Wait...until when?

[Confused2017]

I am utterly confused as to what am I supposed to do at this point with the guy I'm seeing, so I thought I'd reach out for some advice.

 

My story started years ago, when I met a guy I liked a lot, and while we seemed to have lots in common, he just wasn't into me enough to start a real relationship. He may have been with someone else, or the timing may have been wrong - I don't know, all I know is that he didn't treat me right, he was constantly neglecting me, bailing on me, barely called me, and getting together with him was always a struggle. A few months in, it all ended.

 

Fast forward a few years, we reconnected. This time, he is a completely different person, and his behavior towards me has done a 180. He has let me in, he has been treating me very well, contacts me every day almost, we connect in ways I've never thought possible with anyone, let alone him. There is one problem: he is dating someone else, and has been for a couple of years. Of course, I only know his side of the story, but apparently they are just dating, non exclusively. They see each other maybe once a month even if they are not long distance, in fact he has told me, from day one (which was 7 months ago!) that the relationship he has with her is ending, as they are too different and want different things from life. She wants commitment, he doesn't. He is not the relationship/marriage type (and yes I'm ok with that, for my own private reasons I won't get into).

 

Well, things are great with us. We talk all the time, get along swimmingly, have lots in common, and care about one another. Yet, she is still in the picture, 7 months in. I started this because I believed him when he said she wasn't going to be around much longer, but I am starting to doubt that. I understand him not wanting to let go of a sure thing (after all she is at his beck and call and has foregone her own needs and wants just to keep him), not knowing how things would turn out with me - and I was willing to let him take his time, but I am starting to get really attached and thinking of him with her hurts. They are obviously sexually involved, while me and him haven't gone there yet (and won't, for as long as she is in the picture - my choice). He says they haven't been intimate in months, but do I believe it? Not really. It may just be my lack of trust, who knows.

 

So my question is: how much longer should I wait? He knows the situation is getting to me, and says he understands, yet nothing is changing. He is trying his best to be with me as much as possible, to show me he is interested in me, so I can't complain about lack of him showing interest, because he shows me lots. I also can't force him to give her up, it has to be his decision. But I find myself constantly suspicious that he is with her, every time he is not with me or talking with me. I can't harp on it because I don't want to look needy and insecure, but I don't like multi dating, I don't multi date myself, and I want this situation to end. I don't want to give him up either, because I like what we have, and him and her will be eventually done, I know that.

 

It may look like I'm wasting my time, but I am not in any rush to be with anyone, in fact if this doesn't work out I won't be interested in meeting anyone else for years to come (due to my own personal situation I won't go into). So no, I am not wasting my time, I wouldn't be out and about meeting other guys anyway.

 

So what do I do, where do I go from here?

 

PS - I know there will be some temptation to tell me to think about her feelings etc, so I will just say from the start that she is getting exactly what she deserves. She is the one of the reasons things between me and him didn't work in the past, she knew he was with me yet threw herself at him constantly. So, her feelings are of no importance to me.

[Versacehottie]

It's funny the non-committment you got from him the first time around, you are STILL getting. It's just morphed into a different form.

 

Maybe this guy just gets off on feeling wanted by a few women. 7 months is enough time to sort it out, especially if she is long distance and they don't live together.

 

Quite simply, yes you've waited enough and should see others. Tell him to contact you when and if he breaks up with her and only then. And you will see how you feel and if you are free at that time. Though not quite sure you would want to do that: he has twice had other women (doubt it's just the one) in his life at the same time as you & for a significant amount of time, not just initial dating period. That wouldn't fly with me.

[AdamMC]

Confused2017 - her feelings shouldn't be a factor to you if she was the cause for trouble in your relationship before. So I don't think that sounds harsh at all..it's just reality. It seems that she is still getting in the way between you guys though just in a different way now.

 

I mean this in the kindest way possible: I think you have given him enough time to sort this out. He's aware that it bothers you (as it would anyone...I have to give you credit for even giving him this much latitude - most women would probably not) If he were truly taking your feelings into consideration, he would end it for good with her, period. If he can't or won't, then there's your answer on how he truly feels about the subject.

 

Multi dating is not something I could ever do personally but I can see why some do. I don't think not liking it has any reflection on you that makes you appear insecure at all...you shouldn't have to accept it if it's not comfortable for you. Period.

 

The guy has been neglectful and didn't treat you right before...you gave him another chance and he's still pretty much doing that in a way. I wouldn't give him a chance to keep doing it if it were me.

[smackie9]

This guy hasn't changed one iota. He might be a little nicer this time around but he is the same old manipulating jack a$$. He knows how to get you emotionally attached so he can control you....it's his game and it works. Who knows how many other women he is seeing. It is what it is. You are just waiting for the same old song and dance he gave you years ago.

[MountainGirl111]

If something bothers you it bothers you....and as long as his relationship with her bothers you you won't be truly happy and free. It robs you of joy, it really does. I mean, at least it sounds like it does. You deserve to be a relationship with someone that is truly fulfilling. Yes, it sounds like you've had an amazing 'connection' at times...but it is also lacking and it bothers you. It's okay to be 'bothered' about something, but to be chronically bothered is not healthy; it slowly eats away are happiness and can lead to things like depression. You've "settled" with him and you've been willing to take what you can get. That in no way makes you a bad person or anything. But perhaps take a look at what you need to do in life to be truly fulfilled in relationships and what might be holding you back from being fulfilled.

[leogirl876]

I would say to you, don't wait on him or anyone, ever! No man is worth putting time on hold for, and he hasn't changed, all he's done is upped his game. He sounds like a douche that needs attention from plenty of women, move on from him and find a real man that'll give you what you want. One thing I've learned the hard way, if you can't accept someone for exactly who they are right now, then you shouldn't be with them. Don't wait on someone hoping for their potential.

[ExpatInItaly]

This guy hasn't changed, he's just polished up his tactics a bit.

 

I don't buy for a moment that he's not exclusive with this girl. She is his girlfriend and he's trying to make you his side-piece.

 

You need to move on. He's not a good guy.

[Knix]

It's always sad to me how women never blame the guy for anything like this. It's always "she's in the way" or "she came onto him" "I don't feel sorry for her.. etc". But HE is the one playing the both of you, 7 months? There's no reason for him to stay with someone that they don't want to be with for 7 months.

 

Bottom line is that they are in a relationship, not you. He's playing you and deep down, you know it. It doesn't matter if you aren't looking for something serious, you say it hurts you when you think of them together, that sounds like you care a whole lot.

 

Stop blaming her. He is the one playing games with you.

[Confused2017]

Thank you everybody who chimed in, deep down I know you're all right. Back when our relationship ended, years ago, I wanted nothing more than to have him back. Then as the years went by, I tried to move on (unsuccessfully) and didn't think for a second that him and I would ever talk again.

Then it happened, and I was so overjoyed. I thought this was our second chance, especially when I realized the huge change in his attitude towards me. This is why I find it so extremely hard to let him go again. Him coming back, apologizing for the past was a dream that I never thought possible to come true, yet it did. How do I let go now? I just want her out of his life and him to give "us" a real chance.

 

But I know you are all right, if he truly felt enough for me and things with her were truly ending, they would have ended by now.

 

I have decided to give myself a deadline, and that will be in a month, after his b-day. I bought a gift for him that he's always wanted, and I want to be around to give it to him (partly because it was expensive and I don't want to throw it away, and I don't want to keep it for myself as it would be a constant reminder). Plus, I will get to see who he chooses to spend his b-day with, that should speak volumes. If it's not me, then I will give him his gift and that will be the end of it.

 

I may sound stupid but I swear I'm not lol...it's just one of those things. I've never been like this with a guy before, and trust me, I'm no spring chicken. It's just that this guy has always stuck in my heart and mind, and nothing I did could take him out. I'm not sure how I will be able to go on after it's over, but I will surely try.

 

I can't understand for the life of me why, if he doesn't care about me and he doesn't see a future with me (and by future I mean a relationship, nothing more), he is keeping in touch daily, the whole day. If he just wanted me to be a side piece, would he really put in all this effort? We talk for hours, not minutes! We have gotten close emotionally. And he knows that there will be no sex as long as he isn't 100% single. I don't get it.

 

Do you guys think there is any chance that if I end it, he will realize he's really losing me and be motivated to end things with her? He knows me and him are way more compatible than him and her, in fact I have no idea what's keeping him with her to begin with! I am guessing convenience, the fact that she never argues and lets him do whatever he pleases, but I don't know.

I do know that I feel like I'm slowly turning into a neurotic, highly insecure woman who feels the need to ask him constantly "so have you been with her?" and other silly similar questions which of course I end up not asking because it would drive him nuts. I do my best not to bring her up and enjoy the time I have with him, but every time he doesn't call, or ends the call earlier than normal, or doesn't do something with me, I suspect he is with her, and it's starting to do a number on me.

 

Any ideas as to how to go about this, how to talk to him about it? Anything I can do, other than call it quits?

Edited June 19, 2017 by Confused2017

[smackie9]

He is doing all this because well look at you...you are not willing to let go of him. He gets an expensive gift and whatever else from you.....he doesn't to have you eating out of his hand so he can keep screwin around with other women. He's a con artist. You can try and convince yourself all you want that he must be this great guy because you are so "emotionally connected" when all it is, is smoke and mirrors.

 

 

Talk to him to convince him to stop seeing others behind your back?? LOL

He will just feed you more of what you want to hear. He play you like a fiddle....

[healing light]

He is trying his best to be with me as much as possible, to show me he is interested in me

 

He's not, he's still with that other turd.

 

I feel like I'm slowly turning into a neurotic, highly insecure woman

 

These types of situations are often soul-crushing. You spend so much of your time trying to prove your worth without any real security that you end up like the worst possible version of yourself with low self-esteem to boot.

 

I know it's hard, but if you want anything to change you have to let this one go. I think at least part of the reason he's affected you so much is that he's playing into a subconscious wound that you may have. It's worth exploring. Best of luck to you.

[ExpatInItaly]

I've seen a lot of people on this forum trying to justify staying in a situation where they're clearly been played. But this is a new level of the ol' Pick Me! dance.

 

Don't be his lapdog anymore. You've disrespected yourself enough, for long enough. You keep buying whatever load o' crap he tosses in your direction. You figure he stays with her because she lets him do whatever he wants - well, OP, that makes two of you then. You say you're the better match for him, but if he agreed, he'd be with you.

 

You ask why he puts in all this effort - what effort is that, exactly? Talking or texting a lot? That's not very hard. Official dates, being there for you when you need him, integrating you into his life - the real heavy lifting required to make a relationship work isn't happening here.

 

Bottom line - don't further embarrass yourself by giving this guy a birthday gift. Donate it to someone deserving and take it as loss to your wallet but a gain to your dignity.

[Knix]

Waiting for his birthday is just dragging it out though, right? I can understand not wanting to keep a gift you were supposed to give him but you could return it, give it to a friend, or slam dunk it into the garbage! It will all feel better than him accepting it and still seeing her. Have some self respect girl, he's not trying to make a relationship with you because he has one with her. I can't help but think giving him a present is just another way to try and manipulate the situation.

[Whodatdog]

You can't expect people to respect you when you dont respect yourself. You are perfectly willing to stay with this guy when he's staying with another woman. You're delusional if you say "He knows me and him are way more compatible than him and her, in fact I have no idea what's keeping him with her to begin with!".

 

He's a grown man, he could choose you if he wanted to. He doesnt want to. If you tell him to choose now, and he doesnt choose you, why would you have wanted to stay with him in the first place?

 

Respect yourself.

[Versacehottie]

Waiting for his birthday is just dragging it out though, right? I can understand not wanting to keep a gift you were supposed to give him but you could return it, give it to a friend, or slam dunk it into the garbage! It will all feel better than him accepting it and still seeing her. Have some self respect girl, he's not trying to make a relationship with you because he has one with her. I can't help but think giving him a present is just another way to try and manipulate the situation.

 

I agree. Giving the present is about the worst way to do a last ditch attempt. If you want to be totally humiliated and hit a new low, then do that. I would dump in garbage ceremoniously, burn ceremoniously sell or return if you can and take the money to do something nice for yourself. You will regret it to give that to him. Or if you really really can't do that, give it to a friend or family to hold onto & then tell yourself you can give to him after you are bf & gf. If you never get to that place with him then you can get it back from the friend and do any of the above at that time. I wouldn't keep holding out hope for him at this point---you need to break off whatever you have with him. If the present is so sentimental, i don't really recommend it, but if you need to leave the last sliver of hope, let it be like that & you can readdress your thoughts about it along the way. I think it will just keep you hanging in there though. If you really want to move on, you will remove him from your life and your thoughts. It's hard but you need to do right for yourself. Good luck

[preraph]

When guys want to have more than one woman, that's what they always tell them, that the other relationship is on the rocks and they're only still there because of blah, blah. They're still there because they want more than one relationship, period. He's still sleeping with her, you can be certain. If men want nothing else, they still want sex. They're not married and no reason he can't just bail, but he doesn't want to as long as you will sit still.

 

At a bare minimum, you should be dating other guys as well.

[Zahara]

I have decided to give myself a deadline, and that will be in a month, after his b-day. I bought a gift for him that he's always wanted, and I want to be around to give it to him (partly because it was expensive and I don't want to throw it away, and I don't want to keep it for myself as it would be a constant reminder). Plus, I will get to see who he chooses to spend his b-day with, that should speak volumes. If it's not me, then I will give him his gift and that will be the end of it.

 

It speaks volumes that for 7 months he has not chosen you. You're basing all this on one night -- whether he spends it with you? You've demoted yourself to such an extent that this one piddly crumb day is magnified into some sign of how much he values you when he's devalued you consistently for 7 months.

 

You're grasping.

 

And this man leaves you dangling and you buy him an expensive gift?

 

I can't understand for the life of me why, if he doesn't care about me and he doesn't see a future with me (and by future I mean a relationship, nothing more), he is keeping in touch daily, the whole day. If he just wanted me to be a side piece, would he really put in all this effort? We talk for hours, not minutes! We have gotten close emotionally. And he knows that there will be no sex as long as he isn't 100% single. I don't get it.

 

He gets attention. It's an ego boost. Some men get off on that and he's hoping at some point you will give up the goods. For now, your time, attention and care is an added bonus.

 

Do you guys think there is any chance that if I end it, he will realize he's really losing me and be motivated to end things with her? He knows me and him are way more compatible than him and her, in fact I have no idea what's keeping him with her to begin with! I am guessing convenience, the fact that she never argues and lets him do whatever he pleases, but I don't know.

 

He was never interested then, and I don't think he is interested now. Both times -- he did not choose you.

 

There are two women who are letting him do as he pleases.

 

You need to hold on to your self-respect. You teach him daily that you require very little of it and will tolerate just about anything to be with him.

[Knix]

Waiting for his birthday is just dragging it out though, right? I can understand not wanting to keep a gift you were supposed to give him but you could return it, give it to a friend, or slam dunk it into the garbage! It will all feel better than him accepting it and still seeing her. Have some self respect girl, he's not trying to make a relationship with you because he has one with her. And if he's okay with doing this to two girls, I wouldn't be surprised if there are others too.. once a cheater always a cheater..

 

 

I can't help but think giving him a present is just another way to try and manipulate the situation in your favor. Even if you give him that gift, try and be realistic about the situation. He won't leave his gf and be with you because you got him something nice. He doesn't seem to have much of a moral compass. You'll just feel resentful that he gladly accepted a gift while still hurting you.

 

But there is good news here, you can take back the upper hand by ending contact with him. Take back your power, move on to someone that has respect for you and isn't in a relationship.

[salparadise]

But there is good news here, you can take back the upper hand by ending contact with him. Take back your power, move on to someone that has respect for you and isn't in a relationship.

 

Yup. He's emotionally attached to you but getting his sexual needs met by the other girl. You're holding the boundary on sex, but still giving him all the attention and validation he can stand. If you want to turn the tables, cut him off completely. There's no guarantee, but you already know what you get if nothing changes.

 

I'm surprised he stays around if you're not sexing him. He's probably betting that sooner or later you'll cave, that he can outlast you, because he's getting laid and you aren't... then he'll have two.

 

It's just a messed up situation. You want exclusivity but no relationship. He wants a relationship but no exclusivity. I think you need to make yourself scarce and see what happens... because this status quo clearly isn't working out for you.

[Versacehottie]

I would add that OP needs to be honest with herself. Saying you don't want a relationship yet wanting all the elements of one is convoluted. If you have trouble keeping your own intentions & goals straight in your own mind, how is it possible to get what you want in this world? Commit to whatever your real goal is and the first step is being honest with yourself. Even the way that you describe your feelings about this other woman sound like you want him all for yourself, i.e. a relationship, same with the gift. Maybe convincing yourself that you are not in a position to have one with anyone is allowing you to accept these substandard conditions from him?

[Knix]

I would add that OP needs to be honest with herself. Saying you don't want a relationship yet wanting all the elements of one is convoluted. If you have trouble keeping your own intentions & goals straight in your own mind, how is it possible to get what you want in this world? Commit to whatever your real goal is and the first step is being honest with yourself. Even the way that you describe your feelings about this other woman sound like you want him all for yourself, i.e. a relationship, same with the gift. Maybe convincing yourself that you are not in a position to have one with anyone is allowing you to accept these substandard conditions from him?

 

Absolutely

[Purepony]

The op doesn't care to listen and he's getting his rocks off... sounds like their made for each other if you ask me ...

 

Their both living in fear ... he lives in fear with the girl he can't break up with and the op lives in fear about breaking up !

 

It's the kind leading the kind

 

Op wake up and take some time to reflect on what youre doing and how you see yourself

[Confused2017]

I have read each and every answer and I appreciate everyone taking the time to read my post and offer their opinion.

I must admit, it was a bit of a surprise to see how all of you pretty much said the same thing, and you are all right, I do deserve better and the guy is probably just playing with my head.

 

But there has been a development, and once again despite the fact that me leaving is probably still the best option, I would like to know if this changes anything.

 

A couple days ago I was going to suggest a meetup with him, where I was going to tell him I was ending "us" because basically I have all the qualities to be the main dish not the side one, etc etc. I had a whole speech prepared. But before I was able to say anything, he called me and during the conversation he told me he had ended things with the other woman! He didn't say anything about me or having done so in order to see where things went with me, he just informed me of the fact and that was that.

 

Firstly I should say that I'm not sure I believe it's true, he has been known to lie a lot. But I have no way of knowing for sure, right?

 

Then...well, we had plans for this weekend but he cancelled them (with a believable excuse, yes, but once again, who knows if that's true). He did offer next weekend as an alternative. He has still kept in touch by phone every day, but he doesn't seem to make any effort to actually hang out with me in person, even though he knows I have the time.

In fact, since he apparently ended things with her, he seems colder with me! I'm not sure why that is, but what am I supposed to do now? Wait some more and see what happens? I can no longer give him the "I don't want to be the other woman" speech at this point, so then what? I don't want to be the needy woman who complains about him not spending time with me.

 

Also, I'm not sure if this matters in any way, but this is not a guy looking for his bride or anything, he is in his mid-50s and not looking to ever get married or even live with anyone, he is not the committed relationship type of person and I am ok with that, as I am not looking for something all that serious myself at this point. But I do want him exclusively, and to see him at least twice a week. At this point, I see him 1-2 times a month despite talking daily, and that's just not enough for me.

 

So please, other than "move on", what else can I do to turn the tables?

[Knix]

I have read each and every answer and I appreciate everyone taking the time to read my post and offer their opinion.

I must admit, it was a bit of a surprise to see how all of you pretty much said the same thing, and you are all right, I do deserve better and the guy is probably just playing with my head.

 

But there has been a development, and once again despite the fact that me leaving is probably still the best option, I would like to know if this changes anything.

 

A couple days ago I was going to suggest a meetup with him, where I was going to tell him I was ending "us" because basically I have all the qualities to be the main dish not the side one, etc etc. I had a whole speech prepared. But before I was able to say anything, he called me and during the conversation he told me he had ended things with the other woman! He didn't say anything about me or having done so in order to see where things went with me, he just informed me of the fact and that was that.

 

Firstly I should say that I'm not sure I believe it's true, he has been known to lie a lot. But I have no way of knowing for sure, right?

 

Then...well, we had plans for this weekend but he cancelled them (with a believable excuse, yes, but once again, who knows if that's true). He did offer next weekend as an alternative. He has still kept in touch by phone every day, but he doesn't seem to make any effort to actually hang out with me in person, even though he knows I have the time.

In fact, since he apparently ended things with her, he seems colder with me! I'm not sure why that is, but what am I supposed to do now? Wait some more and see what happens? I can no longer give him the "I don't want to be the other woman" speech at this point, so then what? I don't want to be the needy woman who complains about him not spending time with me.

 

Also, I'm not sure if this matters in any way, but this is not a guy looking for his bride or anything, he is in his mid-50s and not looking to ever get married or even live with anyone, he is not the committed relationship type of person and I am ok with that, as I am not looking for something all that serious myself at this point. But I do want him exclusively, and to see him at least twice a week. At this point, I see him 1-2 times a month despite talking daily, and that's just not enough for me.

 

So please, other than "move on", what else can I do to turn the tables?

 

 

Why can't you move on? Planning a lunch to meet and presenting a speech is just another way for you to keep staying on his radar. I think the only person that believes you're only intention is to end things is you. I think the beauty of this forum is that people from anywhere and everywhere can read between the lines from an objective point of view. If everyone on here is saying the same thing, it's because it's very obvious to everyone reading.

 

No he didn't break up with her. He could prbly tell you've been distant and questioning this so he did that to reel you back in, and it worked. They ALWAYS say they're are leaving or will leave. Don't think for a moment she's not there. Let's say they got in a fight and broke up, she'll be back you can bet on that.

 

Also it doesn't matter if this guy doesn't want a serious relationship, he doesn't have any morals clearly. Also because he just wants non-serious things, he likes to play games with you two (possibly more).

 

I think if you didn't want anything serious with this guy you would have let this go a while ago because he's not giving you what you want. You clearly have feelings for him but are willing to bend over backwards and get hurt to be the woman he wants. This will continue to be a back and fourth game for him, and if you think he's saying sweet things about you to his gf, you're kidding yourself.

 

He's playing both of you. I'm not even slightly surprised that he told you he broke it off with that girl right before you were about to end things. You need to think smarter than this.

[ExpatInItaly]

OP, you can't be this desperate.

 

When you can't even trust a 50-something's word that he's broken it off with another woman, you need to ask yourself why you're scratching the bottom of the barrel.