't you say "hey, lets wait to book that trip another time." Very irrational and I can't wrap my head around it. A friend suggested that perhaps she did it in a panic because she immediately fessed up to kissing another guy and ended it in the next text. I have no idea. Trying my best not to think about things brother, I really am lol
preraph Posted June 23, 2017 Posted June 23, 2017 I think maybe jumping right back into a domestic situation gave her security at first but then she started getting used to the idea of not being tied down. Well, I'm sorry it's going that way. I hope things start looking up at some point.
Spartakooty Posted June 23, 2017 Posted June 23, 2017 There was never any signs of stress about our relationship. Her work, sure. Issues with her kid's dad, sure. Never with us, we never fought or argued once in 8 months. The day before she ended things we were talking about whether or not she'd want a 3rd boy or a girl and we planned a trip to VA beach. This is probably one of the hardest things for me to comprehend. Why would you make vacations plans with me and then end things abruptly the next day? Wouldn't you say "hey, lets wait to book that trip another time." Very irrational and I can't wrap my head around it. A friend suggested that perhaps she did it in a panic because she immediately fessed up to kissing another guy and ended it in the next text. I have no idea. Trying my best not to think about things brother, I really am lol Here's a thought. One of the issues my ex had with me is that she didn't see any passion in me. Despite the fact I'm a passionate lover (please avoid visual) a passionate musician and passionate about my friends and family and relatively passionate about my job. I didn't understand what she meant and didn't know what else she wanted. Should i have been passionate about eggplants??? Yes I'm going somewhere with this.. The fact that you two never argued may play into this, because we didn't either unless there was something wrong with the relationship. I'm happy and easy going (usually) and have no problem going with her flow. She was a vegetarian and I'm not. Meant we ate at certain places or what was better for her or her son. I was even entertaining a more veggie lifestyle. With family heart disease rampant I didn't really see a down side. My point is this, while I wasn't a door mat, I didn't exactly put up a fight against anything she wanted or for what I wanted. She certainly liked many aspects of me, but perhaps the lack of standing up for differences plays a role in how they perceive us. I dunno...just thinking out loud. Same with her, her main issues were job, kid, ex...not really me, apart from allegedly showing no passion...which seems like a bit of a cop out anyway. Are we too nice? Too available? Who the eff knows.
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