When does it go from innocent to something more?

[Overtaxed]

Zona, what would be your wife's reaction if you told her you acted inappropriately or cheated because your sex drive is too high?

 

I'd guess she wouldn't buy it ...

 

Mr. Lucky

 

Yeah, exactly.

 

"I want sex more than my W does" is a true statement for about 95% of the married population. If that was a "good" reason to cheat, just about every man out there would be cheating. It's BS, call it for what it is.

 

Now, that said, if you're with a HD woman, be very happy and do everything you can to keep that side of your relationship healthy. It's very rare, and it's a wonderful way to connect with someone that's private to just you 2. But still, HD or not, cheating is NEVER a valid reason; if you really want to have that much sex and your partner simply can't keep up, you need to either D, get a toy/get well acquainted with your hands, or ask for an open relationship. That's it, end of the list.

[wmacbride]

Yeah, exactly.

 

"I want sex more than my W does" is a true statement for about 95% of the married population. If that was a "good" reason to cheat, just about every man out there would be cheating. It's BS, call it for what it is.

 

Now, that said, if you're with a HD woman, be very happy and do everything you can to keep that side of your relationship healthy. It's very rare, and it's a wonderful way to connect with someone that's private to just you 2. But still, HD or not, cheating is NEVER a valid reason; if you really want to have that much sex and your partner simply can't keep up, you need to either D, get a toy/get well acquainted with your hands, or ask for an open relationship. That's it, end of the list.

 

Basing my opinion on what the op says...

 

If the contact between her and the pseudo- other man was strictly heavy flirtation ( and even if it was more ) I don't think it was really about sex per se.

 

His wife sounds more like the kind of woman who uses her ability to attract men and then flirt with them as a source of power. In short, it's not the sexual aspect for her, it's the control. She's using sex to control both her spouse and this other man. She likes the attention, and she likes that her actions are ramping up the "guarding " aspect of their marriage. This isn't about sex at all.

 

If she said to this other guy that she no longer wanted to be flirty with him, I expect she'd never really her from him again. As it stands right now, she's got both the op and om dancing to her tune and willing to excuse her behavior because she has a high sex drive.

 

The op himself says they are very open and can talk about anything, but not really this. She's hiding something,and if their marriage is "open minded" as he says, she wouldn't feel the need to hind anything, and if she was feeling neglected, she'd tell him.

Edited May 7, 2017 by wmacbride

[salparadise]

Zona,

I wonder if the resumption of the active sex life with your wife coincided with timing of this other guy moving out of state? If it did, I'd be inclined to ask her straight up if they had an affair... and pay particular attention to the involuntary eye movements and body language as you ask. Then pay attention to whether she answers with a simple "no" or if she overcompensates. It won't be definitive but since you know her well it's likely that the response will be either believable or not.

 

If you can get into her phone and see why she's guarding it, do it. You have sufficient reason to snoop at this point, and that's not your fault at all.

 

I would not let this get rug-swept. You don't want to actually enable the worst outcome by doing nothing. Since you two have good communication, I'd get it all out on the table and try to put an end to it before anything else happens, assuming that it hasn't already.

 

Then make your best effort to stay closely connected and have lots of great sex. The best chance for a good outcome is taking care of your marriage and getting this other guy out of the picture completely... that is, getting her to cut him off now.

[QuietDan]

If she is smart. After this last encounter, seek he would have cleaned up any questionable material off the phone you know she has.

[Zona]

Hi,

 

Nothing salacious to report. Everything is good.

 

Phone is clean (and it's not possible to erase text message traces that show up in your cellphone usage report from your cell carrier). She didn't erase any messages.

 

My wife is a good woman. Not sure what she was thinking recontacting that pig, although I am convinced it was innocent on her part. I do believe she is a bit naive about such things.

 

Not much else to say at this point. I think I might talk to the doc about getting a bunch of those little blue pills so I can keep up with her better, or at least try

 

I'm going to take her out of town for a getaway next weekend, just the two of us. She means everything to me.

[wmacbride]

Hi,

 

Nothing salacious to report. Everything is good.

 

Phone is clean (and it's not possible to erase text message traces that show up in your cellphone usage report from your cell carrier). She didn't erase any messages.

 

My wife is a good woman. Not sure what she was thinking recontacting that pig, although I am convinced it was innocent on her part. I do believe she is a bit naive about such things.

 

Not much else to say at this point. I think I might talk to the doc about getting a bunch of those little blue pills so I can keep up with her better, or at least try

 

I'm going to take her out of town for a getaway next weekend, just the two of us. She means everything to me.

 

You are still making excuses for her. Do you really believe that viagra will solve her issues?

 

Seriously, she is playing you. Women do not need to be told when a guy is hitting on her. She may play the doe eyed innocent, but she connected with him because she was getting something out of it. Quite frankly, her boundaries are paper thin.

[Mr. Lucky]

Not sure what she was thinking recontacting that pig, although I am convinced it was innocent on her part.

 

You don't know what she was thinking when she responded with a smiley-face to his requests to sleep with her?

 

Mr. Lucky

[Cephalopod]

Your wife is going to cheat on you someday, if not with this OM then somebody else, because you have shown her that you value keeping the peace with her above protecting the marriage.

 

Weak.

[Try]

Chest thumping won't work with a woman like her. She is a medical doctor, and thus a highly educated, independent and intelligent woman

Not sure what she was thinking recontacting that pig, although I am convinced it was innocent on her part. I do believe she is a bit naive about such things.

On one hand you tell us that she is "a highly educated, independent and intelligent woman", yet on the other hand you disregard all of this and tell us that she is "a bit naive". The only thing that these two opposing images of your wife have in common, is that they both let you make excuses.

[QuietDan]

Hi,

 

Nothing salacious to report. Everything is good.

 

Phone is clean (and it's not possible to erase text message traces that show up in your cellphone usage report from your cell carrier). She didn't erase any messages.

 

My wife is a good woman. Not sure what she was thinking recontacting that pig, although I am convinced it was innocent on her part. I do believe she is a bit naive about such things.

 

Not much else to say at this point. I think I might talk to the doc about getting a bunch of those little blue pills so I can keep up with her better, or at least try

 

I'm going to take her out of town for a getaway next weekend, just the two of us. She means everything to me.

 

Hey there Zona, hope you are right.

Hope for the best, but, with smoke, best to keep an eye out for fires.

She does appear to have some wayward tendencies. For at least a decade now.

Thinking you might consider putting a voice activated tape recorder hidden in the car for when she thinks she is alone and has some private time to herself.

Just a thought....

[Just a Guy]

Hi Folks, it seems that the OP is oblivious of all the red flags waving in his face and that he is fully invested in the belief that his wife is innocent and infidelity proof. With that mind set I think it would be difficult to budge him from his entrenched position and he will only defend his wife more strongly. The only way he will believe that his wife is capable of betraying him is when he actually finds evidence of such betrayal and of course by then it would be too late. I guess we are all taking a horse to water but he is refusing to drink so may be everyone should let sleeping dogs lie lest they wake up and bite us. Sadly some people just have to learn their lessons the hard way and there is nothing others can do about it. Warm wishes.

[mikeylo]

It seems like his wife is really one of those who has her nose in the book and inexperienced with the way of guys. If that's the case, no matter how intellectually smart she is , she could really be unaware how to handle men hiting on her!

 

OP, are you her first?

[usa1ah]

Hi,

 

Nothing salacious to report. Everything is good.

 

Phone is clean (and it's not possible to erase text message traces that show up in your cellphone usage report from your cell carrier). She didn't erase any messages.

 

My wife is a good woman. Not sure what she was thinking recontacting that pig, although I am convinced it was innocent on her part. I do believe she is a bit naive about such things.

 

Not much else to say at this point. I think I might talk to the doc about getting a bunch of those little blue pills so I can keep up with her better, or at least try

 

I'm going to take her out of town for a getaway next weekend, just the two of us. She means everything to me.

 

Wow. That is one heck of a turnaround. Glad to see you have the most noble and trustworthy wife.

 

Did you not like what we had to relate?

 

You asked for the experience of others that have gone through infidelity to see if it went along with what you have experienced with your wife.

 

I believe your wife has cheated by what YOU have told us. If you do not wish to hear this then by all means have a great trip and bury your head in the sand.

 

Good luck.

[Mrs. John Adams]

Zona,

 

Many people recommended that my husband divorce me. Some folks told him that my being a faithful good wife for many years since my affair proved my remorse.

 

I tell you this because...It is your life...your decision. If you love your wife and you believe your wife loves you...then your decision to continue in your marriage is your call.

 

John and I wish you and your wife the very best that life has to offer. Good luck.

[wmacbride]

The fact that you don't/won't tell your wife you saw what she's been doing behind your back tells me:

 

That you are afraid of her

That you aren't honest with your wife

 

 

The fact that she does this behind your back tells me:

 

That she's not at all honest

That she needs validation from other men

That she's seeking for more than you can give her

That she's sneaky

That she's interested enough to risk the marriage

That she doesn't respect you

 

 

These lists show serious issues! Get to a professional at least to learn how to be honest with each other.

 

Rewarding bad behavior with a vacation is the worst thing you could do right now. That's not a solution - that's putting your head in the sand while rug sweeping.

 

Your lack of finding SOLUTIONS to CHANGE this will lead to more cheating on her part...she knows she got away with it AND got a vacation to boot.

 

This post makes so much sense.

 

Part of being married is accepting the bad with the good, and in this case, the bad is facing up to what his wife is doing. The good is that, if they can actually be honest and open with one another, they could really grow as a couple.

[Zona]

This post makes so much sense.

 

Part of being married is accepting the bad with the good, and in this case, the bad is facing up to what his wife is doing. The good is that, if they can actually be honest and open with one another, they could really grow as a couple.

 

The totality of a 20 year marriage can't be viewed by looking at a few short facebook conversations between my wife and this guy over a few months. After carefully re-reading the conversations, it is clear that she is not interested in any kind of relationship with him other than purely platonic, and she made it perfectly clear to him in the end.

 

It would be worse for our marriage for me to overreact. I have never actually seen any evidence of an EA, and especially a PA, so now why in the world would I make a federal case out of this?

 

I'm sorry that many of you have suffered through real infidelity, but don't project what happened to you onto others without concrete justification. That doesn't help anyone and in many cases is counter-productive.

[understand50]

The totality of a 20 year marriage can't be viewed by looking at a few short facebook conversations between my wife and this guy over a few months. After carefully re-reading the conversations, it is clear that she is not interested in any kind of relationship with him other than purely platonic, and she made it perfectly clear to him in the end.

 

It would be worse for our marriage for me to overreact. I have never actually seen any evidence of an EA, and especially a PA, so now why in the world would I make a federal case out of this?

 

I'm sorry that many of you have suffered through real infidelity, but don't project what happened to you onto others without concrete justification. That doesn't help anyone and in many cases is counter-productive.

 

Zona,

 

But going back to the original question, this conversation is inappropriate. You need to talk to your wife about boundaries, is a non treating way. Just, hey, looks like this is a little too close, what say you? I don't share some here that think she is fooling around or about to, but she needs to act more like a married woman. Thing grow from less, and I will add sometimes. I would not feel if I was doing the same that I was being "good" to my wife. Maybe that is the key here, if it was you, what would you think, and how would you explain it to your wife? May be a way to start the conversation, if you have not already.

 

I wish you luck....

[Zona]

Zona,

 

But going back to the original question, this conversation is inappropriate. You need to talk to your wife about boundaries, is a non treating way. Just, hey, looks like this is a little too close, what say you? I don't share some here that think she is fooling around or about to, but she needs to act more like a married woman. Thing grow from less, and I will add sometimes. I would not feel if I was doing the same that I was being "good" to my wife. Maybe that is the key here, if it was you, what would you think, and how would you explain it to your wife? May be a way to start the conversation, if you have not already.

 

I wish you luck....

 

Yes, well put.

 

I will revisit the issue when she is feeling relaxed and open. I think the obvious remaining question is why did she contact this guy, who is clearly infatuated with her, after 8 years? Asking this question will be a good way to confirm boundaries we are both comfortable with.

 

She is an extremely outgoing person who has many many friends, and she makes an effort to keep in touch with them. That is pretty obviously why, but still, she needs to consider how such contacts could become problematic, no matter how innocent her intentions.

[mikeylo]

While your wife is innocent here and may have a non aggressive approach to put the guy in his place, you still need to affair proof your marriage. This incident can be a great thing to make your relationship stronger than before. There will always be guys who are attracted to her, for the same reasons you are attracted to her.But if she is loyal to you , open lines of communication , flirt and make her blush like her new bf !

[wmacbride]

While your wife is innocent here and may have a non aggressive approach to put the guy in his place, you still need to affair proof your marriage. This incident can be a great thing to make your relationship stronger than before. There will always be guys who are attracted to her, for the same reasons you are attracted to her.But if she is loyal to you , open lines of communication , flirt and make her blush like her new bf !

 

You can't affair proof a marriage, as that assumption is predicated on the concept that you can control someone elses behavior.

 

You can't

 

No matter what he does, if his wife wants external validation, she will find it. It sounds like she was already getting this from her husband, but she needs to hear it from other men as well, hence he flirting ( and maybe more). This is a problem she has, and the op simply can't fix that. No one can but her.

 

All the op can do is be the best husband he can be, and what "best" means in this context will depend on both his wife and his personality and needs.

[Try]

she needs to consider how such contacts could become problematic, no matter how innocent her intentions.

Although you say that "she needs to consider how such contacts could become problematic, no matter how innocent her intentions", the truth is that she needs to consider that there should be no contact with a member of the opposite sex that has a history of seeking a non-platonic relationship with her.

[usa1ah]

Then why did you post in the infidelity section?

 

Your are the one that brought up your wife's past.

 

You are the one the said she is extremely high drive.

 

You are the one that said you two were not have any 8yrs ago.

 

If it was just communication problems then why not post in the general section.

 

Bottom line. With what you have said your wife cheated on you. She contacted the other guy for the thrill it gives her.

 

By the way, my wife hasn't cheated on me. No miss directed anger here.

[merrmeade]

Anything that you do ... that you would

not do in front of your spouse

or

not allow your spouse [to] read or listen to....

is inappropriate

That's it. This much should pinned on this forum somewhere. Yes, that is where they start to go wrong. And frankly: they know it but their minds make up all sorts of arguments to give entitlement.

 

I remember asking the OW, a family member, why they kept their "friendship" from me, if it was just friendship. She answered, "Because we didn't think you could handle it." And as obvious as the absurdity is in that statement to others, it was not to her. Just an example of how the mind can work, but my husband is all that mattered and that was another story. He knew the argument was absurd and didn't try to continue pretending but did believe for quite a while that they were "mostly" just friends.

 

My point is that you have to get inside your spouse's head and figure out how she thinks of it. Doesn't matter what he's saying or doing. You need to know the bottom line of how they're connecting - from her. And if it rings untrue, you have to dig deeper.

Edited May 13, 2017 by merrmeade

[Superchicken]

Yes, well put.

 

I will revisit the issue when she is feeling relaxed and open. I think the obvious remaining question is why did she contact this guy, who is clearly infatuated with her, after 8 years? Asking this question will be a good way to confirm boundaries we are both comfortable with.

 

Have you ever thought about an ex ?, or someone else at times ?.

We all do, and with FB, its so easy to find out how they are doing, who their with, etc.

 

 

Heck, I've searched my ex's on FB just to see what they look like now, and how their doing.

I did however, stop short of friending them. Not due to anything but me not wanting to take it further.

But, this may have occurred to your Wife, or maybe just wanted a little attention (Chatting, not sexual) from an old friend.

 

 

Its good you have shown more interest in her, and I would look at going out together to some place, like a interstate getaway, or romantic weekend.

Spend all day, and night with her, and just listen and talk with anything she wants.

I normally have match sticks holding my eyes open when my wife talks to me by the end of the night...

 

 

I also don't believe she has done anything, as there would have been more evidence around.

But, still, would have pisses me off as well to hear my wife fib on what was discusses and who contacted who.

 

 

But, I think that's more of a "Oh crap, he's going to get pissed off now if I tell him" reason why.

 

 

See, sometimes, it is a happy ending.

I like these posts..

 

 

On a final note, may I suggest a rose a day for a week in response to her blocking Mr Crapman.

 

 

Ted.

[Zona]

OK, so I finally did ask her about the things that were bugging me.

 

Q: Why the h*ll did you reconnect with this guy when you know d@mn well what you will get from him?

A: She said she was curious if he ever finished Physician Assistant school

 

Q: Why did you say HE contacted you when it was the other way around?

A: Got a BS lawyer type answer in regards to semantics, but she did fess up.

 

Q: Why did you only cut him off completely when you learned I knew about the communications?

A: Another BS answer about how it had been a few weeks anyways since the last communication, and it was likely because she had thrown cold water on his advances.

 

I made sure to embarrass the he11 out of her:p. I even mentioned that her communications with him were popping up on a laptop my son and I were using to study for his math test. This is true because she forgot to log out of facebook, and message alerts were coming in. I told her that our son probably read those pathetic messages he had sent. She was horrified about that, and said she would talk to him and try to explain. I don't think he actually paid any attention to the messages, but it was still a good way to embarrass her and rub her nose in it.

 

I was kind of surprised how she tried to downplay it and make it sound like I was just overly jealous and acting obsessively. I guess that is just to be expected. She just kept saying that in her mind it was nothing.

 

Anyways, my trust has dropped from near perfect to maybe 95%. Her naivete about how devious some womanizers can be could get her full of some other dude's you-know-what if she stumbles into this kind of situation again. Hopefully the embarrassment of it all has driven it home.

 

She is the best thing to ever happen to me, and she knows it. We set new boundaries about communications we know the other would not approve of, so overall I am satisfied. I am just so very glad I found out about these communications before this womanizing scum could get to her. He is the kind of guy who would keep trying to chip away at her defenses and never take no for an answer.