For all the dudes online who are just looking for nookie

October 10, 2016

I don't think I would need to pursue a woman who adores me. If she requires pursuit, her adoration can't be that strong.

How is she going to know you adore her, too?

October 10, 2016

How is she going to know you adore her, too?

By me reciprocating and escalating her actions.

October 10, 2016

By me reciprocating and escalating her actions.

You want her to lead?

October 10, 2016

You want her to lead?

She's the one who adores me. She can initiate the first time. I can initiate after. If I adored her "first", then I would have initiated already.

October 10, 2016

She's the one who adores me. She can initiate the first time. I can initiate after. If I adored her "first", then I would have initiated already.

Let's just say that we'd be incompatible.

I've got zero interest in leading in romance. Cold shower.

October 10, 2016

By me reciprocating and escalating her actions.

So you require the woman to pursue/chase you FIRST, in order for you to feel she adores you.

And once she does, you reciprocate and okay escalate.

That is fair enough, many men prefer that.

In fact many go to great lengths to get the women to prove her worth and chase them first. before they will show their hand.

There are actually articles written all over the internet advising men on how to do this too. PUA sites and the like.

But please know that many women feel the same about men. We need men to pursue us first, in order for us to feel safe and adored, before we feel comfortable enough to reciprocate.

Myself being one of those women, and xoxo.

Once we feel safe and secure knowing he is into us, and adores us, then we will begin to reciprocate.

Just like YOU do ....so I am sure you understand how "we" feel, since that is what you need yourself.

Edited October 10, 2016 by katiegrl

October 10, 2016

So you require the woman to pursue/chase you FIRST, in order for you to feel she adores you.

And once she does, you reciprocate and okay escalate.

That is fair enough, many men prefer that.

This is not what I said. If I am interested in a woman before she has indicated interest in me, I initiate. If she adores me before I have initiated anything, then she can initiate. As you know from my posts, I don't subscribe to gender roles. Whoever feels interest first should initiate. That is my stance.

October 10, 2016

This is not what I said. If I am interested in a woman before she has indicated interest in me, I initiate. If she adores me before I have initiated anything, then she can initiate. As you know from my posts, I don't subscribe to gender roles. Whoever feels interest first should initiate. That is my stance.

Well that was the implication, but thnx for clarifying.

That is actually fair... no argument from me.

Except to say personally I am like xoxo, I have no desire to lead/pursue/chase... does nothing for me, sexually, romantically or otherwise.

In fact leaves me feeling sort of meh. Like xoxo said, cold shower. lol

To each his own though.

We just need to find partners who 'complement' our respective natures... and everyone will be happy!

Edited October 10, 2016 by katiegrl

October 10, 2016

This is a Nice Girl thread. We have Nice Guy threads where guys blame picky women for their dating problems. In the original post, we have the OP complaining about sex-oriented guys for wasting her time and energy instead of looking herself in her mirror.

I have to say the women I know outside of the Internet never really complain about guys who are looking for sex. Instead, they socialize and hang out with relationship-minded guys. Instead of blaming guys for not being able to control themselves or not being "respectful", they choose to go to places with like-minded guys who share their values and beliefs. Last week, I saw this guy look for his wife. They met at an online dating website that is geared toward relationship-minded people. Instead of complaining about guys who do not share her values and views, she screened for relationship-minded guys by going to the relationship-minded dating site.

Sounds like the OP is using one of those large, commercial, dating sites that does not specifically say whether their for relationship-minded people or hookup-minded people. That is why you're meeting guys who are looking for sex. To answer question, guys go for "nookie" on these websites because a lot of women don't have a problem hooking up with an attractive guy. Many women who don't do one-night stands are opening to hooking with a guy after a first or second date.

There's very little said about what the OP does to attract guys who share her values and beliefs. She admitted herself that she got turned off by relationship-minded guys who were tounge-tied and not smooth.

Edited October 10, 2016 by Moves Like Jagger
Forgot to include a point

October 10, 2016

This is not what I said. If I am interested in a woman before she has indicated interest in me, I initiate. If she adores me before I have initiated anything, then she can initiate. As you know from my posts, I don't subscribe to gender roles.

---

Whoever feels interest first should initiate. That is my stance.

I find this^ interesting Shining One.

For me, in all my LTRs (and even short ones for that matter), I would meet a man and we would feel a *mutual* chemistry, a *mutual* interest.

And being that I am attracted to masculine, take charge, assertive men, he would pursue.

After a few dates, once (or more like if/when) I trusted he was sincere in his pursuit and interest, I would reciprocate.

If I didn't feel he was sincere (which has happened especially lately after my breakup)... I would next.

Just me, how I roll.

Again to each his own!

Edited October 10, 2016 by katiegrl

October 10, 2016

I find this^ interesting Shining One.

For me, in all my LTRs (and even short ones for that matter), I would meet a man and we would feel a *mutual* chemistry, a *mutual* interest.

And being that I am attracted to masculine, take charge, assertive men, he would pursue.

After a few dates, once (or more like if/when) I trusted he was sincere in his pursuit and interest, I would reciprocate.

If I didn't feel he was sincere (which has happened especially lately after my breakup)... I would next.

Just me, how I roll.

Again to each his own!

I have initiated with 100+ women (not counting OLD) because I felt interest first. 6 women have initiated with me because they felt interest first. Define that as you will. In the cases where the women put in the effort first, I reciprocated the very next date.

October 10, 2016

She's the one who adores me. She can initiate the first time. I can initiate after. If I adored her "first", then I would have initiated already.

You are far too calculative. All of this - attraction, dates, romance - should be fun and natural. If you approach it in this manner, you are dooming yourself before you've even started.

October 10, 2016

I have initiated with 100+ women (not counting OLD) because I felt interest first. 6 women have initiated with me because they felt interest first. Define that as you will. In the cases where the women put in the effort first, I reciprocated the very next date.

Good for you!

For me, there has been a mutual chemistry/interest. I actually require that actually.

And he pursues. I respond with enthusiasm and desire and eventually reciprocate (in my own feminine way ... which HE loves!).

If it was just "him" being interested but I felt nothing (chemistry-wise), which happens a lot too, I never really trusted it.

Most times when that happened.. I found his interest superficial, based on my looks/sensuality.

Genuine chemistry, which goes way beyond looks, is always mutual imho!

Again just me!

October 10, 2016

And then guys always think you're overweight if you don't post body photos. It's a lose-lose situation.

Yeah, so you need to go for the least revealing (boob wise) body shot you can - a pain but trust me, that's the best way to reduce the perv effect.

Cats are gross to me, to clean up after. I like dogs.

I'm not a cat fan. I like dogs. But would not be a deal breaker personally.

But fine, you can have that one.

So the bathroom selfie, or shirtless photos....I used to strictly not pick those guys either. But lately they all have shirtless photos at the beach or gym or hiking or tough mudder or something...so I decided to be okay with that, since otherwise I'd not have anyone to talk to.

Well, for sure it would reduce your matches, but seeing as you are talking to 20 guys right now, I doubt you would have none.

Honestly, guys posting shirtless (at least in selfie shots) are much more likely to be just looking for fun. I have hiking shots, endurance event shots, etc- but I'm always clothed.

There is no need to be getting naked in your profile. It's sending a clear message, and it sounds like you are tapping into it despite yourself.

Thats a good suggestion, about intelligent questions to ask them. Although, you say you're not a good guy, so why should I follow your advice?

I'm not bad, I just am primarily focused on short term/casual relationships at the moment. That's not to say that can't change if I met someone awesome.

But there is no way I'm going into anything thinking oh, I hope this is the ONE I don't care if I never find the one tbh.

October 10, 2016

Okay so being honest 100% of the time is considered good manners?
What if I told him- "well...hm. Your job is not impressive, and looks wise if I sleep with you, you'll be the least attractive man I've ever had sex with. But sure, let's go at it." That's being honest, is that the considerate or polite thing to say? I'll ask again, would you ever just walk up to a woman in public, introduce yourself, then ask her to have sex with you that night? If not, why not?

....

And again, my point was not that men are bad for wanting sex. My point was about manners and being respectful and treating each other decently.

I think it's really sad when people have this attitude like, "so what, I don't owe him/her anything, we just had sex, who cares?" I mean no, you don't owe that person a marriage, but we all owe each other some basic demonstrations of human kindness. If you show more respect or consideration for your taxi driver, bartender, or person who bags your groceries, than you show to a person you just had sex with, you need to do some soul searching.

Ok now we can be in complete agreement. You have kind of changed tact from your complaint in the original post that started this thread though. Initially you complained simply because the guy wanted to have sex with you and you didn't like that so many guys on OLD were just after "nookie" and not a serious relationship. You said they should go to a bar instead of using OLD. Now you've made it clear that what really pisses you off is more the way they convey their intentions rather the fact they are honest and up front about it.

On this I agree entirely - there is a way to convey this that is tasteful and not vulgar. Indeed as some others on the board have stated there is a way to convey this that would make it a hell of a lot more likely that you might want to actually meet him even if he isn't saying he wants a long term relationship. The art of seduction, charm and flirting is definitely something that has gone by the way side as a result of OLD. You will get no arguments from me there.

On the plus side - it makes it really easy for the rest of the guys who do show even a modicum of charm and manners.

October 10, 2016

So I said, in my experience, the casual sex guys do not pursue nor care to put in any effort whatsoever. and guys in OLD want to put in much less effort than men who I've met other ways. That's been my experience.

You see, there are some indications of an antiquated mindset rolled into this response: 1. that guys either want casual sex or not, as if there are only two kinds of guys and they're diametrically opposite. 2. that guys are supposed to strut like a peacock and display grand gestures, while a woman sits at home and feigns demure waiting on the phone to ring... will he or won't he call, or send flowers? Oh, the rest of my life depends on what he does next! Pfffft.

You're twisting that into making me some sort of entitled princess. Which I don't appreciate. I know no one wants to go to Nana's 87th birthday, that was an example of a relationship type obligation.

Right. It sounds like you believe a guy should prove himself by attending nana's 87th b-day and engaging in other domestic activities while pretending to not be interested in sex... in other words, if he won't jump through hoops then he's not pursuing properly. Bzzzzt.

But I am a little rigid about certain things. That is true. I have expectations, and limits for what I want, how I want it to happen, who I want it to happen with. I don't think that makes me entitled, it means I know who I am.

Yea, I get that. IMHO though, it seems like you have your self-image and self-worth all rolled up into this pursuit notion, which takes it out of your hands and puts into the hands of these random guys that you decide you'd like to be pursued by but who aren't interested in wearing top hats and tails and laying their cape over a mud puddle.

For your question in bold- what exactly CAN I do to gain a guy's respect, when our entire interaction is superficial and meaningless? Was I supposed to go out with him, knowing he wanted casual sex and I don't, waste his time and mine, in the hopes of building a more meaningful interaction? I don't understand your question.

How about engaging him in an interesting conversation and see if he can hold his own... or if you can hold your own with him. See if there's any intellectual or physical chemistry rather than being completely focused on the end game.

I do focus on authentic interactions, when I'm fortunate enough that they happen. I guess you are saying that by wanting a guy to take me seriously enough to meet me in person, before asking me to have sex with him, then I am begging to be pursued? Or is that me requiring men to beg for my attention? You're making this all much more complicated than it really is.

No, not at all. When you run into a guy online who's only interested in a hookup just don't respond, or even better, block him and don't give it a second thought.

Pursuing and 'begging a woman for her attention' are two very, very different things. Successful pursuers will likely tell you that there is no 'begging' whatsoever in their pursuit. It's a dance that both parties enjoy.

Yes I understand the dance, but I believe it's best when both people engage.

It's incredibly annoying how you keep hounding folks' threads with no constructive suggestions except that they should conduct their dating and relationships the same way you do.

I find your simplistic notions annoying as well. And I categorically reject your attempt to censor the conversation just because you don't agree. It I wasn't making valid points it wouldn't bother you.

Spoken like a true Beta, believe me selfconfident men who go after what they want have no issue pursuing.

And the exact same thing can be said of women––not the alpha/beta crap; the self confident ones who know who they are. This "supposed to pursue" mentality so close to the animated Cinderella narrative... all that's missing is a glass slipper and wicked step sisters. Let me guess... you'd like said pursuer to take you shoe shopping to complete the fantasy?

October 10, 2016

I think men who know their value don't need to pursue, and find it distasteful to have to beg a woman for her attention. If they have options they just move along and focus their energy where it's reciprocated.

Right on Sal! A real man does not waste his time chasing the uncatchable or jumping through hoops of fire to get a womans attention. Nor should he harass, cat call or act like an ass by being vulgar or sexually suggestive.

If you want to be chased buy a dog. There are too many good women out there.

October 10, 2016

Judging by 3 or 4 posts by different women on this thread ..... what really seems to be the issue is that OLD has to a degree turned the tables on women in the dating arena. It has made single women and casual sex far more easily available to men. As sex is now easy to get with pretty minimal effort from a mans perspective - women can no longer just rely on being pursued by a bevy of eager young male suitors competing for their affections. Simply put there are plenty of other fish in the sea who are easier to catch. Previously men played the long game but now as the payoff is higher they are frequently playing short and direct.

This I guess you could say is part of the disadvantage of sexual equality movement. Women have obviously gained a lot of rights they should always have had ..... but as a result of the change in the way western women approach casual sex they have also lost a lot of the former "female privileges" that existed in the courtship process. For better or for worse the dating and courting process has changed. If you are looking for something more "old school" then OLD is not the place to find it.

October 10, 2016

Right on Sal! A real man does not waste his time chasing the uncatchable or jumping through hoops of fire to get a womans attention. Nor should he harass, cat call or act like an ass by being vulgar or sexually suggestive.

If you want to be chased buy a dog. There are too many good women out there.

Otter, where did *that* come from?

No one ever said or suggested that a man *waste his time pursuing/chasing the uncatchable or jumping though hoops."

He shouldn't! You are 100% absolutely right on about that!

The woman needs to show interest too! Of course! And if she doesn't. next.

It is just that for some women, especially in the early stages, it *turns us on* for the man to take charge (ask us out, plan and pay for date). We dig that masculine energy.

If you read all the posts, this turns many men on too! They actually enjoy pursuing! Read Gaius's posts for example..... which Shining One said he understood!

Not all men enjoy of course like Shining One, salparadise ... which is okay too...but many do. Yin and yang.

The woman enthusiastically responds, and makes this all very easy for him! She doesn't run away from him forcing him to *chase* her.

And again if she does. Next her! Period end of.

After a few dates, she begins to reciprocate.

Planning a picnic, cooking a nice dinner, stuff like that.

We don't need this because it's *easy* for us.

That is missing the point.

We dig masculine energy, and thus this *dance* turns us on, just like there are specific things a woman *you* are attracted to does, that turn YOU on.

Hope that clarifies!

Edited October 10, 2016 by katiegrl

October 10, 2016

AMJ, I have a few ideas for you, hopefully they will help. You might have a marketing problem. When your boobs are doing your marketing for you, you will attract a certain kind of guy. This doesn't mean it is really your fault, but it will still work out this way. You choose how you attract men, and if you attract them with things other than your looks, you will find yourself valued for those things.

I don't want to say men are dumb, because we aren't. However, when most of the bled has fled from our brain and descended into....other areas, you can't expect brilliance. Some guys, once we start looking at those boobs, we just aren't thinking so clearly anymore. Instead of thinking about how we want to get to know AMJ as a person, suddenly our thoughts are consumed with "OMG BEWBIES!"

I know it sucks for ladies like you sometimes, my ex GF had really big boobs too. She always put those girls away. She pretty much never wore anything that showed a hint of cleavage either. To do otherwise just invited the attentions of too many losers who couldn't look her in the eye. I know everyone wants to look their best, but if you put the boobs away, you might get noticed for things other than your boobs.

Put them away? Where do you suggest I put them?

I do wear clothes, my boobs are fully covered in photos and in daily life.

I'm well aware of how powerful boobs can be. I've had them since I was 16, I've had lots of time to learn.

And sentence in bold- are you now saying that men are capable of being attracted to women for things other than their appearance? When you've done OLD, you think- well she's pretty basic looking, but damn her interests and hobbies are HOT. There is a lot more to me than just boobs, and anyone who would take 15 minutes to have a conversation with me would learn that right away. I don't market myself as a woman with big boobs- there are no cleavage shots, promise- but they are impossible to hide unless I don't post body photos. So there is is.

If I DID purposely market myself as boobs, do you really think I would have started this thread? And gone on this long complaining about unwanted sexual advances?

October 10, 2016

Yeah, so you need to go for the least revealing (boob wise) body shot you can - a pain but trust me, that's the best way to reduce the perv effect.

I've tried this. The only thing I haven't tried, is posting photos where I'm holding things in front of my boobs. Like a baby, or some books maybe? I could try that.

I'm not a cat fan. I like dogs. But would not be a deal breaker personally.
But fine, you can have that one.

Thanks?

Well, for sure it would reduce your matches, but seeing as you are talking to 20 guys right now, I doubt you would have none.
Honestly, guys posting shirtless (at least in selfie shots) are much more likely to be just looking for fun. I have hiking shots, endurance event shots, etc- but I'm always clothed.
There is no need to be getting naked in your profile. It's sending a clear message, and it sounds like you are tapping into it despite yourself.

That's fair.

I'm not bad, I just am primarily focused on short term/casual relationships at the moment. That's not to say that can't change if I met someone awesome.
But there is no way I'm going into anything thinking oh, I hope this is the ONE

This I knew...

I don't care if I never find the one tbh.

And I don't buy this.

But that is a better way to approach dating, not caring about the outcome. I've always been more successful that way. The thing is, I'm not a good liar, never have been. So back when I didn't care, that was my genuine feeling. Now that I do care, it's difficult to hide that.

October 10, 2016

Judging by 3 or 4 posts by different women on this thread ..... what really seems to be the issue is that OLD has to a degree turned the tables on women in the dating arena. It has made single women and casual sex far more easily available to men. As sex is now easy to get with pretty minimal effort from a mans perspective - women can no longer just rely on being pursued by a bevy of eager young male suitors competing for their affections. Simply put there are plenty of other fish in the sea who are easier to catch. Previously men played the long game but now as the payoff is higher they are frequently playing short and direct.

This I guess you could say is part of the disadvantage of sexual equality movement. Women have obviously gained a lot of rights they should always have had ..... but as a result of the change in the way western women approach casual sex they have also lost a lot of the former "female privileges" that existed in the courtship process. For better or for worse the dating and courting process has changed. If you are looking for something more "old school" then OLD is not the place to find it.

True! This reminds me of Chris Rock's joke that "If p---y was a stock it has plummeted". It's just too easy to get these days.

October 10, 2016

The key is to screen for men who view you as no more than sex, just as good as sex with the next woman. Who wants that guy, anyway?

October 10, 2016

Ok now we can be in complete agreement. You have kind of changed tact from your complaint in the original post that started this thread though. Initially you complained simply because the guy wanted to have sex with you and you didn't like that so many guys on OLD were just after "nookie" and not a serious relationship. You said they should go to a bar instead of using OLD. Now you've made it clear that what really pisses you off is more the way they convey their intentions rather the fact they are honest and up front about it.

On this I agree entirely - there is a way to convey this that is tasteful and not vulgar. Indeed as some others on the board have stated there is a way to convey this that would make it a hell of a lot more likely that you might want to actually meet him even if he isn't saying he wants a long term relationship. The art of seduction, charm and flirting is definitely something that has gone by the way side as a result of OLD. You will get no arguments from me there.

On the plus side - it makes it really easy for the rest of the guys who do show even a modicum of charm and manners.

Initially I started this thread wanting to understand how easy it was to find casual sex online, since so many guys on here post about how they can't even get women to talk to them. I was thinking it must be really difficult to find sex, but then some guys have said, no- not really, it's quite easy since pretty much everyone OLD hooks up right away.

Since that's the case, OLD is probably the worst place for me to spend my time.

October 10, 2016

I'm so glad I missed all this OLD stuff. Sounds dreadful!

Back in the early days of the internet, AOL messenger was about as good as it got! I once got chatting to a girl from Texas, got on really well and after a couple of months arranged to meet when she was staying in London.

Turned out we were chalk and cheese. Complete disaster

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