Why we cheat.

June 19, 2017

I know it's counter intitive for some.

But there is something desirable, something animalistic, something very "naughty" about that "empty" sex.

For me it was part of the appeal. I can make love to my husband, heck I can have raunchy sex with him too.

But it will never be some NSA, purely lust driven thing.

I understand this is by and large a "guy thing" - but it is a contributor as well.

Now this ^^^ makes sense to me. Cheating to have "raunchy/animalistic sex". Yup, that certainly seems like something I'd expect to get in an A. But woman after woman comes on here claiming (perhaps embarrassment?) that's not at all what they wanted or valued in the A. My W said the same thing, lining up totally with most of the other posts from WW's I see here.

But this seems like a "good" reason to cheat, because, end of the day, you're going to get what you want (assuming you find a good lover, of course). No lies, no faking it, no backstabbing. You'll get that romp in the hay, and it probably will be great because of the forbidden/taboo aspect of it. If this was the primary reason women cheated, I'd never have started this thread; but, most claim it's "not that", even those who have little/no reason to lie about it (WW's on here, for example).

June 20, 2017

Yeah I know I am the outlier.

You know what the jagged pill to swallow is?

All those things these "married women" want can be found in a good marriage.

I unfortunately have a taste for something that simply can't exist within the confines of monogamy.

And there are a number of guys in the same boat..

June 20, 2017

Yeah I know I am the outlier.

You know what the jagged pill to swallow is?

All those things these "married women" want can be found in a good marriage.

I unfortunately have a taste for something that simply can't exist within the confines of monogamy.

And there are a number of guys in the same boat..

At least you've come to terms with who you are. And yes, most men, myself included, are very happy to trade compliments for sex. My big mistake in my marriage was thinking that compliments weren't as important as actions. I rarely used the words, I tried to show how I felt through my behavior and what I did. But my W was desperate for the words. Enter a smooth talker.. And almost 700 posts on LS later, here we are.

It's sad, I think to myself, if only we'd identified it earlier. The actions were much harder for me than the words, I knew/know how to say nice things to women, I'd done it for years when I met my W to hook up/NSA sex. I didn't think that was "necessary" anymore in a marriage, I thought the actions were more important. What I've learned.. Both are important. Because different people need different things from a relationship.

June 20, 2017

At least you've come to terms with who you are. And yes, most men, myself included, are very happy to trade compliments for sex. My big mistake in my marriage was thinking that compliments weren't as important as actions. I rarely used the words, I tried to show how I felt through my behavior and what I did. But my W was desperate for the words. Enter a smooth talker.. And almost 700 posts on LS later, here we are.

It's sad, I think to myself, if only we'd identified it earlier. The actions were much harder for me than the words, I knew/know how to say nice things to women, I'd done it for years when I met my W to hook up/NSA sex. I didn't think that was "necessary" anymore in a marriage, I thought the actions were more important. What I've learned.. Both are important. Because different people need different things from a relationship.

I can identify with this. I was less than ideal as a husband, which was ultimately why I allowed my wife turned ex wife turned wife back into my life. Were I one of these "good guys" I couldn't imagine a second chance, I'm not a very forgiving man, maybe my biggest flaw.

I allowed my wife to believe she wasn't important to me, I thought my actions were enough I didn't say in words what she meant. The problem with actions is when they are family based how does that make your woman feel special? When I hide problems thinking I'm protecting her how does that make her feel included? When I attack issues alone without her opinion, how does that make her feel valued? My action were out of love, but they made her feel less than. Who knew?

June 20, 2017

Now this ^^^ makes sense to me. Cheating to have "raunchy/animalistic sex". Yup, that certainly seems like something I'd expect to get in an A. But woman after woman comes on here claiming (perhaps embarrassment?) that's not at all what they wanted or valued in the A. My W said the same thing, lining up totally with most of the other posts from WW's I see here.

But this seems like a "good" reason to cheat, because, end of the day, you're going to get what you want (assuming you find a good lover, of course). No lies, no faking it, no backstabbing. You'll get that romp in the hay, and it probably will be great because of the forbidden/taboo aspect of it. If this was the primary reason women cheated, I'd never have started this thread; but, most claim it's "not that", even those who have little/no reason to lie about it (WW's on here, for example).

I can adamantly say I did not cheat to have raunchy/animalistic sex. HOWEVER, I did very much enjoy the raunchy/animalistic sex I had in the affair.

I would have never been able to "rationalize" having the affair in my mind if I did not have feelings...without thinking I was in love. I'm sure that is deep-rooted in how I was raised or something. But for some reason or another, it was only "love" that made the affair somewhat acceptable in my head. I knew it was still wrong, but it was the least wrong of all possible reasons. For me.

I don't know what feelings come first...which steps are taken in what order. But all those lines were crossed, one at a time. By the time I had sex with him, I was certainly falling in love with him. In my mind.

That unlocked the door for me to enjoy sex in a way that I hadn't in years. I've discussed this in other threads. My marriage had serious sexual problems. I was full throttle with the AP.

However, any time it felt like sex without a "relationship", I felt yucky. I even tried that on purpose. I tried disconnecting my feelings. As time went on, we were off and on, so there wasn't as much emotional connection. I could have sex, but it never made me feel very good after the fact. I am not cut out for NSA sex, apparently.

I do really like hot sex though. A lot. I like it inside a relationship where I feel desired, safe, and loved. Ironically.

I should be able to have that in my marriage, but even before the affair, my H and I had so much baggage, that we struggled with just letting go and having that easy, lusty, hot sex.

June 20, 2017

Now this ^^^ makes sense to me. Cheating to have "raunchy/animalistic sex". Yup, that certainly seems like something I'd expect to get in an A. But woman after woman comes on here claiming (perhaps embarrassment?) that's not at all what they wanted or valued in the A. My W said the same thing, lining up totally with most of the other posts from WW's I see here.

But this seems like a "good" reason to cheat, because, end of the day, you're going to get what you want (assuming you find a good lover, of course). No lies, no faking it, no backstabbing. You'll get that romp in the hay, and it probably will be great because of the forbidden/taboo aspect of it. If this was the primary reason women cheated, I'd never have started this thread; but, most claim it's "not that", even those who have little/no reason to lie about it (WW's on here, for example).

Most women have grown up to think that love and sex are intertwined.

They give sex and get love in return.

"He loves me, I give him sex"

"He doesn't love me, but if I give him sex he WILL love me."

"He doesn't love me, so he is not getting sex from me."

Women who do separate love from sex are seen as "bad" women and there are enough derogatory terms for "that" kind of a woman always being thrown about.

So it is hardly surprising that most women like to stick to the social norms in order to present their best face, both to the wider world and to herself .

"I know it is wrong but I love him and he loves me", sounds a lot better to everyone including herself, than "I am only in it for the sex and couldn't care a damn whether he lives or dies otherwise."

Men can usually get away with "It was only a bit of fun", "She meant nothing", as that is "what men do", but women usually can't without a whole lot of flak being thrown at them. Serious judgements on their character are made and "What kind of women would do that?" is asked - the conclusion being, obviously a very "bad" one...

Better to think she is a naive, "romantic", needy, vulnerable person being duped by a predator, or she is simply a woman "in love", rather than to think she is a woman who is on the hunt for some good sex.

The sexual revolution has allowed women to embrace their sexuality to a point, but the old "judgements" still tend to persist.

June 20, 2017

Yeah I know I am the outlier.

You know what the jagged pill to swallow is?

All those things these "married women" want can be found in a good marriage.

I unfortunately have a taste for something that simply can't exist within the confines of monogamy.

And there are a number of guys in the same boat..

So long as you are honest with the people you get involved with and you are not going behind your spouse's back.

June 20, 2017

I can adamantly say I did not cheat to have raunchy/animalistic sex. HOWEVER, I did very much enjoy the raunchy/animalistic sex I had in the affair.

I would have never been able to "rationalize" having the affair in my mind if I did not have feelings...without thinking I was in love. I'm sure that is deep-rooted in how I was raised or something. But for some reason or another, it was only "love" that made the affair somewhat acceptable in my head. I knew it was still wrong, but it was the least wrong of all possible reasons. For me.

I don't know what feelings come first...which steps are taken in what order. But all those lines were crossed, one at a time. By the time I had sex with him, I was certainly falling in love with him. In my mind.

That unlocked the door for me to enjoy sex in a way that I hadn't in years. I've discussed this in other threads. My marriage had serious sexual problems. I was full throttle with the AP.

However, any time it felt like sex without a "relationship", I felt yucky. I even tried that on purpose. I tried disconnecting my feelings. As time went on, we were off and on, so there wasn't as much emotional connection. I could have sex, but it never made me feel very good after the fact. I am not cut out for NSA sex, apparently.

I do really like hot sex though. A lot. I like it inside a relationship where I feel desired, safe, and loved. Ironically.

I should be able to have that in my marriage, but even before the affair, my H and I had so much baggage, that we struggled with just letting go and having that easy, lusty, hot sex.

This was very insightful and gave me an "aha" moment. I've always thought that our greatest talents for lying were when we lie to ourselves. I think that we craft whatever argument/justifications will best fit our own individual psyche. For some, it's just sex with no feelings - because to them not attaching feelings makes it less bad. For others, they MUST have feelings because if they are in love it's not as bad. I think we create whatever scenario will best keep our conscience at bay.

That is also why wayward spouses tend to blame their partners. If I cheat because I was bored or frustrated that makes me pretty awful. But if I was the poor neglected and unappreciated wife or the poor emasculated husband, then it's more sympathetic.

I can't remember what famous author it was who said all of us have a bit of sociopath in us, but i think it's true.

June 20, 2017

But I believe that most WW's truly believe there is a connection with MM/OM. I believe that as the relationship starts to develop there is an element of freedom with the married woman, she cares less about how she is veiwed because there is no future in the relationship. So they open up and share things that they hold back from her husband and the boyfriends before him for fear of judgement. That is why you hear things like he understands me like no other or it's a greater connection than I've ever had. All of this with a guy who likely doesn't know her middle name.

The next issue is tricking themselves into believing that it has to be something special, why else would they risk family life and more often Thier careers. In short women tend to to all in on affairs. This mental tricks make it difficult to re engage back into the marriges, and even more difficult to let go of the other guy. Oddly for most with some distance and focus they can move the n fairly quick. However what me see is women unwilling to admit the true nature and his true feelings/intentions. They continue to buy into the mind screwing they themselves created.

June 20, 2017

But I believe that most WW's truly believe there is a connection with MM/OM. I believe that as the relationship starts to develop there is an element of freedom with the married woman, she cares less about how she is veiwed because there is no future in the relationship. So they open up and share things that they hold back from her husband and the boyfriends before him for fear of judgement. That is why you hear things like he understands me like no other or it's a greater connection than I've ever had. All of this with a guy who likely doesn't know her middle name.

The next issue is tricking themselves into believing that it has to be something special, why else would they risk family life and more often Thier careers. In short women tend to to all in on affairs. This mental tricks make it difficult to re engage back into the marriges, and even more difficult to let go of the other guy. Oddly for most with some distance and focus they can move the n fairly quick. However what me see is women unwilling to admit the true nature and his true feelings/intentions. They continue to buy into the mind screwing they themselves created.

I can certainly understand that. It was one of the things that kept my W so engaged in her online As. She felt safe and accepted there no matter what. Never mind the fact that she was only presenting the best of herself. Her personal issues and delimas that she showed to the OMs were all about outside factors making her miserable (work, jerk husband, etc) and not any of the problems that she may have been the root of. In that false kind of relationship it's easy to gain sympathy as nothing was her fault and the OMs were certainly playing along to get what they wanted.

I'm not sure about how special it was to her though. Certainly the excitement and naughtiness and sneaking around behind my back or even on the couch next to me might have made the relationships feel special enough to keep going and keep risking every other part of her life for, but it's something I can't really understand at this point. What I found interesting was that my W has said she didn't really feel comfortable or happy with the texts, pictures, etc that she sent to the OMs, but she really liked how they reacted at receiving them. It kept their attention and validation for her sexual attractiveness up. She was willing to give them what they wanted so she could keep receiving what she wanted.

Maybe that's part of the big differences between affairs and marriages or relationships. At least with her affairs it was really an understanding of selfishness. She would give the OMs what they wanted and in return she would get what she wanted. If one side or the other stopped delivering the affair would probably be off. In a marriage or relationship there is certainly an expectation of reciprocation, but the motivations tend to be less self centered: I'm doing this for you because I know it makes you happy. The expectation is that in one way or another you will see that love or action returned, but the demand of expectation of an immediate return is not as pressing.

Who knows. Just idle thoughts at lunch.

June 20, 2017

But I believe that most WW's truly believe there is a connection with MM/OM. I believe that as the relationship starts to develop there is an element of freedom with the married woman, she cares less about how she is veiwed because there is no future in the relationship. So they open up and share things that they hold back from her husband and the boyfriends before him for fear of judgement. That is why you hear things like he understands me like no other or it's a greater connection than I've ever had. All of this with a guy who likely doesn't know her middle name.

The next issue is tricking themselves into believing that it has to be something special, why else would they risk family life and more often Thier careers. In short women tend to to all in on affairs. This mental tricks make it difficult to re engage back into the marriges, and even more difficult to let go of the other guy. Oddly for most with some distance and focus they can move the n fairly quick. However what me see is women unwilling to admit the true nature and his true feelings/intentions. They continue to buy into the mind screwing they themselves created.

I agree with this.

There is the initial feeling of being understood as the affair develops, maybe even before it turns physical. But once you are in the affair, the only person who can understand you is the AP. You are "bad" to your husband but not to the AP (in your mind, as a WW). So you're tied to the enemy in a sense.

The second part is also true, for women who tie love to sex, and need to justify having an affair by being in love, it literally MUST be special, otherwise you would never have done this at all. Many women do not consider themselves capable of having an affair. The men in their lives do not consider their wives capable of having an affair. If you are "capable" you are a slut or simply a bad person. So at least if you are "in love" or the relationship is extraordinarily "special", you must not be so terrible...right?

None of this happens in the conscious mind, and I'm not saying it's what the only thing driving women to feel love in affairs. But I am certain it's a factor.

June 21, 2017

Overtaxed,

I'm not too sure where journalists get their info from/who they interview when they write these articles?

Below are a list of reasons from married men as to why they cheated (according to what their wives told me)

"One woman will never be enough for me"

"It's not you it's me"

"It was a distraction until things got better at home"

"The guys at xyz said it was OK for me to have their wives now and again"

"I didn't get enough affection"

"I knew it was wrong but I didn't think I'd get found out"

Only one said they needed more "affection" and none said that it was for more sex ( or more exciting sex). In fact the women I know said that it was the husband who kept having "headaches". Go figure.

June 21, 2017

Men use sex for everything...if they're happy, they want sex...if they're upset, they want sex, after death, they want sex.

Sex can never make a man love a woman but if they love a woman they want to have sex with her. There are married couples that go without sex & even though the husband may love their wife, if it goes on too long they get to the point where they want to leave bc of lack of sex. So does that mean they never loved their wife?

So to say if a man wouldn't stay around if a OW wasn't having are with them, well most would do the same with their wives...& in cases like that the only reason not to jump to divorce usually involves finances & kids.

Also what this study fails to say...is most men that are cheaters for sex aren't really emotionally there for their wives either but often the BW shrugs that part off to other things. Not to mention, men like this aren't going to go around telling others they're crushed my their A ending (like a woman) men with emotional & ego issues aren't going to open up to so easily to others about what they're feeling.

June 21, 2017

Men use sex for everything...if they're happy, they want sex...if they're upset, they want sex, after death, they want sex.

Sex can never make a man love a woman but if they love a woman they want to have sex with her. There are married couples that go without sex & even though the husband may love their wife, if it goes on too long they get to the point where they want to leave bc of lack of sex. So does that mean they never loved their wife?

So to say if a man wouldn't stay around if a OW wasn't having are with them, well most would do the same with their wives...& in cases like that the only reason not to jump to divorce usually involves finances & kids.

Also what this study fails to say...is most men that are cheaters for sex aren't really emotionally there for their wives either but often the BW shrugs that part off to other things. Not to mention, men like this aren't going to go around telling others they're crushed my their A ending (like a woman) men with emotional & ego issues aren't going to open up to so easily to others about what they're feeling.

Just like studies that talk about how second marriages that start as affairs are more likely to end in divorce fail to point out that BY THEIR VERY NATURE started with a FIRST MARRIAGE that ended in divorce.

I also think we are neglecting to mention that, while many men may seek an affair initially for sex, that isn't necessarily what the affair always ends up meaning to them in its entirety. Which is pretty much their motivation AND outcome for relationships in general. They are looking for sex and sometimes they find more. The inherent lack of availability is really the only difference.

June 21, 2017

Just like studies that talk about how second marriages that start as affairs are more likely to end in divorce fail to point out that BY THEIR VERY NATURE started with a FIRST MARRIAGE that ended in divorce.

I also think we are neglecting to mention that, while many men may seek an affair initially for sex, that isn't necessarily what the affair always ends up meaning to them in its entirety. Which is pretty much their motivation AND outcome for relationships in general. They are looking for sex and sometimes they find more. The inherent lack of availability is really the only difference.

Also someone wins Powerball... doesn't mean you should bank your retirement on the chance.

Of course he will develop some kind of emotional connection, unless he is a sociopath.

We hear 98% of MW/OM claim they have found the golden unicorn, that this relationship is special that it's more then sex because they rarely have it.

I'm not sure where Whoknew was going with her post, but she brings up a very valid point. If MM is cheating for sex, maybe a lack of sex in his marriage, how on Earth does the MW/OW convince themselves the affair isn't about sex? If he is getting none in his marriage than once every month or so is an improvement. Love>logic

June 22, 2017

Overtaxed,

To go back to your original post about why people cheat;

Firstly I take all these statistics with a pinch of salt and secondly I wonder at the motivation for such a study?

If the idea is to find out why people cheat in order to stop them doing it, that's pants.

People cheat because they want to cheat. End of.

In the samples I quoted (I know it was a very small sample) only one could give a reason why they cheated. The others didn't really know.

June 22, 2017

In the samples I quoted (I know it was a very small sample) only one could give a reason why they cheated. The others didn't really know.

Ok but did they really not know or did they just not want to say the real reason why?

I guess many would not want to say, as it would throw a very bad light upon them, worse I guess than just the cheating itself.

June 22, 2017

elaine,

Ok but did they not really know or did they just not want to say the real reason why?

a good question to which I have no answer !

I suppose it would take a very brave and honest person to say " at the time, having sexual fun with another man/woman was more important to me than acting ethically"

And let's face it, cheaters aren't known for being either honest or brave

June 22, 2017

I think almost no one wants to cheat. They want something that they're missing, and cheating is the easiest, quickest way to get it. If they could get whatever it is another way, I'm sure they would do so without the risk of hurting their partner. Our social conventions (monogamy, fidelity, marriage, etc.) limit these options, so cheating is often the only readily available answer.

June 22, 2017

I think almost no one wants to cheat. They want something that they're missing, and cheating is the easiest, quickest way to get it. If they could get whatever it is another way, I'm sure they would do so without the risk of hurting their partner. Our social conventions (monogamy, fidelity, marriage, etc.) limit these options, so cheating is often the only readily available answer.

Nobody likes this answer but it's the most realistic one I've seen yet.

June 22, 2017

central,

I think almost no one wants to cheat. They want something that they're missing, and cheating is the easiest, quickest way to get it. If they could get whatever it is another way, I'm sure they would do so without the risk of hurting their partner. Our social conventions (monogamy, fidelity, marriage, etc.) limit these options, so cheating is often the only readily available answer

I could not agree less with most of your post which comes over as a being from a cheater apologist.

People on the whole don't do anything they don't want to do.

They want something that they're missing, and cheating is the easiest, quickest way to get it.

and that's because they are selfish, lazy, have poor coping skills and questionable ethics.

How about actually communicating their needs to the other party before slipping off to "fry their eggs in someone else's pan"?

Our social conventions (monogamy, fidelity, marriage, etc.) limit these options, so cheating is often the only readily available answer

If people think that these social conventions limit their options then they don't have to sign up for marriage/fidelity/monogamy. Nowadays there are so many variations in types of relationships open/bi/poly etc etc in fact a veritable smorgasbord of alternatives - "there's a lid for every pot" as they say......

We are discussing cheating here, not consensual non-monogamous relationships. Cheating is about diseases, betrayal, secrecy, and deception.

Blaming social conventions for peoples' poor choices is a cop-out and an attempt to absolve cheaters of personal responsibility.

Edited June 22, 2017 by Arieswoman

June 22, 2017

knabe #95

Nobody likes this answer but it's the most realistic one I've seen yet.

(My italics)

Really?

You really think societal constraints cause cheating?

There is a power dynamic inherent in infidelity. The cheater wants all the advantages of a committed partner, and also the excitement of messing around on the side. The secrecy is about gaining advantage for them.

If they said "So, how about you commit all your resources to this relationship and I’ll just pretend to do the same" just how far would they get with that one?.

Cheaters don’t want a level playing field, because it’s about control and entitlement. Cheaters give themselves permission to cheat, because they deem themselves more deserving than the silly people who play by the rules. (Rules the cheater signed up to, BTW )

June 22, 2017

central,

I could not agree less with most of your post which comes over as a being from a cheater apologist.

People on the whole don't do anything they don't want to do.

and that's because they are selfish, lazy, have poor coping skills and questionable ethics.
How about actually communicating their needs to the other party before slipping off to "fry their eggs in someone else's pan"?

If people think that these social conventions limit their options then they don't have to sign up for marriage/fidelity/monogamy. Nowadays there are so many variations in types of relationships open/bi/poly etc etc in fact a veritable smorgasbord of alternatives - "there's a lid for every pot" as they say......

We are discussing cheating here, not consensual non-monogamous relationships. Cheating is about diseases, betrayal, secrecy, and deception.

Blaming social conventions for peoples' poor choices is a cop-out and an attempt to absolve cheaters of personal responsibility.

well put. cheating is called that for a reason.

I don't know that there is a pat answer to why people cheat. Each person is different.

Some cheat or sex, some to fill a void in themselves, some because it's what they grew up seeing, some as a passive aggressive jab at their spouse, some because they are like little children sneaking around behind mom's back, some because they are looking for something, some cheat just because they can.

June 22, 2017

knabe #95

(My italics)

Really?

You really think societal constraints cause cheating?

There is a power dynamic inherent in infidelity. The cheater wants all the advantages of a committed partner, and also the excitement of messing around on the side. The secrecy is about gaining advantage for them.

If they said "So, how about you commit all your resources to this relationship and I’ll just pretend to do the same" just how far would they get with that one?.

Cheaters don’t want a level playing field, because it’s about control and entitlement. Cheaters give themselves permission to cheat, because they deem themselves more deserving than the silly people who play by the rules. (Rules the cheater signed up to, BTW )

I agree with both you and the quoted price to a degree. Maybe I'm niave but I don't think that most cheaters even think about the pain and damage, I believe that if they knew they wouldn't do it. Most...now some don't give a flip about anything outside of thier own personal happiness. What they want is always more important than what's best for the partner and family, see alot of that here.

Some simply should never be in committed relationships, also see alot of that here. I think many just love falling in love, and no matter the state of the relationship they will always seek out the new experience. Seen a few here.

This is an awesome thread with a lot of good/great comments and thoughts, however alot is dressing up a pig, cheater cheat because they are selfish and entitled, they believe they should and can do whatever makes them happy no matter how it impact anyone including Thier own kids. Like another poster said because they want too, and what they want will always be more important

June 22, 2017

central,

I could not agree less with most of your post which comes over as a being from a cheater apologist.

People on the whole don't do anything they don't want to do.

and that's because they are selfish, lazy, have poor coping skills and questionable ethics.
How about actually communicating their needs to the other party before slipping off to "fry their eggs in someone else's pan"?

If people think that these social conventions limit their options then they don't have to sign up for marriage/fidelity/monogamy. Nowadays there are so many variations in types of relationships open/bi/poly etc etc in fact a veritable smorgasbord of alternatives - "there's a lid for every pot" as they say......

We are discussing cheating here, not consensual non-monogamous relationships. Cheating is about diseases, betrayal, secrecy, and deception.

Blaming social conventions for peoples' poor choices is a cop-out and an attempt to absolve cheaters of personal responsibility.

This is typical of the thinking I read on the internet. The assumptions that no cheater has ever communicated needs, the idea that a bad marriage never makes one vulnerable, etc.

I DO agree that no one cheats unless they eveentually want to. We all have free will. I also agree that no matter WHAT the state of one's marriage, cheating is always wrong and never justifiable.

But to act like every person who has cheated was rubbing their hands together and going out trolling is so simplistic. I think people like to think this because making any connection between a truly crappy marriage and vulnerability to an affair sounds like justification. Even though it's not. Stealing is unequivocally against the law too. And even if someone is starving, they shouldn't knock over a grocery store. But I think we can all agree that a starving person who sees an open grocery store with no staff or security cameras would be vulnerable to slipping a candy bar into their pocket than a well-fed person. Let's get real. They still broke the law and need to be prosectued. But you'd have to choose to be blind not to admit the distinction.

People cheat because they want to - at least at some point.

But refusing to look at WHY they wanted to beyond "they're just evil" is...really really dumb, IMO.

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