How To Get To The Next Level

[Grey40]

So since being out of my 5 year relationship, I've been single for a good 6-6 months and feel like I'm finally starting to get my "game" back. I'm more social again, and have no issue talking to women, and building a connection both online and in person.

 

But, I keep running into the same problem/issue over and over again. I can't seem to get girls to go out with me on a date or even to just hang out for drinks/coffee or whatever. At first I thought it was a comfort/rapport issue, because sometimes I would ask girls out very quickly with not a lot of "getting to know them". I switched my approach and it's made no difference. No matter how little or much comfort I seem to build, they still will not meet up with me.

 

So I'm trying to figure out where I could having issues. When I ask girls out one of these 3 things always happens and it's now happened I would say to about 30 women over the last year. (Like I said, I approach and talk to many). So when I do ask them out they either

 

1. Initially agree to a date and then bail/cancel last minute (usually day of or day before) with no reschedule

2. Go silent when asked and don't talk to me again, or will reinitiate contact after

A good period of time (like a week later).

3. Keep saying they are busy and a different excuse every time

 

Now I find it hard to believe that THIS many women are uninterested. I understand that not everyone will like me and want to go on a date, but it's almost every single girl I ask. I'm a very good looking guy, so I know it's not my looks getting in the way, and I'm a musician, guitar teacher and run my studio so Im in general pretty interesting and have interests so I don't think my personality is that dull either. Perhaps I could get better at showing my personality more in conversation, but like I said, this happens even if I meet them in person and things go really well and even when there seemed to be a connection. It also happens with OLD which I understand is much more common, but even I spend an entire week talking to a girl getting to know her or spend 1 day, I get the same result.

 

Any ideas? Thanks again everyone, most people on here have been really insightful and have really helped.

[smackie9]

Just me saying this but from my experience, any guy that's really good looking, women tend to not care about anything else, even if you were jobless, and still living at home.

 

The only way to get an outside opinion is not on line here, but someone like a female coworker, friend, friend's wife or family member that knows you personally.

[Sara1989]

WELCOME to the world of dating

 

I am a female in my 20s and it happens to me as well. Bit of an advice, dont spend an week speaking to a woman without confirming a date. Alot of people are online for an ego boast, if you cannot confirm a date within a couple of days then bail.

[Grey40]

Just me saying this but from my experience, any guy that's really good looking, women tend to not care about anything else, even if you were jobless, and still living at home.

 

The only way to get an outside opinion is not on line here, but someone like a female coworker, friend, friend's wife or family member that knows you personally.

 

Yeah, that's what I would have figured, which is why it's strange. I'm not a typical guy who thinks the hottest thing going, but I know I'm very good looking. Women have told me I look like celebrities and even some of them have gone as far as telling me "you are beautiful", "look like a young tom cruise or brad pitt" or think I'm a model or something. I'm not tall, so there's that, but my point is that it's not like I have an inflated image of myself. You'd think if that was the case I wouldn't have to be on these sites/forums.

 

Could it possibly be the opposite? That these girls maybe think I'm a player or just going to use them? Maybe they think they're not good enough for me and they're afraid that it's too good to be true? I hate to think that arrogantly because I know that's probably not the case, but I guess I can't rule it out

[Alamo657]

The moment a self labelled good looking and interesting guy starts approaching women, is when his game is uncovered : he doesn't get many offers and is actively looking to get laid.

 

If you were that great , you wouldn't need to approach women, you d be filtering them.

 

So whatever your degree of coolness, stop actively looking for dates, and focus more on socializing with people you meet naturally. Sex will then come on time

[Grey40]

The moment a self labelled good looking and interesting guy starts approaching women, is when his game is uncovered : he doesn't get many offers and is actively looking to get laid.

 

If you were that great , you wouldn't need to approach women, you d be filtering them.

 

So whatever your degree of coolness, stop actively looking for dates, and focus more on socializing with people you meet naturally. Sex will then come on time

 

I agree and disagree. I think no matter how great you are as a male, you're still going to have to do approaching..even more so if you're good looking because women will assume "he's probably taken" or "He won't talk to me" etc. You might get a few women chasing after you, but most likely not the ones you want.

 

But I agree with your second point, that sounds like good advice..to stop actively pursuing dates and just being cool and natural and letting stuff flow. Clearly actively pursuing dates has not really yielded me good results. I've only been on 2 dates in the past year through OLD, and both were very bland and I was not very attracted to them at all. Other than that, like I said, very little success. So maybe I should change my strategy to basically having no strategy hahah

Edited December 17, 2016 by Grey40

[smackie9]

Men are more apt to think they are not good enough, or are intimidated by an attractive woman. Women on the other hand, don't think that way. I agree with Alemo657 you would be filtering them....beating them off with a stick. Women are not afraid of players, they talk themselves out of the fact they are a player.

 

If you are 5'6" - 5'8" ya that would create a challenge unfortunately

 

If you look like Brad Pitt or Tom Cruse ish.....you would be attracting women in their 50's not 20's lol maybe it's time to update/freshen up your look....get a new wardrobe, hair style, etc

[TheAntiHero]

Tell me. Would you consider yourself a nice guy?

 

Something tells me this might be your missing ingredient, a bit of the "bad boy" vibe.

 

And yeah, you're right when you say that no matter how good looking you are as a guy, you still have to initiate.

 

Women are intimidated by the extremely good looking guys; it'll always be up to the guy to put himself out there.

 

Had a blonde just stare at me for a couple weeks at work; when I started talking to her, one day she ran her fingers through my hair when I was seated doing some work.

[HereNorThere]

Are you positive that you aren't coming on too strong beforehand? I've never had an issue with being stood up or cancelled on, but I also never display romantic interest before I meet someone.

 

It sounds silly, but people are really put off by the idea of a "date." It has all these negative connotations of a job interview like, awkward experience. Instead of the typical dinner date, find common ground and something that you both like to do. Talk about an event, concert, new place and make plans together a friends. It sounds silly, but people want an "out" in case you end being a creep. Make sure your plans have a beginning and an end, no romantic overtones, and don't display romantic interest until she has first. It works, dude.

[HereNorThere]

Men are more apt to think they are not good enough, or are intimidated by an attractive woman. Women on the other hand, don't think that way. I agree with Alemo657 you would be filtering them....beating them off with a stick. Women are not afraid of players, they talk themselves out of the fact they are a player.

 

If you are 5'6" - 5'8" ya that would create a challenge unfortunately

 

If you look like Brad Pitt or Tom Cruse ish.....you would be attracting women in their 50's not 20's lol maybe it's time to update/freshen up your look....get a new wardrobe, hair style, etc

 

I've had a different experience with than you. A lot of times women that feel I'm "out of their league" will turn me down because they're worried I'll pursue sex and not a relationship. Insecurity can be a real barrier for some women.

 

Especially in the online dating world, I've noticed guys will go after girls way out their league hoping to find one with self esteem issues. Their motto is like the lottery "you have to play to win." They know that even a blind pig can find the occasional truffle.

 

It's interesting that we've had different experiences. I appreciate you sharing yours.

[Satu]

There is another possibility.

 

You're not that long out of a fairly lengthy relationship, and not really ready to date.

 

That can come over subliminally via body language, the way you make eye contact, etc.

 

That might not be it, but it's a possibility.

 

 

Take care.

[Grey40]

Men are more apt to think they are not good enough, or are intimidated by an attractive woman. Women on the other hand, don't think that way. I agree with Alemo657 you would be filtering them....beating them off with a stick. Women are not afraid of players, they talk themselves out of the fact they are a player.

 

If you are 5'6" - 5'8" ya that would create a challenge unfortunately

 

If you look like Brad Pitt or Tom Cruse ish.....you would be attracting women in their 50's not 20's lol maybe it's time to update/freshen up your look....get a new wardrobe, hair style, etc

 

I'm only 5'7" so yeah it's definitely not ideal, but good looks help and I try to go after girls shorter than me...In the 5'1"-5'6" range. And funny you say that because I do attract a ton of women in their 40s and 50s, but my style isn't outdated or anything I don't think..I have a pretty common look for someone my age. It could be because I do look a little younger, I have kind of a baby face which probably makes me come off as less "bad boy" like the other guy mentioned.

[Grey40]

Tell me. Would you consider yourself a nice guy?

 

Something tells me this might be your missing ingredient, a bit of the "bad boy" vibe.

 

And yeah, you're right when you say that no matter how good looking you are as a guy, you still have to initiate.

 

Women are intimidated by the extremely good looking guys; it'll always be up to the guy to put himself out there.

 

Had a blonde just stare at me for a couple weeks at work; when I started talking to her, one day she ran her fingers through my hair when I was seated doing some work.

 

 

I can definitely agree that I'm probably lacking that "edge" that most girls tend to like, but I wouldn't say I'm a "nice guy" I don't get friend zoned by these girls, they just seem to lose interest quickly, or chicken out. Partially my baby face makes me seem less edgy and look young. I'm 28 but most people guess I'm 21. So that doesn't help.

[HereNorThere]

The "edge" has nothing to do with being a bad boy. The edge is being a GENUINE nice guy. If you're genuinely nice, that means you are truly interested and getting to know someone. If you're a nice guy™ it means you're pretending to be nice because you have an agenda.

 

Women can smell manipulation a mile away. It really is in your best interest to be the best person you can be, generate attraction, and let them pick you. Your job is to pick up on the little indicators that let you know they like you in a romantic way and push it forward. The biggest mistake guys make is trying to promote themselves like a product. You need to be the best option on the shelf, a product that sells itself.

[Sweetfish]

To be honest part of the overall problem is females online are looking for the top 10% of guys online while men drop the bar.i believe for an average guy its harder and for an average female its a bit more easy.

 

But the problem is women filter out a lot of men because with numbers ... you get bad and good.

 

I saw one womens profile that said, if i dont contact you in 24 hours you not the one... lol

 

Thats until they hit 40 that is...and men start dating "up" and women start dating "down"

 

My buddy would get zero responses online and he is ripped. This was for years... i told him what he was doing wrong... he changed it and now he is beating women off with a stick.

 

We went on a trip and i couldnt sleep because his dating app was going off all thru the night...

 

Ive never used tinder... but i think we he got to 1000 matches he had to uninstall the program.

 

Its 100% not the way you look or how tall you are.

 

Im not going to spill the beans unless you got PM. Lol

 

But its all about the experience..when a girl sees your profile.. what is she experiencing sooo different than the other profiles. Ever look at the other mens pages... you'll be surprise how dull your profile looks.

 

So if women are looking for the top 10% of guys online... if yours is like 90% of the profiles.. you odds are not good.

[HereNorThere]

I always tell my female friends after a break-up "go find some dates online, get your confidence up." I tell my male friends "don't go online until you get your confidence up!"

 

It's brutal for a guy online. If your frame isn't strong and you aren't familiar with how it works, it will destroy you. However, someone is going out with these girls. You can be that guy, but you have to put in the work. It really is art form, but the best part is that there's a minimal investment compared to IRL social interaction. The rejection doesn't sting nearly as much.

 

If your game isn't tight, don't go online. Go out and have genuine fun with your friends. You'll attract more girls when you're happy and having a good time because they want to be happy and have a good time. Don't look for the party, be the party.

[Grey40]

I always tell my female friends after a break-up "go find some dates online, get your confidence up." I tell my male friends "don't go online until you get your confidence up!"

 

It's brutal for a guy online. If your frame isn't strong and you aren't familiar with how it works, it will destroy you. However, someone is going out with these girls. You can be that guy, but you have to put in the work. It really is art form, but the best part is that there's a minimal investment compared to IRL social interaction. The rejection doesn't sting nearly as much.

 

If your game isn't tight, don't go online. Go out and have genuine fun with your friends. You'll attract more girls when you're happy and having a good time because they want to be happy and have a good time. Don't look for the party, be the party.

 

Once again I'm going to agree and disagree. I've had a lot of success in OLD in terms of girls responding and talking, but little success in terms of actually meeting up with me. I don't think landing dates on OLD is about game. I think it's about timing. A lot of girls use those apps from time to time, when they're bored or lonely or Just had a bad experience with s guy they liked that maybe ditched them or didn't make a move. Sometimes they just gov N there strictly outvof boredom and rate guys wi no other intention than that. So basically lack of success in OLD means nothing. It doesn't mean you're ugly, it doesn't mean your game sucks. It's like playing poker or blackjack or roulette,every so often you'll hit it off with a girl and it might progresss to a date if you fit what she's looking for and catch her at an opportune times. Otherwise it's slim odds

 

I'm not afraid of rejection.i used to be and that's why I had no chance. Now even though I expect rejection I'm still trying and that's a lot more likely than doing nothing. I also disagree that just having fun with your friends and being social will change anything. It'll make girls look your direction and maybe be interested but you still have to make a move

[HereNorThere]

That fine, you can disagree with me all you want. I'm not the one who has a problem reeling in the fish.

 

It's ALWAYS about game when it comes to dating, ALWAYS. I'm seeing what your sticking point is now. You're trying to make logical rules to an emotional game. It doesn't matter how you look on paper, how much luck you have, etc. In the dating world, it's always about how you make someone feel. How else do you think a bunch of dead beat losers can mooch off of hot chicks while some Ph.d guy gets mooched off of? One of them knows the rules of the game, the other one is trying to make them.

[Sweetfish]

Once again I'm going to agree and disagree. I've had a lot of success in OLD in terms of girls responding and talking, but little success in terms of actually meeting up with me. I don't think landing dates on OLD is about game. I think it's about timing. A lot of girls use those apps from time to time, when they're bored or lonely or Just had a bad experience with s guy they liked that maybe ditched them or didn't make a move. Sometimes they just gov N there strictly outvof boredom and rate guys wi no other intention than that. So basically lack of success in OLD means nothing. It doesn't mean you're ugly, it doesn't mean your game sucks. It's like playing poker or blackjack or roulette,every so often you'll hit it off with a girl and it might progresss to a date if you fit what she's looking for and catch her at an opportune times. Otherwise it's slim odds

 

I'm not afraid of rejection.i used to be and that's why I had no chance. Now even though I expect rejection I'm still trying and that's a lot more likely than doing nothing. I also disagree that just having fun with your friends and being social will change anything. It'll make girls look your direction and maybe be interested but you still have to make a move

 

 

I will say 90% of the time women who have an online profile are looking for a serious relationship. So its not like playing blackjack or roulette. If you go out with the girl its because she had interest in you and somewhere along the line you blew it or there is no connection.

 

And yes being social with your friends and having fun does changes everything and no you don't have to make a move. Lots of women make the move or hint they are attracted to you.

 

So I think your point of view is off.

[Grey40]

Well clearly my game sucks then. I was never good at it, and I got into a long relationship and now and back at it and I understand it's going to take go get better. I guess I just thought it would be easier because I'm above average looking. The truth is that it hasn't been easier. I think part of my problem might be that I have my standards too high? I really don't try to initiate conversation with women I'm not attracted to. I get plenty of signs from girls I don't like. It's the girls I want that never show any interest that I can pick up on.

 

And what you're saying is that if you have "game"- girl online will agree to a date? They either are attracted enough to go on a date or they're not.

[Grey40]

I will say 90% of the time women who have an online profile are looking for a serious relationship. So its not like playing blackjack or roulette. If you go out with the girl its because she had interest in you and somewhere along the line you blew it or there is no connection.

 

And yes being social with your friends and having fun does changes everything and no you don't have to make a move. Lots of women make the move or hint they are attracted to you.

 

So I think your point of view is off.

 

That percentage is a serious assumption. How do you know that many women are looking for a serious relationship? You have no idea. Don't throw out random stats that are made up it doesn't help. I've had plenty of girls I've talked to that had a connection in some way and they made up reasons they couldn't hang out. There was nothing I said or did that "blew it" I just did what everyone says to do, ask them out. And many women even on here have admitted women go on there for fun and for ego boosts etc. so to even claim that "90% of women use OLD seriously" is just pure ignorance

[HereNorThere]

It could be that your standards are too high, I dunno ¯\_(ツ)_/¯. If you're trying to go for the to top 10 to 15%, they probably are too high for online dating. Those chicks ares getting hundred of messages a day by Greek god type dudes. You need at least 6 feet and 6 figures to even qualify for those women.

 

Even in a relationship, you need game. I'm not talking about manipulation or psychological tricks, I'm talking about being fun and leaving a little mystery out there. People want the thrill of the chase. They can tell if you're "too unavailable" and it comes off as needy. People want something of value that they have to work for.

 

Have you read the statistics book and articles put out by the people from OK Cupid? Google them and see what you're up against. You're going to be shocked by what you see. Yeah, your standards probably are too high for online according to those stats. It's not your fault, it's thirsty white knights messaging EVERY girl and ruining it for us.

[HereNorThere]

Check this out, OP.

 

Cupid on Trial: An OKCupid Online Dating Experiment

[Sweetfish]

That percentage is a serious assumption. How do you know that many women are looking for a serious relationship? You have no idea. Don't throw out random stats that are made up it doesn't help. I've had plenty of girls I've talked to that had a connection in some way and they made up reasons they couldn't hang out. There was nothing I said or did that "blew it" I just did what everyone says to do, ask them out. And many women even on here have admitted women go on there for fun and for ego boosts etc. so to even claim that "90% of women use OLD seriously" is just pure ignorance

 

 

Maybe you suck at reading women.

 

That last day of my middle school years.. I had plenty girls tell me they liked me the whole 4 years and I had not one clue. That's because what you seen on the exterior is completely different in whats going on in their heads. Same in High school and college.

 

Believe what you want...but if a woman is on OLD she wants to find the guy. "Not many of guys." and the minute she puts not looking for a long term relationship her in box will explode..

 

Yes.. women do use OLD for validation and Ego boost..

But once attraction is locked its game over and your in.

 

Change your profile to looking for short-term relationship...if its not already and you should just lock your penis and throw away the key.

 

If they made up a reason not to see you again... you did something wrong.

 

Don't get upset because you cant score the next date. Im not being mean...but every date I've ever been on... I lock in multiple dates and its because I don't do the same typical dates that most guys do. I remember only one time I killed attraction dating a girl and the minute I said it...I knew right there and then I killed attraction.

[HereNorThere]

Maybe you suck at reading women.

 

That last day of my middle school years.. I had plenty girls tell me they liked me the whole 4 years and I had not one clue. That's because what you seen on the exterior is completely different in whats going on in their heads. Same in High school and college.

 

Believe what you want...but if a woman is on OLD she wants to find the guy. "Not many of guys." and the minute she puts not looking for a long term relationship her in box will explode..

 

Yes.. women do use OLD for validation and Ego boost..

But once attraction is locked its game over and your in.

 

Change your profile to looking for short-term relationship...if its not already and you should just lock your penis and throw away the key.

 

If they made up a reason not to see you again... you did something wrong.

 

Don't get upset because you cant score the next date. Im not being mean...but every date I've ever been on... I lock in multiple dates and its because I don't do the same typical dates that most guys do. I remember only one time I killed attraction dating a girl and the minute I said it...I knew right there and then I killed attraction.

 

You're reading my mind over here. I was just thinking to myself "Did OP say serious relationship and online dating in the same sentence?"

 

People are scared of someone coming on too strong. If someone likes you enough, you'll naturally move on to a long-term relationship. You don't have ask for a dowry on the first date. Hell, I don't even believe in dates in the traditional sense. That scares people off as well.

 

Humans are fickle and selfish, but once you find the signal in the noise, they start to become predictable. Not logical, predictable.