CrushingHope Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 My ex boyfriend broke up with me about 7 months ago. He had been involved with someone off and on for 7 years and left her many times but kept going back. She is (from what he has told me) abusive and an alcoholic and not a very happy person. He claims that he isn't in love with her anymore but cares about her very much. We dated twice. Both times, he ended up going back to her, but he claimed to be "so in love" with me and was going to marry me and all this stuff. Anyway...I'm totally hung up on him still. I had some of the best times of my life with him and I guess I keep hoping that he will realize that he doesn't have to keep going back to someone that doesn't make him happy. He always refuses to give me any details about why he goes back and even his own son thinks there's something wrong there, and that his dad was "crazy about me". I just wonder...if he is so happy with her (which I'm assuming he must be on some level or wouldn't keep going back), why does he still text me (not always, but here and there) and say that he misses me and that I'm all these wonderful things? Why bother? I get that most people will say he wants to keep me on a string...but why? If he's happy, why?!?!?! And if he's NOT happy, why stay??? I will never understand. I do reply to his texts. I do initiate conversation sometimes too. I've been advised by friends to completely stop and only then will he be forced to face that...I don't know. I really want to be with him but I can't keep going through this.
SpecialJ Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 It sounds like he's in a codependent cycle that he isn't ready to break, either because it's like an emotional addiction, he has his own deep issues, or both. No matter what, he isn't healthy, and you keeping in contact with him at all before he gets through these issues isn't healthy for you. You've tried to work through it with him, he's left twice. Trying again won't change that. You can only change how you're responding. Figure out why you're willing to tolerate someone who isn't all in, try to address it with yourself. Once you do that, you may find you don't even want him anymore, especially if he can't change. 2
Author CrushingHope Posted June 5, 2017 Author Posted June 5, 2017 Thank you SpecialJ. I agree...the last time he left me to go back to her, he had just bought me a piano (three days before) and was planning on moving into a new place (long story) and wanted the piano to go into his place so I would have something special there. I know he cared (cares) about me deeply but I know that something unhealthy continues to bring him back to her. I completely agree that I have to let him go and deal with that situation...see things through with her...and if he lets her go for good, and if I'm still here and willing, then fine... But I have a hard time staying away. I know it's healthier for me to let him go. I know it's unfair of him to text me those things, and unfair of me to respond or to reach out to him too. But when I hear from him, I become instantly hopeful and happy for a split second. He FELT all in. That was the biggest problem. I have never been treated better by any man than I did by him...until he left. And then of course, I have never been sadder over anyone in my life. I have definitely hit an all-time low for myself. I have been in therapy for 5 months with no real change. There are so many factors that come into play. I have written the whole story on another thread. I just have a hard time understanding any of it, and why he bothers to be in touch...
SpecialJ Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 He is in touch because you let him be in touch. He may care about you, he may just form very unhealthy attachments to all the people in his life, it doesn't really matter. For sure, he finds being in touch with you comforting. That doesn't mean it is good for either of you. My last ex was cruel in words at the end of the relationship but then wouldn't leave me alone. I thought this meant he really cared. It really meant he had control issues and even told me later he has an insecure attachment style (Google attachment theory if you're unfamiliar, it's really enlightening). Giving it some more time, he really showed me that whatever the real reason he was in touch with me, it was NOT because he cared for me in any healthy way. I'm glad you're in therapy. Have you considered seeing what happens in that process after cutting him out for a while? It may change your perspective and give therapy a better chance to start helping a couple months down the road. Or perhaps you'd find a different therapist a better match. 1
Author CrushingHope Posted June 5, 2017 Author Posted June 5, 2017 I know keeping in touch with him is not the solution. But I'm so afraid of losing every tie with him for fear that it means he will forget me or never be with me again, even if he did leave her. I was single for many years before meeting him and then suddenly my world was full of (what seemed like) love and affection and attention and sex and belonging....and now back to NOT having those things, in a town that I moved to in order to go back to school for nursing. I am just finishing school and will leave this town in a few months. Funnily enough, I am moving to his hometown where he said he would always love to move back to one day (he said this after knowing I would be moving there). Anyway...I am holding onto hope, I think mostly for fear that I will never again find someone who made me feel the way he did. I guess that's most people's fear when they are dumped by someone they really loved. He has a lot of issues. But I suppose I do too, being so hung up on him 7 months later and not being truly able to let go.
Minneloa Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 I am sorry you are hurting, OP. This thread (and your previous one) resonate with me. I highly relate to your struggle to let this person go and your frustration with not having answers. In your words, "I will never understand." I don't mean to be presumptuous, but from your posts you seem like a sensitive person who tends to ruminate. This is me! So at the risk of merely projecting, I will say that one of the most useful "life lessons" I have learned in the last several years is that sometimes we as humans have to accept something we do not understand. I am not saying this is easy, but rather suggesting that you take your focus off him and his psychopathology/motivations and focus on your own wellbeing. What do *you* want, aside from him? Because the harsh truth is that he is not available, emotionally or otherwise. And that is painful. I remember one time last year a dear friend said to me (about a guy over whom I was agonizing), "Minneloa, he is choosing not to pursue a relationship with you, for whatever reason." I think this might be a helpful mantra for you. Not because I am trying to be mean, but rather because it states the facts plainly and in a neutral way. It relieves you of the burden of trying to figure out his reasons (btw, I am highly dubious that there is any actual "smoking gun" he is withholding from you that would suddenly explain everything) and allows you to proceed with your own life in accordance with the current reality. Which, to repeat, is: He is, for whatever reason, choosing not to pursue a relationship with you. You may never fully understand his story, but that's not your job. Your job, imho, is to take care of yourself by allowing yourself to accept the facts, grieve, and, eventually, move on. Sending good thoughts! M. 2
Author CrushingHope Posted June 5, 2017 Author Posted June 5, 2017 Thank you, Minneloa...you are bang on. I absolutely know that my greatest challenge with all of this is not having answers. I have given him so many chances to tell me what the "reason" was, and all he would ever say is "I need to be able to live with myself. You have no idea what I'm dealing with"....it was all so cryptic. And having that made me think about things even MORE. So, I know trying to get answers from him is not helpful. But somehow I haven't been able to walk away. I do keep telling myself that exact thing..."he has chosen not to be with you"....over and over I have said it, written it, thought it...yet I keep staying in this horrible mindset that he is it for me and I will do anything I can do have him back. Even, at this point, I know that if he came back tomorrow, things wouldn't likely work out. I would feel that he was always going to leave. How could I trust him? Yet, I know in my heart I still want him back. It's a feeling I'm ashamed and embarrassed to still have after all of this. And to know what many others think of him...he is not good enough for me. Not even close. Yet, in my mind he is.
Minneloa Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 CH, Please do not feel ashamed or embarrassed about your feelings! I completely relate. In fact, I myself am still working to "shake off" that guy (we broke up six months ago) with varying degrees of success. One thing I will offer is that, for me, it is important to distinguish between feelings and actions. So, for example, though I still miss that guy and wish things had worked out differently, I choose not to contact him or respond to his messages. Is is hard? Yes. But it helps keep me grounded in the facts, even if my feelings haven't quite caught up. M.
Minneloa Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 Speaking of action, I also find that when I am in a ruminating phase, it is crucial to get the heck out of the house and into the world. Today, I took my nephew, whose family is currently in crisis, out to lunch. I was trying to distract and comfort him, but the truth is that the outing did me just as much good. Also, if you are interested in reading an excellent chapter on rumination, check out Beat the Blues by Robert Leahy. It helped me understand why overthinking is both seductive and, ultimately, futile. M. 2
Author CrushingHope Posted June 5, 2017 Author Posted June 5, 2017 That's good advice, Minneloa. I'll try that. How often is your ex messaging you? Does he have a clear intent or is it just random texts like mine? I have also found that something my friend said hit home with me...he said right now, my feelings/emotions/depression are lying to me. The thoughts I have about never being able to find someone, that he was the only one for me, that i'm not good enough for anyone else etc....all lies. I try to keep that into perspective. People often tell me to get out there and date...to "find someone new"...and as tempting as that might be for many, it isn't at all for me. I feel like it would be completely unfair of me to try to meet someone new only to feel better about myself or my situation. I feel like maybe that's what my ex did with me, and he did get feelings for me and that complicated things way more for him. I won't do that to anyone. But it feels like time is ticking...42 years old...doesn't get easier to find someone...
Author CrushingHope Posted June 5, 2017 Author Posted June 5, 2017 I will definitely check that out. Overthinking/ruminating/analyzing is such a big part of what gets me into trouble in my life, and often brings me great sadness. I find it difficult to let go of thoughts. A lady at work told me my mind is always in overdrive. She's right. I can't seem to stop. Getting out in the world is a good idea. My ex used to live downstairs from me (and his son still lives there with his mom now...long story, if you read my other post you probably know)....and being here is a constant reminder. Anywhere I go in this small town is though. I try to leave as often as I can, but it's difficult.
vanhalenfan Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 It sounds like a co-dependency issue....One question: Is she the mother of his son? If so, that could be the reason. He just wants to make it work for his son's sake and keeps trying to run back to her. Either way, it's time for you to get out there and find someone else more suited to you. A healthy relationship
Minneloa Posted June 5, 2017 Posted June 5, 2017 My ex was messaging me once or twice a month, random breadcrumbs. But I never replied, and he seems to have given up. I absolutely agree that in your current emotional state your thoughts are distorted. I have similar self-defeating thoughts about my life and the future, especially in terms of relationship failures. I call this my "mean mind," and sometimes I like to talk back to it (not out loud), as in "Nice try, mean mind!" Talking back to my thoughts, or challenging them with facts, is something that I have learned in my CBT therapy. I highly recommend this approach! I think it's up to you when you start dating again, but I would say that "getting out there" in non-dating ways is essential. And by that I mean, participating in whatever activities you enjoy, seeing friends, just leaving the house and getting out of your head. For me, that means going to the movies, doing yoga, or hanging out at a local coffee shop. It can instantly improve my mood, even though I initially have to force myself. M.
Author CrushingHope Posted June 5, 2017 Author Posted June 5, 2017 No, she's not the mother of his son. I agree, it's a codependent relationship and I do get the feeling that both people are unhappy but don't seem to be able to move forward. Breaking up 7 times in the last 2 years of their relationship says a lot...but I suppose going back that many times says a lot too. That's why i do believe that they need to see it through and let them be or not be what they need to ...who am I to step in between that...but still...cuts me so deeply.
SpecialJ Posted June 6, 2017 Posted June 6, 2017 Living with himself may refer to guilt. Since he sounds codependent, and she has substance issues, he may feel like he has to save her... or least if she drank herself to death, he'd feel responsible. So if you really need an "explanation" to understand what he means, that's how I interpret what he said. But that again points to a lot of his problems, and I think you're better off looking at things the way Minneola is suggesting. I just listed a bunch of other coping suggestions in another thread, which talk about building self esteem and could also help.
Author CrushingHope Posted June 6, 2017 Author Posted June 6, 2017 Yes, "living with himself" may refer to guilt. He has always eluded to the fact that something more is going on than he shares with me....which I get doesn't really matter. Regardless of what or why, he has chosen a life that doesn't include me. But then why...why why why bother to text me. It gives me hope....and that's not on him, that's on me to get rid of that hope...but I can't seem to let it go. I suppose I don't actually want to...because that means facing the reality that I will be alone for real again...with such seemingly little chance of ever finding love again. That's truly what the fear is...never finding what I THOUGHT I found in him.
Minneloa Posted June 6, 2017 Posted June 6, 2017 I hear you on the whys. The problem is that though we can speculate, we will never really know why he stays in contact with you. Here on this site, many people explain these "breadcrumbs" as a toxic, selfish combination of one or more of the following: wanting attention/an ego boost/validation, guilt over hurting someone, and/or loneliness. I think these reasons are often valid, but I also think sometimes the ex genuinely misses the other person as well. However, none of those reasons equals a sincere interest in rekindling the relationship. That's the rub, and that's why so many people advocate no contact. I know you don't want to let go. I hear you. But what is the alternative? Pining away for the next few months before you move? You have mentioned that you have the feeling that your time is running out to find a suitable partner. I don't agree with you & think that's your "mean mind" talking, but let's say for the sake of argument that you are right. Wouldn't it be better to take some steps towards healing and moving on so that, eventually, you'll be ready for the next person?
Minneloa Posted June 6, 2017 Posted June 6, 2017 And by steps, I don't necessarily mean dating, though there some who would strongly advocate dipping your toe into these waters. I mean things like not initiating contact with him, taking longer to respond, avoiding interactions with his ex-wife and son (I realize this is logistically difficult), and distracting yourself by whatever means necessary. I mean, it would be ideal if you deleted and blocked his number, but I know that you aren't there yet. So maybe set a few goals of starting to detach emotionally and focus your attention elsewhere. What sorts of activities/hobbies do you enjoy?
Author CrushingHope Posted June 6, 2017 Author Posted June 6, 2017 I do believe he misses me. And I guess I keep hope alive because he came back to me before because he "missed me so much" and couldn't keep living the way he was living with her. So I guess I keep thinking that one day he will really get the courage to leave her for good. But I do know that getting back with him now would mean a very distrusting relationship for probably a long time...and I don't think I would end up being able to deal with that. I try to focus on that, but I miss him to such an overwhelming degree that I feel that even THAT kind of relationship must be better than the severe sadness I have felt without him. I am talking to the ex-wife and son much less now. And I have gone large patches of NC but end up ruining it by initiating conversation. And recently responding quickly when he messages me. I will work on more NC (I vow not to initiate text with him again), and see how that goes. I agree that I need to let myself move on in order to have any hope with anyone else ever...I have thought about it so many times. But every day I continue to find it difficult. I am struggling in this small town where I don't know a lot of people. He was everything I had here for a while. I have a couple of friends and see them here and there but not often now that school is done and we are in our nursing placements. I am making an effort though. I have a lot of hobbies, but they tend to be things I do on my own - painting, writing, guitar/singing, photography, reading, crafts, etc.... Once I leave this town, I will be able to find more to do, I'm sure...plus I will have a job and be making money again (finally!!) which will make socializing more manageable on my wallet. It seems like everything is on hold until then...and so much of me just wants to stay here and hope he changes his mind...but I know I can't do that. And won't.
Minneloa Posted June 7, 2017 Posted June 7, 2017 I know it hurts. You are grieving. And the wound is still fresh and open because you have been in contact with him, even though the breakup was a while ago. Be kind to yourself, and try to remember that your mind is not your friend right now. Distract it! Even taking a book to a cafe or park is better than sitting at home. I am rooting for you. M.
Mittens Posted June 7, 2017 Posted June 7, 2017 I was involved in an on/off relationship like this for four years. I still loved him, and convinced myself that he loved me too, because he kept coming back. It took one simple remark from him to finally make me see sense. I had imposed NC for 6 months, and during that time he'd split up from his girlfriend, and then got back together with her. I finally replied to a message he sent and we met up. We were talking about his break up, and he casually threw out that the night it happened, he went and slept with another female friend of his...I expressed my disgust and he said 'well it would have been you if we had been talking'....and after four long years I realised that it wasn't me he missed at all. That if it wasn't me as his backup, it would be someone else. It was truly a 'eureka' moment for me. I felt angry and used, but mainly angry at myself. The first time we split should have been the last time. I kept letting him come back, fooling myself that he still cared and missed me. He cared, but only as far as how my being in his life could benefit him. That was the last time I saw him. 7 years ago now and I think I've had one message in that time, that I didn't reply to. Keep doing what you are doing. Once I implemented the final NC, I moved on with my life and met my current partner 6 months later. That wouldn't have happened if I'd kept clinging onto the past. 1
Author CrushingHope Posted June 7, 2017 Author Posted June 7, 2017 Thanks Mittens. Your story makes me sad. I do hope that that's not what is happening here, but I wouldn't be completely surprised. I don't know him like I thought I did. We only dated for a short time and he could have been lying to me the whole time. To be honest, one of the only things that made me feel like he had genuine feelings for me (other than telling me himself which I was skeptical of since he left so quickly) was that he told his son (teenager who ended up telling me) that he was more in love that he ever had been and that he was going to marry me. If he didn't have real feelings, why would he say that to his son? Even the son said it that me ex was "always all over you. couldn't get enough of you" and just seemed like "old buddies" with her. I do think that he has deeply seated issues to be able to go back to this horrible woman over and over, meanwhile tell his kids that he's unhappy with her. I do think it's about codependence more than anything. His daughter who is in her early 20s doesn't even talk to him now because he keeps going back to this person who never respected his children. The whole thing has been a mess and logically I know I'm too good for all of this. I am glad to have the memories with him that I do because they are the best of my life when it comes to being spontaneous and the affection and excitement he brought to my life....but I wish those memories would stop haunting me long enough to be able to move forward and have hope that doesn't include him. It's been the hardest 7 months of my life.
Author CrushingHope Posted June 7, 2017 Author Posted June 7, 2017 Thank you Minneloa. I am so grateful for your kind words. So many people don't understand that this is not a choice to feel like this. I don't want to feel this way. I wish I didn't want him in my life anymore. I wish I was over him or had someone else. I am so scared of never finding the happiness again that I had with him. I guess everyone gets scared of that after the ending of a relationship that they really enjoyed. I also think about how many times I was worried that he was in touch with her again. I remember the night he told me he loved me for the first time, we had gone for dinner and then after just did some shopping. When we were in the store, he went to the bathroom and was taking a while in there...my first thought was "did he leave? could he really have left me here??" (we were in another town), and then "is he talking to her?" That's a terrible way to feel about anyone...but especially sad the night that your bf first tells you he loves you...no trust. And I was right to be suspicious, I suppose. I am sure she doesn't know and wouldn't be pleased to know that he has been in touch with me. what a mess.
jessiesgurl Posted June 7, 2017 Posted June 7, 2017 (edited) I know keeping in touch with him is not the solution. But I'm so afraid of losing every tie with him for fear that it means he will forget me or never be with me again, even if he did leave her. My experience has been otherwise. By losing touch and going NC, he'll get a chance to experience life without you, wonder about you, perhaps miss you and think about you MORE. It's the exact opposite of what you're thinking. Plus going no contact gives you the chance to move on too. If you want to get in touch later, say in a few months, that's fine. I mentioned this earlier in another thread, and this may sound odd, but breaking no contact (after a few months) actually allowed me to get over them and move on for good. Edited June 7, 2017 by jessiesgurl
Author CrushingHope Posted June 7, 2017 Author Posted June 7, 2017 JessiesGurl, do you think that applies to people who are back with their exes? I feel like he is back in his old life with her...it would be easy to forget about me I guess. But I do notice that the two times I've done NC for a couple of months, I did hear from him again...but it doesn't seem to change anything like it did the first time we broke up last year. My best friend says the same thing. The only hope I have with him is to go NC and give him time to sort out his life/things with her. Only if he has left me or tells me he is leaving or whatever should I entertain any conversation with him. Only then do I have any chance of things ever working out between us, and even then it would be a long road to a trusting relationship. She doesn't want me to give him the time of day ever again, but sees how happy he made me for a short time so really wants to believe there could be hope for us but only under these specific circumstances.
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