MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted July 27, 2005 Posted July 27, 2005 I am not quite sure where I am. I started talking to a guy on msn a couple of months ago. We met online last fall and didn't talk much all winter (I was going thru a separation and madly in love with someone else at the same time). After the rebound fizzled, this new guy said hello online. It took a while, but I remembered who he was. We talked on and off, friendly conversation, and decided we would like to meet. He has his own business and works 10-12 hrs a day and usually 7 days a week. I guess I made myself too available near the beginning because he always knew my schedule, and always had something planned (work, family, friends). Finally there was an evening a few weeks ago where he invited me and my kids over for a swim. I like him. He's different. He's 43, divorced, no kids. We have alot in common but since we've only met once we have alot to learn about each other. I did some not-so-good things like giving him crap for working so much (jokingly) and told him this was why my last relationship didn't work. We argued(?) a bit on msn about this and I told him people need to find a balance between work and "life". He thinks I need a guy who works 9-5. I argued this because I am busy too, just there can be an in-between 40hr weeks and 24/7. He made a cute comment that the "love gods don't like us" and maybe cuz of the things i have said, he is afraid to ask me out for fear he may have to cancel, and I'll give him a hard time. Really, I will because if you make a date with me, I feel it's important and your staff can handle things that come up on a Sat night. right??? So we talk alot and have concluded that we would like to get together more often and get to know each other better. We live about 45 min apart so not always easy to get to each other (his parents live in my town). So our phone conversation about the long weekend went like this: Me: So what have u planned for the long wknd? He: Well I told my staff I'm off Friday at 5pm and not back until Tuesday and I left them instructions Me: Wow good for you! You need a break. He: mmHmmm Me: So.....what are u gonna do with all your time off? He: I dunno. Me: okay.... He: What are you doing? Me: I don't know. There are fireworks Friday night and the fair is on here, I haven't made any definite plans yet. He: Oh. Are you coming into the city? sheesh get a hint buddy! Ask me out and I'll come to the city for pete's sake! He: The (two week festival) starts this weekend. Me: Oh I haven't gone in years He: I went last year. Me: thinking.....is he going to ask me out or what. Me: So um...well....I'll talk to u before the weekend then He: Yeah maybe I'll think of something we can do Me: That would be great. He: I'm not sure which day would be best. Prob not Fri night cuz I might get held up at work. And I don't want to say definitely saturday cuz something might come up....(he gave a lame example). aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack this is driving me nuts. I read the frickin book so I can't very well ask him out haha. How do I get this guy to ask me out so I can find out if I want to date him or not before we get too attached on MSN?
Dasani Posted July 27, 2005 Posted July 27, 2005 amazes me.. honestly that as much as you would like him to ask you out- you didnt mention asking HIM out. as much as people would love to have the knight in shining armor, or the guy who does this and does that for you- guys ALSO like it when they are asked out for an evening on the town. now you may have done this- but in the IM convo you paraphrased- it was all, "i cant believe he hasnt asked me out yet." according to your name, I'm going to put the theory you're over 40 out there. do you really want/need to play that game? or would you rather take the opportunity as it comes your way? If a girl wants a guy- and the guy is a bit stand off'ish... do a role reversal. You are just in the same situation guys are in when they're trying to ask out an attractive girl but dont see a "is she into me" vibe. They just need to try. Ask him out yourself.
Electrogrrl Posted July 27, 2005 Posted July 27, 2005 Is there something that's stopping you from asking him out? Are you trying not to be too aggressive or something? It seemed from your conversation that you were both trying to hint to each other that you wanted to get together but neither would just come out and say it. The one thing that bothers me is that he's giving you excuses already. Sure he's busy, but if you really want to see a person you'll find the time, no matter what your schedule looks like (I used to work full time Mon-Fri then go to school in the evenings every night and I would still make time to see my b/f). If you ask him out, and he makes up lame excuses, I say forget about him. Not worth your time. However, you'll never get to that part if you don't make a move. Go for it!
JanieQP Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 If he's already commented that 'the love gods don't like you', this doesn't sound good. 'Too attached on MSN' isn't an attachment - it's a nice little diversion for him. He's keeping you on the back burner, holding you in his stable of attentive admirers. Sorry if it sounds harsh - I've been giving myself this talk all day about the guy who's really NOT into me. If your guy-in-question can run a business, he can make a date with a woman he wants to actively date. My guy-in-question is a doctor, and even if he's a bit dorky, I'm sure he could figure out how to use the phone if he were so inclined. This really bites, but any minute we spend on them is wasted time. It also sounds a bit like you might be nagging him sometimes. You told him this was why my last relationship didn't work, he's afraid you'll be hard on him and you know you would be hard on him, and you tried to hint him into asking you out during his time off. When I'm on the fence about liking someone or not, this kind of stuff tips the scales in the wrong direction, fast. Most people don't feel especially attracted to even mild pressure or negativity. (I'm not saying that you're negative, just that it could have come across to him this way.) I've decided not to respond to the last e-mail of Dr. Non-Alpha. We went through this once last winter (with me not answering his last mail) and he never picked up the phone. So he's not going to take action this time, either. Whether I'm not his type or what, I can't change it. Fortunately I didn't drool over him or anything, or say anything that would indicate real interest, but I'm really into him and it's rotten to face the fact that he doesn't return the favor. To me, it looks like your best bet now is to find a way to save face and recover some dignity. What if you tell this guy that you met someone and want to investigate that? Sorry so much of my response is about me ... I hope you can pick out some bits that make sense for you, too.
J dub Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 A man said to me once, men will move mountains to get a hold of a woman they want to see. They will MAKE time in the busiest of busy schedules. If they get caught up in something, then they REschedule, but make time never-the-less. Anything less than that, he's just lukewarm about the relationship and proceed with caution.
alphamale Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Originally posted by MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 How do I get this guy to ask me out so I can find out if I want to date him or not before we get too attached on MSN? Honestly MWC_LBA40....you should forget about this one cause he does not seem too interested.
A Fly onThe Wall Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Originally posted by J dub A man said to me once, men will move mountains to get a hold of a woman they want to see. They will MAKE time in the busiest of busy schedules. If they get caught up in something, then they REschedule, but make time never-the-less. Anything less than that, he's just lukewarm about the relationship and proceed with caution. you are soooo right JB .. I have moved a few mountains myself in the past and I think all guys have.
J dub Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Originally posted by A Fly onThe Wall you are soooo right JB .. I have moved a few mountains myself in the past and I think all guys have. It doesnt mean there's anything wrong with YOU, it just means hes not good enough
Author MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted July 28, 2005 Author Posted July 28, 2005 For all of you who think I should ask HIM out, this in no way tells me he's into me, which is why I will NOT ask him out. And, in our earlier conversations I left so many doors wide open for him to ask me over and he always had a busy excuse, so the ball has been in his court for a while now. You're right Janie, JDub and Alpha....I don't think this guy will move mountains. He has way too many excuses related to his company. Even though he told me he has the wknd off, last night he found out he is short two employees this wknd. Anyway, here is an update: I was online again (I really gotta stop it)! I started talking to a guy back and forth msgs and he said why don't I just call you. So he did, and we talked for 2 hrs, and he was so easy to talk to! I told him I wasn't sure what I was up to this wknd because I was waiting to see if this other guy was going to ask me out. I know, I give away tooooo much information to guys LOL. Anyway, he asked me out and asked "would u rather wait for a maybe date, or go out on a for-sure date!" I said OK I would love to go out with you! So I have a date Sat night. If for some reason I do not see this other guy over the wknd (ie. he has no time) then I will use all the words (nice, maybe, friend) and kindly tell him it's over.....oh and I will mean it too. There are other guys out there who WILL move those mountains.
Outcast Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Me: So.....what are u gonna do with all your time off? He: I dunno. Me: okay.... He: What are you doing? Me: I don't know. There are fireworks Friday night and the fair is on here, I haven't made any definite plans yet. He: Oh. Are you coming into the city? Look, he's not going to invite you anywhere unless you sound at least a bit interested. That was your opening to say something like 'I will be if there's something to do there. Got any ideas?' He: The (two week festival) starts this weekend. Me: Oh I haven't gone in years He: I went last year. He said this hoping you'd express interest - like 'that's great!'. Instead you said 'I haven't gone in years' - which translates to 'I quit thinking it was interesting long ago and have no desire to go.' Then he says 'I went last year' and you could say 'are you going this year, too? I think I'll go' but no, you let it drop. So basically you fended off every opportunity he gave you to show interest. And then you think he'd be stupid enough to ask you out when you've already shot him down three times? Kwitcherbitchin and quit playing games. Don't insist someone batter down your resistance with a ram in order to be 'worthy' of you. At least show a smidgen of interest, for cripes sakes. I think it's nuts to expect someone who's just met you to 'move mountains' for you.
J dub Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Good girl Go have fun with this other fella, dont ever exhaust the idea that there are always other options Let us know how it goes, too!!
alphamale Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Originally posted by MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 If for some reason I do not see this other guy over the wknd (ie. he has no time) then I will use all the words (nice, maybe, friend) and kindly tell him it's over..... why bother doing that even? you never had any relationship with him anyways
Author MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted July 28, 2005 Author Posted July 28, 2005 Originally posted by Outcast Look, he's not going to invite you anywhere unless you sound at least a bit interested. That was your opening to say something like 'I will be if there's something to do there. Got any ideas?' He said this hoping you'd express interest - like 'that's great!'. Instead you said 'I haven't gone in years' - which translates to 'I quit thinking it was interesting long ago and have no desire to go.' Then he says 'I went last year' and you could say 'are you going this year, too? I think I'll go' but no, you let it drop. So basically you fended off every opportunity he gave you to show interest. And then you think he'd be stupid enough to ask you out when you've already shot him down three times? Kwitcherbitchin and quit playing games. Don't insist someone batter down your resistance with a ram in order to be 'worthy' of you. At least show a smidgen of interest, for cripes sakes. I think it's nuts to expect someone who's just met you to 'move mountains' for you. Actually it was a 40 minute phone call and I only put the parts where I was waiting for "the question". We talked alot about how great this festival was, but he still never said the words "Would you like to go with me?" Why on earth should I expect anything less than a guy who won't even ask me out on a date for cripe's sake? I'm not playing games, and I told him just that. I had told him before when we were having a hard time finding time to get together that I'm available and here is my schedule. I don't play games and make myself unavailable when I am. When you're free let me know and we'll have to get together. (not my exact words). Again Alpha...good idea to just blow him off. We are only at the friend stage (although we did talk about what we'd like to do to each other in the bedroom - or elsewhere). I hate the friend stage. I like to take risks and put my heart on the line. Why not? You only live once!
alphamale Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Originally posted by MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Again Alpha...good idea to just blow him off. I seriously think u need to do that....institute strict NC starting today and see if he eventually contacts you. If not, then it is his loss...
Author MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted July 28, 2005 Author Posted July 28, 2005 He will contact me, but whether he asks me to go out somewhere, is what will make the decision from my end.
JanieQP Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Maybe we should have an NC-support thread ... So what does MWC do when the guy contacts with no intent of initiating a real date? That's more wasted time, right? What if she says, "great to hear from you, can't chat now, drop me a line if you want to do something!" ? I worry that my dude-in-question will find it pretty rude of me to just not answer his last e-mail at all, but I'm thinking NC is in order for my sanity. We'll run into each other in various settings - I presume I should just continue to be friendly and act interested then - and maybe tell HIM that he has MY number, call me sometime. Or what would you do? Have fun Sat. pm MWC!
clynn Posted July 28, 2005 Posted July 28, 2005 Originally posted by Outcast Look, he's not going to invite you anywhere unless you sound at least a bit interested. Kwitcherbitchin and quit playing games. Don't insist someone batter down your resistance with a ram in order to be 'worthy' of you. At least show a smidgen of interest, for cripes sakes. I think it's nuts to expect someone who's just met you to 'move mountains' for you. Hear, Hear! I'm with you on this one Outcast. You both sound pretty 'tepid' to me. Which isn't a horrible thing. What? Move mountains for someone who hasn't decided if they can handle your lifestyle yet?
Author MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted July 30, 2005 Author Posted July 30, 2005 Originally posted by clynn Hear, Hear! I'm with you on this one Outcast. You both sound pretty 'tepid' to me. Which isn't a horrible thing. What? Move mountains for someone who hasn't decided if they can handle your lifestyle yet? You obviously didn't read my rebuttle to that post. Here, I'll make it simple why it's better for the GUY to ask me out FIRST: If I have to ask a guy out cuz he's too lazy or shy or whatever his excuse is, it will be for a date and a date only. There will be no sex. If a guy asks me out, then I know he is interested in spending time with me cuz he could have asked any girl out. Now that I feel good that he is interested, he will probably get some form of sexual intimacy. There I hope that clears things up for you guys who don't know why "she" hasn't called.
d'Arthez Posted July 30, 2005 Posted July 30, 2005 Originally posted by MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 You obviously didn't read my rebuttle to that post. Here, I'll make it simple why it's better for the GUY to ask me out FIRST: If I have to ask a guy out cuz he's too lazy or shy or whatever his excuse is, it will be for a date and a date only. There will be no sex. If a guy asks me out, then I know he is interested in spending time with me cuz he could have asked any girl out. Now that I feel good that he is interested, he will probably get some form of sexual intimacy. There I hope that clears things up for you guys who don't know why "she" hasn't called. And why cannot the guy reason along this line: "If she does not ask me out, she must be conservative in that department. Very likely she is also politically conservative. I am not interested in politically conservative women. Bye bye." or this: "I am not certain if she likes me, and as I am a bit shy, I won't risk rejection. If the attraction is mutual, why the hell would not she want to ask me out? I know from experience tht if she is not interested in me, it can't work out. So better leave it at this. It will never work out, if I ask her." or this: "She will look at it as if I ask her out because I feel sorry for her."
loony Posted July 30, 2005 Posted July 30, 2005 You cling to this book because it offers you answers and rules but life is not like this and you can't fit people in schemes as easily as this book claims. The conversation with him was so-so, he didn't seem really interested, you didn't seem really interested. Nobody wanted to risk something or invest some effort. You believe that if he were into you, he would show it, he would do this and that. But let's ask some questions: "Why should he be that much into you already? What did you offer him in respect to looks, smartness, kindness, humour and whatever is on the list of desirable qualities to make him be into you?" My guess is that you're used to sitting around and waiting, expecting that some knight in shiny armour will finally get the hint. Did you show him that you really like him? Did you smile often at him? Or do you wait and hope that he finally will sweep you off your feet? If you had made him feel good about himself, if he had thought that you were into him, then I guess he might have also been more into you. Being into someone is not a one-way street, people don't start to invest feelings when they don't believe that they are reciprocated or if they don't feel that the other person is also going to invest something or meeting them half-way. The strongest attraction between two people occurs when both people let the other one know that they have a genuine interest in this person and that they would like to get to know this person better, it's an affection between equals. You would have more success with men if you realized that when it comes to love it's a giving and taking, it's two people enjoying the time they have together and having the same interests. Unless he had a strong interest in you already for whatever reasons he will certainly not going to risk making a fool out of himself and start to run after you. I think you have way, way too many expectations on what men who barely know you should do for you.
clynn Posted July 30, 2005 Posted July 30, 2005 Hey you're not really loony. That all made good sense to me!
Outcast Posted July 30, 2005 Posted July 30, 2005 If a guy asks me out, then I know he is interested in spending time with me cuz he could have asked any girl out. Now that I feel good that he is interested, he will probably get some form of sexual intimacy. Oh wow. Or maybe if a guy asks you out, he's hoping to get laid and has been turned down by everyone else he's tried lately because he did ask a bunch of girls out. Not that he'll tell you. So you think he's 'interested' merely because he asked you out and so you'll 'reward him' and he'll get his payoff of getting laid? Again. Wow. Not such a good way to go about this, methinks. I'm with Loony and clynn on this one.
loony Posted July 31, 2005 Posted July 31, 2005 If a guy asks me out, then I know he is interested in spending time with me cuz he could have asked any girl out. Now that I feel good that he is interested, he will probably get some form of sexual intimacy. I just looked up this quote and I realized that I had paraphrased more or less what Outcast had said. Your reasoning is so deeply flawed and so incrediblely naive it baffles me, as if guys were just out to meet a women and live happily after with her. Did it ever occur to you that some guys just want sex?? And believe me, it has nothing to do with how you dress or how you behave, what you say or do, you're a woman and that's good enough. Really, you have to become a bit more realistic about men and about yourself. When I was younger I also didn't really understand it why some men approached me, I thought, hell, what have I done? I don't want to have an affair and I didn't give you any signals, so what do you want? See, it doesn't matter what you do or not, just because you want a relationship and are not out for an affair, doesn't mean that they feel the same and that they will respect it. They find you attractive and they try it, from their interest in you you can not deduce that they are single and not interested in other women at the same time. Some guys prefer to ignore any clues or signals until you tell them what exactly you want, a relationship and not only sex. And then sometimes it's still not enough.
Author MWC_LifeBeginsAt40 Posted August 3, 2005 Author Posted August 3, 2005 Okay I know what you are all saying and I agree, but you misinterpret me. The first guy knows I was into him. You are all assuming I didn't give him enough "clues". We flirted alot on msn, we talked on the phone often but I always had to be the one to keep the conversation going, and sometimes we talked about the kinds of intimacies we would like to share with one another. There were alot of smiles and looking deep into each others' eyes (when my kids weren't watching of course). We're not kids, we're both 40-ish, so not like we have to play these high school guessing games. But it never seemed to go anywhere in real life.... arranging a time and place to actually see each other in person. He was always busy with work, meetings, and other previous engagements. He is a business owner, and that was always his excuse too. He would tell me "You need an 8-5 guy". No, I would tell him I just want to be able to spend time to get to know you better in real life, like once a week even. But he only had time to see me once in 3 months. It's not because I didn't initiate the asking, I am just tired of waiting for him to make time. I think if he wanted to see me that bad, he would have MADE some time to see me. It was a catch-22 because you can't demand or expect that until you get to know each other much better, which is what some of you said and I know this. We only met once, so we never had a chance to become much more than online friends. So what can you do but complain on LS! I met this new guy online. He called me the first night we talked. We saw each other three times over the weekend and talked at least 3 times a day on the phone. He used to be busy like the other guy, but realized he had no life, and now he is making time for a life, and for now, lucky for me, I am a part of it. Oh ya and I got an email from the first guy. It seems he's been working so hard he got sick and is on bed rest for a week. He told me it's a sign he works too hard, and he also told me he thinks I'm a beautiful, sexy, intelligent woman and wishes he wasn't so busy, but doesn't know how to change it overnight. I take that as "I guess we're back in each others' friend category" and that is okay with me.....I go work on new guy now
clynn Posted August 3, 2005 Posted August 3, 2005 Aaaah, well explained. Sounds like you had a pretty awesome weekend!!! Good luck!
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