Phase_shift22 Posted May 21, 2017 Posted May 21, 2017 So I've been trying various ways to meet people/girls. One of the ways suggested was group hikes through local hiking clubs, since I'm an outdoors type. That's been going swell except for the fact that generally speaking, the ratios are something north of 4 to 1 guys/girls, and some of the guys are aggressive. I mean to the point that there is no room for me to really do anything. A good example was a hike I went on recently. There was a girl who seemed nice and I was able to talk to her a bit early on in the hike. We had several common interests (cooking, photography, cosmology) and the conversation went well- she was impressed by my knowledge of these topics and I was able to give her a few cooking/photography tips. However, there was another guy, let's just call him "Guy A" for this discussion who also talked to her during the hike. In the beginning, he merely joined our group conversations, but mid way and especially towards the end of the hike, he was VERY AGGRESSIVE about talking to this girl, where there was no room for anyone else to talk to her at all. Their conversations were kinda one sided, him asking a bunch of questions and her not giving many answers, but it wasn't so awkward the he was going to stop. Obviously, I wouldn't want to try to join this conversation, since I would probably come off as another overbearing jerk to the girl as well. Generally, if there's a girl I'm interested in during a hike, I'll talk to her a little bit to see if we have some interests and then kind of let the convo go at its own pace. Since it's a group hike, I try not to be too overbearing and give the girl enough space so that she can talk to other people as well (there's something to be said about being too interested too soon), but given the fact that this has happened to me several times now, I'm starting to rethink my strategy. Side note: I'm not sure if I should make this another thread, but when I have been able to meet girls on these hikes, it doesn't usually lead to anything either. I have a lot of varied interests, from cooking to martial arts to tennis to gardening, etc. So when I meet girls who are also into these topics, I'm able to talk quite in depth about these topics and most often given them helpful advice to improve their cooking or gardening etc. Which is cool, but a lot of times when I try to get their contact info or number at the end of the hike, they dodge. Mind you, usually I try to work in the convo "hey, I have this picture I took that you liked, let me text it to you" or "i can email you that cooking recipe" but they always decline either flatly or "contact me through the hiking website" which I do, but they never respond. For the most part, the conversation between me and these girls is pretty good during the hike; we talk pretty evenly where we both asking questions or making a concerted effort to keep the conversation going, I try to work in humor which they laugh at and I usually get a pretty good vibe about the overall experience. So I am puzzled as to why they are unwilling to go any further after the hike. Thanks.
Imajerk17 Posted May 21, 2017 Posted May 21, 2017 Well, it's hard to tell what really happened from this narrative. In the example you gave though, it is quite possible that it came across to the girl that you were bowing out--either you weren't interested or the other guy intimidated you. That said though, girls are not stupid. They can make choices on who to talk to as well. If you HAD stuck around in the conversation (instead of drifting away as it sounds that you did) and she liked you better, she would, well, keep talking to you. 1
Kamille Posted May 21, 2017 Posted May 21, 2017 It kind of sounds like you're overthinking your moves. Are you in the moment when you're talking with these girls? 1
smackie9 Posted May 21, 2017 Posted May 21, 2017 (edited) How old are you? Topics like cooking and gardening is for seniors...time to drop that subject matter. You want to come off as alpha you need to be a little more "assertive" and just ask questions like that other dude. Talk about travel, clubbing, craft beer, great places to eat, music/concerts, other hikes, camping (this is possible date stuff). Don't be exchanging cooking recipes.....it's no wonder they are dodging and running away.....cosmetology? really?? they prob think you are gay/bi...... Edited May 21, 2017 by smackie9
Author Phase_shift22 Posted May 21, 2017 Author Posted May 21, 2017 How old are you? Topics like cooking and gardening is for seniors...time to drop that subject matter. You want to come off as alpha you need to be a little more "assertive" and just ask questions like that other dude. Talk about travel, clubbing, craft beer, great places to eat, music/concerts, other hikes, camping (this is possible date stuff). Fair point. I just go with the flow man. What I gave was one example-she was more of a science/homebody type so for her I went on that angle. Normally though, I'll ask them about other hikes they've been on and then when they ask me, and I'd casually get around to talking about hiking the Grand Canyon or Hawaii or hiking the southern Arizona desert by myself in 100 degree heat where i encountered a number of rattlesnakes and had to deal with them. Or I'll show them a picture of a lightning strike over a city when I got stuck inside a thunderstorm when I was on a mountain. I have a fair amount of stories to tell. Well, it's hard to tell what really happened from this narrative. In the example you gave though, it is quite possible that it came across to the girl that you were bowing out--either you weren't interested or the other guy intimidated you. I suppose? Like I said though, these things are a balance. My thoughts were if I'm trying to spend every single second of the hike with that girl, she might take it as me being too overbearing/overwhelming. But maybe this is incorrect, which is what brought me here. If you could further clarify, that would be appreciated. That said though, girls are not stupid. They can make choices on who to talk to as well. If you HAD stuck around in the conversation [...] and she liked you better, she would, well, keep talking to you. Fair point. If that's the case, then it simply boils down to attractiveness or lack thereof on my part or other intangibles like her assessment of our "compatibility," etc. where no amount of swashbuckling tales would then make any difference. I'd either need to find and address those issues (if possible) or look elsewhere to meet girls.
Imajerk17 Posted May 21, 2017 Posted May 21, 2017 (edited) I suppose? Like I said though, these things are a balance. My thoughts were if I'm trying to spend every single second of the hike with that girl, she might take it as me being too overbearing/overwhelming. But maybe this is incorrect, which is what brought me here. If you could further clarify, that would be appreciated. I meant this. You are having an interaction with this girl on your hike. It is presumably going well. The interaction between you and her ends, and then she is talking to this guy. How/when does the interaction with this girl end? Does it end when this guy walks over or does it instead tend to end before that? If you and she are talking and she seems to be enjoying the conversation, and this guy just butts in, then you need to be making more of an effort to stay in the conversation instead of just slinking off. I mean, if she decides to talk to this other guy over you, that is her choice. At least give her the chance to CHOOSE keeping on talking to you though. And if she and Aggressive Guy are in a conversation and she doesn't seem to be enjoying it, then you can walk over and join in the conversation, as he did yours. You may end up being her hero from rescuing her from an interaction she wasn't enjoying! Again if you go over again she may decide to start talking to you instead or she may not--if she decides instead to keep talking to this guy that is her choice. Fair point. If that's the case, then it simply boils down to attractiveness or lack thereof on my part or other intangibles like her assessment of our "compatibility," etc. where no amount of swashbuckling tales would then make any difference. I'd either need to find and address those issues (if possible) or look elsewhere to meet girls. What I meant (and I mentioned again above in this post) is that if a girl wants to keep talking to you and you don't just slink away because you had "competition", then she will keep on talking to you. However, it is all about how you and she were connecting before that. So yes, what you do talk about aka "game" does matter. ******** So to sum up what I was saying, you have to learn to hit the sweet spot between being assertive AND giving a woman space. And to this end, overall you need to learn to be more assertive. Edited May 21, 2017 by Imajerk17
Author Phase_shift22 Posted May 22, 2017 Author Posted May 22, 2017 Thanks for the clarification. The interactions pretty much ended whenever the group stopped and then the hikers reorganized themselves- pretty much, we'd be talking, then the entire group would stop where she'd go closer to read a sign or hear what the hike leader was saying and then she'd stay there. Or while stopping, she'd hear another conversation of interest and join in on that. It would have been very clear had I followed her after that that I was "going out of my way" to be with her, which I thought would have been overbearing. Meaning, she was putting out 0 effort to try to stay with/continue to be with me; she was more talking to me because it was "convenient." It was times like these that the other guy came in and then stuck to her like glue. I guess as I'm typing this out, I think it's a fair assessment to say that she just wasn't really all that into me. Oh well. And maybe these hikes aren't really the best place to meet girls either, since the guy/girl ratios are so skewed (4 or 5 to 1), unless I want to do some hardcore competition with these guyse (which really isn't my style) and I probably won't win at anyway given the fact I probably won't be the smoothest operator among them or there'll be someone more attractive than me among them. Perhaps that's part of my problem- my way of thinking up till now has been kind of thinking that interactions with girls should be mutual- that is we should both want to talk to and hang out with each other; there really should be no "girl chasing." However, at these hikes and at just about every other venue I go to (happy hour groups, co-ed tennis matches, kayaking hangouts) the guy girl ratio is always heavily skewed and the guys that seem to do well are the ones that are super aggressive like the guy I saw on this hike. For those of you who are NBA fans, the analogy I can make is, in terms of dating, I should be like how Dennis Rodman was on the court- throwing elbows, kicking people and playing very aggressively to do whatever to get that basketball to my team.
GemmaUK Posted May 22, 2017 Posted May 22, 2017 I agree with Imajerk in that you need to find that mid-point. Hikes are an easy way to have conversations here and there along the way. Did this guy - the aggressive egt her number or ask her out? It doesn't sound like she was interested in him from what you're saying. The other thing I would add in is a sense of humour. I went on a little tour of a city last week, me and 3 guys - 2 of the guys I had not met before that day. For a multitude of reasons I won't go into one of the guys and I will never date but we had a connection without doubt - he was funny, sarcastic and self depreciating (as am I) and all the way through the day we were getting together for a chats along the way. At the stop offs we had we were like the cheeky little kids - not even going as far as flirting though (due to circumstance). If there weren't a multitude of reasons not to date him then I'd keep in touch, do something else and would go on a date with him - he was fun and he and I both paid attention to each other. We'll never date but I've thought about him every day since. 1
Author Phase_shift22 Posted May 22, 2017 Author Posted May 22, 2017 I agree with Imajerk in that you need to find that mid-point. Hikes are an easy way to have conversations here and there along the way. Did this guy - the aggressive egt her number or ask her out? It doesn't sound like she was interested in him from what you're saying. Correct. That's the unfortunate part about the situation. If you have multiple guys who are "not taking the hint" and swarming the girl, unless you know her, it's really hard to swoop in and play hero while distinguishing yourself from just being another guy who's trying to get with her. That's kind of why I'm starting to think hiking isn't the best place. I went on a little tour of a city last week, me and 3 guys - 2 of the guys I had not met before that day. For a multitude of reasons I won't go into one of the guys and I will never date but we had a connection without doubt - he was funny, sarcastic and self depreciating (as am I) and all the way through the day we were getting together for a chats along the way. At the stop offs we had we were like the cheeky little kids - not even going as far as flirting though (due to circumstance). If there weren't a multitude of reasons not to date him then I'd keep in touch, do something else and would go on a date with him - he was fun and he and I both paid attention to each other. We'll never date but I've thought about him every day since. Sounds like those guys got further with you than I did with that girl, but even then they still didn't make it with you. Thanks for sharing. I've probably been one of those guys you referred to in your story before, contextually. I guess the one thing I would ask is, if you were interested in dating one of those guys, how would you have acted differently? Or conversely how did you act differently with these guys, being that you were not interested in dating them? I'm asking so that I can learn to pick up better on cues from girls as to whether or not they are interested.
elaine567 Posted May 22, 2017 Posted May 22, 2017 Women in general like to be wanted, so if a guy is hanging back or has merged into the background, most will assume he is not interested in her. By allowing those other guys to hog the limelight you are giving out the signal you are not THAT interested. However the more worrying aspect here for me is this I have a lot of varied interests, from cooking to martial arts to tennis to gardening, etc. So when I meet girls who are also into these topics, I'm able to talk quite in depth about these topics and most often given them helpful advice to improve their cooking or gardening etc. Which is cool, but a lot of times when I try to get their contact info or number at the end of the hike, they dodge. Mind you, usually I try to work in the convo "hey, I have this picture I took that you liked, let me text it to you" or "i can email you that cooking recipe" but they always decline either flatly or "contact me through the hiking website" which I do, but they never respond. My concern here is that you may be coming across as a "know it all" and with your "helpful advice and tips" it may all be coming across as condescending and patronising to these women. Are you imparting your knowledge in a humorous and entertaining way or is just all coming across as boring and maybe a little too intense for most? Seems odd that you are having such great conversations from your POV, but they then decline any further contact rather rudely or they shut you down flatly.
GemmaUK Posted May 23, 2017 Posted May 23, 2017 Sounds like those guys got further with you than I did with that girl, but even then they still didn't make it with you. Thanks for sharing. I've probably been one of those guys you referred to in your story before, contextually. Only the one guy, I was friends with one other already and friendly with the other chap. Nope, due to circumstances, nothing will happen. I guess the one thing I would ask is, if you were interested in dating one of those guys, how would you have acted differently? Or conversely how did you act differently with these guys, being that you were not interested in dating them? I'm asking so that I can learn to pick up better on cues from girls as to whether or not they are interested. I would have flirted, touched, gauged if I got the same responses back.
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