Closure

[Sweetfish]

The deep, inherent flaw in this strategy, though, is that nobody has ever learned anything by holding on to their guilt feelings -- women and men only learn once they start to let go of whatever negative feeling(s) to which they're attached. You will see that it works the same for feeling sad or depressed that you got dumped -- as long as you just stay holding onto feeling sad, depressed or like a victim, you're not learning a thing!

 

True recovery from guilt or pain leaves scars. You must live with those scars. Each scar reminds you of your current positon. To say you only learn in a state of happiness is far fetch.

 

Its in a state of happiness when many do not learn or progress.

 

Its the dumpers continous search for happiness (for more)and the lack of feeling pain is why many dumpers do not learn. Rinse wash repeat.

 

Majority of the time its the dumpee who gets the hard lesson to find happiness internally. Many times this lesson is taught with pain, sadness, and depression.

[Chi townD]

The deep, inherent flaw in this strategy, though, is that nobody has ever learned anything by holding on to their guilt feelings -- women and men only learn once they start to let go of whatever negative feeling(s) to which they're attached. You will see that it works the same for feeling sad or depressed that you got dumped -- as long as you just stay holding onto feeling sad, depressed or like a victim, you're not learning a thing!

 

Not exactly a flawed strategy. I mean, different strokes for different folks. Some people don't feel guilty about what they've done. So, they have nothing to feel guilty about. It's not the gold standard.

 

But, what is the gold standard is maintaining NC for you're own healing. NC is a tool for us. So, we can heal more quickly and move on with our lives. But, if a byproduct of that NC is that our Ex's learn a lesson from our silence, then great! But, it wasn't it's main intention in it's construction.

[Mike2534]

I'll try thank you.

 

So...here are a few problems that come through in your post: You are, in one or more ways, being the wrong kind of 'very nice guy', and, thereby allowing yourself to be taken advantage of. The latter suggests lack of awareness/gullibility on your side. Then also, the mindset that thinks in terms of 'my women' - the way it's expressed here - can very easily digress into the antiquated notions that saw women as chattel until the most-recent century. (It's not not the thinking of a player; so, it's possible that, once this was brought into her conscious awareness, she realized that there was some truth behind his characterization of you.)

 

First, 'A man is known by the company he keeps'. Second, the same lack of awareness that prevents you from being able to select a girlfriend who properly and truly values you and what you bring to the table - and who is not into using/disrespecting - also prevented you from seeing the true colours of your now-former 'best friend'. (Real friends do not do that to each other, never mind 'best friends'.)

 

Hugs, Mike2534; I know it sucks.

 

Im always told I don't pick the right women an I think it's true cause I still have not been able to figure out what the signs of the wrong type of woman are. I think that is something important I need to figure out next before I get into another relationship. Would you happen to know signs of the wrong type?

[Mike2534]

They do this in the beginning. Demonize you to make it easier to walk away. But; once time has past, they do realize what they did was pretty crappy and that's usually when they reach out to you...see how you're doing and more importantly, MOST girls can't stand the fact that there might be someone on this planet that hates them or doesn't think that they are a nice person. So, that's when they reach out to you. Not for a second chance in most cases, it's to see if you actually do hate them for what they did. They're looking for you to ease their guilt and maybe even give them an ego boost. It's all selfishly motivated.

 

That sounds so jacked up lol I'm sorry I think this is how me an this gal got back together to begin with she might have felt guilty. We ended up right back where we started it just took longer to get there this time.

[Mike2534]

I'm inclined to agree with this. For months I tried every nice, gentlemanly thing I could think of to try and get through to mine. Poetry, calls, gifts, songs, everything. I finally went NC and she started her games up about a month later. At that point I told her off, and never to bother me again.

 

In my case, it was completely appropriate for me to do so, and my friends got in a line behind me and applauded when I did. Sometimes a pretty girl, who is used to being pretty, simply needs to hear what a beeyotch she is acting like.

 

Funny part is, after relating the saga to a mate of mine who went through almost the exact same thing, he said now that I've told her off, I'll get a crying phone call. I think not, and we bet a $125 bottle of wine on it. lol

 

Its counterintuitive, but the sooner the dumped regains their self confidence and establishes boundaries, the better chance they have of either obtaining their ex back, or finding someone even better.

 

my .02c

 

Dave

That's so great that you reached that point an have support from friends where you can do that. I'm paranoid to tell her off. The closest thing I've done is tell her I won't sink to her level by talking to her like she does me.

[Mike2534]

I think that the best way of immunizing yourself from the trauma of a woman given you a heartless dumping is to stop dating one woman only and to start dating more than one woman. Preferably three at one time. For some reason, that seems to take the sting out of it.

 

Failing that, when you get the heartless dump text, you text back

 

 

 

She will of course immediately text you back exclaiming that she doesn't know what you're talking about, and that's when you hit her with:

 

 

 

Be sure to include the smiley face, and be gracious.

 

Where do you people come up with these awesome ideas lol I am beginning to see why I never did well dating!

[Mike2534]

Yup! That is your biggest problem!

 

You're putting women up on a pedestal. And I'll tell you that most women don't want that. Because, sooner or later they are going to realize that you placed them up there. You've elevated them above yourself. They'll start to realize that they are looking down at you and that it's easy to step all over you at that height.

 

Most women want to be at their man's side. Walking through life side by side and hand in hand. As equals and as partners. Where both parties have something equal to bring to the table.

 

If you're in a relationship where all you do is give, give, give and all they do is take, take, take.....then you're in the wrong relationship. Now, I'm not saying to treat women like dirt, but there needs to be and equal amount of give and take. And you would know these women that would take advantage of your generosity. Hell, we see it on here all the time. You'll see stories of guys taking their girlfriends on a very expensive vacation and as soon as they get back, they break up with them and they find out they're dating someone else within the week. They didn't want you, they wanted that trip!

 

There are women out there that know how to treat their man right. Trust me, she's out there and she waiting for you to find her. To quote Silent Bob from the movie Clerks, "There's not too many girls out there that will bring you homemade lasagna to work for you just because". Or something like that. So, don't lose faith!

 

I apparently am not a good judge of the wrong type of woman. I try to go 5050 but then the second I notice I pay for everything I find a reason why that's ok an she wouldn't screw me like that. I try to give people the benefit of the doubt because I'm such a good person to others. For example when I take her out, I pay for everything, she's never asked to pay at all..I figured it was cause she doesn't have enough money an I'm afraid to ask her to pay cause she may think I'm cheap.

[Mike2534]

Meh, I have a feeling you might win that bet. Another part of them reaching out is to find out how you feel about them. If you respond like you did by going off on her, it has the same affect that they were looking for, you to ease their guilt. She calls you up and you blast her, she can say to herself, "Wow! What a complete Douche Rocket! I don't need this! I'm glad I dumped his ass!" now you've given her a reason to forgive herself and ease her guilt.

 

That's why I'm a strong supporter of NC (No Contact). When you go completely dark in NC. She has no idea if you are angry, she has no idea if you're sad. She has no idea if you're happy, she has no idea if you're moving on and she has no idea if you're indifferent towards her. YOU GIVE HER NOTHING when you go NC. Now, she has no choice but to hold onto that guilt.

 

And we want our Ex's to hold onto that guilt. Not to punish them, but to have them learn from it. That you can't treat people the way you treated them and expect them to be okay with it.

 

I think you have something. How long am I supposed to not contact them you think? An when they do contact me how should I act?

[Sweetfish]

I apparently am not a good judge of the wrong type of woman. I try to go 5050 but then the second I notice I pay for everything I find a reason why that's ok an she wouldn't screw me like that. I try to give people the benefit of the doubt because I'm such a good person to others. For example when I take her out, I pay for everything, she's never asked to pay at all..I figured it was cause she doesn't have enough money an I'm afraid to ask her to pay cause she may think I'm cheap.

 

There is no such thing as 50/50 try 60/40 or 70/30.

When you see a 50/50 relationship let us be the first to know.

[Maldives]

I've had this happen a few times and I finally found out why the dumper behaves this way. I found the reason in an article and it made a lot of sense well for me. The reason they act so cold hearted such as my current ex did a few mths back u should see wat she dI'd wth our photo on social media and mocked it and laughed the reason is because it reduces the guilt they would feel if they were to be nice and also to cut the communication. Nasty biatches im sorry but I find woman to be quiet similar wen it comes to cutting ties let me guess her needs weren't met or they hav there eye on someone else or who knows they r so complex if they didn't have a hole would u even bother

[Ronni_W]

Some people don't feel guilty about what they've done. So, they have nothing to feel guilty about. <snip>

 

But, what is the gold standard is maintaining NC for you're own healing. NC is a tool for us. So, we can heal more quickly and move on with our lives. But, if a byproduct of that NC is that our Ex's learn a lesson from our silence, then great! But, it wasn't it's main intention in it's construction.

I agree with everything you say about NC being for one's own healing. But, you're also putting forth the idea that the other person potentially might 'learn a lesson', which,

if the person who initiates NC has even a single thought about that, then it means that s/he is not focusing 100% on her/his own healing, which really should be one's ONLY intention, goal and aim for going NC in the first place.

 

When people do not think-believe that they have anything to feel guilty about, then they're simply not going to feel guilty - no matter what anybody else does; that is,

going NC on them is not going to change their mind or get them to a new perspective.

 

Im always told I don't pick the right women an I think it's true cause I still have not been able to figure out what the signs of the wrong type of woman are. I think that is something important I need to figure out next before I get into another relationship. Would you happen to know signs of the wrong type?

Actually, that is 100% an individual thing; and, therefore, it is part of your own healing and growth to figure that out for yourself.

You can use your prior relationships to determine what of your g/f's qualities, traits and characteristics did NOT work for you and were a turn-off -- and also what did work and were a turn-on. (What would you like more of, less of and none of?)

 

You also have to look at what brings you closer to your highest vision and version of yourself, and what takes you away from that -- with all people, in all types of relationships and situations, and under all types of conditions and circumstances. (What would you like more of, less of and none of?)

 

Then, always and in every aspect of your life, only pursue or follow the highest and the best; and ignore, refuse, forego all the rest.

 

There is no such thing as 50/50 try 60/40 or 70/30.

Each person in any type of relationship should be always aiming to put forth the best that they can possibly be at any given time in any given situation;

so, 100% of themselves. In this way, it properly should be 100/100.

 

True recovery from guilt or pain leaves scars. <snip> To say you only learn in a state of happiness is far fetch.

The first statement (quoted immediately above) is just inaccurate. The second statement doesn't relate to anything I've said. In a state of happiness, you live in happiness. Period.

 

Sweetfish, if I may: there are misinterpretations of your instructors and/or sources of instruction for mental health care.

[marky00]

I am simply replying to thread title.

 

 

To hell with closure. It DOES NOT EXIST.

 

 

You have two options.

 

 

One, you take baby steps forwards (it's slow and painful but it is a way).

 

 

Two, call up your Ex, get nasty, twist the knife. You might initially feel better but in the days or months to come it might bother you that released those emotions.

 

 

Closure is a myth. All that happens is we follow option 1 or 2 and move to a different place (better or worse, who really cares).

 

 

Some call this new place Closure. I call it a new or different place because that is all it is.

[preraph]

The last night I saw her I took her out with my best friend cause I wantyed her to meet my best friend an him meet the woman I cared for. At the start of the date we were great, totally holding hands. By the end of the night she was all into my friend an wouldn't talk to me anymore. She hugged him good bye an handed me my car keys an told me to "never bother her again" after all we have been through together one night with my best friend an we are done forever....later I found out my so-called friend told her I was a player an grabbed grabbed her ass an I didn't see it. She blamed it all on me an just was going to move on without telling me till I tried to ask about things. I didn't know any of it had happened. So yrah the gal I fell for is now seeing my ex best friend.

 

I'm sorry you lost two at once. Been there. It's ugly. My best friends started meddling with present and past bfs and slept with the present one. I got closure. I waited six weeks to cool down and rule out any irrational thinking on my part and then I closed her mouth for her and made sure all my expanded circle of male friends knew what she was up to and we froze her out of town.

 

Still, now you have seen true colors. Yes, he'd probably been secretly sidling up to her. Maybe there was even some truth in you being a player. Still no excuse for a best friend to expose you. And she was all too ready to jump ship and go about your pirate friend's instead, so she is NOT worth fighting for.

 

It's unfair it didn't get to run its course, but neither he nor she is worth retrieving. Because he didn't just tell her one day only one occasion you were a player. That wouldn't have worked. He groomed her about it secretly and she kept that secret from you on those occasions. So just walk away and remember living well is the best revenge. Don't let yourself remain sad over the loss of this woman. She was not right for you and probably not that right for anyone at this time.

[Chi townD]

I apparently am not a good judge of the wrong type of woman. I try to go 5050 but then the second I notice I pay for everything I find a reason why that's ok an she wouldn't screw me like that. I try to give people the benefit of the doubt because I'm such a good person to others. For example when I take her out, I pay for everything, she's never asked to pay at all..I figured it was cause she doesn't have enough money an I'm afraid to ask her to pay cause she may think I'm cheap.

 

50/50 doesn't have to be with money. Sure, you go out and pay for everything on your dates. But, one day you walk into your place and you have a fresh plate of chocolate chip cookies with a little love note from her. Or maybe you mention wanting to get the new Madden for Playstation and the next thing you know, she's bought it for you. Hell, one time I said to a girlfriend that I didn't have time to get my laundry done. I came home from work and she had done it for me. But, on the flip side, one day I called her at work and she was having a bad day, so I ordered her flowers and had them delivered to her work. She was so happy after that and she said that all the other girls at her work were jealous that their men don't send them flowers. Made her feel really special. That kind of stuff!

[Bromeo]

Chi, that sounds like the formula for a nice relationship. They tend to forget all those niceties at the end. lol

[Sweetfish]

The first statement (quoted immediately above) is just inaccurate. The second statement doesn't relate to anything I've said. In a state of happiness, you live in happiness. Period.

 

Sweetfish, if I may: there are misinterpretations of your instructors and/or sources of instruction for mental health care.

 

I will take your view point with an unwilling or unable to see beyond your vision or perhaps lack of depth.

 

Pain, guilt, negativity, and uncertainty has brought many people to L.S. many will learn that what they thought was happiness was merely not as such. Many people here actually suffer from an addiction of codepedance. Like any addiction they will lose all self modivation and drive.

 

They come here for enlightment and knowledge and learn things they haven't learn before... it took pain for many here to learn to find happiness starts with within and delayed self development when in reality making someone else happy.

 

Many men come here angry or upset because they try to be the good guy and get the same results over and over again and you lack the perspective or experience to relate to these men.

 

I suspect you to were taught or thought what happiness should be and it delayed your own self development? Were you riddle with guilt and thats why your so defensive on the topic?

 

I wouldn't be surprise coming from a female that "happiness is happiness." The ability not to accept both negativity, guilt, happiness, pain and all other emotions is actually not healthy.

 

The best lessons are taught in a state opposite of happiness, when you fall down, when your jealous, and even in a state of guilt. (As long as its healthy doses) They are what make us human.

 

 

But I will let my mental health care provider know this

 

If you think other wise... I respect your view point 100%

 

 

As far as the 50/50 statement.

 

As of right now in the U.S. 75 percent of taxes are supplement by males and women have 85% of the purchasing power.

 

50/50 shoudn't be discussed.

 

Men and women are just different and each should bring their own traits and skills to the table.

Edited February 8, 2017 by Sweetfish

[Ronni_W]

... it took pain for many here to learn to find happiness starts with within

Yes, I agree -- it's called, in many circles, 'learning in the school of hard knocks'. We are all still subject to this method of learning - save for a very few - but, that does not mean it is the ONLY method of learning available to humanity on this planet.

 

I am, of course, like everyone else, still subject to the same conditions, momentums and magnetic-gravitational pulls of the mass consciousness of Earth -- otherwise I would have ascended beyond it by now. Thus, I am also, like everyone else, still bound up in the process of my own full and permanent psychological healing.

 

Now, while I accept that you don't think such is possible - which is, of course, fine and your free-will right - I, nevertheless, am okay with setting that as my only and ultimate goal for my own psychological healing. (When it might be attained by me, personally, is even beside the point; for, certainly I am finding it a difficult and challenging Path! - which may be why many/most people are not even willing to even entertain its existence, in the first place? I don't know.)

 

In Love and Light.