Choice between LDR or New Flame

[KBarletta]

Hi all,

 

I’ve been on these boards for over two years in the Breakup/Divorce section. Here is my backstory from that section …

 

http://www.loveshack.org/forums/breaking-up-reconciliation-coping/separation-divorce/500910-ups-downs

 

Now, though, I’m through with the divorce and my story has evolved into one that is just straight up about dating/LDR, so I figured I’d migrate over here for some advice.

 

Here’s a synopsis:

 

A little over a year ago, about a year after separating from my wife, I met a woman by chance while I was on the road for work. We hit it off completely. But we live 1,000 miles apart and we had to go our separate ways.

 

So we e-mailed and texted and called every day after that for several months. We got to know each other this way, pretty deeply and intimately, before meeting up again. But when we did, the in-person chemistry was great and our bond grew deeper. We have seen each other on average every month or six weeks since then, having an amazing time each time we meet and still talking, texting and e-mailing every day. We even took a weeklong Caribbean vacation together this fall, which was amazing. We love each other.

 

We have a great physical connection, as well as a wonderful emotional and mental bond. It’s the closest I’ve ever felt with anyone, including my ex wife of 10 years. We’ve both been married and divorced - so neither of us is naïve. We love each other, but neither of us is in a position to move to be with the other due to a number of family/work/child commitments.

 

That said, about a year into this arrangement, she met a guy, and he asked her out. She told me about it immediately (our policy has been full disclosure about everything), and said she was considering saying yes because – in her words – she is lonely and bored when I am not there and she was looking for a distraction.

 

I understood those feelings (though I didn’t really share them) but I also made it clear that I was somewhat hurt that she was going to be seeing someone else. I can’t lie. It made me sad to see her with another guy, and I was afraid I was going to lose her.

 

Then … the very day after she told me she was going to start seeing this guy, I went out with some friends in a group situation and met a woman who was a friend of a friend.

 

The new woman was amazing (yet completely different than my LDR) and we hit it off immediately, again. We spent hours talking, and she ended up driving me home and giving me her number (I asked).

 

We have seen each other every week or so since then, both individually and in group settings, and had a great time each time. Nothing physical, but each time we have been a little bit more flirty and touchy and ended each encounter with a promise to see each other again. (I admit I have still felt a sense of “commitment” to my LDR, even though she is seeing other people, and since my divorce I tend to move slow in these situations anyway – I’m not one to jump into bed after one or two dates).

 

While I have maintained contact with my LDR partner, I can’t get my mind off of this new woman. When my phone rings, I hope every time that it's her. She is local (a big plus), but it’s not just that. There is something about her that just makes her seem like the right fit, and we have a connection that is maybe even more intense than the one I have with my LDR. I'd really like to see where this goes. (I have met plenty of other women in the interim who did not seem so, BTW. This is different and I can’t put my finger on what it is – it’s just a different kind of connection.)

 

The trouble is, despite her being very flirty and very obviously into me, she has kept me at arm’s length physically to a large degree because she is aware of my LDR and how close we are. She seems worried about being a back-burner option. I have assured her that if we were to begin seeing each other as a couple, the LDR would become nothing more than a long-distance friendship and my focus would be 100 percent on her, romantically. That is a fact. I know in my heart that is true (I’ve never cheated on a partner in 44 years despite numerous opportunities) but she seems unconvinced and seems to want me to break things off completely with the LDR before we start dating, even though I truly value that friendship (which is how we started) and I am confident that it would be nothing more than that.

 

I like this new woman enough to do just about anything to be with her, but ending a relationship that I value is a tough decision to make for something that may or may not last. I feel like my friendship with my LDR partner will stand the test of time, even if we are with other people.

 

I guess I just don’t know what to do. I feel stuck in the middle of something with no clear path. Do I just break off contact with my LDR cleanly and move forward with the new woman? That is my inclination, but it’s scary and sad to do that when I have no idea what is going to happen, and our friendship is one of the best in my life and something I don’t want to lose.

 

Any advice?

[smackie9]

Can you blame her really??? The only way for this new flame to progress, or any other for that matter, into something, is to dump the LDR permanently. You need to move on. Let a new relationship fill the void. IMO and most people's opinion, LDRs are a big waste of time. So make the change, take the more promising relationship.

 

If you don't let go, you prevent yourself from something that would be more fulfilling and rewarding.

[kendahke]

(our policy has been full disclosure about everything)

I'm not seeing anywhere in your post where you say you are reciprocating on this point.

 

When do you plan on telling LDR that she's being demoted and that you've found a local woman?

 

Because right now, it looks like intentional deception on your part--lying by omitting the fact that you're pursuing someone in your area.

[KBarletta]

Honestly, no, I can't blame her on one hand. She's suspicious, and rightly so.

 

On the other, is there really anything wrong with remaining friends? I don't have any ill will toward the LDR partner and would like to stay friends, something I don't think is a danger given the distance. We'd never see each other and would only communicate via Facebook and e-mail once in a while as most long-distance friends do. Everything we did would be open for any new partner to there would be nothing to hide.

 

The fact is, if both people were local, and I had to choose one, I would choose the new woman 10 times out of 10. It's actually no even close. So I guess I know what I need to do. I do truly value the friendship we have built, though, and I feel like I'd be throwing the baby out with the bathwater in a way.

 

Thanks for the advice.

[KBarletta]

I'm not seeing anywhere in your post where you say you are reciprocating on this point.

 

When do you plan on telling LDR that she's being demoted and that you've found a local woman?

 

Because right now, it looks like intentional deception on your part--lying by omitting the fact that you're pursuing someone in your area.

 

No - sorry for the confusion. My LDR is well aware of the new woman. Sorry if that was not clear.

[kendahke]

Honestly, no, I can't blame her on one hand. She's suspicious, and rightly so.

 

On the other, is there really anything wrong with remaining friends? I don't have any ill will toward the LDR partner and would like to stay friends, something I don't think is a danger given the distance. We'd never see each other and would only communicate via Facebook and e-mail once in a while as most long-distance friends do. Everything we did would be open for any new partner to there would be nothing to hide.

 

The fact is, if both people were local, and I had to choose one, I would choose the new woman 10 times out of 10. It's actually no even close. So I guess I know what I need to do. I do truly value the friendship we have built, though, and I feel like I'd be throwing the baby out with the bathwater in a way.

 

Thanks for the advice.

 

Glad to know you've told her.

 

The truth is: you've found someone else--she deserves to know that and to decide on that information whether a friendship with you is what she wants--because she may want to be your woman and not your friend; but she has the right to a level playing field here.

[KBarletta]

Glad to know you've told her.

 

The truth is: you've found someone else--she deserves to know that and to decide on that information whether a friendship with you is what she wants--because she may want to be your woman and not your friend; but she has the right to a level playing field here.

 

 

Right - there is no lying going on with either woman. Each one is fully aware of the situation. There has been nothing hidden on either side.

[kendahke]

Right - there is no lying going on with either woman. Each one is fully aware of the situation. There has been nothing hidden on either side.

 

How are they both handling the knowledge that the other exists? I know the local gal is keeping you at arm's length at the moment, but what is LDR saying? Is she down for just being your buddy?

 

My advice is to make a clean break from LDR and to let her know that you're pursuing local gal in earnest and to wish her well in her search for love. Finding love is hard enough without distance complicating matters.

[KBarletta]

How are they both handling the knowledge that the other exists? I know the local gal is keeping you at arm's length at the moment, but what is LDR saying? Is she down for just being your buddy?

 

My advice is to make a clean break from LDR and to let her know that you're pursuing local gal in earnest and to wish her well in her search for love. Finding love is hard enough without distance complicating matters.

 

The LDR has expressed jealously, not so much of the other woman, but of the simple fact that she is nearby every day and the LDR is not. But she is jealous. Even so, she has expressed a desire to continue seeing other people. What she wants is an open relationship where we see other people in the interim but keep seeing each other.

 

The new woman would NOT be down with that, and neither would I. The LDR is in love with me but lonely and wants something approaching a polyamorous situation. That's not really an option for me. I want to focus on one person, which is what makes this hard.

 

I believe you are right - I need to have a heart to heart with both women, lay all the cards out, break off the LDR and pursue the local woman. I believe that is the right path - I guess it's just going to be a tough one to navigate.

[smackie9]

There is something wrong with remaining friends, because of the intensity of your emotional attachment with this LDR. Your new best everything should be with the new girl. She is making it clear, she doesn't want to be sharing you with someone you still have a deep affection for. Put yourself in her shoes? what would you think if new girl had a guy she wanted to keep as a friend that she still had intense feelings for??? and has trouble letting go because of it??? It would be upsetting for sure.

[KBarletta]

There is something wrong with remaining friends, because of the intensity of your emotional attachment with this LDR. Your new best everything should be with the new girl. She is making it clear, she doesn't want to be sharing you with someone you still have a deep affection for. Put yourself in her shoes? what would you think if new girl had a guy she wanted to keep as a friend that she still had intense feelings for??? and has trouble letting go because of it??? It would be upsetting for sure.

 

Yes, you a right. It helps to put myself in her place. I would be suspicious just like her. I like to think I would give her the benefit of the doubt and trust her, but I agree it would be difficult and upsetting. I REALLY want to make sure I don't want to hurt anyone, least of all the new woman I like so very much. Things with the LDR, honestly, have been slightly fractured ever since she announced she was seeing other people. If not for that, I wouldn't be in this situation because I would not have been open to meeting someone when I did.

 

You are right. Thanks for the advice. Update - I am going to cut the LDR loose and ask the new woman out on a proper date this week, where I will tell her exactly what is going on.

 

Maybe one other question - do I tell the new woman exactly WHY I broke things off with the LDR (because I want to focus solely on her) or do I just tell her it happened and let that be the end of it?

 

KTB

[LargoLagg]

Why can't you date both of them? You seem to be old enough for that. Full disclosure, right? Otherwise, I'd go for the local one.

[KBarletta]

Why can't you date both of them? You seem to be old enough for that. Full disclosure, right? Otherwise, I'd go for the local one.

 

Honestly, the answers are that 1. It's not really my style, as I usually focus on one person and I like it that way, and 2. I know the local woman is wary of and unwilling to become a second fiddle to someone who is already very much a part of my life.

 

I expect that if I did that, every time I texted someone she would think I was talking to the LDR and it would just be a problem. An emotional affair already in existence before the relationship starts, in effect. I know full disclosure sounds OK in theory but in practice it ends up being one feeling inferior to the other. That just my theory. And that seems to be the way the new woman is taking it. She wants to be the only one I date, and that seems to me a fair expectation, given how much we like each other.

[OnlyHonesty]

I must be missing something here or is this just a case of people unnecessarily over-complicating their lives?

 

You were in a LTR, she met someone else and pretty much chose him over you.

 

You met someone else and pretty much chose her over the LTR. This was unnecessarily complicated. The minute she chose someone else over you should have been where your self worth / esteem and boundaries kicked in.

 

What is it with people allowing themselves to be treated as a second option?

[Gr8fuln2020]

I was involved in a successful LDR. Met once a month w/o zero problems. The problems came after we got married. Lol. You never really get to know the LDR person as well as you think. Local is ALWAYS the better option in my mind if neither stacks that much higher than the other.

 

It sounds like you and your LDR friend have a mature relationship. It also sounds like you two are ready to find someone local if the opportunity exists....the opportunity exists....for both of you.

[KBarletta]

I must be missing something here or is this just a case of people unnecessarily over-complicating their lives?

 

You were in a LTR, she met someone else and pretty much chose him over you.

 

You met someone else and pretty much chose her over the LTR. This was unnecessarily complicated. The minute she chose someone else over you should have been where your self worth / esteem and boundaries kicked in.

 

What is it with people allowing themselves to be treated as a second option?

 

 

Well, I appreciate the comment, but I do think you're mischaracterizing the situation somewhat in saying that saying that she chose another guy over me, or vice versa. The fact is, as I said, she's bored a lonely during our long stretches apart. She wanted someone to fill the boredom, not because we don't love each other, but because it's sometimes six weeks before we see each other. As I said, she sees it as a distraction, not a commitment.

 

I never felt like a second option. The fact is, the other dude was her second option, not me. But I did feel jealous, much as she did, that there were people like him who got to be around her every day. That's natural in a LDR, I think.

 

Also, it's maybe worth mentioning probably that the LDR partner's new guy lasted two weeks before revealing himself to be a liar and he is now out of the picture. She hasn't seen anyone new since.

[KBarletta]

I was involved in a successful LDR. Met once a month w/o zero problems. The problems came after we got married. Lol. You never really get to know the LDR person as well as you think. Local is ALWAYS the better option in my mind if neither stacks that much higher than the other.

 

It sounds like you and your LDR friend have a mature relationship. It also sounds like you two are ready to find someone local if the opportunity exists....the opportunity exists....for both of you.

 

You are correct that it is a mature relationship. That's one reason why I feel like it could have continued as a friendship after we both found other people locally. But maybe that's wrong. I feel like we both are mature enough to deal with being friends while also being in committed relationships with others.

 

Most people seem to think that can't happen, and I happen to think it would be unfair to start a new relationship locally with that "hanging over our heads" and I feel strongly enough for the local woman that I won't do that to her.

[hippychick3]

I think the moment LDR woman wanted to date others, this relationship was over. You can't go "backwards" in a successful relationship and unless you were fully on board with an open relationship, going out with another man was going backwards. It was the beginning of the end. Honestly, seeing each other only once a month or every 6 weeks with no plans on closing the distance is not sustainable for most people.

 

End things with LDR woman and officially date the local woman.

[Gr8fuln2020]

I was involved in a successful LDR. Met once a month w/o zero problems. The problems came after we got married. Lol. You never really get to know the LDR person as well as you think. Local is ALWAYS the better option in my mind if neither stacks that much higher than the other.

 

It sounds like you and your LDR friend have a mature relationship. It also sounds like you two are ready to find someone local if the opportunity exists....the opportunity exists....for both of you.

 

Ack, meant to say, 'Met once a month with zero problems.

 

KBarletta. Go local. It is clear that your friend is moving in that direction. Remaining friends is another issue. Considering the non-acrimonious nature of your decisions, it is possible that you two could remain friends, but after a while, at long distance, it will probably fade and that's ok.

[KBarletta]

Thanks to everyone for your responses.

 

In truth, part of my fear is that I will end the LDR, start dating locally and that will end, too. Then I will be back at square one. I like both of these women and this seems like a possible path toward losing both of them. But I guess that's always a possibility where romance is involved. I am scared of losing a best friend type of relationship with the LDR, while entering a new romantic one locally.

 

Of course, that's kind of fatalistic thinking that a new relationship won't work out. But a year or so removed from a divorce, it's maybe natural to assume that all relationships end at some point. It's just hard because in my opinion nobody in this situation has done anything really wrong.

 

I should say, hippychick, that we did discuss an open relationship at various points throughout the LDR and each time decided it wasn't the way we wanted to go. But my LDR partner has always been able to have casual hookups without feelings getting involved - I am not that type of animal. I think that is the main difference here. I have strong feelings for my local person, she does not. Her only strong feelings are for me.

 

I appreciate everyone's input. It seems very clear that most people think I should end the LDR and move forward locally. That is my plan.

 

I'll keep y'all posted on how it goes from here.

[hippychick3]

Thanks to everyone for your responses.

 

In truth, part of my fear is that I will end the LDR, start dating locally and that will end, too. Then I will be back at square one. I like both of these women and this seems like a possible path toward losing both of them. But I guess that's always a possibility where romance is involved. I am scared of losing a best friend type of relationship with the LDR, while entering a new romantic one locally.

 

Of course, that's kind of fatalistic thinking that a new relationship won't work out. But a year or so removed from a divorce, it's maybe natural to assume that all relationships end at some point. It's just hard because in my opinion nobody in this situation has done anything really wrong.

 

I should say, hippychick, that we did discuss an open relationship at various points throughout the LDR and each time decided it wasn't the way we wanted to go. But my LDR partner has always been able to have casual hookups without feelings getting involved - I am not that type of animal. I think that is the main difference here. I have strong feelings for my local person, she does not. Her only strong feelings are for me.

 

I appreciate everyone's input. It seems very clear that most people think I should end the LDR and move forward locally. That is my plan.

 

I'll keep y'all posted on how it goes from here.

 

Given her desire to casually date others while in a relationship with you (regardless of whether feelings are involved) make the 2 of you incompatible. That's a HUGE source of incompatibility actually. My BF and a I have been in a LDR for quite awhile now but with much more frequent visits (every weekend or every other weekend) and there is no way in H*** either of us would be okay with the other going on casual dates ever.

 

Good luck with everything. Love means taking risks. Even if it doesn't work out in the end with the local girl, I don't see the LDR going too far. That would have eventuallly faded anyway given her dissatisfaction with the distance.

[KBarletta]

Given her desire to casually date others while in a relationship with you (regardless of whether feelings are involved) make the 2 of you incompatible. That's a HUGE source of incompatibility actually. My BF and a I have been in a LDR for quite awhile now but with much more frequent visits (every weekend or every other weekend) and there is no way in H*** either of us would be okay with the other going on casual dates ever.

 

Good luck with everything. Love means taking risks. Even if it doesn't work out in the end with the local girl, I don't see the LDR going too far. That would have eventuallly faded anyway given her dissatisfaction with the distance.

 

 

Honestly, I think it's a function of the distance, not so much us being incompatible. I guess it's how we deal with the distance that makes us incompatible in an LDR. If we were in the same city, I think we would be a fine couple without major incompatibility issues.

 

But either way - your point is well taken - we don't have a future as a romantic couple, at least as things stand right now. So I have to look elsewhere. That's what I've been doing.

 

The new woman and I have been talking/texting each day and made plans to see each other on Friday. Meanwhile, I have had a couple conversations the past few days with my LDR partner to explain where things stand and why I think we need to back off from each other and just be friends. I hope that doesn't blow up into something bad.

 

All of this seems to have the potential to work out OK. BUT ... there is a new wrinkle and I wasn't sure if I should create a new thread or just throw the door open for comments here. I try this first and see where it goes.

 

Here's the new wrinkle:

 

I have been seeing a therapist for the past two years, since my ex and I split up. It has been going very well. We see each other every two weeks and it's really helped me grow and cope and - I hope - become a better and more well-rounded person. I don't know where I'd be now without it.

 

What I discovered recently through some very mild social media snooping is that my new "flame" is like best friends with my therapist!

 

So ... now what? I have an appointment to see her next week. I have spent a decent amount of time in her office already talking about this new woman and wondering what to do about her. I don't *think* she knows who I am talking about - yet - but it probably will only be a matter of time before she figures it out.

 

What to do now? Do I let her know that a close friend of hers is my new romantic interest? Do I try to keep that a secret so we can maintain the same relationship we have always had? Do I let her handle it like a professional and expect her to keep the two things separate (which I think would be OK most of the time, but these two seem extremely close. I'm not sure it's possible for someone to have that level of a conflict and keep it under wraps.)

 

I don't want to lose my therapist. She knows every detail of my life and has been extremely helpful to me. I also don't want to compromise my relationship with this woman this way if that is what ends up happening.

 

Can I still see them both or do I need to choose one?

[olivetree]

What are the odds!

 

This seems like a conflict of interest to me.

If she is professional, she will terminate your relationship if you date her friend.

 

Don't you think it would be weird dating this new woman while sharing your whole life with her friend?

What if you start having issues with the new woman - you will feel the need to guard parts of your life from your therapist.

I think the new woman would think that is weird and the therapist would expect you to be uncomfortable with that.

[hippychick3]

Honestly, I think it's a function of the distance, not so much us being incompatible. I guess it's how we deal with the distance that makes us incompatible in an LDR. If we were in the same city, I think we would be a fine couple without major incompatibility issues.

 

But either way - your point is well taken - we don't have a future as a romantic couple, at least as things stand right now. So I have to look elsewhere. That's what I've been doing.

 

The new woman and I have been talking/texting each day and made plans to see each other on Friday. Meanwhile, I have had a couple conversations the past few days with my LDR partner to explain where things stand and why I think we need to back off from each other and just be friends. I hope that doesn't blow up into something bad.

 

All of this seems to have the potential to work out OK. BUT ... there is a new wrinkle and I wasn't sure if I should create a new thread or just throw the door open for comments here. I try this first and see where it goes.

 

Here's the new wrinkle:

 

I have been seeing a therapist for the past two years, since my ex and I split up. It has been going very well. We see each other every two weeks and it's really helped me grow and cope and - I hope - become a better and more well-rounded person. I don't know where I'd be now without it.

 

What I discovered recently through some very mild social media snooping is that my new "flame" is like best friends with my therapist!

 

So ... now what? I have an appointment to see her next week. I have spent a decent amount of time in her office already talking about this new woman and wondering what to do about her. I don't *think* she knows who I am talking about - yet - but it probably will only be a matter of time before she figures it out.

 

What to do now? Do I let her know that a close friend of hers is my new romantic interest? Do I try to keep that a secret so we can maintain the same relationship we have always had? Do I let her handle it like a professional and expect her to keep the two things separate (which I think would be OK most of the time, but these two seem extremely close. I'm not sure it's possible for someone to have that level of a conflict and keep it under wraps.)

 

I don't want to lose my therapist. She knows every detail of my life and has been extremely helpful to me. I also don't want to compromise my relationship with this woman this way if that is what ends up happening.

 

Can I still see them both or do I need to choose one?

 

Well, first of all it is illegal for your therapist to disclose anything to this woman regardless of how close they are. She could lose her license for breach of confidentiality.

 

But now that you know they are friends, it may inhibit you from being as open as you would normally be. I can't imagine continuing your sessions with that knowledge. I'd find a new therapist.

[VeveCakes]

Shes a therapist - she is bound by her profession to keep her lips tight. I honestly wouldn't worry about it. She probably figured it out long before you did lol