Break up over religion - Tragedy

[Indestructible]

My Ex and I met in college. We were both waiting for a shuttle and realized we worked together in different departments and started talking. She was gorgeous. Like, completely naturally beautiful without even trying. Her skin was olive toned and her hair naturally curly and fairly short. She was so nice to talk to and interested in everything I said, pretty much immediately I wanted to be with her. We had very different backgrounds as I was born and raised in the US and she was born in the Middle East but came to the US at a young age. Our religious backgrounds were different and we both knew it was an issue but we didn't care. The issue was that I wasn't a follower of the belief system she was born into and it was against said belief system for females to marry outside their beliefs. On my end it was much simpler. Though I grew up influenced by religion, I became a skeptical agnostic in my adult years. Of course I had my reservations with organized religion but I didn't care. In my mind, and I believe in hers as well, things felt so right that it didn't matter. A month later I asked her to be my girlfriend and we were together for almost 4 years.

 

Over the course of the relationship we got along great and became incredibly close. It wasn't entirely typical in that I lived on my own and she still lived with her family. In her culture this was more common than in mine. We saw each other virtually every day for the most part but she rarely spent the night as her parents would not approve. Did I mention this relationship was hidden from her family? I know, I know. You don't have to tell me that we were fighting a losing battle. Honestly, I accepted that it would most likely end but believed (still do) that it was worth the eventual heartbreak.

 

Aside from the religion issue, she sometimes expressed her desire to have children. I too share that desire but it would have been impossible because we could never get married. This issue was the catalyst for our eventual break up. Giving it much thought, I knew I could forego having children and just be happy with her but I knew this wasn't the case for her so about 2.5 years into our relationship we began preparing to break up. I made sure we talked about it semi-regularly to become acclimated to the idea. I truly hated to do it, I loved (still do) her so much. She made me happy. I knew, however, that she couldn't be happy down the road without children so I forced myself to keep it a recurring topic. In retrospect, it was selfish to let the relationship go so long. We were both in our late 20s so the child window was diminishing. We tried to break up for over a year before we were successful.

 

We texted for a few months after breaking up, kind of just continuing our relationship except we never saw each other. Over that time we became less close and texts became less frequent. We both knew it had to end. Finally we had our last texting conversation and said our goodbyes. She is stronger than me and has been able to avoid contacting me. I've done pretty well except for a couple of snapchats saying I miss her. I realized after a while that I'd stopped seeing any of her FB activity in my feed and realized she blocked me. I am inherently forward and blunt unfortunately so of course I messaged her asking if that's what she'd done. I realize this was borderline inappropriate as she doesn't owe me any explanation but she wasn't upset I'd asked about it. She said she had blocked me and did it only to avoid hurting my feelings. I completely understood why she'd do that but regardless, it hurt a lot. I asked if she stopped responding to me because there was someone new and she said yes and that she didn't know how to tell me. Also totally reasonable actions. I had already suspected that this was a possibility. She is amazing and would never have a problem finding someone else. I asked if she'd unblock me as it hurt worse to be shunned (though I know it was well intended) and she was fine with it. Yes, I might see her with her new someone and yes, it will definitely hurt, but I feel like it will also help me to move past this. The sad feelings will eventually go away and seeing her will make me happy. Seeing her happy will make me happy; even if it's with someone else. We again said our goodbyes. This time was permanent though. She is doing what I should be doing and moving on and I harbor no ill will about it. It's good one of us can do it.

 

Despite my acceptance of how things are now, I still feel a sudden and unbearable wave of sadness since our conversation today. I'm not a person that is hindered by depression and this probably wont have a noticeable effect at work or in my day to day interactions but deep down, I am devastated. I feel lonely because I don't have that person to talk to. It's been over 4 months since I saw her last but it's hitting me hardest now. I know time will take care of it. I have been through a big break up before. A few years before meeting her my girlfriend of 7 years split and it too was rough but it was because we weren't good for each other. This time we were great for each other but it still didn't work. So I guess I am feeling despair as well as I'm not sure I'll find something even close to what I had with her again.

 

Ultimately I am just using this forum to vent see if anyone else has had a similar experience or incite. Thanks for reading.

Edited October 4, 2016 by Indestructible

[ja123]

You sound really mature.

 

 

Sorry about your breakup.

 

 

The only thing I can say is that I dated someone who wanted children and I can't have them, so when he had to leave for work, I didn't push for him to stay.

 

 

We're now "friends" and exchange the occasional email 2-3 times a year, but there was a solid period (about 2 years) of "no contact" before we became alright with our emotions and could just be friends.

 

 

You might have to do that, too, so you can get over her first.

 

 

Breakups can hurt like heck.

 

 

Take care of yourself.

[bubbaganoosh]

I think it's a shame that religion broke you up. Seems to me that you had no problems with her beliefs and she obviously had no problem since she was with you.

 

Would be nice if people could judge another person for who they are. I'm not knocking religion, I'm just saying that there are other qualities to judge a person.

[Indestructible]

Thanks y'all for the responses

 

@ja123

 

Preciate the incite. I agree, we need to not be in contact for a long while. It's just gut wrenching to let go. With her finding someone else it'll be a little easier not to contact her I suppose since I don't want to mess up what she has now. It's still taking everything I've got not to...

 

@bubbaganoosh

 

yea, I think that's what gets to me the most. It's discriminatory in a way but since it's due to religious belief it's okay. So it goes I guess

[Toodaloo]

You are not giving yourself time. You need to start being kinder to yourself.

 

I am sorry it didn't work out but its far better and easier to be able to date people who can be open and honest with all their loved ones.

 

Better it ends now rather than later.

 

Chin up chook. There are others out there and when you are ready you can go and find them.

[elaine567]

QUOTE=Indestructible;7075673] We had very different backgrounds as I was born and raised in the US and she was born in the Middle East but came to the US at a young age. Our religious backgrounds were different and we both knew it was an issue but we didn't care. The issue was that I wasn't a follower of the belief system she was born into and it was against said belief system for females to marry outside their beliefs.

 

Islam is not a religion that can be messed around with easily and we can all go BUT it is 2016 and they love each other, give them a break.

It doesn't tend to work like that.

"For 22 years, Mandy Sanghera has worked with women who have married out of their faith, and counselled their family members. Like Bond, she says transgressing women rejected by their families often withdraw from their faith, as they are unable to enter a mosque or interact with the community.

Interfaith relationships have at times led to ostracism and violence against the couples, sometimes even resulting in forced marriages and honour killings. According to the UK constabulary, 2,823 honour crimes were reported to the police in 2010 and an estimated 10,000 forced marriages take place in Britain every year.

Many women in interfaith relationships, says Sanghera, have been disowned by their families, who in turn are often shamed with hate mail, threats and assault. "They never overcome the shame element of what their neighbours and the community will think,” says Sanghera. “And their daughters become part of a witch-hunt, always looking over their shoulders for the rest of their lives."

Muslim men can marry Jewish or Christian women in some circumstances, but Muslim women cannot marry non Muslim men, is the accepted doctrine. Some religious leaders have questioned that in the UK and a few will allow Muslim women to marry non Muslim men, but generally there is still a lot of hostility in families and communities.

'Halal' interfaith unions rise among UK women - Al Jazeera English

[yeonnii]

Oh I do feel for you... my Muslim boyfriend just ended our relationship 2 weeks ago. Although we haven't been together as long as you had with her (only 1 year), it sucks so much that religion was the breakup reason. Albeit there were other reasons he broke up with me, but the main one being that he didn't see a future with me. This is likely due to the fact that I am agnostic and was never born into a religion. Despite this, I felt like we did have a future together, as I was willing to learn arabic and learn more about Islam for him. We also had common grounds such as not drinking, smoking, or gambling and connected on so many levels even with our ethnic differences (arabic vs cantonese) so it felt almost imperfectly perfect.

I can only respect his decision to leave me, but I know the pain and hurt you are feeling... I thought true love could triumph all, including religion, but I guess we can't win over god. It hurts when the circumstances of the break up are beyond you. I don't think I will ever forget him and I may never move past him.

[pteromom]

Aww, I am sorry you are hurting.

 

It's not discriminatory. And "religion" didn't break you up. It's a matter of lifestyle differences. I assume that not only does she want children, but she wants her children raised in her family's faith. I assume she tried the "love is enough" thing until she matured and realized that love isn't enough to overcome major differences in what you want your life together to look like.

 

It hurts, but it is for the best for both of you.

[Indestructible]

@yeonii

 

Yea, sounds like we were in very similar situations and it totally sucks. He could have married you (technically) but it doesn't work that way for Muslim women and it is about preservation of the faith. I saw a future with her and the baseline reason it didn't work out is because her family was/would have been completely against it and disowned her had she decided to stay with me. I want, more than anything, for love to triumph but neither of us was willing to let her destroy her relationship with them.

 

@toodaloo

 

Thanks for the kind words. You're probably right and I know honesty is the best. I am a logical person and can see all the walls with this particular relationship but when it has come to the couple of people (her included) that have held that spot in my heart and life logic goes out the window every time.

 

@elaine567 and pteromom

 

I agree, as an outsider, Islam isn't something to be taken lightly. This relationship has def helped to show me that. Not like I dismissed it before or anything but as someone who resonates most as an agnostic it is unfathomable that people live that way and would throw away something amazing over faith.

 

We'd talked about it and I was willing to raise any potential children in her faith and at the time she would have been okay with that. She's been in the US much of her life and is more open minded than some that are more devout. She liked to think critically about things. It was the influence of her family that ultimately doomed things

 

Yes, it is a way of life but to me it seems like discrimination on the grounds of religion. If there is another word to better describe it that doesn't have a negative connotation please let me know.

 

Once again, I agree with y'all ultimately that this is the best but it doesn't change the fact that I have found myself in an invidious position because of it.

Edited October 7, 2016 by Indestructible

[BC1980]

Yes, it is a way of life but to me it seems like discrimination on the grounds of religion. If there is another word to better describe it that doesn't have a negative connotation please let me know.

 

It's not discrimination. It's basic incompatibility. Religious incompatibility can certainly be a deal breaker. As you realized, how to raise children is a big deal with an interfaith couple. Discrimination would mean that she was treating you unfairly because you are not Muslim, but I think that it's perfectly fair to break up with someone over a religious difference.

 

It sounds like you both knew this was coming. College is a time for exploration of one's beliefs. She may have wanted to look outside her faith, but she decided she wasn't willing to be with someone of a different faith in the long run. You are young. You are thinking in the moment. In the long run, you are better off unless you are going to convert to Islam. My first BF was Jewish, and he told me he would only marry me if I converted to Judaism. Fair enough. It hurt at the time, but I rarely ever think of him anymore.

[Indestructible]

You're right, it is a different lifestyle and discrimination isn't the right word.

[lightfoot]

It was absolutely your fault. You should have converted and could have done so very easily. Even if you didn't believe, she would have been happy with an effort. She was not a religious girl if she had a premarital sexual relationship with a non-Muslim for four years, but she couldn't break that last thin thread holding her onto her identity. All you had to do was drop into a mosque, talk to someone, say the Shahada, and voila. Instant Muslim. It's not like you already had a religion of your own; nothing held you back except that you didn't care. You've just wasted four years of her life.

[joyful]

You should have converted and could have done so very easily. Even if you didn't believe, she would have been happy with an effort. She was not a religious girl if she had a premarital sexual relationship with a non-Muslim for four years, but she couldn't break that last thin thread holding her onto her identity. All you had to do was drop into a mosque, talk to someone, say the Shahada, and voila. Instant Muslim.

 

This is true.

[lightfoot]

Just being honest OP, though admittedly a little harsh. It seems like an awfully trivial reason to doom such a long relationship with a good woman. The solution was simple.

[NopeNah]

Excuse my ignorance on this but, are converted muslims(or any religion) considered "equal" as far as marriage and such? I'm not big on religion.

[joyful]

Excuse my ignorance on this but, are converted muslims(or any religion) considered "equal" as far as marriage and such? I'm not big on religion.

 

Yes, they are.

[elaine567]

Just a little thing BUT

" Be aware that once you have said the Shahada you are committed to following Islam for life."

 

He is still very young, he shouldn't do that.

The relationship may have just ran its course anyway and then where would he be?

 

Leaving Islam is often not easy either.

[joyful]

 

Leaving Islam is often not easy either.

 

If one's family and community is not Muslim, why wouldn't it be?

[joyful]

Just a little thing BUT

" Be aware that once you have said the Shahada you are committed to following Islam for life."

 

Shahada is a declaration of belief.

 

Lots of Muslims the world over don't practice the religion strictly or faithfully (as in the case of OP's ex and Zayn Malik and Amal Clooney), and practice wanes and picks up again over the life of many Muslims.

Edited October 8, 2016 by joyful

[elaine567]

If one's family and community is not Muslim, why wouldn't it be?

 

If he married the girl then decided Islam was not for him, the marriage would be annulled if her parents ever found out.

 

The other problem with him converting is that HIS family may not be too pleased and disown him.

 

It is a huge decision and not one that many can make on the strength of a college romance.

[joyful]

If he married the girl then decided Islam was not for him, the marriage would be annulled if her parents ever found out.

 

The other problem with him converting is that HIS family may not be too pleased and disown him.

 

It is a huge decision and not one that many can make on the strength of a college romance.

 

Understood. But your statement about it not being easy to leave Islam sounds like you are talking about something inherent in the religion, which is just not true, especially for converts.

 

"There shall be no compulsion in the religion" Surat Al-Baqarah [verse 256] is an oft-repeated phrase among actual Muslims.

 

But your point about people disowning their children for changes of faith does seem to apply across religions and ethnicities, so point taken.

[elaine567]

"CEMB ( Council of Ex-Muslims of Britain) assists about 350 apostates a year, the majority of whom have faced death threats from Islamists or family members"

 

It all depends on how conservative/traditional the family/community is, as to how serious they would take leaving Islam to be.

Britain's Muslims are in fact not as "moderate" as you may assume them to be. The US Muslim community is reported as being less "conservative" in general.

[joyful]

"CEMB ( Council of Ex-Muslims of Britain) assists about 350 apostates a year, the majority of whom have faced death threats from Islamists or family members"

 

It all depends on how conservative/traditional the family/community is, as to how serious they would take leaving Islam to be.

Britain's Muslims are in fact not as "moderate" as you may assume them to be. The US Muslim community is reported as being less "conservative" in general.

 

There are about 1.6 billion Muslims in the world, roughly a fifth of the world's population. That one statistic is an absolutely infinitesimal number by comparison and can in no way be used to characterize a whole religion.

 

Stop spreading misinformation about a whole group of people and their way of life.

[joyful]

Oh, and there are nearly 3 million Muslims in the UK, so that statistic is infinitesimal even there.

 

Seriously, spread love.

[lightfoot]

The Shar'iah death sentence for apostasy is greatly misrepresented. It's something that was done a long time ago, and it's a subject of debate among scholars. No country today practices Shar'iah 100 per cent. In practical terms anybody's chance of getting killed after leaving Islam is zero, especially a Western convert in their own country. Maybe if you were living in Iran or Saudi Arabia and were very vocal about it, you'd have reason to worry.